Doom Reproduction CDs / Boxes / Jewel Cases? Any interest?

[Loud Silence]

What about CD-RWs? They could go with all content (except IWADs), installer and instructions how to burn own IWADS so installer would pick them up. It's up to you, but i think this would be safer. Also "DoomkidWorks" printed on CD or at least sticker on box would look great.

[Muusi]

I'd be okay without a disc at all, just boxes and manuals. Hell i'd be okay with just the boxes.

 

Anyone have a high quality scans of the PlayStation versions of Doom and Final Doom? I have both but BOTH of them are missing the goddamn front artwork and Final Doom is missing the back too. Like, who'd dismantle the jewel case like that?

[Doomkid]

On 5/21/2021 at 6:43 PM, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

There are also many different variations of the boxes, even in the same region.  DOOM II in particular has a huge number of slightly different boxes, some of which can be viewed below in the photos I found on online stores.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

From left to right, top to bottom:

 

Row 1

* Australia - DOS CD-ROM with large OFLC rating.

* Australia - DOS CD-ROM with small OFLC rating.

* Australia - Platinum PC budget range - "Windows 95 CD-ROM" with small logos on cover.

* Australia - Platinum PC budget range - "Windows 95 CD-ROM" with large logos on cover.

 

Row 2

* Australia - "DOS and Windows 95 CD-ROM" with upgrade offer.

* North America - DOS 3.5" floppies.

* North America - DOS CD-ROM.

* North America - "DOS and Windows 95 CD-ROM" with upgrade offer.

 

Row 3

* North America - "Windows 95 CD-ROM" with updated id logo on cover.  System requirements on box mention both the DOS and Windows versions of DOOM II.

* Europe - DOS 3.5" floppies in two-piece box.

* Europe - DOS CD-ROM in two-piece box.

* Europe - DOS CD-ROM with BBFC rating on cover.

 

Thank you so much for all this info! I've been trying to track down EVERY single way in which Registered Doom, Ultimate Doom, Doom2 and Final Doom were packaged and sold (officially, anyway) and frankly it's enough to make a person's head spin.

 

Due to the overwhelming nature of all the variants, I think if I do go forward with any sort of reproduction effort, it will be focused on the GT Interactive version of Ultimate Doom, Doom 2 and Final Doom which come with Doom95, since they're all 1.9 and also come with clean DOS versions right there on the disc. They seem to be the "seriously final versions with everything a person could want included" packages, at least as far as 90s prints are concerned - in other words, not counting Collector's Edition from 2001 (which is lacking the DOS versions anyway..)

 

Interestingly, the HD scans that @Smouths provided me with of the Box, CD and inserts for Doom 2 seem to be mismatched - The box appears to be that of the 1.9 DOS version on CD-ROM, no mention of Win95 or Doom95 on the front or back anywhere, and lacking the distinct blue triangle at the top that says "$10 rebate offer!" which is present on most(?) Doom95 versions - but the actual disc and front / back inserts seem to specifically be the Win95 versions, not the DOS disc or front / back inserts.

 

I can't help but wonder if some boxes were actually shipped this way?   Where the box is for the generic DOS version, but the CD and insert are Doom95 version - or if some retailer/reseller/collector accidentally swapped materials somewhere along the way without even realizing it?.. (and who could blame them - the differences are extremely minor and would only be picked up on by the most hardcore collectors..)

Edited May 24, 2021 by Doomkid

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

1 hour ago, Doomkid said:

Interestingly, the HD scans that @Smouths provided me with of the Box, CD and inserts for Doom 2 seem to be mismatched - The box appears to be that of the 1.9 DOS version on CD-ROM, no mention of Win95 or Doom95 on the front or back anywhere, and lacking the distinct blue triangle at the top that says "$10 rebate offer!" which is present on most(?) Doom95 versions - but the actual disc and front / back inserts seem to specifically be the Win95 versions, not the DOS disc or front / back inserts.

