Does anyone else think this game is going to suck?

[Taurus Daggerknight]

3 minutes ago, Super Mighty G said:

This is the most nonsense statement I've seen here. You don't have to buy the game. You can say it's garbage, that's all well and fine. But to sit there and belittle the amount of effort and technical talent that clearly went into this game and say it deserves NOTHING is pure ignorance. 

 

This. A million times this. 

 

Anyone who says that Eternal is a mere expansion knows nothing of development. Which is shocking considering that half of the Doomworld community are modders who have at least a modicum of knowledge of what it takes to make at least simple game ready assets.  Nothing of what we've seen in Eternal thus far seems to be shared with Doom 2016 (graphics assets wise), and we've seen a ton of mechanical additions to the game so far too. 

 

If the game itself turns out to be fun or not remains to be seen, but lets not talk shit about the actual effort and resources that are being poured out here. And say what you will about "graphics not making a great game", but lets not confuse that with "lazyiness by the devs". Graphics development is fucking hard word and involves a shit ton of effort. Lets not be arrogantly dismissive of that just because its not classic MS DOS Doom. 

[Taurus Daggerknight]

On another note; the Revenant control segment. Not that it was the most exciting part for me, but I totally get why it's in there. It probably serves as a chance for people to familiarize themselves with demon controls for both Invasion and Battle Mode, which makes sense.  

 

As for the fortress; am I the only one getting Quake 1 vibes? I know it's not really the same thing, but Quake 1's hub basically served as your "catch a breath and choose a level" center. I was almost wondering if the fort here wasn't also where we'll choose our difficulty ala Quake. I assume it'll be your mission select zone at any rate. Not sure why anyone would think its sissy either way. I mean... you're king of your own castle. That generally speaks to ones power, not weakness.... 

[Chezza]

Shame some people do not like the direction of Doom Eternal. For me, I'm loving it the more information released. I will be selfish today and say I'm glad to be me and and have something to really look forward to. No changes to please the others are needed.

Edited January 21, 2020 by Chezza

[warman2012]

47 minutes ago, Super Mighty G said:

This is the most nonsense statement I've seen here. You don't have to buy the game. You can say it's garbage, that's all well and fine. But to sit there and belittle the amount of effort and technical talent that clearly went into this game and say it deserves NOTHING is pure ignorance. 

Tl,Dr: The world will not give you the time of day if you do not achieve expectations, no matter how much effort.

 

Ignorance? Sir, the notion that this is nonsense could be farther from the example in modern life. That example is that you can work hard all you want and never get ahead because all your efforts did not bear fruit. Want a real life example? Les Miles, the former head coach from LSU got the sack because he could not WIN. The LSU football team had great winning streaks in the past and his efforts were well known, when he won. The minute he failed, he was gone, no award, no recognition, just a boot out the door. Forgotten in this harsh world.

 

Are we going to give Bethesda the same recognition for Fallout 76? Sure, that game was a technical marvel, but its STILL riddled with bugs and exploits that constantly break the game. Bethesda has been very dodgy about giving refunds for shoddy work. Are you still going to suggest that effort deserves praise if it not only accomplishes nothing of what it promised, but actually causes more headache than what should have been possible?

[Taurus Daggerknight]

3 minutes ago, warman2012 said:

Tl,Dr: The world will not give you the time of day if you do not achieve expectations, no matter how much effort.

 

Ignorance? Sir, the notion that this is nonsense could be farther from the example in modern life. That example is that you can work hard all you want and never get ahead because all your efforts did not bear fruit. Want a real life example? Les Miles, the former head coach from LSU got the sack because he could not WIN. The LSU football team had great winning streaks in the past and his efforts were well known, when he won. The minute he failed, he was gone, no award, no recognition, just a boot out the door. Forgotten in this harsh world.

 

Are we going to give Bethesda the same recognition for Fallout 76? Sure, that game was a technical marvel, but its STILL riddled with bugs and exploits that constantly break the game. Bethesda has been very dodgy about giving refunds for shoddy work. Are you still going to suggest that effort deserves praise if it not only accomplishes nothing of what it promised, but actually causes more headache than what should have been possible?

 

I keep seeing people liken iD's future work with Bethesda Softworks bungling of a completely unrelated and far more experimental project. A year in and I still do not understand where the confusion keeps coming in. 

