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Doom 64 coming to PC and modern consoles?


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Yes, but not by much. I think the run speed for turn is just about what the basic turn for PSX Doom was. I still believe PSX basic turn is still a lot faster than run+turn for Doom 64, but probably not.

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16 hours ago, famicommander said:

Doom 64 uses analog movement controls, so you'd be much better served using an analog stick as opposed to a d-pad.

 

One of the first things I did on Doom 64/Switch was remap fwd/back/strafe-left/strafe-right onto the d-pad.

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27 minutes ago, Jon said:

 

One of the first things I did on Doom 64/Switch was remap fwd/back/strafe-left/strafe-right onto the d-pad.

 

I may swap the trigger and shoulder button functions...right now I have SPEED set to the left trigger (I took the autorun function off the left stick clicker, as I kept accidently toggling it during play), and FIRE set to the right trigger.  The problem is that I keep accidently hitting the shoulder buttons (weapon cycle), often at the worst possible times.  That's definitely messed up some level plays for me.    

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The secret maps are almost too well hidden, especially Hectic. I would be surprised if someone back in the day found all of them with no help.

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48 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

The secret maps are almost too well hidden, especially Hectic. I would be surprised if someone back in the day found all of them with no help.

 

No way that anyone found Hectic on his own.  

 

The others...maybe.  Most players would've figured that those four switches in the Holding Area must lead to some reward...but finding that hidden exit (to Outpost Omega) would've been a serious PITA, trying to find exactly the right order to hit the switches...24 possible combos of 1, 2, 3, 4...not like you could save within a level back then, so if you didn't get it right, you couldn't just re-load from that point to immediately try again.  Assuming someone was willing to go in a "logical" order to try to figure it out on his own, he likely would've gotten the right combo on his 13th try:

 

1 2 3 4 ; 1 2 4 3 ; 1 3 2 4; 1 3 4 2; 1 4 2 3; 1 4 3 2

 

2 1 3 4 ; 2 1 4 3 ; 2 3 1 4; 2 3 4 1; 2 4 1 3; 2 4 3 1

 

3 1 2 4 (ding ding ding) 

 

Hard to imagine that too many players were willing to take 13 stabs at having to clear that level over and over before they consulted some guidebook.  I sure wasn't.

 

For the hidden exit to The Lair (from Altar of Pain), I'm guessing that rock that is clearly meant to look like an arrow would get some people to wonder what's up; of course, that rock wall that the arrow points to doesn't give away anything.  But as long as you take a "What the hell, might as well see what that arrow is pointing to" approach, that secret exit isn't really too hard to find.  Much easier than trying to dial up the right combo of switches.  

 

I haven't yet reached Spawned Fear in this go-round, but finding that secret exit wasn't too too bad IIRC (which I probably don't).  

Edited by Devils950003

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The barrel gimmick leading to Hectic is just too obscure. I wonder if the mappers actually expected anyone to find it on their own or assumed people would buy strategy guides or use the Internet...

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8 hours ago, Devils950003 said:

 

No way that anyone found Hectic on his own.  

 

The others...maybe


Indeed Hectic is difficult to find and probably only found through guides. I was always puzzled why I was teleported back to the beginning with that secret when I was young.

For Outpost Omega I think sometimes, if not all the time, when you make a bad switch choice it will close all the switches and spawn lost souls. So it would only take a max of 4 tries to figure out the first switch was, on average 2 or 3, then so on for the rest. But that still means an average of 7 tries prolly. Luckily with level restarts/passwords and that level isnt hard, so I think it could be done within 2 hours or even less. Did I do it when I was young? No haha.

With the Lair, I discovered it without a guide. For some reason the Baron in that secret exit got alerted and was fireballing me from behind the wall, which is how I seen it. I think I might have shot a rocket or something in there by accident? Or my memory is wrong as I also recall shooting plasma and not seeing it hit a wall which gave it up (bad memory).

And you're right about In The Void. There is a sound which really gives it away. Probably the easiest secret level to find, which I dont mind since its such a cool level.

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3 hours ago, Immorpher said:


Indeed Hectic is difficult to find and probably only found through guides. I was always puzzled why I was teleported back to the beginning with that secret when I was young.

For Outpost Omega I think sometimes, if not all the time, when you make a bad switch choice it will close all the switches and spawn lost souls. So it would only take a max of 4 tries to figure out the first switch was, on average 2 or 3, then so on for the rest. But that still means an average of 7 tries prolly. Luckily with level restarts/passwords and that level isnt hard, so I think it could be done within 2 hours or even less. Did I do it when I was young? No haha.