 

I can't help but wonder if some boxes were actually shipped this way?   Where the box is for the generic DOS version, but the CD and insert are Doom95 version - or if some retailer/reseller/collector accidentally swapped materials somewhere along the way without even realizing it?.. (and who could blame them - the differences are extremely minor and would only be picked up on by the most hardcore collectors..)

The CD/inserts and box are indeed mismatched.  I don't think any retailer would have sold the Windows 95 version of DOOM in a box that makes no mention of Windows.

 

Most DOOM95 boxes for The Ultimate DOOM and DOOM II have the blue triangle on the cover.  DOOM95 boxes that lack the triangle still mention Windows on the box.

[Smouths]

I'm gonna chalk this up to being an oversight/screw up on my part (don't quite remember- my bad!) I have a few Doom 2 discs lying around- TL;DR, it looks like I scanned the best looking jewel case/ disc set which still had the front insert, not the ones which came with the box.

 

 

Here's the more in-depth OCD triggering part, since I figure it'd be welcome here, lol-

 

 

At the top are discs/jewel cases missing the front inserts, containing Doom2 1.666 and DoomSW 1.666, DOS-only. The one on the right shipped with the Doom 2 box I scanned. To my eye these are totally identical, though the one on the right has a "Made in Canada" sticker on the back- can't verify that was originally there, since I picked these up second hand.

 

The middle and bottom sets both have Doom2 95 1.9, and while the contents of both discs are the same, the print on the disc for the bottom is far inferior (easier to tell in person.) The middle one seems to be the one I scanned before.

 

Here's the part that's bugging me now- the last four digits on the previously scanned back-insert are 70252, which matches the disc- but the front insert reads 10723, which matches the bottom disc/back-insert, which makes me wonder if that's actually the correct front-insert. *exhale and shrug*

Edited May 25, 2021 by Smouths

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

10 minutes ago, Smouths said:

At the top are discs/jewel cases missing the front inserts, containing Doom2 1.666 and DoomSW 1.666, DOS-only.

The front inserts are not really "missing"; that's how some copies of DOOM II were released (I have seen many copies on eBay like that, and even the sealed DOOM II box I got lacked a front jewel case insert).  Similarly, some Ultimate DOOM releases lack a rear insert for the jewel case.

 

Since the big box version of DOOM II I have is DOS v1.666 and lacks a front jewel case insert, I assume they did not add a front insert until later runs.

 

35 minutes ago, Smouths said:

To my eye these are totally identical, though the one on the right has a "Made in Canada" sticker on the back- can't verify that was originally there, since I picked these up second hand.

Some CDs for both The Ultimate DOOM and DOOM II are made in Canada.  Canadian versions come with the "Made in Canada" sticker attached to the jewel case.  US versions lack the sticker on the jewel case, and for DOOM II the text "MADE IN U.S.A." is printed on the disc's label below the GT Interactive logo.  I notice that neither of the DOS discs in your photo say they are made in the US.

 

 

There is also a DOOM II jewel case with a "cleaner" cover that has the modern id logo on it along with the ESRB rating.  In Australia, some keep case versions were released, like the one I have below.

 

Spoiler

 

[Doomkid]

2 hours ago, Smouths said:

Here's the part that's bugging me now- the last four digits on the previously scanned back-insert are 70252, which matches the disc- but the front insert reads 10723, which matches the bottom disc/back-insert, which makes me wonder if that's actually the correct front-insert. *exhale and shrug*

 

On eBay, I've found yet another example of a back-insert and disc of Doom2 bearing the number 70252, paired with a front-insert numbered 10723. In other words, exactly what you have there: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/154312995258?hash=item23edc571ba%3Ag%3AmdYAAOSwJp1ewBDj&LH_BIN=1

 

Conversely, here's a listing where the front-insert, back-insert and disc all agree on the serial number 10723: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/402850918513?epid=54727903&hash=item5dcbc93071%3Ag%3AOQkAAOSwZe5gofN0&LH_BIN=1

..and yet, despite sharing the serial number, the actual design on the disc is different from the one in the bottom row of your picture. Bloody hell.. Since you say the printing is inferior on your version, which lacks the "cut out circle" around the middle bit and moves the "For Windows 95" bit to be directly under the Doom II logo rather than to the right, I can't help but wonder which was printed first..