 

Once again.... iD is a completely different and unrelated studio from Bethesda Softworks. The ONE and ONLY link is the publishing arm. Which does not actually have a long history of releasing poor products. A few misfires aside, they actually have a pretty solid track record thus far, whether their games are specifically to your taste or not. 

 

And as for Id failing or not, fact is, Doom 2016 did sell extremely well. It was a pretty high quality product on release. Saying it was anything less just because it wasn't classic Doom is like insisting Doom 3 was a piece of shovel ware, because #NOTMYDOOM. Which is to say; Doom 2016 did end up meeting the expectations of being a high quality, multi-platform FPS release of 2016 that made the turbulent development of Doom 4 ultimately worth it for the company. Call it  a great game or a poor shooter all you want, but saying it was a "failure" is just flat out wrong under all considerations, certainly if you measuring example is "coach who didn't get a win". 

[NoXion]

The Doom Slayer can move quickly, but so far as I understand he can't cross dimensions unaided. So a hub fortress makes sense to me. The Doom Slayer isn't the kind of guy to ignore any useful tools he can get his demon blood-soaked hands on.

They've taken Doom in a new direction with this generation of games. I like it, but I've noticed a vocal minority who don't. I don't think their issues are entirely unreasonable, but the legitimate ones seem to be largely based on personal taste.

For example, the platforming. Now from what I've been able to see of Eternal's platforming, none of it holds any issues for me. I've had years of extensive experience on the most popular and frustrating puzzle maps on Sven Co-op servers. The stuff in Eternal looks positively forgiving by comparison.

But some people hate platformers, and I get that. I don't often play platform games myself, so they can be frustrating. Even if you're pretty good at platforming, you might think that the real action of the game is being unduly interrupted. Maybe these people might be convinced by id software's execution of Doom Eternal, maybe not.

I'm really looking forward to it, I think that while it's possible they could still properly fuck this up, it seems very unlikely.

[Super Mighty G]

20 minutes ago, warman2012 said:

Are we going to give Bethesda the same recognition for Fallout 76? 

No, because unlike that game you can SEE the effort in Doom Eternal. And comparing Doom Eternal to Fallout 76 is frankly insulting. The difference in quality could not be more different. Again, trash the game all you want, but ignoring objective facts because of your bias is just laughable. 

[warman2012]

19 minutes ago, Super Mighty G said:

No, because unlike that game you can SEE the effort in Doom Eternal. And comparing Doom Eternal to Fallout 76 is frankly insulting. The difference in quality could not be more different. Again, trash the game all you want, but ignoring objective facts because of your bias is just laughable. 

Oh but I CAN compare F76 to Eternal considering that A: Id software and Bethesda are branches of the same company, Zenimax Media. Zenimax's brand is on all these games, meaning that if their past games were crap, their future games will also be. And B: several of their last games such as Rage, Fallout 76, Dishonored, etc have been riddled with game-breaking bugs and in some cases sheer unplayability over the last 10 years. So the objective facts are that Zenimax aka Bethesda aka ID have falling quality standards.

Edited January 21, 2020 by warman2012

[Taurus Daggerknight]

1 minute ago, warman2012 said:

Oh but I CAN compare F76 to Eternal considering that A: Id software and Bethesda are branches of the same company, Zenimax Media. Zenimax's brand is on all these games, meaning that if their past games were crap, their future games will also be. And B: several of their last games such as Rage, Fallout 76, Dishonored, etc have been riddled with bugs and in some cases sheer unplayability over the last 10 years. So the objective facts are that Zenimax aka Bethesda aka ID have falling quality standards.

 

Not sure if you meant Dishonored 2 or not, which I did not play. But Dishonored 1 came out in a pretty good state, and I never had an issue with it. From what I've heard, Dishonored 2 had some glitches, but not exactly "unplayable" as you're suggesting. Rage 1 was pre-Bethesda , or at least its development was, where as Rage 2 seems to have had a  pretty good state on release. 

Meanwhile, you're happily ignoring the Wolfenstien games having been released in good condition. They aren't my favorite games, but they were hardly technical messes. Prey was just fine by all accounts. Doom 2016 also came out in  pretty stable condition. Which again, really makes me wonder where the hell you're getting this whole "iD's quality standards are falling". Barring Rage, what exactly did iD release that was such  a technical nightmare? 

