Doom 1 and 2 are flawless.

[HombreSal]

Unless you think of the graphics, which still look good, then that's it. These are the perfect games.

 

Do you agree or am I drunk?

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

Great, yes. Perfect? No. Even classic Doom games aren't perfect. Doom 2 had some annoying and cryptic maps, and Ultimate Doom has some reused music, a disappointing end to e3, and e4 has a difficulty curve that curves the wrong way. Lost souls are annoying, Doom 2 has some hideous looking maps like Downtown, and maps that are pure trash like Chasm.

 

No game is truly flawless.

 

Also Doom 64>>Ultimate Doom>>>>>Doom 2

Edited October 24, 2020 by TheMagicMushroomMan

[OniriA]

24 minutes ago, HombreSal said:

Doom 1 and 2 are flawless

 

Yes.

 

24 minutes ago, HombreSal said:

am I drunk?

 

Always.

Edited October 24, 2020 by OniriA

[nostalgia]

Everything has its flaws. But with its flaws and everything I think the better word to define DooM is "perfect". Yeah it may sound cliché, but read this: Today was a particular day, I replayed Memento Mori while waiting for an online class, then later I played Deathmatch before Dinner and later I played a Co-Op Cyberdreams with some random dudes on Odamex while drinking a cold one. To be able to still have lot of fun after more than 20 years is more than enough for me to say that even with all the flaws the game is perfect as it is.

 

But yeah, flawless? hell no. Fuck infinite height.

[VoanHead]

I liked the new additions that DOOM II brought to the table, but 1/3 of the maps are shite, and the Pain Elemental is the most annoying enemy to be added. DOOM I is where it all started, and the first two episodes are good, I actually liked Thy Flesh Consumed, but I thought the third episode was trash. It's a good thing that the DOOM community is crazy (and I mean it in a good way) to make fan made maps to a game they love so much for almost 27 years, not to mention that are better in quality to the maps made by OG id. God damn that's some real dedication.

[Juza]

The more you play the original games, the more you notice their flaws. At least it was like that for me.

Not to mention the reception for Doom 2's levels, and just the 'game' (more like expansion) overall, are mixed at best.

I haven't felt a wish to replay the original levels in a looong time. Doom games are great because of the community.

 

Plutonia is flawless though

Edited October 24, 2020 by Juza

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

25 minutes ago, nostalgia said:

Everything has its flaws. But with its flaws and everything I think the better word to define DooM is "perfect". Yeah it may sound cliché, but read this: Today was a particular day, I replayed Memento Mori while waiting for an online class, then later I played Deathmatch before Dinner and later I played a Co-Op Cyberdreams with some random dudes on Odamex while drinking a cold one. To be able to still have lot of fun after more than 20 years is more than enough for me to say that even with all the flaws the game is perfect as it is.

 

But yeah, flawless? hell no. Fuck infinite height.

That's more a testament to the modding community than Doom 1&2 specifically. Even the original Memento Mori is more consistent in quality than Doom 2.

 

And yes, fuck infinite height. Hooray for source ports!

Edited October 24, 2020 by TheMagicMushroomMan

[Pseudonaut]

The mechanics are perfect, the maps are not. And that's where fanmade wads come in. Also, I don't mind infinite height. Unintuitive, like many other things in Doom, but you get used to it.

[GraphicBleeder]

Oh nononononono.


Good? Yeah, of course.

Perfect? God no. 

 

Doom 1 gets way too repetitive by the second episode for me, and Doom 2's level design lacks when compared to Doom 1. Both great games. But they are in no way perfect.

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

9 minutes ago, Pseudonaut said:

The mechanics are perfect, the maps are not. And that's where fanmade wads come in. Also, I don't mind infinite height. Unintuitive, like many other things in Doom, but you get used to it.

Infinite height in the originals isn't that bad since they were developed with the "mechanic" in mind, however, playing most pwads with infinite height is almost impossible sometimes.

[Maximum Matt]

They're aaight.

[AinuTheTaken]

Maybe if they git gud they will be flawless someday.

[dmslr]

Apparently, it's an unpopular opinion, but I still think Classic Doom is perfect. Visuals, audio and especially gameplay were just done right. I'm not talking about the levels because we are all spoiled by what the community made for 25 years.

Edited October 24, 2020 by dmslr

[DOEL]

I don't think the mapping is perfect but the gameplay sure as hell is. I think Plutonia provides the best overall experience from commercial Doom. For me, playing some custom map sets is essential to the classic Doom experience.

 

Oh and the SSG is kinda ugly in my opinion because of the weird shadowing on the right barrel.

[HombreSal]

2 hours ago, Maximum Matt said:

They're aaight.

 

Just aaight?

[Mayomancer]

There's a couple of things i don't like a lot, such as killing cacodemons without the SSG in Doom 1, and some boring looking levels in Doom 2... other than some technical flaws such as unreachable secrets and engine glitches and bugs. But yeah, i'd say they're the nearest videogames to perfection i know.

[Doomkid]

Flaws are weird for me because I often end up liking them if the product is good overall, they add character or something. Too much refinement and sterility is arguably a flawed approach in it's own right. "It has to be a little bit ugly to truly be beautiful".

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Flawless? Did you see the unpopular opinions thread :P.

[Redneckerz]

Perfect games don't exist.*

 

Spoiler

^{*Perfect music, however, does. And that honor goes to Alexander Brandon's sound.}

 

[SilverMiner]

18 hours ago, HombreSal said:

These are the perfect games.

It's an axiom

[lilpastasalad]

Have you played The Chasm?

[HLRaven]

Honestly Doom is amazing, but I don't think it's a perfect game, I don't think any game is perfect, one of the things I don't exactly like is how some of the maps can just feel exhausting to play because you get stuck. I just got used to that and I kinda grew fond of the Doom 2 levels for trying to be unique (screw the city levels I still hate them)

[D4NUK1]

DOOM 2016 and Eternal are flawless.

 

Unless you think of the gameplay, which still play good, then that's it. These are the perfect games.

 

Do you agree or am I drunk?

[Percy T]

I believe there are some flaws in both games, like how some levels can be too difficult and unenjoyable for newbies (for example E4M6 took me forever to beat on Ultra-Violence in my first playthrough), but Doom 1 and 2 were definitely ahead of it's time, and the fact that there is still an active community for modding, speedrunners, content creation, etc. is pretty astonishing. It isn't flawless, but out of the hundreds of video games I've played in my life, Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 are in my Top 5 for sure.

[Gez]

It's not that they don't have flaws (just look at all the "if you could go back in time to 1993 and change things in Doom" threads); it's more that the flaws are not consequential. They don't prevent the games from being timeless works and indisputably among the most influential games of all time.

[M_W]

Flawless?

 

Have you played MAP21?

 

I love these games to the point that I don't even bother with other shooters, but perfect? Nah.

 

Hit-or-miss level design, bullet-sponge lost souls, hit detection at point-blank range, I could go on.

 

I will say classic Doom got a lot right, especially considering it was more or less starting from nothing as far as the genre was concerned. Even its imitators failed to live up to it.

[NoahRules]

Um, Actually there are 2 transparent pixels in doom 2's sky texture, so you're wrong.
Credit to Gez for making this gif

Edited October 25, 2020 by NoahRules

[Gez]

I see my old gif is still online. :p

[NoahRules]

8 minutes ago, Gez said:

I see my old gif is still online. :p

Didn't know you made it, I'll add credit

[Gez]

Yep, back in 2011:

Scroll a few posts down and indeed it's still up. Imgur is holding up much better than imageshack or photobucket!