Akeldama - Now on Idgames!

[DJVCardMaster]

@waverider what I didn't like is that it kinda feels out of place, like two levels mixed into one, but know I understand the reason. And why map11 felt the same as the second part of the first level in Style. By the way is not by any means bad or mediocre.

 

Also I consider save buffer a big issue since most people tend to save and leave when they end their playing session,if this is a Vanilla mapset you should respect the fact that there is going to be people playing in Vanilla.

Imagine this scenario, a guy just completed 3 or 4 big levels and just wants to leave and play later. He proceeds to save and the game suddenly crashes, loosing all his progress.

I personally hate things like that, 

I would quit playing  that wad for a really long time.

That actually happened to me when playing Hell Revealed a long time ago, never touched it again, hated it.

I feel like I wouldn't be the only one

 

Oh, and by the way, Alien Vendetta is for limit removing ports, not Vanilla.

Edited January 17, 2019 by DJVCardMaster

[valkiriforce]

Alien Vendetta was definitely vanilla - there were quite a few troubles that followed this including the author of MAP20 painstakingly editing the map to fit within the blockmap limits as well as other difficulties, but that's beside the point.

 

I can understand not wanting to go against the savegame buffer, since during Reverie's development I did everything I could to avoid hitting that limit only to find there were two maps where this was not possible despite showing restraint in detail. For the most part I'm not concerned about this not only because of modern ports but since we're mostly focusing on small/medium-size maps with a few bigger ones in the mix, so I would think most maps wouldn't have this problem. We've obviously already hit that limit in some maps though so I'm not going to make a case about it, and it'll definitely be listed as a bug in the text file come release day.

 

@waverider I'm curious what your thoughts are on the state of MAP01; I didn't want to make any changes without you, as I'm also fond of how the map came out (probably because I've known it this way for well over a year now) but it would probably break the pacing for the next few maps that won't feature the arachnotron as well as the rocket launcher. Kind of been hard to say on my part.

[Moustachio]

@DJVCardMaster Thanks for the review of Map08! About the crushers: the ghost monsters are intentional with the goal being that a savvy player could stop the crushers quickly with the contraption on the blue platform. Perhaps the crushers activate too soon after walking into the room though?

 

I'll add some more cover and rockets for potential ghost monsters as well as more cover towards the end so it's not quite so slaughtery.

[dt_]

Just confirming that I wasn't complaining with regards to the early use of the trons and RL, I think the map is a great opener and a lot of fun to play.  I was just wondering how much leeway is given in these circumstances; I've got an RL (and about 10 rockets total) in map03 which I hope isn't too much of a problem

[obake]

12 hours ago, waverider said:

 

@obake: I'm glad you seemed to really like Map01! As stated, it's a collaboration between me and valkiriforce, we each made 50% of it. Speaking of it, it was me who's guilty of charge about the arachnotrons and rocket launcher (I made the second half, after the spiral staircase). What did you think of those items, hit or miss? Seems a few people would like to see those items/monsters removed.

 

What do you guys think? Should we care about the save game buffer or not?

I think having those is fine. I feel the Arachnotrons fit well into the maps space, without being too difficult to take care of. As far as save game buffers, with Chocolate Doom I simply removed the Doom savegame buffer limit, as will most people probably. So I wouldn't worry too much about those.

[pcorf]

13 hours ago, waverider said:

@pcorf: Wow, those screens looks awesome! :)

 

Hopefully they're not too deceiving and the map ends up playing awesome in the end.

[obake]

Map 08: Winter Stronghold by The Mysterious Moustachio

This one definitely has a Tricks and Traps vibe, and not just because of the music.

 

The setup of the map is a little strange, and not in a bad way. Areas like the Yellow Key room and the outside hall surrounding the Blue Key stand out in terms of design, being aesthetically fairly simple but also pleasing.

 

Gameplay is fine for the most part, though there may be a few too many Chaingunners for my liking. I also am not a fan of the final stretch, with the crusher room and that huge open hallway with all of the barrels. It felt extraneous, especially with so many Viles. However, it does not do much to hurt the map. Perhaps nixing a Vile and providing some more armor bonuses in the last hall would ease the frustration. 

