let's stop calling them "things"

[anotak]

for those out of the loop, this is what a "thing" is in doom context.

 

this "things" shit sucks.

 

it's so hard to talk about anything related to doom mapping or coding without running into ambiguity. i just want to say a thing, without, people misunderstanding. see, it happened right there in that sentence.

 

every engine since then has called them actors or entities or whatever. pick one that you like, take it for a spin.

 

doom's been around for 25 years. the longer we wait to rip this bandaid off, the worse it'll be.

[Doom Marine]

Actor

[Linguica]

You'll never rip off the bandaid, though. The "thing" terminology is all over the source code and that's never going away.

[anotak]

the source code mostly calls them "mobj"s tho

[Doomkid]

Yep, I always call them actors. “Things” is a dumb word for them, since “things” can either be living enemies or inanimate objects, it feels weird to call an imp a “thing”. I remember finding it a strange choice of word when I first got into DeHackEd modding.

Edited August 21, 2019 by Doomkid

[MTrop]

I'd bet, though, on a forum of makers and modders, that people knew what you were talking about before they clicked on the topic (I did), so it's still not that bad of a term.

 

A Thing is an informational spot that can either spawn an actor or be the spot of a special action (player starts, teleporter destination, map spot, polyobject anchor, etc.). It doesn't necessarily mean a 1-to-1 Actor, Object, Decoration, or Item. It may even be "the spot that objects are created and respawned at." It's kind of a catch-all term. What are they? I dunno. Things!

 

"Map Object" is better, but "Things" are what they're called in Doom and every editor that edits it, and "Things" they'll unfortunately remain.

 

[Not Jabba]

Alternative terms:
-"Delights"

-"Tangibles"

-"Friends"

-"Associates"

-"The artists formerly known as things"

-"Rare candies"

-"Bees"

-"Most favored children"

-"Unmentionables"

-"Fruits of one's labour"

-"The inevitable"

[anotak]

1 minute ago, MTrop said:

I'd bet, though, on a forum of makers and modders, that people knew what you were talking about before they clicked on the topic (I did), so it's still not that bad of a term.

 

A Thing is an informational spot that can either spawn an actor or be the spot of a special action (player starts, teleporter destination, map spot, polyobject anchor, etc.). It doesn't necessarily mean a 1-to-1 Actor, Object, Decoration, or Item. It may even be "the spot that objects are created and respawned at." It's kind of a catch-all term. What are they? I dunno. Things!

 

"Map Object" is better, but "Things" are what they're called in Doom and every editor that edits it, and "Things" they'll unfortunately remain.

 

 

those are all actors or entities

[MTrop]

2 minutes ago, anotak said:

 

those are all actors or entities

 

Actors imply those all "act," which they don't. "Entity" would probably be better.

 

Postcount++

[anotak]

sure but most people use the word "thing" just in general aside from doom in regular conversation to refer to things that are not Things. it leads to ambiguities all the time and it sucks and is annoying.

it also makes variable naming awful.

 

i do tend to use "entity" but zdoom and unreal and a few others use "actor". i respect any choice that is not "Thing".

[DynamiteKaitorn]

Just use "Entity" when using a blanket term, "Enemy" or "NPC" for actors that move around, "weapon" for guns, "health" for health, "armour" for armour, "ammo" for ammo, etc...

 

Or do what I do and stick with Thing. :3

[komojo]

The name comes from the THINGS lump in the WAD file. That's what most editors call them, so I don't think it's going to change any time soon. I'm fine with calling them Things, the word is used often enough in Doom editing that it's usually easy to recognize the context.

[Dark Pulse]

How about let's not.

 

This is Doom's engine. They're things. The end.

 

 

Edited August 22, 2019 by Dark Pulse

[Test Tickle]

Ok, "thing"

[Big Ol Billy]

Ok, good points, but here's the Thing:

 

Spoiler

 

[Reisal]

Objects.

[valkiriforce]

Call them neighbors. Love thy neighbor.

[xvertigox]

How often are you trying to explain Doom modding/mapping to outsiders that we need to replace the term entirely? Just call them entities for that one conversation you had and it's fine.

[anotak]

im not talking about with outsiders. im talking about with other mappers and coders. not to mention just the annoyance with variable names

 

the thing is that the word thing means many things. this is a real thing that i have to deal with when i talk about anything to do with things. or when i have to read things that other people have to say about things

Edited August 22, 2019 by anotak

[HavoX]

If not things... stuff?

[Bauul]

I always called them Things with a capital T to differentiate from general objects. 

 

For example, any Doom mapper would understand the following sentence: "There are lots of things you can do to add decoration to a room. Adding detail Textures and Things both work well"

[Mk7_Centipede]

 

 

 

[Zanieon]

5 hours ago, Not Jabba said:

Alternative terms:
-"Delights"

-"Tangibles"

-"Friends"

-"Associates"

-"The artists formerly known as things"

-"Rare candies"

-"Bees"

-"Most favored children"

-"Unmentionables"

-"Fruits of one's labour"

-"The inevitable"

 

5 hours ago, Not Jabba said:

-"The inevitable"

Sure let's wipe half of the source code :V

[Phobus]

They'll always be Things. I've been going to "Things Mode" by pressing T in map editors almost as long as I've been playing Doom. It's just the terminology where this game is concerned, and covers everything from a puddle of blood that is so simple it, inexplicably, is not affected by gravity, to the most complex of custom monsters.

[anotak]

not worried too much about existing source code, just new code

 

if we cared about the existing source code we'd just as easily call them "mobj"s but i bet like half of yall have never even heard that term

Edited August 22, 2019 by anotak

[Dark Pulse]

Someone needs to make a map where all the Things are in a bar. Like Club Doom from the PSX version, but instead it's playing 80s speed metal.

 

The bar's name?

 

Mob J's, of course.

[DecoyZulu]

This sounds like an argument Carmack and Romero had for months during Doom's development.

 

I think Carmack won for a reason.

[Eurisko]

I didn't even know this was a thing. 

[anotak]

32 minutes ago, DecoyZulu said:

This sounds like an argument Carmack and Romero had for months during Doom's development.

 

I think Carmack won for a reason.

carmack called them entities in every game he worked on that came after actually

[DecoyZulu]

13 minutes ago, anotak said:

carmack called them entities in every game he worked on that came after actually

Fair enough. I suppose for new code, it's all well and good. But everyone used to these older engines is probably more familiar with thing. You've got to expect that they're not going to just change the word because someone else got confused once or twice.