 

I get the distinct impression the one with the words circling around the outside of the disc is the later print. That exact design is used on a disc with the 10723 serial code as shown in the 2nd eBay listing there, and yet it seems to be visually identical to the disc in the second row of your picture, which has the 70252 serial code. What in the actual fuck. (At first I wondered if the difference in serial code was due to one using 1.666 and the other using 1.9 - but they're both Windows 95 discs, and AFAIK those strictly came in the 1.9 flavor, since 1.9 was already out by the time Doom95 was developed).

 

Perhaps this is a case where the disc and back-insert were updated for a later pressing, and this later pressing was given the code 70252 but they just re-used the front insert only, serial code 10723 and all? Seems really unlikely, but the fact that both you and the first eBay seller I linked have that specific combo makes it feel possible they were sold together at some point...

 

Or, perhaps it's just another case of a front-insert being (unintentionally) paired with a disc and back-insert it doesn't necessarily belong with due to being "close enough", and that discs with the serial code 70252 were some of the ones that never had front-inserts to begin with, which TheUltimateDoomer666 mentions in his post? Even that explanation seems weird though, it seems like just the older Doom II discs (1.666) lacked front-inserts, and by 1.9 they were all getting them, which leads me back to my guess that 70252 variants of the disc and back-insert were sold paired with a 10723 insert for whatever reason.

 

All I know is, I couldn't find a single example of a front-insert for Doom II labeled 70252 anywhere on eBay or the greater net. I guess the true explanation is anyone's guess.. What an oddly deep rabbit hole these various Doom and Doom 2 discs are..

[Barking Sands]

On 5/20/2021 at 10:10 PM, Muusi said:

Oh god that Master Levels box is just *chef's kiss*

 

Sorry for the double post, this was supposed to be included in the previous post but Android thought otherwise.

OT, but I cobbled together a TITLEPIC lump based on that cover art (using the UD INTERPIC because it's a cleaner image):

[Doomkid]

15 minutes ago, Barking Sands said:

OT, but I cobbled together a TITLEPIC lump based on that cover art (using the UD INTERPIC because it's a cleaner image):

Funny enough, not to long ago, Scuba Steve made a very similar widescreen titlepic for Master Levels:

 

 

Widescreen assets are becoming a thing, you can find more like that here as well: https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/121385-widescreen-assets-appreciation-thread/

 

[Muusi]

Always great to see people giving some love to the Master Levels! PSX Final Doom made my 10-year-old mind think the Master Levels were only for the Master players so they became extra cool immediately😆

Edited May 25, 2021 by Muusi

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

44 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

Or, perhaps it's just another case of a front-insert being (unintentionally) paired with a disc and back-insert it doesn't necessarily belong with due to being "close enough", and that discs with the serial code 70252 were some of the ones that never had front-inserts to begin with, which TheUltimateDoomer666 mentions in his post? Even that explanation seems weird though, it seems like just the older Doom II discs (1.666) lacked front-inserts, and by 1.9 they were all getting them, which leads me back to my guess that 70252 variants of the disc and back-insert were sold paired with a 10723 insert for whatever reason.

User @Doominion posted some photos in this thread that show a DOOM II 70252 disc in a jewel case that has no front insert.

[Doomkid]

24 minutes ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

User @Doominion posted some photos in this thread that show a DOOM II 70252 disc in a jewel case that has no front insert.

That seems to clarify that 70252 didn't come with a front insert.