 

Also, here's a serious question to everyone who keeps bringing up Fallout 76; how many of you were even the sorts looking to play that game in the first place? According to so many people here, the only example of a great and legendary game is classic Doom, which makes me wonder why half the community keeps acting like Fallout 76 was a personal slight to them or had anything even remotely to do with what they want or like. If you're a huge Fallout player who was really looking forward to 76, sure, I get that, but honest question, how many of you were actually watching for it, and how many are just invoking its name to prove a flawed point? 

 

[RaikohZX]

12 minutes ago, warman2012 said:

Oh but I CAN compare F76 to Eternal considering that A: Id software and Bethesda are branches of the same company, Zenimax Media. Zenimax's brand is on all these games, meaning that if their past games were crap, their future games will also be. And B: several of their last games such as Rage, Fallout 76, Dishonored, etc have been riddled with game-breaking bugs and in some cases sheer unplayability over the last 10 years. So the objective facts are that Zenimax aka Bethesda aka ID have falling quality standards.

You're not even cherry-picking correctly. Only Bethesda's games have genuinely been absolutely fucked, everything else is a little buggy or stable. Fallout 76 may have been bad, but do not assume id, Arkane, Machinehead and everyone else are suddenly going up in the toilet bowl all because of one damn game.

[Super Mighty G]

2 minutes ago, warman2012 said:

 Zenimax's brand is on all these games, meaning that if their past games were crap, their future games will also be.

This is completely flawed logic. The equivalent of saying Devil May Cry 2 is bad so Devil May Cry 5 is bad. Here's a fact: Doom 2016 was not a failure even if you say it was. And given what we've seen Doom Eternal will not be either. Something is not an objective failure because you don't like it.

[Super Mighty G]

16 minutes ago, Taurus Daggerknight said:

Also, here's a serious question to everyone who keeps bringing up Fallout 76; how many of you were even the sorts looking to play that game in the first place? According to so many people here, the only example of a great and legendary game is classic Doom, which makes me wonder why half the community keeps acting like Fallout 76 was a personal slight to them or had anything even remotely to do with what they want or like. If you're a huge Fallout player who was really looking forward to 76, sure, I get that, but honest question, how many of you were actually watching for it, and how many are just invoking its name to prove a flawed point? 

 

I myself had no stakes in the Fallout series. Since 76's launch, and condition to this day, is what I would describe as disastrous I couldn't help not hearing about it from just about all the content creators I follow. 

 

Edit: Something else occurred to me. Just last year EA, one of the most parasitic publishers around, released a little game called Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order and it was actually decent to everyone's surprise. A LICENSED PROPERTY game published by EA was GOOD. 

Edited January 21, 2020 by Super Mighty G

[Taurus Daggerknight]

6 minutes ago, Super Mighty G said:

I myself had no stakes in the Fallout series. Since 76's launch, and condition to this day, is what I would describe as disastrous I couldn't help not hearing about it from just about all the content creators I follow. 

 

Edit: Something else occurred to me. Just last year EA, one of the most parasitic publishers around, released a little game called Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order and it was actually decent to everyone's surprise. 

 

Oh I know everyone's heard of the drama around 76 (which I personally feel like has been blown out of proportion, going by what I've seen of my father-in-law's play through of it). I only mentioned what I did because of how passionately everyone keeps bringing it up as if they had first hand, personal experience with the disaster, and can clearly see all the issues it had permeating all the things they are seeing now. 

 

Spot on about Jedi Fallen Order there.

 

[DoctorObviously]

When the internet hivemind decides that something is a masterpiece, no argument is articulated well enough to warrant a reconsideration, or at the very least a calm discussion. Any thoughts, mild dislikes or flaws are immediately stamped hard on the throat as "nitpicks", which makes talking about anything on the internet a complete futile endeavor. 

 

I chipped in just to make myself present as being somebody among the minority. The answer to your question is yes. Yes, I do think DOOM Eternal will suck. id seemed to have something truly wonderful in their hands and twisted it into a parody of itself. It sacrificed atmosphere, immersion, mystery and even the main character with Eternal. It's a wry, annoying feeling to have waited so long for fireworks, only to see that it's a mere dud. 