With the Lair, I discovered it without a guide. For some reason the Baron in that secret exit got alerted and was fireballing me from behind the wall, which is how I seen it. I think I might have shot a rocket or something in there by accident? Or my memory is wrong as I also recall shooting plasma and not seeing it hit a wall which gave it up (bad memory).

And you're right about In The Void. There is a sound which really gives it away. Probably the easiest secret level to find, which I dont mind since its such a cool level.


Forgot all about that, re:  the Holding Area switches and the lost souls; you’re right, I do kinda remember that now.  Yeah that would streamline things for sure (probably to just three guesses...assuming the “logical path”, starting with Switch 1 or Switch 2 would’ve led to instant failure, with Switch 3 allowing a chance to complete the sequence...once that happened, if you simply went left-to-right for the remaining switches, you’d then hit Switch 1, then Switch 2, then Switch 4).  I’m guessing most players would have still just looked that one up though, after a couple of failures.

 

You jarred another memory loose...I DO remember being fireballed from that wall, back in the day.  I thought “huh?”, looked at the map, saw that the rock in front of the wall looked like an arrow, and already knowing that there was a secret level exit (but not where it was), I had a feeling that would be it (or at the very least, a very cool secret).  

Edited by Devils950003

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10 hours ago, GoatLord said:

The barrel gimmick leading to Hectic is just too obscure. I wonder if the mappers actually expected anyone to find it on their own or assumed people would buy strategy guides or use the Internet...

An insanely obscure secret exit in the very first map that unlocks a Features menu and such?! It was obviously meant to sell strategy guides.

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On 3/23/2020 at 9:08 PM, Edward850 said:

If it's authenticity you wan't, then turning on bilinear filtering would do the exact opposite. Doom64 never had bilinear filtering and all 2D elements (the HUD, menus, etc) were unfiltered. You might be thinking of emulators, which got N64 graphics very wrong.

Isn't this a bit of a technicality, though? They're likely unfiltered because on the N64 they were drawn 1:1 to the screen with no scaling, so there's no reason to filter them. It wasn't designed for the prospect of higher resolutions in mind. If it ran at a higher resolution I imagine filtering would have been enabled for weapon sprites/HUD elements. I wouldn't call it any more unauthentic than having a resolution higher than the N64 native.

Edited by Tarvis

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6 hours ago, Tarvis said:

Isn't this a bit of a technicality, though? They're likely unfiltered because on the N64 they were drawn 1:1 to the screen with no scaling, so there's no reason to filter them. It wasn't designed for the prospect of higher resolutions in mind. If it ran at a higher resolution I imagine filtering would have been enabled for weapon sprites/HUD elements. I wouldn't call it any more unauthentic than having a resolution higher than the N64 native.


Doom 64 is a highly unfiltered game for the N64. The N64 offered many kinds of filtering and overall screen filtering. Mario 64 had the overall screen filtering, but it was disabled for Doom 64. In fact I tried to see if I could go through the ROM filtering options to disable everything I can (http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=3892.75). In every option Doom 64 seemed to have the filtering turned off, even though other games which preceded it often had them. The only thing that wasn't turned off was the texture filtering. Which I think (could be wrong) if games fully utilized the graphical hardware, it wasn't an option to turn off (not even in Quake 64 which had some filtering options in its menu). But this is just semantics, having extra options doesn't hurt regardless.

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8 hours ago, Tarvis said:

They're likely unfiltered because on the N64 they were drawn 1:1 to the screen with no scaling, so there's no reason to filter them.

Nah, we know it's intentional based on the code and design. For example the UVs and offsets of the weapons are built to take advantage of the lack of filtering.

Edited by Edward850

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I agree the UV and offsets are intentional because they wanted the sprite to appear 1:1 on the screen as it is stored in the graphics and not get shifted into subpixels. Any filtering would make it look lower quality than the graphics stored in the data. This no longer applies when the game is drawn at a higher resolution because the resulting aliasing artifacts would be greatly diminished. I disagree that the sprites being sized and positioned to be 1:1 at 240p necessarily suggests that they would want it to be blocky if there was a high res option. Both of us are purely speculating on that regard since the original game never had a hi res mode for Memory Pak. I think its a stretch to assume nothing about this would have changed had they decided to support a 480p mode. I would speculate even further that forcing blocky scaling is even less 'accurate' behavior to achieve crispness as the pixels are not evenly integer scaled at 1080p and result in uneven sizes, which I believe is precisely what Midway were trying to avoid with their UV setups for 2D graphics.

