How Hard is doom eternal compared to the classic doom games?

[Hellektronic]

24 minutes ago, jazzmaster9 said:

No it just proves that. That is the most painless way to kill the marauder. I've seen players kill the marauder in various ways. 

 

This is the same people who cry that Dark Souls 3 is just "spamming twinblades, lazy" because they see how videos on youtube about it.

 

Even in classic Doom there are multiple ways to kill an Archvile... But the best way is to rush it with a BFG.

 

Ohh boy i was looking for this

"Its COD and bad" 😂😂

 

"Its lazy" "its generic" "its a cash grab"

 

"I dont like it but i need to have legitimate reason no to like it... Its the devs fault"

 

Its become a buzzword at this point for anyone not liking anything.

 

Wow- that's a pretty extreme case of generalization, isn't it?

 

It's called an opinion my friend, and I was merely stating mine. I actually like Call of Duty, and I don't think Eternal is a cash grab. Just because I criticize Eternal doesn't mean I'm "that" kind of person, does it? I preordered Eternal like a year before it came out, I play it every week, I run an Xbox club about Doom, and I have every right to state how I feel about it. Just as you do. So don't give me any of your generalization bullshit, "jazzmaster9". You want me to generalize you back? It'll get real nasty, real fast, based purely on how much I hate jazz music.

 

I don't hate Eternal at all. I just think marauders are... not like Doom. I hate that. But I think it's safe to say I still enjoy the game to a large extent.

 

[Hellektronic]

41 minutes ago, jazzmaster9 said:

See you on the next Doom Eternal Thread 

 

I saw you edit that in just now by the way. Nice finish, you really blew me away.

 

 

Serious question though, is Sekiro where that came from? I honestly wouldn't know.

Edited August 13, 2020 by Hellektronic

[jazzmaster9]

7 minutes ago, Hellektronic said:

. You want me to generalize you back? It'll get real nasty, real fast, based purely on how much I hate jazz music.

 

I don't really like Jazz music but nice try.

Cheers

[Hellektronic]

Marauders aren't worth forsaking the whole game.

 

I just... "strongly disagree" with whoever's idea it was to make them fight like that. I think I'd rather just shoot something til it died, call me old fashioned.

Edited August 13, 2020 by Hellektronic
Back on topic

[jazzmaster9]

1 hour ago, Hellektronic said:

Marauders aren't worth forsaking the whole game.

 

I just... "strongly disagree" with whoever's idea it was to make them fight like that. I think I'd rather just shoot something til it died, call me old fashioned.

I get where you are coming from.

 

The Marauder is a abrupt change of pace from the other demon's. But i wouldnt call that Lazy at all, not by ANY stretch.

A lot of effort went into making that boss as different of an encounter as possible.

[GuyMcBrofist]

I can beat Doom Eternal on Nightmare pretty easily now and I'm getting close to beating it on Ultra Nightmare.

 

I never got past Toxin Refinery in Doom on Nightmare. That was a long time ago but from what I recall there is way less room for mistakes there compared to Eternal.

[Mordeth]

is it possible you guys can discuss some shit which does not result in my inbox receiving reports? No need to be rude to other peeps just because they don't get or don't want to get your point of view.

[ZeroTheEro]

17 hours ago, Hellektronic said:

People always say to me: "but you can hit them around the shield!" Yeah, but not enough to really make a difference. You're still going to have to play their extremely linear little minigame of hitting them when they do their melee swings. So obviously, you benefit from using only instant high damage attacks like the super shotgun or ballista. Anything else, you might as well not even bother. The game forces you to fight marauders ONE WAY, and if you don't do it that ONE WAY, you're just going to take a lot of damage and probably die.

 

Watch that video above, it completely proves my point. Ballista, super shotgun, ballista, super shotgun, everybody does it the same.

 

To be completely honest, once you get the Marauder dance down pat, you don't even need to do the combo. Just a ballista would work fine.

[DooM Bear]

12 hours ago, jazzmaster9 said:

A lot of effort went into making that boss as different of an encounter as possible.

 

I agree and actually liked the Marauder as a boss :-D

 

He’s a bad ass and was a real pain to get the hang of at first which I really liked!

 

The big issue with the Marauders for me was when they start showing up amongst the other enemies. All the other bosses fit in well to the roster of enemies and help to make the fight more frantic where as the Marauders are the only enemy that needs to be taken down one on one.