[Super Mighty G]

18 minutes ago, DoctorObviously said:

When the internet hivemind decides that something is a masterpiece, no argument is articulated well enough to warrant a reconsideration, or at the very least a calm discussion. Any thoughts, mild dislikes or flaws are immediately stamped hard on the throat as "nitpicks", which makes talking about anything on the internet a complete futile endeavor. 

Very rude to suggest most people here are completely unreasonable. 

[Taurus Daggerknight]

1 hour ago, DoctorObviously said:

When the internet hivemind decides that something is a masterpiece, no argument is articulated well enough to warrant a reconsideration, or at the very least a calm discussion. Any thoughts, mild dislikes or flaws are immediately stamped hard on the throat as "nitpicks", which makes talking about anything on the internet a complete futile endeavor. 

 

I chipped in just to make myself present as being somebody among the minority. The answer to your question is yes. Yes, I do think DOOM Eternal will suck. id seemed to have something truly wonderful in their hands and twisted it into a parody of itself. It sacrificed atmosphere, immersion, mystery and even the main character with Eternal. It's a wry, annoying feeling to have waited so long for fireworks, only to see that it's a mere dud. 

 

No one's stomping on the mere notion that Eternal isn't going to be everyone's definition of amazing. What's contested are arbitrary takes on the developers ability to deliver quality based on the work of some unrelated teams on unrelated projects.  Quality in this case being completely separate from "is this my definition of a fun game". 

 

Honestly, as much as I am super keen on Eternal, I do frankly share your own reservation on the lack of heavy atmosphere too, and I'm sure lots of people do. It just isn't a deal breaker for me personally, and I can still have fun in the world they have crafted, even if it isn't the most serious of the lot. 

 

[Ferk]

Talking about something that hasn't even released yet is a futile endeavor.

I take it that some people might decide that something is "a dud" or "a masterpiece" based on superficial impressions from a few trailers, but definitely not everyone is like that.

Edited January 21, 2020 by Ferk

[whatup876]

8 hours ago, Gerardo194 said:

Then Doom 2 is just a stand alone expantion to Doom 1. hehe

Hmmm, I could be possible, Doom Eternal might be using a few scrapped content from Doom 4. Do you know Doom 2 RPG??? IMO that game contained some spoilers to Doom 4, there an unused texture in game that later appeared in Doom 2016 and some community member like @whatup876 have found some elements from the aforementioned game present in Doom Eternal trailers.

 

Wasn't it the cross symbol in the Mayrks' place that looked like that cross in the Holy Water Pistol?

Now that's a pistol they could have used.

[Knee Deep In The Fan]

[D4NUK1]

People will call this now the new era of Doom so i don't trink will suck.

The new videos show how awesome it's feel to play and i hope it's a glorius masterpiece

[spineapple tea]

I think this is gonna get game of the year.

[Wereknight]

On 11/20/2019 at 7:00 PM, tsunstealer said:

I’m not here to start any drama, but seriously...

But seriously, you did. Why would you do that, WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT. 

 

In all seriousness being afraid of DE to suck like FailOut’76 is like helping Randy doing magic card squirt trick with saw blades and fail miserably.

 

... the fuck I just said...

[Nevander]

Based on the latest gameplay I've seen, I'm pretty on the fence about Eternal actually.

 

Don't get me wrong, it looks fun, but there's some things that don't look like my idea of a good Doom game, namely:

• The majority of levels look even more arena styled than 2016. At what point does it become Quake 3 Arena but with a Doom coat of paint?
• The platforming. Wasn't a big fan of it in 2016 and now it looks even more abundant. Why does Doom need platforming to begin with? I don't know.
• The dependence on glory kills to survive. I'm one of those people who never really liked the glory kill system in the first place. I just want to be able to shoot the Demons and they die. It's looking like it's even less of an option in Eternal.
• It's almost too colorful. Hard to explain. I think the colors on the HUD are messing with me too. The HUD in 2016 was great.

[VanaheimRanger]

23 minutes ago, Nevander said:

• It's almost too colorful. Hard to explain. I think the colors on the HUD are messing with me too. The HUD in 2016 was great.