 

I can tell this was also a pretty last-minute decision considering that most of the promo images across the various store pages all show the weapon sprites being filtered. It should at least be an option.

Edited by Tarvis

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On 4/14/2020 at 8:34 PM, Tarvis said:

I can tell this was also a pretty last-minute decision considering that most of the promo images across the various store pages all show the weapon sprites being filtered.

It wasn't, those screenshots were taken in advance, and the store page was up months before release. It was a bug due to a simple typo in the renderer setup that happened to still be in the build they used to take the screenshots.

Edited by Edward850

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Unfortunately I’m getting strong motion sickness from this and can’t really play it, at least with the switch docked. I think I respond badly to 60fps

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13 hours ago, Jon said:

Unfortunately I’m getting strong motion sickness from this and can’t really play it, at least with the switch docked. I think I respond badly to 60fps


Marble Blast Ultra (Xbox 360) had the same effect on me.  Thought it was a freak thing, but the same thing happened when I tried to play it again.  
 

I’ve only played Switch D64 in handheld mode...don’t think I’ll ever bother playing it on a big screen.  
 

Just finished my first playthrough (including the Lost Levels).  Started up a second one and it’s definitely a lot more fun not having to fumble about with some of the puzzles.  Though some new levels to play through and explore are better than no new levels, damn is the last level of the Lost Levels a serious letdown.  Feels like a lazy thrown-together mashup of No Escape and The Absolution...with SO much ammo (especially energy cells) and Invincibility Spheres scattered about that it’s not much of a challenge at all.  And of course, to release the Mother Demon’s sis, you have to have a fully upgraded Unmaker, which means the big “climactic” final battle is anything but.  A shame, because the first five Lost Levels were pretty solid additions, and clearly some effort was made into creating them.  The final level just feels extremely uninspired by comparison...No Escape from Absolution, Part Deux.

Edited by Devils950003

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On 4/18/2020 at 3:47 AM, Jon said:

Unfortunately I’m getting strong motion sickness from this and can’t really play it, at least with the switch docked. I think I respond badly to 60fps

Try playing with the FOV slider (which is in the switch version) Lower values will make you appear to move slower.

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5 hours ago, Tarvis said:

Try playing with the FOV slider (which is in the switch version) Lower values will make you appear to move slower.

 

Thanks for the tip, I’ll give that a try!

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I have a question about the Steam release: what kind of options does the game give you for turning speed? As a keyboard user I tend to feel left out with those options only applying to the mouse.

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@valkiriforce Using the run/speed button will make you turn a little faster than if not using that button but it's not quite the same as the original.

I'm used to playing D64 on an emulator and I have d-pad left and right set to Q and E and analogue stick left and right set to the left and right arrow keys and it feels just like original experience but when I tried the re-release it didn't feel quite right if you were using the keyboard only. You can adjust the sensitivity but it still doesn't feel right to me so I guess you're better off using a mouse but for me personally I'm not used to playing Classic Doom that way.

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@valkiriforce

From what I have tested, a mouse running 800 dpi turning and turning with the Arrow keys (as preset stuff), is roughly the same. It is more then manageable to play like this. M&K setup is slightly faster only for exact movement. Controller setup has toggleable turn speed via the joysticks, so it and Mouse are 1 to 1.

 

Just adjust the keybindings to what makes you work on the game, you should be good, outside of your computer complaining of sticky keys and such. Don't forget to bind Auto Run to something else, most likely a press once and done. For some reason Caps lock does NOT want to make it a functional binding (in my case, it kept turning off as I pressed once for on.)

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Just listened to some of Aubrey Hodges’ D64 Extended Remixes of the original soundtrack...takes what was already very good and sends it all into the stratosphere and then some.  Several bonus tracks too, so you can substitute some of these newer tracks for “repeat” track levels, to give those levels even more of a unique feel.  Next playthrough will definitely be to THIS soundtrack (the remix tracks account for over EIGHT HOURS of music).  Amazing the heart, soul, and love Hodges puts into his work.  

Edited by Devils950003

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6 hours ago, Devils950003 said:

 Several bonus tracks too

Between the "regular" album and the "extended" one, there's 11 bonus tracks. (It's not the same bonus tracks in both.) Same deal with the PSX Doom soundtrack album, so that's 22 bonus tracks total. Oddly enough, though, he missed the ten tracks from PSX Final Doom.

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