The map you thought would never end

[Steveb1000]

I've just finished Epic 2 Map 28. I felt like I was going to be playing that map forever, like a Doom Sisyphus! It felt exhausting with no end in sight. I am not a good player and it took me 1 hrs 59mins on HMP with saves and loads of deaths and fruitless exploring.

 

For those who haven't played it - I will keep spoilers minimal - it's long, labyrinthine, with puzzles, teleporting archiviles, and key weapons as secrets ( I did it all rocket less:( for example ). I had to cheat and use Tatsurds YouTube play through to understand how to get the red key.

 

The combination of length, complexity, backtracking, ammo deprivation, obscure puzzles, resurrecting monsters, non-linear design, and the sense there would always be one hurdle meant I felt I would be trapped there forever.

 

Does anyone have any similar map experiences? Not just for difficulty, but the mix of factors.

[Michniko]

I remember feeling similar feelings when playing Thy Flesh Consumed and some sections of Doom 2 when I was younger. Just endless enemies, low health, low ammo, just trying over and over to gain that one inch over the demon onslaught.

 

It's such a good feeling when you finally get over that hurdle.

[Albatross]

Map03 of Magnolia recently. The monster count seemed reasonable and 01-02 weren't too long or cryptic, so I really wasn't prepared for what followed.

[NieMaMordy]

Eviternity's MAP19 - Dehydration. This map feels like it's ending 20 times, before it does really end abruptly.

[Polri]

Xaser's "Enigma Helix" in Plutonia Revisited Community Project was an epic adventure, and finally reaching the exit felt like a big achievement. Never figured out how you're supposed to reach the secret exit, though.

[Phobus]

CC3 MAP12 Black Rain. It’s just so long, and never really feels like it should be!

[Devalaous]

A few maps in the old Devilution/Revilution fit this category. The much maligned Sting Theory (named so because of the numerous complaints) had two wings on each side that were painfully linear with no backtracking allowed, and each side never felt like it would end. I generally LOVE huge exploratory maps, but the inability to go back for supplies or look for missed secrets made this one unbearable, even for me. I had fun seeing Eris, Jaws, Tarnsman all throw hate at the map. One day the rest of you will see it, and cry. Or IDCLEV.

 

The old Map 21, Arenophobia and the old Map 29, Veridian Twilight, were also insanely huge but they were a journey or trial; you knew what you were generally getting into. Arenophobia was Hell throwing everything at you as you broke through the Portal Facility and into Hell, and Viridian Twilight was the last bastion and resistance of Hell's forces, everything and the kitchen sink all trying to stop you from reaching the mastermind behind it all.

 

The only other WAD ive played that had such exhaustive maps is ALT, but all those long maps had a very clear feeling of progression.

[italocaco]

41 minutes ago, NieMaMordy said:

Eviternity's MAP19 - Dehydration. This map feels like it's ending 20 times, before it does really end abruptly.

Hence the name.

[xdarkmasterx]

Demonic horde (forgot the number) from AV. The fights just go on and on and on and on and...

[Omniarch]

Several maps from Alien Vendetta fit this description, for better or for worse. On the former side, you have Misri Halek and Toxic Touch, two beautiful, atmospheric adventure maps that left me feeling satisfied and content as the intermission rolled, while on the latter you have maps like Demonic Hordes or Nemesis, which felt just a little too long for their own good, and left me exhausted by the end.

 

For me, though, there is one map in particular that felt truly endless: Sanctuary of Filth, E4M6 of No End In Sight. I have already written about this map in great detail elsewhere, so here's a little excerpt that I think gets the point across nicely:

Quote

E4M6 is the epitome, the final form, the platonic ideal of all NEIS strives to be. A vast, hostile megastructure, crawling with hell's denizens, disorientingly vertical, inscrutable to the point of frustration. Sanctuary of Filth is the single most cruel, demented and brilliant map I have ever played, and one of the most difficult.

It took me four hours across three playthroughs and multiple consultations with a map editor to finally unravel this masterpiece, to 100% complete it. I had to save scum like hell to do it, dying dozens of times to monsters, traps or simple attrition. Never before have I been so ground down by a Doom map, so filled with bitter determination to see it through, to prove that the end is in sight after all.

 

[pcorf]

Jade Earth .... tell me more about that one, it goes on and on and on and ......

[deleted.]

.

Edited June 12, 2022 by deleted.

[Stabbey]

2 hours ago, Steveb1000 said:

I've just finished Epic 2 Map 28. I felt like I was going to be playing that map forever, like a Doom Sisyphus! It felt exhausting with no end in sight. I am not a good player and it took me 1 hrs 59mins on HMP with saves and loads of deaths and fruitless exploring.

 

For those who haven't played it - I will keep spoilers minimal - it's long, labyrinthine, with puzzles, teleporting archiviles, and key weapons as secrets ( I did it all rocket less:( for example ). I had to cheat and use Tatsurds YouTube play through to understand how to get the red key.

 

The combination of length, complexity, backtracking, ammo deprivation, obscure puzzles, resurrecting monsters, non-linear design, and the sense there would always be one hurdle meant I felt I would be trapped there forever.

 

Does anyone have any similar map experiences? Not just for difficulty, but the mix of factors.

 

I recently completed Epic 2, and yeah, that map was kinda tiresome. You left out two things of note, which I'll put into spoiler tags.

 

1. Not only is the map long, but it has a lot of boss monster in it.

2. In order to get the Red Key, you need to locate various switches hidden across the map. EIGHT of them.

 

The map has a par time of seven minutes. Try more like seventy.

