The DWmegawad Club plays: Memento Mori 2

dobu gabu maru · November 1, 2018

What is the DWmegawad Club?

This is a place where we settle down, have a cup of tea (or drink of your choice) and take a month to play through a megawad on our own, together! Any keen observations, criticisms, or frustrated ranting about it goes here in the discussion. As long as you want to say something about what you've played, feel free to speak your mind.

Can I join?

Sure. The only rule is that you have to play at least some of the levels in our monthly megawad to contribute, but you're generally encouraged to finish the whole thing, even if you've played it before.

What levels am I allowed to post about?

Whatever day of the month it is, is the upper limit for the map you can post on. So if it’s the 6th, you may discuss up to MAP06.

Do I have to post an entry every day?

Nope, not at all. This is only for our more enthusiastic members. As long as you play through it with us you’re part of the club.

When do we vote on the next month’s megawad?

Voting begins on the 25th of the current month. Remember to add one “+++” before your vote to make it easier to count. For example:

+++ Ultimate Doom

Note that you can only nominate up to three separate wads for a single month, and the wads must contain at least three maps each. These are hard limits instituted for my own sanity.

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>>>DOWNLOAD MEMENTO MORI 2 HERE<<<

Remember when community projects took a year to develop and release? 1996’s Memento Mori 2 remembers! Made by The Innocent Crew, this self-purported “final Doom 2 chapter” is a must for fans of the 90s!

Author & Maplist for Memento Mori 2:

MAP01 - “Outpost” by Denis Möller

MAP02 - “The Feeding Pit” by David Davidson

MAP03 - “… And Hell Beneath” by Matthias Worch

MAP04 - “Ratamahatta” by Florian Helmberger

MAP05 - “Rites of Passage” by Paul Noble

MAP06 - “Trapped” by Adam Williamson

MAP07 - “Frustration” by David Kuykendall

MAP08 - “Stigmata” by Denis Möller

MAP09 - “Sabbath Sewer” by Mark Klem

MAP10 - “Clear for Death” by Matthais Worch

MAP11 - “Sewer Shutdown” by Eric Sargent

MAP12 - “The Waterway” by Orin Flaharty

MAP13 - “Devils Paradise” by Rhys Hughes

MAP14 - “A Question of Time” by Matthias Worch, Thomas Möller

MAP15 - “The Devil’s Coterie” by Adam Windsor

MAP31 - “DejaVu” by Orin Flaharty

MAP32 - “Dances with Demons” by David Kuykendall

MAP16 - “The Nephilim” by Denis Möller

MAP17 - “No One” by Michael Rapp

MAP18 - “Regulate” by Matthias Worch

MAP19 - “The Shaft” by Jeremy Statz

MAP20 - “The Experiment” by Alden Bates

MAP21 - “Sanctuary” by Andy Badorek

MAP22 - “R.R.F. Refinary” by Thomas Möller

MAP23 - “No Way Out” by Eric Sargent

MAP24 - “Io Lab” by Sean Birkel

MAP25 - “Forgotten Town” by Denis Möller

MAP26 - “Base Exposure” by Mark Klem

MAP27 - “The Silos” by Paul Noble

MAP28 - “Corporate Hell” by Stephen Watson

MAP29 - “Kings of Metal” by Jens Nielsen

MAP30 - “It” by Jim Wraith

BONUS CONTENT

Andy Olivera's review

Suitepee Plays Memento Mori 2: 1 2 3

Lingyan203's playthrough

--------

OLD THREADS

Spoiler

The DWmegawad Club Metathread

2012

2013

2014

2015

2016

2017

2018

Edited May 8, 2023 by dobu gabu maru

Capellan · November 1, 2018

I'll definitely be playing along this month. Really excited to re-visit a WAD I loved in the day, but haven't touched for 20 years.

Also excited by the opportunity to bore you all with tales of the Olden Days :)

kmxexii · November 1, 2018

The old link to my review broke awhile ago when Blogger was arbitrarily reverting posts to drafts. This is the current one.