 

Oddly, Doominion's box seems to not match his CD, with the box reading 10723 instead, thus seemingly belonging with either the one shown on this eBay listing with what looks to be a high print quality, or the bottom row in Smouths' collection, which has the same serial numbers but a lower printing quality on the CD. Interesting..

[Doomkid]

Ok, I think I've worked it all out. I just had a HUGE post typed up clarifying everything, but DW decided to eat it unceremoniously.............. (WHY)

 

I can't even remember all I said, but the 10723 Doom 2 box from Doominion's post seems to be a later reissue based on the "faded style" id logo. I can't help but think it belongs with the low quality 10723 Doom 2 CD reprint bearing the same serial number (also seen in the bottom row of Smouths' picture).

 

The high-quality variant of the 10723 Doom 2 CD seems to be the older one (in my opinion) and also seems to belong with the Doom 2 box with the blue $10 rebate triangle and Windows 95 logos on the box.

 

Both of them seem to belong with this front insert, also bearing the 10723 serial code.

 

 

The Ultimate DOOM CD scan and back-insert scan that @Smouths provided both bare a 70249 serial code. However, the front-insert has a serial code of 10722, and I'm willing to bet the box does as well, given how well it matches the Doom 2 box with the 10723 code (just one number off).

 

If I were to go forward with reproductions, I’d just want to be sure the box, jewel case, CD and manual all actually belong together.
 

I’m thinking the 10722 Ultimate Doom & 10723 Doom 2 Boxes, inserts and CDs are going to be my target, specifically the high-quality CD print versions (not the low quality reprints) with the Win95 logos and “blue triangle” boxes. These versions have both Doom95 and DOS compatibility, they have nice crisp CD art, and they have dedicated front and back inserts, making them feel like the most “whole” packages.

 

Getting high quality prints of all that stuff, including the sides, top and bottom of the boxes and the Doom95-specific manuals to go with them is going to be hell, and it may be damn near impossible.. but I just want to make sure this is all done as well and consistently as I possibly can :) ...

 

Also I just want to thank you both again, Smouths and TheUltimateDoomer666 for all the help you’ve been with this so far. Trying to juggle all the different serial codes until they match is insanity!

Edited May 25, 2021 by Doomkid

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

Matching discs, jewel cases, and manuals with opened boxes can be pretty tricky. Even eBay listings are not always reliable, as sellers can--and do--end up mixing big boxes with discs/jewel cases/manuals that the boxes didn't actually come with. For example, I have seen a listing for Quake: The Offering that included the discs from the standalone Quake boxes, and I saw an Australian Duke Nukem 3D keep case that included the disc and mini-manual from the US version of the game.

 

1 hour ago, Doomkid said:

The Ultimate DOOM CD scan and back-insert scan that @Smouths provided both bare a 70249 serial code. However, the front-insert has a serial code of 10722, and I'm willing to bet the box does as well, given how well it matches the Doom 2 box with the 10723 code (just one number off).

I have seen Ultimate DOOM 10722 jewel cases (where both the front and rear inserts have a 10722 serial) actually contain 10722 discs (example here, from an eBay listing).

Edited May 25, 2021 by TheUltimateDoomer666

[DoomGater]

I appreciate your efforts very much and acknowledge all the work you've put into this, but I strongly recommend NOT to do it.

I did not read everything posted here, so maybe, it was said before, so please sorry, when I am stating the obvious...

 

-The Box-art and all graphics are copyrighted (not only the iwads...) and if you print out an 1:1 copy of the big boxes and ask
for monetary compensation, you are in trouble.

 

- No collector would buy it, as it is not an original.

 

- But everybody who is NOT a collector would complain about technical shortcomings. ("Does not run on my shitty windows 11",
   "Where is the Eywad" , "Can't find it in my Steam Account"). You would get many really stupid questions.

Prepare a nice DL with all the scans, the 'exe'  to run it and write a short description. But don't take money in your hand to go the
Hardware way..