 

Overall, not my favorite of the set, but still fun.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2019 by obake

[NuMetalManiak]

Hi, so I played a random map, actually two

 

MAP21: Disaster County

 

Layout is excellent, allows for a lot of movement and chaos since you can release monsters anywhere. Gameplay is pretty decent on all difficulty settings, although the PEs on UV are much easier to tangle with in the plasma gun area than the cacos on the lower settings. Missed the green armor on my first playthrough. It's a very SSG and chaingun-oriented set due to having loads of hitscanners and not much other ammo, but I don't think it really needs more balance. Looks like the exit requires one of two keys, but since you can get the red much earlier than the blue, I feel liable to run for the exit then. Quick and dirty. I'll check out the other ones I guess.

 

MAP11: The Glacier Base

 

This map is only really challenging and interesting on UV, I guess that's fine because it's fairly pedestrian and easy enough on the other settings despite being long. Nothing memorable aside from the Tricks and Traps-style fight and the area at the southernmost end where it's likely to make the rockets fly. It's pretty easy to adapt to each encounter. Kinda boring but I didn't run into any major problems.

Edited January 18, 2019 by NuMetalManiak
another one

[DJVCardMaster]

I noticed that Valkiriforce really likes plasma gun.
Better keep it hidden on map24 ;)

[obake]

Map 11: The Glacier Base by Waverider

I agree with @NuMetalManiak on a lot of points. This level is not among my favorites, but it does have some interesting stuff going for it.

 

I actually like the (excuse the pun) chill atmosphere during the first part of the map. The Cyberdemon, for example, is not too threatening but can still be a nuisance, plus there are enough other monsters around to cause trouble should you try running away. I noticed a lot of Sergeants behind barred windows, which were actually more of a threat than the Cybie.

 

Things pick up at the halfway point with the SpiderMasterminds. After their encounters, though, things start dragging. A lot of the encounters are not that memorable, and the progression can be difficult to figure out. On that note, however, there is one aspect that is actually quite nice, and that is there are multiple teleports which lead right to key doors, making traveling easier to manage.

 

Not my favorite map, but it has its moments.

[CorianderCastor]

Save game buffer is too much of a headache to deal with. It's dynamic after all. Not to mention that Chocolate Doom has an option for that. People who play on era appropriate hardware know what they're getting into. Sure it would be nice to never walk into thou shalln't save, but it's just too limiting and toolless.

 

This looks amazing by the way.

[DJVCardMaster]

Another Update! (Still no need to change the link at the OC post, autoupdated)

Finally I can upload something. Still has some issues, I'm really awaiting for the FDA someone mentioned before on this topic.

I did a combination of ideas for the cyberfight, so it gets more dynamic, but it may change.

I removed lots of unfair enemies and replaced some other to not to create patterns on them. Also removed most of the "block monster" linedefs so they flow more on the map. Added more ammo on some other parts, and removed most of the unnecessary stimpacks. Be sure to check it out 

[Pegleg]

I recall one of the levels in Doom 2 (Suburbs, I think) had the potential to trigger the save game buffer limit when played on UV. I may be remembering that incorrectly, but Doom 2 is, by definition, vanilla. So, perhaps we're overthinking it with worrying about whether a vanilla megawad should adhere to the savegame limit.

 

Of course, I could also be wrong, but that's a different story. We still may be overthinking the savegame buffer issue.

[gaspe]

1 hour ago, Pegleg said:

I recall one of the levels in Doom 2 (Suburbs, I think) had the potential to trigger the save game buffer limit when played on UV.

Many vanilla maps can potentially break the savegame buffer limit since it takes in account also the spawned projectiles at the moment. It can happen anytime, at the right conditions for sure, so it's pointless to think about it so much imo.

[DJVCardMaster]

2 hours ago, gaspe said:

Many vanilla maps can potentially break the savegame buffer limit since it takes in account also the spawned projectiles at the moment. It can happen anytime, at the right conditions for sure, so it's pointless to think about it so much imo.