Spectre01 · November 1, 2018

I've played MM2 before, up to something like map28, but with the D4T mod and not vanilla. For this playthrough I'll be doing PRBoom+, UV-Continuous. That's right, I have no interest in shotgun gameplay and questionable armour placement. And if MM1 is anything to go by, there is little in the way of cells and rockets even on continuous.

MAP01 - “Outpost” by Denis Möller

Hey, that's literally the picture in the OP, but there isn't much else that's visually striking aside from the opening room. Right away, it's easy to notice that you start in Hell this time around and fight your way back to more traditional Earth/techbase setting. Something like Resurgence. There are also plenty of custom textures that don't look too bad for a '96 PWAD. Compared to something like Icarus at least. The map itself is as straightforward as things get, with the only peculiar aspect being the Green Armour secret that triggers by shooting a switch you press for progression. And if punching it, take a step back.

Pegleg · November 1, 2018

1 hour ago, Capellan said:

I'll definitely be playing along this month. Really excited to re-visit a WAD I loved in the day, but haven't touched for 20 years.

Also excited by the opportunity to bore you all with tales of the Olden Days :)

I'm particularly interested by what you have to say about Map 15, especially after 20 years.

And, personally, I enjoy the "tales of the Olden Days." As for MM2, I would be interested in playing along with this, were it not for the fact that November is a ridiculously busy month.

vdgg · November 1, 2018

Lots of stuff to read :) This is my all-time fave and there's no other WAD I played this much in my life. Thus, I dare to say I know it well. With one day delay (MAP01 on the 2nd...) I'll be posting my little reviews including some trivia. In the 90's there were three demo packs recorded on MM2 containing some interesting opinions from the era and I will quote and make a summary of everything that I found worth quoting and summarizing.

While I'm about to change my avatar to "celebrate" this thread, a little comment on my current one: I realized that SLADWALL looks like a face when I was (multiple times, again) trying to align the player properly and press one of the switches from below on MAP27 The Silos, which can be finished in below 30 seconds due to the author's little awareness...

Edited November 1, 2018 by vdgg

Korikon · November 1, 2018

Can't wait to play it.

Edited November 1, 2018 by Korikon

galileo31dos01 · November 1, 2018

Aww, one of the oldies <3

Been waiting for this to get selected, Memento Mori II was the 4th megawad I completed about almost two years ago. Lots of sweet memories from it, the custom textures, the music, that rocking status bar, and all the lovely gameplay, that of course my lack of experience in Doom influenced a lot. Since I'm currently not playing anything different until I get at least three reviews done (and there're ~~eight~~ seven pending), I'll take the opportunity to revisit the rest of the maps that I haven't retried these days. Crispy Doom 3.5. like the old days, this time UV, experiencing pistol starts to see how better or worse it gets compared to sassy continuous. I'm already aware of the grindy nature and basic armor scarcity in a lot of maps, required secrets and whatnot to get a foothold, but it's all part of the wholesome experience (?).

MAP01: Outpost

Well that's a nice setting at the start room, not a lot of megawads begin in a red-bricked sort of hellish building, like Spectre01 said Resurgence is a popular example of an atypical theme progression. It gets into human-made bases and greenish textures pretty soon anyways. As an opening map it's fun enough, basically giving a glimpse of the wad's nature. If anything to point out, besides the unintuitive invisible switch for the armor, is the items in the deathmatch isolated portions. That's something that used to intrigue me back in the day, why they weren't set for multiplayer only. I guess that couldn't be done in older editors. Oh and no automap names, but the solution is simple. Here is a patch for them, if anyone wants. mm2_maps.zip

And a video:

Korikon · November 1, 2018

So I have never played Memento Mori or Memento Mori 2 So I have never played Memento Mori or Momento Mori 2 ever so I'm sorry if I don't say what they're going for right I also haven't been playing Doom in a while so I sucked at it pretty bad ever so I'm sorry if I don't say what they're going for right I also haven't been playing Doom in a while so I sucked at it pretty bad