 

When I play I’m usually flying around a breakneck speed, double dashing, spinning through the air in an indiscriminate hail of bullets. Then once everything else is dead around me, I jump down, move around slowly in their “dead zone” and precisely fire when the time is right to kill the Marauder.

 

They really just don’t fit in to the fights with other enemies around :-(

[Hellektronic]

4 hours ago, DooM Bear said:

They really just don’t fit in to the fights with other enemies around :-(

 

That's honestly kind of what bothers me, I guess- they're like a dramatic change of pace that doesn't really fit in with the rest of the gameplay.

 

In terms of laziness, I mean that in more of a concept kind of way- of course a lot of work went into programming such a complex enemy. BUT, the idea behind how it fights I think was more or less stolen from other games and repurposed for Doom. And that's not really like Doom, ya know? That's a very lazy way of conceptualizing an enemy, in my opinion. It's not really... pioneering, and I think of Doom as being just that: Doom doesn't steal ideas, it makes new ones.

 

So I think you can understand how I might compare that to how Call of Duty and other popular game developers operate- they're almost so cut-throat to outdo eachother that they steal ideas from eachother. They steal elements from another game without deeper thinking and try to duct tape it to their series like a shiny new addition. That really bothers me... even if the game turns out absolutely fantastic, the practice of blatantly stealing ideas from your competitors is... artless. And in a way, I kind of feel like that's the curse of the marauder.

 

Now I've never played or seen gameplay of Sekiro, but if this is the way those battles play out, and Eternal kind of pilfered that style, I say that's pretty sloppy. In this day and age I'm sure ideas for your game come from hundreds if not thousands of different people, but whoever had the idea for marauders I just... don't think was with the program in terms of past Doom games. It was trying so hard to change the formula, to be nuanced and unusual, that I think they totally lost track of what makes Doom... well... Doom, ya know? Just in terms of the marauders and gladiator. The rest of the game does a pretty damn good job reprising the gameplay of 2016, it just really bothers me that they felt they had to change anything so drastically as they did marauders.

 

At the end of the day, I think we can all agree that marauders don't fight like a Doom enemy. They fight like an enemy from a different game. And that just... I dunno... it really bothers me.

 

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Ultra nightmare is designed to be beatable. What's the point of competing it with the difficulty that was thought of in 10 mins to fuck with players who want a harder experience (Even if a dozen of people can do it consistently) ? 

[Mystic 256]

Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal were both way harder than Plutonia for me, maybe it was me not being used to the mechanics and layout of the newer doom games and having played classic doom and doom wads for years to where they are ingrained in me

but I found both 2016 and Eternal way harder than any of the classic doom games from my personal experience.

[Hellektronic]

On 8/15/2020 at 7:02 AM, Mystic 256 said:

Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal were both way harder than Plutonia for me, maybe it was me not being used to the mechanics and layout of the newer doom games and having played classic doom and doom wads for years to where they are ingrained in me

but I found both 2016 and Eternal way harder than any of the classic doom games from my personal experience.

 

Nah, I don't think it was just you or anything. Most battles in Doom 1 are like... you're going down a hallway,  killing demons as you go, maybe some traps along the way, and occasionally a bigger area where a lot of enemies pop out all at once. 2016 and Eternal especially bring a new idea to the table, it's like a huge arena battle where monsters constantly spawn and chase you until they're all dead. When you finish the battle, you're able to progress, but you can't run past them or avoid the battle. It's a battle to the death, either yours or theirs.

 

In a way I don't really like that style, because it feels very scripted. "This area is a battle area, a scripted fight will happen here". It's not like you can progress slowly and stealth-ish, you're thrown into the thick of it and have to kill the crap out of every last enemy in the area. Eternal in a lot of ways takes this even further, where most battles in the game kind of go based off scripts like that. You walk to this point, enemies start appearing, and there may or may not be a forcefield that blocks your progression or leaving the area entirely until they're all dead.

 

It might seem bizarre to say, but it's almost like... the lack of scripting in Doom 1/2 made it more freeform. You could fight or run, do this or do that, even go backwards to a chokepoint and hole up, waiting for the enemies to show up. The new games are like: "you fight them HERE... no arguing, you're not leaving this area even if you want to." Occasionally Doom 2 did that with traps locking the door behind you, but overall you could do whatever you wanted during combat.

Edited August 17, 2020 by Hellektronic