This gripe at least can be easily remedied as the HUD is fully customizable!

 

 

As for the rest, those points are valid.  I personally don't like platforming in classic Doom, but in 2016 I didn't mind it since it isn't really the same type of game.  I didn't mind the glory kills either, it added more depth to the combat for me in a way.

[Caffeine Freak]

11 hours ago, warman2012 said:

Why do I see people rewarding bad games with shitty gameplay mechanics by over praising the visuals? 

 

 

Can I ask exactly what it is you find off-putting about Doom Eternal, from what's been shown so far? Because I'm reading over this thread, and despite the length of discussion you've had with other members here, the only specific complaints I see from you regarding Eternal are:

 

1) the Fortress of Doom references being gay sissyboy shit or whatever, and 

 

2) you think playing as a demon is stupid. 

Edited January 22, 2020 by Caffeine Freak

[warman2012]

7 minutes ago, Caffeine Freak said:

 

 

Can I ask exactly what it is you find off-putting about Doom Eternal, from what's been shown so far? Because I'm reading over this thread, and despite the length of discussion you've had with other members here, and regarding Eternal, the only specific complaints I see from you are:

 

1) the Fortress of Doom references being gay sissyboy shit or whatever, and 

 

2) you think playing as a demon is stupid. 

Need I also add the platforming elements and the swinging around like Tarzan with that shotgun grapple gun thing? I swear, now that I say it, this Doomguy looks more like a Batman reject just thinking about it. The game adds way too many elements that go overboard like that obnoxious flamethrower cannon on the shoulder and the arm blade he has which are ripoffs of the Predator series. The grapple hook and Fortress of Bullshit are ripoff elements of Batman. Its all too awkward for my tastes. Add my dislike of the crutch that is the health-based gore system and the redesign of the armor suit and you have most of my complaints there.

 

Most, but not all. Does that help?

Edited January 22, 2020 by warman2012

[wheresthebeef]

I'm liking what I've been seeing from these previews.

 

I don't think its going to suck, and judging by the fact that Zenimax/Bethesda invited so many people out to try out 3 hours of the campaign a couple months before release tells me they don't think its going to suck either. Remember, after Doom 2016 came out Bethesda was very stingy with preview/review copies going out before their games released for a while.

Edited January 22, 2020 by wheresthebeef

[jazzmaster9]

I was planning on buying this (along with Doom 2016) just because i really enjoyed what ive played of D2016 so far.

 

But now i have more incentive to buy so i can "encourage" id software to make "Garbage" or so they say.

[Komenja]

53 minutes ago, warman2012 said:

Need I also add the platforming elements and the swinging around like Tarzan with that shotgun grapple gun thing?

"Oh no! More mobility options for combat encounters and level traversal! How terrible!"

 

Quote

I swear, now that I say it, this Doomguy looks more like a Batman reject just thinking about it.

He doesn't even have a cape. Or wear black.

 

Quote

The game adds way too many elements that go overboard like that obnoxious flamethrower cannon on the shoulder and the arm blade he has which are ripoffs of the Predator series.

Secondary weapons were already in Doom 16 and even Doom-engine games like Heretic and Hexen. It's literally the grenades from D16, but now you don't put your main gun away to use them and they have more utility. The armblade exists because people complained the glory kills took too long and it allows for some faster kill animations. Any resemblance to the Predator is a bonus in my opinion.

Quote

The grapple hook and Fortress of Bullshit are ripoff elements of Batman. Its all too awkward for my tastes.

The meat hook is actually a callback to early versions of Doom, and the fortress is a hubworld. You know, like in Quake? Hexen? Except with easter eggs. The name is a bit silly, I agree with you there.

Edited January 22, 2020 by Komenja

[Taurus Daggerknight]

Honestly, the blade reminded me more of Bloodrayne, or if we're taking the real world into account, pata swords. Not that I mind wherever it drew influence from... more melee is awesome in my books. 

 

It's actually kind of funny... before Eternal was announced, I was playing Shadow Warrior 2 a bit. At the time, I kept thinking that the dash and melee were the only two things I felt were missing from Doom 2016, and how cool it would be to see them in a sequel. That, and if the Praetor suit had on-board weapons. 

 

Turns out, I got exactly what I wanted I guess :D