Map01:

Difficulty: Hurt me plenty

Kill:88%

Items:19%

Secrets:0%

Personally the first map is getting my hopes up for the rest. I liked the spawn point it gets straight to action with enemies. The design was pretty nice it had a castle like feeling and the only problem I had with the textures and this is the mixture of the satanic like textures mixed with the uac ones forming a weird kind of satanic advanced castle thought of the textures. The gameplay was ok but at a few points it felt generic. Overall the map was good for a first map.

Edited November 1, 2018 by Korikon
Fixed bad spelling

Korikon · November 1, 2018

1 hour ago, Smight said:

Hello well I didn't join the club but it seems cool

I didn't sign up for anything because the original post says you can join by just playing the maps and actually playing them and reviewing them I'm pretty sure you don't gotta sign up for anything if your thinking of joining

Spectre01 · November 1, 2018

The club is currently full and not taking new members at this time. You're welcome to join the waiting list though!

Spoiler

I'm not serious. Anyone can drop in and post.

Capellan · November 1, 2018

Olden Timer Yarn

So I don't know how TiC assembled the team for the original MM, but for MM2 they announced it on usenet and told people to email them some sample maps if they wanted to be invited in. I sent them dfear5.wad, which was maps 21-25 of Demonfear, and one of them (Denis, IIRC) emailed back to say that I was in, as long as my map for MM2 was bigger.

TiC had a firm set of rules about when weapons and monsters could be introduced, which they shared at the start of the project. Mappers claimed specific map slots and mapped for that slot. The idea of starting in Hell and progressively getting more Earthlike was established early, and Alden Bates wrote some fiction to justify that progression.

Then we were given the resource WAD and let loose, with the instruction to make sure we oriented more toward SP (while still supporting co-op) this time, and that we needed to allow DM play on our maps, as well.

And with that out of the way, let's get stuck in. PrBoom+. HMP, continuous, no music, frequent saves and loads, vanilla settings.

MAP01

This is actually the second map01 made for MM2. The first (by Steve Towle) was immediately rejected by TiC. That map ended up becoming 'secret mission 1', hidden in the MM2 infopack, if you simply must check it out. I don't think much of it, myself, but 'secret mission 2' is a good one. Or at least, so I remember it.

Anyway, as far as this map goes, it's relatively straightforward map01 stuff mostly, though the large number of hitscanners and relative lack of health make it a bit more dicey than the norm. Still, nothing like that opening shotgunner gauntlet in the original MM!

Everything looks pretty nice, showcasing some of the new textures right off the bat, with some fun little lighting details included.

I like that if you don't kill the two imps behind the 2-sided 'red diamond' walls, they will ultimately teleport out of there and come after you (at least, if you go into the optional room to the east of the exit, they will).

Spectre01 · November 1, 2018

25 minutes ago, Capellan said:

I like that if you don't kill the two imps behind the 2-sided 'red diamond' walls, they will ultimately teleport out of there and come after you (at least, if you go into the optional room to the east of the exit, they will).

That's cool. I was going to mention in my post how their placement seemed questionable and easily ignored.

meapineapple · November 1, 2018

Nice, I've been meaning to play Memento Mori 1 & 2. I'll have to get to that this month. Will people mainly be playing the maps continuously or from a pistol start?

SiFi270 · November 1, 2018

It'd be a crime to discuss this map without bringing up the deathmatch side of it:

Spoiler

DOOM0000.png.e317985c8ce5feb9539b891b7c57ec66.png

Aquila Chrysaetos · November 1, 2018

MAP01

GLBoom+ 2.5.1.5, complevel 2, UV, pistol starts, saveless

54/58 K | 8/41 I | 0/3 S | 2:38

mm201-AC.lmp

The last time I played MM2 was as a kid, and I seem to remember I liked it better than the first, so this will be an interesting experience.