TIL that can happen on Vanilla, well, that can change my opinion on it

[NuMetalManiak]

6 hours ago, DJVCardMaster said:

Another Update! (Still no need to change the link at the OC post, autoupdated)

Finally I can upload something. Still has some issues, I'm really awaiting for the FDA someone mentioned before on this topic.

I did a combination of ideas for the cyberfight, so it gets more dynamic, but it may change.

I removed lots of unfair enemies and replaced some other to not to create patterns on them. Also removed most of the "block monster" linedefs so they flow more on the map. Added more ammo on some other parts, and removed most of the unnecessary stimpacks. Be sure to check it out 

Played your map on three difficulty settings.

 

MAP24: Alexandria's Library

 

Overall it's average. Design is pretty meh, gameplay is generally good except for a few areas which I just found boring instead of frustrating like the marble room with six mancubi on UV which I did some hide and seek on and the red room with barons on blocks. Gotta agree with valk on the plasma gun secret. Also the "Keep silence" room, uh, I don't know what was supposed to be done but I ran for the two teleporters, hit the switches, then went back and started shooting, it's the most difficult fight because of the cyber and revenants but manageable still. Unsure what was supposed to be the idea there since I could probably start shooting right away if I had the ammo when I got there. Don't really have any suggestions, except put an impassable/block monster flag on the cage line in the first room so the imps don't fly out when you shoot them dead (this happened once).

[DJVCardMaster]

43 minutes ago, NuMetalManiak said:

Don't really have any suggestions, except put an impassable/block monster flag on the cage line in the first room so the imps don't fly out when you shoot them dead (this happened once).

Strange, it was always impassible, I gonna check that out.

Edited January 19, 2019 by DJVCardMaster

[Philnemba]

Been a week since I last updated my progress on Map 02: About 80% done :)

 

 

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP07 Carnage Facility

 

The name makes perfect sense. It's a lot harder than the other maps I've played so far, and like MAP21, there's quite a few ways to cause chaos in the nonlinear layout. Blue key area is pretty cool. Not sure about the teleporting arch-vile near the beginning, but oh well. Doesn't look like a lot needs to be done unless you want to consider savegame buffers or something.

[slayer's]

It still lacks areas and level 12 will be finished ah yes and the music too :)

[waverider]

On 1/17/2019 at 6:15 AM, valkiriforce said:

I'm curious what your thoughts are on the state of MAP01; I didn't want to make any changes without you, as I'm also fond of how the map came out (probably because I've known it this way for well over a year now) but it would probably break the pacing for the next few maps that won't feature the arachnotron as well as the rocket launcher. Kind of been hard to say on my part.

 

Yeah I see what you mean. Either way is fine with me, I'm sure there are other ways to keep the biggest room (with arachotrons) busy/interesting. Should we decide to remove them as well as the rocket launcher then?

Edited January 19, 2019 by waverider

[waverider]

On 1/18/2019 at 4:58 PM, NuMetalManiak said:

MAP11: The Glacier Base

 

This map is only really challenging and interesting on UV, I guess that's fine because it's fairly pedestrian and easy enough on the other settings despite being long. Nothing memorable aside from the Tricks and Traps-style fight and the area at the southernmost end where it's likely to make the rockets fly. It's pretty easy to adapt to each encounter. Kinda boring but I didn't run into any major problems.

 

Thanks for the feedback. I guess the issues on skills 1-3 being not interesting enough may have something to do with me often being extra careful not to make those skills too difficult. But that doesn't mean I want them to be boring on those skills. (just easy/medium) ;)

 

If you can come up with some, I'd be happy to hear some more direct advice on how to improve on what you considered not so good all in all.

 

On 1/18/2019 at 7:19 PM, obake said:

Map 11: The Glacier Base by Waverider

I agree with @NuMetalManiak on a lot of points. This level is not among my favorites, but it does have some interesting stuff going for it.

 

I actually like the (excuse the pun) chill atmosphere during the first part of the map. The Cyberdemon, for example, is not too threatening but can still be a nuisance, plus there are enough other monsters around to cause trouble should you try running away. I noticed a lot of Sergeants behind barred windows, which were actually more of a threat than the Cybie.

