What is the worst official Doom/Doom II/Final Doom level?

[Elio AF]

E2M9 of Doom (Honorable mentions include E1M5, E3M1, E4M6)

Map 21 for Doom 2 (Honorable mentions include map 9, 12, 16 and 24)

Map 18 for TNT (Honorable mentions include map 20, 21, 22)

Map 32 for Plutonia (don't @ me, I just don't like slaughter maps, imo carelessly placing enemies to make it "challenging" is bad map design) Though I am biased since I mostly dislike Plutonia's maps.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2020 by Elio AF

[doom guy66]

E4M1 mainly because it gives you almost no supplies and that one secret with Barons that doesn't have anything 

[FabulousDoom]

DOOM II Map19. What madman designed this level.

[KeaganDunn]

Ultimate Doom’s E4M1: Hell Beneath. It’s tough and crowded, and while I appreciate the challenge it provides, the severe shortage of health in this map makes you better off pistolstarting E4M2. It’s not too bad, though.

 

Doom II’s The Citadel. Where the hell am I going??!!!

 

Doom II’s MAP21: Nirvana. Well, this shouldn’t come as a surprise. I agree the level layout is hideous and it’s just a few random, mostly empty rooms. Doesn’t help when it’s the first map of the third episode. But at least it is a challenge, with hordes of monsters in most rooms.

 

I’ve liked Final Doom because of the concepts and TNT’s music, but the maps were pretty mixed and mostly forgettable, hence why I can’t point out particulars - TNT is usually just full of imps and hitscanners (simple enemies) and Plutonia was basically more annoying than anything (although I really did enjoy Go 2 It.)

 

I haven’t played enough Doom just yet to truly point out and appreciate level design and all...but the kind of gameplay I enjoy is very simple. Throw me in a room with 10 Cyberdemons with enough resources and room to move around, I don’t care. It’s fun, and it’s a challenge. Nonstop action, like the modern games, is what I enjoy most in classic Doom.

That being said, I love E2M9, E3M9, TNT’s MAP27 and MAP30, and Plutonia’s Go 2 It. Sue me.

Edited September 21, 2020 by Dunn & Dunn

[Firedust]

That bigass map from TNT

[Poncho1]

Administration Center is simply the worst. Despite the high-ish monster count, the map's so enormous that it doesn't feel dense, the design is simplistic, the progression is uninteresting and boring, plenty of parts feel slow as shit (that lift in the lava, for example), and the ending is so flat (and bigger than the main part of the level, btw). The ONLY fun part is BFG-ing the Imps at the exit. That's it.

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

On 7/7/2020 at 9:38 AM, Doomkid said:

I have a theory that people rarely ever mention E4M4 when these types of threads show up because it's so bland that it may as well not exist. Forgettable to the point that people don't even remember it when asked what the most forgettable maps are!

 

Map21 and E2M9 at the very least stuck with me for being "so shitty that I remember them clearly", so maybe there's a so bad they're good argument to be made there. Every mapper who's spent more than an hour fucking around in Doom Builder has made something better, more fun and more thought provoking than E4M4.

 

I couldn't remember the map either, had to google it. Turns out it's so forgettable that nobody even searches for it!

 

 

[Biodegradable]

6 hours ago, Dunn & Dunn said:

Doom II’s MAP21: Nirvana. Well, this shouldn’t come as a surprise. I agree the level layout is hideous and it’s just a few random, mostly empty rooms. Doesn’t help when it’s the first map of the third episode. But at least it is a challenge, with hordes of monsters in most rooms.

 

This 100%. As far as I'm concerned, Nirvana is guilty of the greatest sin of all when it comes to our collective interest: Making Doom boring. Absolutely disgraceful!

[spineapple tea]

E4M2 is hated on too much. It can be stupidly hard in places and unfair in most but it's honestly a welcome challenge being that most of the other levels are pretty easy. Plus I like the aesthetics.

[CyberDestroyer]

Barrels o fun looks fucking awful and i cant see why a place like that would be on earth.

"doom 2: hell on earth"

A lot of doom 2's levels are the designers screwing around.

[M_W]

I honestly didn't find the Pit that offensive. The layout is kind of weird and nonsensical, but I'll take it over the city levels any day of the week.

[Lila Feuer]

Did I ever say Fortress of Mystery? Because it's E2M9.

[BoxY]

I'd like to drop a +1 for E3M7, the product of the worst habits of Tom and Sandy's mapping styles combined, a truly unspeakable vileness. Lately I've been trying to beat the par times on every Ultimate Doom map, and so far I have them all for E1-3 except E3M7 because running it destroys my will to exist. Just the "essentials" progression walkthrough on the wiki is book length and borderline unreadable. Fuck that map.

[Chip]

I was so against Final DOOM originally. LoL. I don't change my answer, I still hate level 21, but I liked Final DOOM. I also don't know why I said Final DOOM sucked. I hadn't even played Plutonia at that point. LoL

[Smoothandz]

+1 for E3M1

After I finally took off the rose colored glasses, I realized how much I dislike the level. Pistol two Caco's? No thank you. Forced into a hallway full of Pinkies with no chainsaw? Naw. Small room full of enemies just begging for a rocket but don't have one? Miss me with that shit.

And I hate the fact that this was the first "Hell" level that I played. I remember thinking, "oh shit, I'm in HELL!!!" and being captivated by the whole idea. I guess I really let my imagination run wild and I just kinda forced myself to enjoy it. After playing so many different maps (and frankly better) this one just doesn't hold up for me.