A quick map, this one pits you against mostly zombiemen, shotgunners, chaingunners, and imps.

Nothing terribly advanced in the department of visuals, but it still looks nice.

The gameplay is a little campy, with there being so many hitscanners about, but it's not very difficult, regardless.

Progression is linear, hard to get lost, but there is an optional side area to look at before heading for the exit.

Edited November 1, 2018 by Aquila Chrysaetos

gaspe · November 1, 2018

One of my favourites wads, and imo one of the best megawads ever made. The ost is excellent. I'm glad to see that Capellan joined, it will be cool to hear some stories from the old days :)

MAP01: The starting view is great with that pentacle hanging on the ceiling, and it makes also a nice tribute to the first map of the first Memento Mori. It's an easygoing level but you have to be careful of the hitscanners around, especially the chaingunners. We start also from the hell settings, in this red-marble with metal and wood building. There's also a gate made with a transparent textures, though you can shoot the monsters on the other side. I always forget how to find the secret armor, I wonder why they did that in that way.

Deadwing · November 1, 2018

I don't think I'll be able to play the whole thing, but if you guys post videos I'll definitely youtube it :D

Catpho · November 1, 2018

12 hours ago, vdgg said:

Lots of stuff to read :) This is my all-time fave and there's no other WAD I played this much in my life.

We totally wouldn't have guessed it from your custom title. It wasn't a dead giveaway, I promise ;)

Also I'm glad ancient member @Capellan is still here 23 years later (P.S Map 15 of MM2 is one of my favorites). The "kids" here will be listening to your snippets of the old days!

Never forget the MM roast of 2013.

Capellan · November 1, 2018

MAP02

IMO this is definitely one of the weaker entries in the WAD. On the plus side, it all looks nice enough: clean layout, no glaring misalignments, a good sense of visual flair. Against that ... it's a bit dull, with a very gated, linear progression through mostly quite constrained areas. Freedom to move is not a feature here, so instead it's mostly about popping imps and sergeants with the shottie or chaingun and slurping up keys when you find them. And ignoring the demons guarding the blue key because they're a waste of ammo.

I quickly remembered the rather random action needed to open the door to the red key. I wonder how many first timers get stuck on that?

No true secrets in this (just a marked sector to ensure you don't waste time looking for them) which is a shame, since it seems like it would be easy enough to pop one in.

Summer Deep · November 1, 2018

Here we go then. I'll be playing on UV continuous, in GLBoom+, my default format for most multi-level wads. By the way, I
liked the cartoon at the start, 'Nascentes morimur' is an amusing response and good grammatical Latin, whereas 'Memento
Mori' is somewhat dubious on that score, but a good title nonetheless....

MAP01: Quite a challenging start for an opening map, I'll bet quite a few half-decent Doomers have died at some point on
this. The awkwardly placed chaingunners and the demon ambushes prefigure more dangerous repetitions shortly to come, and
the imps shooting through walls can come as a shock. There's apparently a green armour suit hidden somewhere, but I was
unable to find it.

98% kills, 2/3 secrets

MAP02: Starts with the player immersed in toxic blood, but it's not a big deal, and one's soon out of there. The imps
opposite are easily dispatched, though without the luxury of having the shotgun this would be rather more difficult from a
pistol start. The two side rooms were straightforward enough, as was the main building over the bridge. The yellow key
rising from the blood pit is an effective touch, as is the strikingly beautiful red and yellow exit area. Wasn't sure
what my two secrets were (this is obviously going to be a feature of the mapset), but I suppose one of them might have
resulted from passing through the squareish 'window' to unlock the second side room.

100% kills, 2/2 secrets

D4NUK1 · November 1, 2018

Welp, never played Memento Mori 2, only 1. I will join. I Hope Retro Doom works with this.

Capellan · November 1, 2018

12 hours ago, meapineapple said:

Nice, I've been meaning to play Memento Mori 1 & 2. I'll have to get to that this month. Will people mainly be playing the maps continuously or from a pistol start?

