Is TNT Evilution good, bad OR okay

[Doomkid]

So I’m replaying TNT right now with the intent to play MM after. Im up to Map 11 and have died a handful of times. The only map that has me legitimately mad is Metal. The HUUUUUUGE room with 0 cover points can get fucked in it’s butt. There’s nothing this rage-inducing in MM! I had to use freelook to beat it or else that handful of shotgunners and chaingunners take you from 100 to 0 in seconds and there’s NO way to kill them other than freelooking at them and Chaingun sniping since they’re 900 miles away on their stupid perch or IDDQDing and getting up close like you want to. It doesn’t help that it’s a giant 2 mile wide building that is 1 ugly fuck sector with absolute zero on the way of visual interest. The nose dive in quality is so stark, I was never paying this much attention before so it never stood out to me.. I thought the 64 wide hallways were bad, but holy hell. Can’t wait to see what’s next!

Edited July 12, 2020 by Doomkid

[Maximum Matt]

Controversial opinion: I still love Central Processing and Administration Center (maps 20 and 21).  Big, sprawling multi-part bastards that end in giant arenas.  

And you gotta love how you can just run to the end of Habitat without even pressing the spacebar 

[Pirx]

42 minutes ago, Maximum Matt said:

Controversial opinion: I still love Central Processing and Administration Center (maps 20 and 21).  Big, sprawling multi-part bastards that end in giant arenas.  

And you gotta love how you can just run to the end of Habitat without even pressing the spacebar 

 

 

oh, those 2 are cool. despite being big and sprawling. they gave me a sense of adventure, like i was playing something with an unfolding story. especially 20 with its huge outdoor area. got lost in 21, and it was the first time i saw the message: "time sucks".

[Maximum Matt]

Yeah, I remember my last playthrough I got like 45 minutes or something.  It's got loads of interesting and contrasting areas, cool secrets (and non-secrets), and I don't care, fighting a teleporting cyberdemon is extremely tense and fun.

[head_cannon]

Administration Center is really cool in how it's got so many side-adventures to go on and how it gradually opens up. And it has the audacity to - after you've finally solved every part of this massive complex - dump you into a brand new outside space which is bigger than the entire complex that came before it, which is a crazy escalation. Another point in its favor is that it's one of the few maps that gives you a reprieve from the godawful grating TNT music.

 

...I still don't like Central Processing. For every fun moment of dungeon-crawling it contains, it has several more points of pure frustration, especially from the resource-starved Pistol Start. And getting stuck in a softlock behind a decoration in its final cliffside adventure sequence didn't help improve my impression of it one bit.

[ReaperAA]

6 hours ago, Doomkid said:

So I’m replaying TNT right now with the intent to play MM after. Im up to Map 11 and have died a handful of times. The only map that has me legitimately mad is Metal. The HUUUUUUGE room with 0 cover points can get fucked in it’s butt. There’s nothing this rage-inducing in MM! I had to use freelook to beat it or else that handful of shotgunners and chaingunners take you from 100 to 0 in seconds and there’s NO way to kill them other than freelooking at them and Chaingun sniping since they’re 900 miles away on their stupid perch or IDDQDing and getting up close like you want to. It doesn’t help that it’s a giant 2 mile wide building that is 1 ugly fuck sector with absolute zero on the way of visual interest. The nose dive in quality is so stark, I was never paying this much attention before so it never stood out to me.. I thought the 64 wide hallways were bad, but holy hell. Can’t wait to see what’s next!

 

There is a partial invisibility in an area near that final huge room that can help in surving the hitscan hell

[lwks]

On 7/12/2020 at 9:53 PM, Maximum Matt said:

Controversial opinion: I still love Central Processing and Administration Center (maps 20 and 21).  Big, sprawling multi-part bastards that end in giant arenas.  

And you gotta love how you can just run to the end of Habitat without even pressing the spacebar 

Wait, That's Illegal

Haha but in all fairness I like TNT, at least the first half of it, and I even like TNT as a whole more than Plutonia since TNT doesn't have a billion troll traps

Edited July 23, 2020 by lwks

[ViolentBeetle]

I finally made it past Metal, and ran into Crater, which feels very unfinished. You'd think the eponymous feature would have more than 5 monsters in it. And what's up with a completely featureless labirynth?

[Michael Jensen]

It's amazing. Easily the best IWAD. Music, atmosphere, huge, varied maps that are filled with interesting places to explore, it gets almost everything right. Only thing Plutonia does better are the monster encounters, but that's not the main point of Evilution. It's all about the wonder of exploration, great atmosphere and general mood. Plutonia is a collection of mostly small, characterless, green and brown arenas. Evilution is a work of art (besides Habitat, fuck that shit).  

[jazzmaster9]

1 hour ago, lwks said:

Wait, That's Illegal

Haha but in all fairness I like TNT, at least the first half of it, and I even like TNT as a whole more than Plutonia since TNT doesn't have a billion troll traps

The Troll traps atleast make Plutonia exciting and keeps you on your toes. TNT just drags on and just dull for the moss part.

[P41R47]

Sense of wonder and oppresive fear, or constant streesing and rewarding foreknowledge?

I seriously prefer the first couple, even when it might come as not too challenging sometimes.

[Faceman2000]

7 hours ago, A.H. Sankhatayan said:

It's amazing. Easily the best IWAD.

I. . . uh, what? What?

[Doomkid]

7 hours ago, A.H. Sankhatayan said:

It's amazing. Easily the best IWAD. Music, atmosphere, huge, varied maps that are filled with interesting places to explore, it gets almost everything right. Only thing Plutonia does better are the monster encounters, but that's not the main point of Evilution. It's all about the wonder of exploration, great atmosphere and general mood. Plutonia is a collection of mostly small, characterless, green and brown arenas. Evilution is a work of art (besides Habitat, fuck that shit).  

Despite disliking about 5-6 TNT maps and preferring Doom2 on the whole, this so perfectly sums up why I enjoyed TNT more than Plutonia. In terms of personality the difference is night and day in TNT's favor, and TNT has a much, much better sense of progression, giving the player the feeling that they're actually going somewhere, actually doing something beyond just "Doom for Doom's sake".

 

 

I've been shit talking poor old Plut a lot lately, but it does have some beautiful maps and really fun encounters. It is much cleaner than TNT, but almost to the point of sterility because everything is so visually similar all the time. In terms of combat, it taught me so much about what

not to do if you want your maps to actually be fun for the masses. No sarcasm at all, that is an extremely important thing to learn and Plut taught it well. I'd recommend everyone play it. (Just throwing this out there for the people who might think I hate Plutonia after all this crap I've talked. I don't!)

Edited July 24, 2020 by Doomkid

[GarrettChan]

On 7/12/2020 at 5:53 PM, Maximum Matt said:

Controversial opinion: I still love Central Processing and Administration Center (maps 20 and 21).  Big, sprawling multi-part bastards that end in giant arenas. 

I actually like those 2 maps too. Map20 is my favorite in TNT: Evilution.

[Juza]

It's fucking raw.