[Juza]

Doom: E2M9 (Fortress of Mystery)

Doom II: MAP21 (Nirvana)

TNT: All of it

Plutonia: None of it

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

Ultimate Doom: Fortress of Mystery is the de facto worst level of the game, but at least it is a secret level that can be skipped. I believe E4M4 Unruly Evil is worse, because it can't be skipped. And it's just a boring, lazy, tiny, brown map that simply shouldn't exist. It's a turd in form of a Doom map.

Doom 2: The Chasm.

TNT: Habitat vs Baron's Den. Tough competition.

Plutonia: Anti-Christ.

 

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

7 hours ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

Ultimate Doom: Fortress of Mystery is the de facto worst level of the game, but at least it is a secret level that can be skipped. I believe E4M4 Unruly Evil is worse, because it can't be skipped. And it's just a boring, lazy, tiny, brown map that simply shouldn't exist. It's a turd in form of a Doom map.

Doom 2: The Chasm.

TNT: Habitat vs Baron's Den. Tough competition.

Plutonia: Anti-Christ.

 

 

Totally agree about FoM. On an unrelated note, your city maps in Hell on Earth Starter Pack are the best I have ever seen.

[TwilySparky]

E3M2, Slough of Despair

[HQDefault]

On 7/5/2020 at 9:05 PM, andrewj said:

Out of DOOM 2, the one I find least fun is MAP08 "Tricks and Traps".  Too many gimmicks, nearly every room is a poor space for fighting in, and the path to the exit is a real bastard when keyboarding (no mouse).

This is the one for me. It was the level that I realized Doom 2 was no longer interested in creating even remotely cohesive spaces, and was going to feel a lot more abstract and video-gamey.

 

It was just a big mess of corridors and gimmicks that weren't fun nor made for an interesting environment. Yuck.

[HQDefault]

On 7/7/2020 at 3:41 PM, I_Punch_Demons said:

Hands down E4M2 for me. Granted I pistol started it. That or Tricks and Traps from a pistol start. Or the "city" maps. I hate Chasm as well, but I would actually argue its a good map. But to me E4M2 was a map designed out of hate. That beginning is brutal with all the caco's and the forced pain sectors suck. Not to mention the trick secret to get passed the cyberdemon. 

Eh, it was really hard but it wasn't like E4M1 which just felt like a pain to try and complete. I remember enjoying it, although there were a couple really bizarre triggers here & there.

[NonniR]

Ultimate Doom: E4M4 Unruly Evil. Absolute travesty of a map, especially considering the rough, brutal awakening of E4M1 and E4M2. It's super short, no special architecture, boring fights, no puzzles worthy of mentioning. It feels like an incomplete, draft of a map that was shoehorned into Episode 4 just to increase the level count. Honestly, I hated it.

 

Doom II: Map 13 Downtown. While I can appreciate the attempt to create a  semi-realistic portrayal of a city it fundamentally failed at giving you any form of directions on where to go. Add to that the fact that you were constantly being sniped by Imps from high places. ... Ugh, awful. 

 

I am at work now but these were the ones that really stood out to me as being bad.

 

Unlike most, I loved E4M1 and E4M2. Such brutal but unique maps, not to mention the movement restrictions. Personally, I loved them.

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

1 hour ago, NonniR said:

Doom II: Map 13 Downtown. While I can appreciate the attempt to create a  semi-realistic portrayal of a city it fundamentally failed at giving you any form of directions on where to go. Add to that the fact that you were constantly being sniped by Imps from high places. ... Ugh, awful. 

I think Downtown is the most over-hated level of all times. The lack of direction may seem annoying for some, but for me I find it a nice break from all the previous videogame-y levels and encourages exploration in an adventure game sense.
And how can an Imp "snipe" you? They fire slow fireballs. Unless you literally stand still, they can't hit you. At least Sandy had the decency of not making them Chaingunners.

[NonniR]

40 minutes ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

I think Downtown is the most over-hated level of all times. The lack of direction may seem annoying for some, but for me I find it a nice break from all the previous videogame-y levels and encourages exploration in an adventure game sense.
And how can an Imp "snipe" you? They fire slow fireballs. Unless you literally stand still, they can't hit you. At least Sandy had the decency of not making them Chaingunners.

Ok yeah, snipe wouldn't be an accurate word for this. I mean that being shot at  from above from multiple Imps (some of which are above your line of vision, if playing without mouselook) is annoying as hell.

And yes, thank God for them not being Chaingunners. It would have been even worse.

 

But I imagine it is "over-hated" for a reason. I remember playing it for the first time, without ever having heard about it, and I didn't like it the first time around. Only later did I hear that so many others also didn't. I dont believe that's just by chance.

 

But like I said, I appreciate that Sandy tried to be different and create a more "realistic" map. I just dont think it was successful.

[Andromeda]

Am sad to see so much hate for E4M4 :( for me it's a fun, little breather level and one of the (few) highlights of the episode, shame about the bugged monster closets at the end.

Edited October 2, 2020 by Andromeda

[AinuTheTaken]

For me it was the skyscraper level in Doom 2. I just couldn't figure out what they were thinking with enemy placement, building placement, and teleporters in that level. Dead Simple seemed ok to me. 

[Devalaous]

Unruly Evil has always been the worst of the bunch, followed by Hell Keep. Hell Keep was so bad, id replaced it THEMSELVES in the Jaguar port. The only reason it isnt worse than Unruly Evil, is because its an episode starter, like Unruly Evil should have been. At least then the map might have been remembered as an easy start to a bunch of dickery, rather than being a random tiny effortlessly easy inclusion after THREE hard levels.