 

Things pick up at the halfway point with the SpiderMasterminds. After their encounters, though, things start dragging. A lot of the encounters are not that memorable, and the progression can be difficult to figure out. On that note, however, there is one aspect that is actually quite nice, and that is there are multiple teleports which lead right to key doors, making traveling easier to manage.

 

Not my favorite map, but it has its moments.

 

Cheers for feedback. Do you have any specifics on some of the encounters that wasn't too memorable? What areas were confusing? Are there other things you would like to see improved?

[Juza]

Began working on MAP13: Disgust. I'm having NaZa help me with MAP19, which is about half complete.

[waverider]

Map24: Alexandria's Library:

 

- I played on UV only. First off, nice music track! It's from Memento Mori 1 right? (Yeah I just had to show off, didn't I. :P )
- Pretty looking starting room, I always like "cut out" pieces from flats, like with those pieces of wooden floor! Nicely shaded staircase in sector 23! I like the sign on the wall in S35. Also fond of the S57 library room, it's nice as it is when you begin the map but it's a really cool thing I think when all of the bookcases lowers to the ground later on! Just a nitpick about that though, when the bookcases are lowered, the walls does look slightly empty imo. Add a bit of wall detail to make the room great!
- Sector 74/80 areas looks alright, but some more color contrast could look nice here I think. Gameplay wise, it's cool though, I like the imp ambush.
- Sector 154 is a nice looking room. Good secret in here as well, the clue is adequate.

- It's a nice touch that you use colored PANEL textures wherever a key is needed. An unusual but nice trick.

- The blue key room could use a little more sector and wall detail I think. The revenant ambush was cool though.
- Sector 220 is a pretty room. It's tempting to punch the imps which I'm guessing was intentional. :) Fun stuff!
- S237 looks good as well. Nice room with a desk and chair in S111, it's a clever clue in regards to the secret here. Nice star near yellow key.
- I'm also fond of the chapel room! Nice atmosphere here. And secret 242 is clever, nice clue. I like that this secret is quite spacious too, it's nice to vary closet secrets with more spacious ones I think. 
- It's another nice touch that you have a second, more dark and sinister chapel room too. ;) Like a twin chapel, the first one with regular crosses on the walls, and the second one with upside-down ones, cool stuff! :) It's just a shame that the arch-vile can be killed so easily, it's not much of a threat currently.
- 100% Kills, items and secrets was possible.
- I found no HOM's or VPO's.

 

- Cool "Keep silence" sign, inventive! It's also a good looking room! It's cool also that you get to revisit the "dark chapel", but this time from above! It's a good thought that you can't backtrack from the cyber at all, but I wish there was a way to do it after you've killed everything in the room, how about adding a teleporter back out that will be revealed after pressing the two switches that reveals the exit switch? Just a thought if you're up for allowing backtracking.

- I did found a handful of problems in the final room as well: 
  * I noticed there is a soulsphere on skill 1-2 but a megasphere on skill 3-4.
  * The final switch (linedef 3439) can be pressed even if sectors 184 and 299 are up.
  * The block sound effect near the red key could be done more effectively, you should change them to instead appear on linedefs 2830 and 2833 for instance, since they're located after the fall down and not before, otherwise, it will be possible to fight the cyber from the safety of the red door.

 

All in all I really liked this map! It had nice and fun gameplay, good atmosphere and nice overall visuals!

Edited January 20, 2019 by waverider

[DJVCardMaster]

1 hour ago, waverider said:

Map24: Alexandria's Library:

 

- I played on UV only. First off, nice music track! It's from Memento Mori 1 right? (Yeah I just had to show off, didn't I. :P )
- Pretty looking starting room, I always like "cut out" pieces from flats, like with those pieces of wooden floor! Nicely shaded staircase in sector 23! I like the sign on the wall in S35. Also fond of the S57 library room, it's nice as it is when you begin the map but it's a really cool thing I think when all of the bookcases lowers to the ground later on! Just a nitpick about that though, when the bookcases are lowered, the walls does look slightly empty imo. Add a bit of wall detail to make the room great!
- Sector 74/80 areas looks alright, but some more color contrast could look nice here I think. Gameplay wise, it's cool though, I like the imp ambush.
- Sector 154 is a nice looking room. Good secret in here as well, the clue is adequate.

