What should stay, what should go? ::MAJOR SPOILERS::

[PlayfulPuppy]

IF YOU DONT WANT TO LEARN ANYTHING ABOUT THE ALPHA, DO NOT READ THIS





In the final version, what do you think should stay from the alpha, and what should go?

DEATH ANIMATIONS
At the end of the alpha where you get eaten by the Hellknight, I hope we see more of these! I'm hoping Id didn't just put that in for a 'coolness factor' with the E3 demo, I hope they happen more often. :)

SHOTGUN RELOAD
The reload sound should SERIOUSLY be beefed up... I mean, come on! It's just a 'click-click' sound at the moment. :P

I LIVE AGAIN!
The Zombies getting back up is probably THE most annoying thing next to respawn points in games. In Quake 1 it wasn't so much of a problem, because you were always armed to the teeth with high-explosives, but if you're down to only a few pistol shots and all the enemies keep re-animating, it's going to get HELLA annoying!

What about you guys, what are your opinions?

[Shaviro]

uhmm...The demons don't respawn, and you can kill the zombies.

[PlayfulPuppy]

I was more talking about them doing respawning in other games (NOLF2, Project IGI... GAH!).

But the Zombies come back to life after a while... sometimes you have to 'kill' them 3-4 times before they stay down.

[Disorder]

PlayfulPuppy said:

But the Zombies come back to life after a while... sometimes you have to 'kill' them 3-4 times before they stay down.

That only adds to the fearfactor IMO. When you've gunned down a zombie you'll always keep watching the body to make sure he's dead. That causes my heart to beat faster :)

[WhilelM]

Disorder said:

That only adds to the fearfactor IMO. When you've gunned down a zombie you'll always keep watching the body to make sure he's dead. That causes my heart to beat faster :)

100 % agree with you.

[Dima]

Actually, I think it's more related to some bug on the first map...

If you kill them on all the other maps, they don't get up at all!

[GazzaQ]

i think its a good idea beacuse you will have to watch your ammo and be more tactical or use other methods of keeping them away (using crates to block them etc)

[SledGeHammer]

its no bug.. id already stated that the zombies stand up after some sec, only some zombies dont stand up again cus it could form a problem if they follow you trough a door and totaly messing up a cutscene

[The_Tonx]

Disorder said:

That only adds to the fearfactor IMO. When you've gunned down a zombie you'll always keep watching the body to make sure he's dead. That causes my heart to beat faster :)

Yea, mine too..
I REALLY like it =)

But there are 2 things I DO NOT like AT ALL:
1) My shitty PC can't handle this alpha
2) The blood should stay FOREVER on the floors/ceilings/objects..

Well.. I can make the 1) better, but I don't think that id's going to do anything with the current blood FX :(

[PlayfulPuppy]

Making blood stay forever is unreasonable and would make the game unstable.

People think it's an easy task, but then would complain when their systems crash after the memory limit has been reached.

[The_Tonx]

PlayfulPuppy said:

Making blood stay forever is unreasonable and would make the game unstable.

People think it's an easy task, but then would complain when their systems crash after the memory limit has been reached.

It can be done more easy.. I'm not an expert, but they can do it without 'renembering' all the other splats are..

Quake, Quake II and Quake III a-like games have a 'lightmap', right? They can make a "bloodmap" as well.. It doesn't make game slower..

[PlayfulPuppy]

You have to draw this 'bloodmap'... that takes time.

Not to mention, the main problem isn't speed, but memory. 'Bloodmaps' would only make that matter worse.

[The_Tonx]

PlayfulPuppy said:

You have to draw this 'bloodmap'... that takes time.

Not to mention, the main problem isn't speed, but memory. 'Bloodmaps' would only make that matter worse.

Yea I know.. It would be a hell of a huge image to keep in memory, but that's one way..

[Prime]

Personally, I have yet to see something in Doom 3 that I would like to have removed. I love the sounds, especially the sound of the swinging lamps or the buzzing lightbulbs, because they add to the ambient creepiness already created by the dark lighting. Oh, and about the zombies reviving themselves, I think it's a great idea. I mean, the entire time I played the alpha my friend and I were swearing in surprise and fright everytime we'd see yet ANOTHER zombie come around the corner that we could swear was already dead...

oh, and that demon moves FREAKIN fast.



All in all, I'm pleased.

[Hicks]

are the Zombies in the Alpha like the ones of Quake? i mean do they DO the same stuff.....

[LorD BaZTArD]

No, The Alpha zombies are more mobile, and they don't chuck rotting bits at you. They have a melee attacking style.