It's a mix (I'd guess it generally tends to pistol start, but that's not from any proper analysis). Play the way you prefer.

Korikon · November 1, 2018

(I clicked through to fast too get my scores)

Map02: The 2nd map is still ok the start has the player in a room with blood that harms them there's a few former humans in the room as well. now the only interesting parts of the map other than the start is the jumbled up dark room that you enter and the pinky ambush but that's about it it's not too exciting much weaker than the opening level. overall the level was ok but definitely not the greatest.

Magnusblitz · November 1, 2018

I think I've played this before, but if I have, it's been a long time (the WAD file wasn't already on this PC, at least). ZDoom/UV/saving/mouselook/pistol starts.

Kinda worried I won't have much interesting to say for these; I'm just here to listen to Capellan's back-in-my-day stories.

MAP01: Outpost

98% kills, 2/3 secrets

Love that custom skylight. The most dangerous part of the map is probably the hitscanner opener, combined with no armor and low health (where have I seen this before...) There's a bit of cheekiness right away too with the red key only being revealed by approaching the red door, as well as imps hiding behind false walls. After that it's pretty standard fare though. Seems a bit cramped to really be fun for co-op, but I suppose this was designed as SP first, as opposed to MM1, even though co-op is intended. Had to look up the third secret in DB2, no bueno... no way you'll get it unless you get lucky randomly shooting over the invisible trigger line.

Suitepee · November 2, 2018

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/260316631 = part 1. (maps 1-15)

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261439065 = part 2. (maps 31,32 then 16-22)

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261789075 = part 3. (maps 23-30)

I played through this a couple of months ago, as it was part of my huge request list. (was requested by @Nevander) I found MM2 to be mostly enjoyable, but became a bit frustrating in the last few maps for me. Still worth a playthrough though in my opinion, and at least it ends on a better IoS than the first one.

Edited November 2, 2018 by Suitepee

Spectre01 · November 2, 2018

MAP02 - “The Feeding Pit” by David Davidson

A very short and not particularly strong map. Mostly hallways leading to small rooms with a few Sergeants/Imps to shoot and grab a key to progress. Why is there even a secret sector before jumping off the starting room? The other secret is not as obvious, although I think it's nice that the map hints at what's supposed to open up after you punch the central cross.

galileo31dos01 · November 2, 2018

MAP02: The Feeding Pit

Lol random secret at the start room was, well, not that random considering the age of the wad. So, the most striking things in the map came from the music track and the architecture, pretty clean and detailed, favoring a vaguely better visual of the sky, while the combat was rather silly but the gameplay not so much. I found it amusing that you had to cross over the guillotine(?) to open the door to the RK, or that you can get trapped in the YK fountain. Just those kind of details that add points. Also the secret chaingun, a must to max the map, is impossible to not notice, since a stray bullet will hit the cross anyways. Yea, quick, silly, and cute map.

Edited November 2, 2018 by galileo31dos01

Summer Deep · November 2, 2018

So, this is a bit weird. I've been noticing while playing the first three maps of MM2 that the discovery of some secrets has been credited on the end-of-level 'scoreboard', but I'm not getting the 'A secret is revealed' notifications in game. I've looked at Galileo's playthroughs, and they're certainly showing up there. I can only think it's something to do with the sourceport I'm using (GLBoom-plus), but this hasn't been apparent before. Any clarification would be welcome.

EDIT: Tried GLBoom+ (and PRBoom+) on various wads, including IWADS, and this message never seems to show up. Strange I haven't noticed that before...

Edited November 2, 2018 by Summer Deep

gaspe · November 2, 2018

MAP02: A 3-keys hunt crammed in a very short level. I don't think that the keys were necessary here, you could keep to open the doors with other kind of triggers but whatever. It's allright overall, each room has its different trick and the central metal structure of the hub look nice. It gets overshadowed quickly by some better maps though.

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