- It's a nice touch that you use colored PANEL textures wherever a key is needed. An unusual but nice trick.

- The blue key room could use a little more sector and wall detail I think. The revenant ambush was cool though.
- Sector 220 is a pretty room. It's tempting to punch the imps which I'm guessing was intentional. :) Fun stuff!
- S237 looks good as well. Nice room with a desk and chair in S111, it's a clever clue in regards to the secret here. Nice star near yellow key.
- I'm also fond of the chapel room! Nice atmosphere here. And secret 242 is clever, nice clue. I like that this secret is quite spacious too, it's nice to vary closet secrets with more spacious ones I think. 
- It's another nice touch that you have a second, more dark and sinister chapel room too. ;) Like a twin chapel, the first one with regular crosses on the walls, and the second one with upside-down ones, cool stuff! :) It's just a shame that the arch-vile can be killed so easily, it's not much of a threat currently.
- 100% Kills, items and secrets was possible.
- I found no HOM's or VPO's.

 

- Cool "Keep silence" sign, inventive! It's also a good looking room! It's cool also that you get to revisit the "dark chapel", but this time from above! It's a good thought that you can't backtrack from the cyber at all, but I wish there was a way to do it after you've killed everything in the room, how about adding a teleporter back out that will be revealed after pressing the two switches that reveals the exit switch? Just a thought if you're up for allowing backtracking.

- I did found a handful of problems in the final room as well: 
  * I noticed there is a soulsphere on skill 1-2 but a megasphere on skill 3-4.
  * The final switch (linedef 3439) can be pressed even if sectors 184 and 299 are up.
  * The block sound effect near the red key could be done more effectively, you should change them to instead appear on linedefs 2830 and 2833 for instance, since they're located after the fall down and not before, otherwise, it will be possible to fight the cyber from the safety of the red door.

 

All in all I really liked this map! It had nice and fun gameplay, good atmosphere and nice overall visuals!

Thanks for the feedback, I'm adding a little bit more of detail on the map, specially on some of the areas you pointed out
-Fixed the early switch press at the Lecture hall (Cyber room)
-Added a teleport for backtracking when the fight is over.

And yes, music is from Memento Mori, map10.

I also changed textures here, but I'm not sure about this change, what do you guys think?

Edited January 20, 2019 by DJVCardMaster

[Khorus]

Seeing quite a few orthogonal maps, don't be scared to experiment with shapes for your areas :)

 

Making good progress myself, lots of moody lighting.

 

 

 

 

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP27: Bitter Waters

 

Yet again, very action packed with Plutonia vibes and semi-nonlinear. Pretty good slot to put it in considering how hard it was on just HMP (again I played on easy, medium, and hard). Hitscanners really slow down the gameplay at times though. Tough usage of barons. This level could probably use a second megaarmor, that's about all I can say.

[pcorf]

A screenshot from the final area of my map (29). It is an underground arena-like area where you'll fight against two Cyberdemons and various other monsters. The Cyberdemons guard a switch that allows access to the exit.

Edited January 20, 2019 by pcorf

[pcorf]

13 hours ago, DJVCardMaster said:

And yes, music is from Memento Mori, map10.

 

Certainly one of my favorite songs from Memento Mori. The Wind is a masterpiece of a song composed by Mark Klem.

[waverider]

13 hours ago, DJVCardMaster said:

Thanks for the feedback, I'm adding a little bit more of detail on the map, specially on some of the areas you pointed out
-Fixed the early switch press at the Lecture hall (Cyber room)
-Added a teleport for backtracking when the fight is over.

And yes, music is from Memento Mori, map10.

I also changed textures here, but I'm not sure about this change, what do you guys think?

 

All sounds and looks like good changes to me! :)

 

@pcorf: Totally agree about The Wind being one of the best songs from MM1. I recall another favorite being the somewhat sad sounding Map21 tune.