 

****

 

Ar Luminae is another map which feels like it takes forever, it's a single map which is at least four hours long.

[MS-06FZ Zaku II Kai]

2 hours ago, a.a.i. said:

Fire and Ice. I love that map, but also, fuck that map. I have a complicated relationship with it.

Sounds like my ex ;/

 

edit: Oh god, why did I post this?

Edited April 19, 2021 by MS-06FZ Zaku II Kai

[roadworx]

definitely misri halek. it's wayyy too long for it's own good, and the grindy combat doesn't help whatsoever

[deleted.]

.

Edited June 12, 2022 by deleted.

[Optimus]

Some maps from Eternal Doom if you don't know the puzzles and get stuck forever. I remember MAP20: Silures just took so long the first time (way over 1 hour, almost 2) when I didn't know where I was going and what to do next. Everytime I found some secret button or puzzle clue I missed and thought that's it, I am not stuck anymore, to have to find another and another one the very next moment, the flow was interrupted for the majority of the time. And it's an interesting level if you learn what you should do, there are some tedious teleport puzzles, but also different exits, depending on the path you took, there is I think a yellow key that you may not find and opens an optional area, and more. I think the second time it took me 40-50 minutes, after I kinda knew what to expect.

[MS-06FZ Zaku II Kai]

10 minutes ago, roadworx said:

definitely misri halek. it's wayyy too long for it's own good, and the grindy combat doesn't help whatsoever

Send him to the shadow realm

[P41R47]

4 hours ago, Devalaous said:

A few maps in the old Devilution/Revilution fit this category. The much maligned Sting Theory (named so because of the numerous complaints) had two wings on each side that were painfully linear with no backtracking allowed, and each side never felt like it would end. I generally LOVE huge exploratory maps, but the inability to go back for supplies or look for missed secrets made this one unbearable, even for me. I had fun seeing Eris, Jaws, Tarnsman all throw hate at the map. One day the rest of you will see it, and cry. Or IDCLEV.

 

The old Map 21, Arenophobia and the old Map 29, Veridian Twilight, were also insanely huge but they were a journey or trial; you knew what you were generally getting into. Arenophobia was Hell throwing everything at you as you broke through the Portal Facility and into Hell, and Viridian Twilight was the last bastion and resistance of Hell's forces, everything and the kitchen sink all trying to stop you from reaching the mastermind behind it all.

 

The only other WAD ive played that had such exhaustive maps is ALT, but all those long maps had a very clear feeling of progression.

good memory for sure. As i'm helping Jaws with the making of TNT: Forever, formerly Convilution, i can tell that those maps are big.

But in my case, i greatly enjoyed them. Sting Theory is one great adventure map, even if linear, it does deliver a good fun. Long, no doubt of that. But its just amazing that Kyka mafe all that on vanilla. For being a map soo big, its one that never explode on visplane overflow on Chocolate Doom.

 

Arenaphobia is great, and Twilight is surely the longest map on the set, longer even for really long maps.

Hope Devilution hits the street someday so more people have the oportunity to try this maps.

 

I know there will be a liking for those great exploratory adventurous maps.

[yakfak]

Nato by Zan-zan-zawa-veia. frankly unconscionable level

Edited April 19, 2021 by yakfak

[SilverMiner]

Doom Odyssey E3M7

[Jacek Bourne]

The first long slaughtermap I played through is rush map12. I didn’t want it to end. It was excellent.

[LudicrousFPS]

Map 32 of Eviternity. Forgot the name. Took me forever with saves, and that was on HMP as well. 

[Toastd]

3 hours ago, LudicrousFPS said:

Map 32 of Eviternity. Forgot the name. Took me forever with saves, and that was on HMP as well. 

 

Anagnorisis. Recently played that for the first time on UV, took me somewhere between two and two-and-a-half hours with saves. A real adventure of a map with awesome visuals and pretty good combat. I was a big fan, to be honest, and I don't usually like long maps.

[out_of_service]

MAP27: Mount Pain

 

This is the map that doesn’t end

Yes, it goes on and on my friend

Some people started playing it not knowing what it was

And they’ll continue playing it forever just because

This is the map that doesn’t end

Yes, it goes on and on my friend

[LadyMistDragon]

Map 20 from TNT, or really, any map Drake O' Brien was involved with.

 

Map 23 from New Doom Community Project also comes to mind, though I'd say Map 10 from that's also a strong competitor.

 

Or how about Map 29 from Memento Mori. God, Jens Nielsen quit Doom too early like Drake(him, Denis Moeller were probably the most consistent TIC designers, but that map can drain the soul through prolonged exposure. Map 29 of Memento Mori II? Four Barons teleported into the central slime pit when you pick up the last (yellow) key?. ARE YOU FRICKIN KIDDING ME? Did you think you used up your arch-vile quota, dude?

[Pirx]

On 4/21/2021 at 4:32 AM, LadyMistDragon said:

Map 20 from TNT, or really, any map Drake O' Brien was involved with.

 

 

 

this or map 21 from tnt. i think it was 21. when i played it in 1996, it was the only map that ever gave me the message. "time sucks".

[roadworx]

10 minutes ago, Pirx said:

 

this or map 21 from tnt. i think it was 21. when i played it in 1996, it was the only map that ever gave me the message. "time sucks".

habitat?

[Pirx]

32 minutes ago, roadworx said:

habitat?

 

 

this one

[roadworx]

2 minutes ago, Pirx said:

this one

OHHHH that one, i was one off lol

 

from what i've seen, opinions on that map seem to be pretty divisive. a lot of people share your view while many others love it. but i personally don't know cuz i haven't played tnt: evilution ^{nor do i want to}