 

[Doomkid]

You make some great points, DoomGater. I still want to get all the HD scans of boxes, CDs and jewel case inserts that I can (and all the numerous variants).. but maybe just for others to look at and appreciate as well, as opposed to actually making/selling them.

[DoomGater]

18 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

I still want to get all the HD scans of boxes, CDs and jewel case inserts that I can

..there 's nothing wrong  with that. :-)
I'll check if my specimen are something special ... Maybe at least the German D2 V1.666.
I also have some russian versions, but these are just pirated copies..

 

 

[Vic Vos]

Dunno about actually selling reproductions, but wouldn't it be much easier to prepare and upload the necessary resources (minus the WADs) so that anyone would be able to make their own?
 

On 5/25/2021 at 5:09 PM, Doomkid said:

I still want to get all the HD scans of boxes, CDs and jewel case inserts that I can (and all the numerous variants).. but maybe just for others to look at and appreciate as well, as opposed to actually making/selling them.

Did you try contacting @Revenant100? If there's anyone with a metric ton of Doom stuff, it's him.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Vic Vos

[Skeletonpatch]

This thread is quite the ride. Reading all this made me come to the realization that most of these boxes and materials would have been assembled by hand in many different locations, without much enforcement in ensuring that everything matched. Pair that with items trading hands constantly over thirty-something years and you get an even bigger mess. Makes sense but it never occurred to me.

 

This shit still happens. I ordered my copy of Doom Eternal online and while it came in a standard Canadian English-French bilingual case, the disc has English and Spanish on it.

 

As for the topic, I would be interested in a reproduction box. Doubt I could afford one, but you have my interest. My recommendation as to getting around the legal issues is to include two discs, one blank and one containing an assortment of curated PWADs which you've gotten permission to distribute. I think you can probably justify charging money for the PWADs, correct me if I'm wrong. The buyer would take the blank disc and download your updated Doom 95 to it, copy the appropriate already owned IWADs into it, then burn it onto the disc. Though, I think there'd still be an issue with distributing reproductions of the boxes and manuals themselves, since wouldn't those also fall under copyright? The whole point of this is to recreate an approximation of the original materials, so I doubt fair use could be argued since you aren't going to be altering the artwork or the text much beyond marking it as a reproduction.

[Gifty]

On 5/25/2021 at 12:49 AM, DoomGater said:

No collector would buy it, as it is not an original.

 

I'm a collector and I would definitely buy it. 

 

(Or I would donate to a fundme page to help cover the cost of shipping and production, whichever is less risky)

Edited May 28, 2021 by Gifty

[talond66]

Hello @Doomkid,

 

I would buy a box of Ultimate Doom and Doom II immediately!

 

Some time ago I already searched for high-resolution pictures of all packaging, logos and artwork and found a packaging (unfortunately only the back) of a Doom II CD, which has not been listed here yet which I have attached.

 

Spoiler

 

Unfortunately, even after two years, I have not found any further information about this packaging, or the front of the packaging. Maybe someone has more information about it ... I would also like to see the missing front of the packaging and CD.

 

Oh and is there already an archive or collection with all Doom packaging, logos and artwork?

 

Many thanks and best regards

 

 

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

12 hours ago, talond66 said:

Unfortunately, even after two years, I have not found any further information about this packaging, or the front of the packaging. Maybe someone has more information about it ... I would also like to see the missing front of the packaging and CD.

I mentioned that release and posted a picture of an Australian version of it earlier in this thread (although I didn't post the back cover or disc). It's a Windows-only CD case release (no big box). The CD is orange and shows the Cyberdemon from the cover, and the reverse of the cover insert contains installation instructions and a list of the game's controls. A PDF version of the full manual is included on the disc.

 

Here's a picture of the cover of the US version from an eBay listing:

 

Spoiler

 

Here are screenshots of the Australian installer:

 

 

 

And here's the title image that's included on the disc:

 

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by TheUltimateDoomer666