[dsm]

Prime said:

Oh, and about the zombies reviving themselves, I think it's a great idea. I mean, the entire time I played the alpha my friend and I were swearing in surprise and fright everytime we'd see yet ANOTHER zombie come around the corner that we could swear was already dead...

Do they ALL revive themselves? And do they keep reviving each time you've shot the same zombie?
Because if you can't kill the zombies, then I'd say that it sucks - I want to be able to really kill stuff so that it stays dead - no point in gunning them down if they don't stay down.
If they only get back up like two or three times then it's ok - then it's actually perfect.

[PlayfulPuppy]

dsm - I thought you were the 'Hear no alpha, See no Alpha' types?

Or am I thinking of someone else?

[Shaviro]

dsm said:

If they only get back up like two or three times then it's ok - then it's actually perfect.

You said it...

[The_Tonx]

dsm said:

Do they ALL revive themselves? And do they keep reviving each time you've shot the same zombie?
Because if you can't kill the zombies, then I'd say that it sucks - I want to be able to really kill stuff so that it stays dead - no point in gunning them down if they don't stay down.
If they only get back up like two or three times then it's ok - then it's actually perfect.

You CAN kill 'em.. Sometimes you just have to do it 3-4 times before they don't stand up again.. sometimes they 'die' after 1 "round" :p

I like that, because you can never be sure if the zobie wakes again and going to hit you or is he dead.. Everytime I kill one of those I stand about 10 seconds near to him just to make sure he's done.. =)

[Dark-tenshi]

i doubt that we can fire rocket at zombie to make sure that it won`t revive again.

[Tetzlaff]

Dark-tenshi said:

i doubt that we can fire rocket at zombie to make sure that it won`t revive again.

Why this? Do think the gibs will revive and attack you? Or that a rocket doesn´t gib a zombie?

[Disorder]

I think I've read a statement of Carmack somewhere saying that you cannot gib enemies in Doom III.

[Prime]

Disorder said:

I think I've read a statement of Carmack somewhere saying that you cannot gib enemies in Doom III.

Outrageous!!! Gibbing is a Doom trademark, John!!!

[Dark-tenshi]

You can`t gib enemy in DOOM3!!! OH THIS GAME WILL SuXoR lol

/clams down
Err link please?

[LorD BaZTArD]

I think, that statement's been misinterepreted. I remeber ID saying that they won't have removable limbs, so no dismemberment, but I can't remember anything about no gibbing. Also, there is a folder in the alpha labeled as Gibs. Now, that could be anything, although I would assume gibs will be possible. Plus, how would a zombie or an imp survive a rocket intact, the imp has an advantage, he's agile, so he would be hard to hit with a rocket, but he's taken down with two or so shotgun blasts. If you can kill him with a shotty, but not gib him with a rocket....something is wrong there.

[uniQ]

Disorder said:

I think I've read a statement of Carmack somewhere saying that you cannot gib enemies in Doom III.

cant gib enemies in the full version...argh...damn - i was full of hope that this one will be implemented the right way, e.g. you shoot off a zombies leg, he tumbles down (skeletal animation!) and then still tries to crawl up to u. this would be very scary. you really have to shoot him to pieces until he stops coming at you.

i really hope id will put gibbing in. its not because i like to gib every enemy and paint the hallways red - its just for the realism and the freaky gfx. if ut2003 can do that then d3 should do this way better!

right now i am starting to get really worried about what's finding its way into the full game...questionable things imho are: gibbing, lack of ragdoll physiks (except for that experimental zombie model), mirrors that correctly display your current weapon and lightning (this one is not important for me), 5.1 surround sound not just for some "key"-sound sequences, lack of background music, shootable lightssources with the right physical behavior (eg. shoot lights out or shoot at lights and they start to swing), unkillable zombies, etc.

lets hope and pray that a lot of those issues will be done right in the final...take your time id and make it perfect!

[Wobbo]

PlayfulPuppy said:

Making blood stay forever is unreasonable and would make the game unstable.

People think it's an easy task, but then would complain when their systems crash after the memory limit has been reached.

thats just not true, have the engine keep track of added decals, not the actual pictures (which are obioulsy, already ALL loaded into memory anyway) but the places where blood lands (i.e. as set of coordinates on whichever texture). Its entirely possible and will probably happen in the real game.

The maximum amount of memory it could possibly take up would be about 1 extra megabyte and thats assuming the WORST

In fact the only reason it WASNT in quake 3 is because verybodys resapwning, in doom 3 even the zombies eventually dies

[Xzyl]

If it was just that easy dont you think that somone have done it by now.

[Wobbo]

Its been done in many games, an doom has abigger memory requirement than any game up to this point