Dehacked Wizards, how do you do things you do?

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

what I mean by dehacked wizards is people who do crazy shit with dehacked, such as increasing the number of sprites that a monster has, or creating new weapons and monsters, I want to know this because I have seen some pretty cool dehacked stuff in wads and wonder "how do I do that?".

 

So if you know something that can alter doom a LOT using dehacked, then say something here.   

Edited June 7, 2021 by SLOTH MARINE (CB)
forgot to put the word know

[Aurelius]

On 6/7/2021 at 4:56 PM, SLOTH MARINE (CB) said:

"how do I do that?"

 

If by "how" you mean the actual mechanics of altering frames, states and properties of things, the most intuitive method for a beginner is to use a program called Whacked. A more recent alternative is DECOHack (part of Doom Tools by MTrop), which does require you to be/get familiar with DECORATE, but it makes experimentation and DECORATE-to-Dehacked (or vice versa) conversions much easier. For a beginner, I would highly recommend Whacked for it's more accessible user interface.

 

My advice to getting started:

• Download Whacked from the above link.
• Watch this tutorial video by Doomkid for the basics. The only thing I would do differently is not hack the actual .exe, but rather just drag the .deh file into your wad using Slade, rename it DEHACKED and then use -dehlump command on Chocolate Doom to run it.
• Another good step-by-step tutorial on making a specific edit was made by bonnie in this thread.
• Many people also link Enjay's tutorials, but I have to admit I never really got into these. That's probably just me though :P
• Read the Doomwiki page on Dehacked, which contains descriptions for the different codepointers.

To actually learn how to do more complex modifications, you do what we all do: study, experiment and repeat. A lot of the information is available out there, but it's often very fragmented, so be prepared to do some extensive googling. I remember starting out I spent hours upon hours reading through different threads discussing all sorts of complicated dehacked stuff (turning a Lost Soul into a projectile, for example). It didn't make much sense to me at first, but after a while messing around in Whacked I was able to make some changes that actually worked. It takes a lot of time though, so be prepared to fumble in the dark for a little bit. Start small, and whenever you don't quite know what something means, google it.

 

A good additional resource is the list of hardcoded behavior assembled by MTrop, which helps you better understand some of the exceptions.

If you want to achieve a specific effect, but are not exactly sure how to approach it and your googling turns up empty (it usually doesn't though, if you're stubborn enough), you can always drop the question in here. Make sure it's very focused, and try to get as far as you can on your own. Experimentation goes a long way.

[antares031]

Like Aurelius mentioned, Whacked4 is an easy way to understand how dehacked works. It's easy and straightforward, has user-friendly interface, and it provides useful features, such as previewing states, linking frames in order, and so on. Editing properties from Things, Weapons, Strings, etc. is pretty much straightforward, since all you need to do is just changing values. The highlight of dehacking (that's how I call making dehacked patch) is editing States with various code pointers. Keep in mind that player code pointers only work with the player's weapons, and monster code pointers only work with actors. Otherwise, such as using FireBFG code pointer to a monster, the game will crash with an error. It's worth mentioning that there are many hard-coded behaviors in dehacked, mostly with the specific frames and things. Again, Aurelius already posted the document about those hard-coded behaviors, so I recommend checking that out.

 

The way I learned about dehacking was basically with lots of trial-and-error. After I learned how to use Whacked with basic tutorials, I was like "Hey, I wanna make something interesting with those code pointers, because why not?" Then I started making various dehacked patches with their own concepts, such as a monster with "sprinting" behavior (which ultimately became Astral Cacodemon in Eviternity). Of course, I encountered lots of bugs and crashes, mostly because of my poor knowledge about the hard-coded behaviors of dehacked. And whenever I got errors, I tried to look for answers, by simply searching on Google or Doomworld. Because dehacked has been used by lots of doom modders for ages, chances are there were another modders, who also encountered the same issue with the exact reason.

 

Most of knowledge I learned was from making dehacked patch for Struggle. Since that megawad was designed for limit-removing compatibility, it still used the old vanilla dehacked with limited amount of code pointer frames; remember, only the designated frames are capable of using code pointers in vanilla dehacking, unlike boom or above. So I had to optimize the dehacked patch as far as I could, in order to put lots of custom monsters I wanted. During the optimization, I learned how I can handle frames more efficiently, and how to avoid certain issues and errors. So don't be afraid, and go try to make some cool dehacked patches of your own. Every dehacked wizard has their own first step.

[RDETalus]

I've heard "Batman Doom" does a lot of trickery, a good one involving an enemy that appears to pick-up rocks from the ground and throw them at you by using the Arch-Vile's states, as well as "The Sky May Be."

Edited June 9, 2021 by RDETalus

[ReX]

On 6/7/2021 at 9:56 AM, SLOTH MARINE (CB) said:

dehacked wizards

@Doomkid is, what I would consider, a DeHacked (and WHacked) wizard, so I'm pinging him.

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

9 hours ago, ReX said:

@Doomkid is, what I would consider, a DeHacked (and WHacked) wizard, so I'm pinging him.

I was actually trying to get a answer from DoomKid because I've seen the stuff he can do with dehacked  and wanted to know how he does it.

Edited June 10, 2021 by SLOTH MARINE (CB)

[Pegleg]

Others that should be included in that list of DeHacked wizards (in no particular order other than alphabetical):
@antares031
@Aurelius
@Da Werecat
@Mechadon
@Obsidian

@Revenant100

 

@SLOTH MARINE (CB) If you've seen something (such as a custom monster or an interesting effect) in a map you played, you can open up that map or that DeHacked file and see how the author did that custom thing you liked.

Also, if you're interesting in knowing something from these masters, you may have better luck getting a response if you have specific questions, instead of "How do you do the magic that you do?" That is likely a much longer answer that can't be easily distilled into a simple post.

[Doomkid]

I didn't mean to ignore this thread! I played a map by Sloth Marine earlier that had some pretty darn competent DeHackEd work, but if you ever need help with anything specific feel free to ping me.

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

21 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

I didn't mean to ignore this thread! I played a map by Sloth Marine earlier that had some pretty darn competent DeHackEd work, but if you ever need help with anything specific feel free to ping me.

ok I did have a question, I see in some of your wads you have been able to increase the amount of sprites a monster has, how the hell do you do that?

 

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

7 hours ago, Pegleg said:

you can open up that map or that DeHacked file and see how the author did that custom thing you liked.

ok, I have tried to open .bex and .deh files in whacked 4 and doesn't work, like it will open but when I try to see what they did it gives me a error and it'll only show doom 2 stuff

[Doomkid]

2 hours ago, SLOTH MARINE (CB) said:

ok I did have a question, I see in some of your wads you have been able to increase the amount of sprites a monster has, how the hell do you do that?

Basically, you have to get it to use frames from other enemies like the SS Nazi or Commander Keen. A sprite can have frames from A all the way to Z and beyond even, so you can just use the SS Nazi’s frames to add more for another monster instead. (It’s a bit hard to explain - hope this makes sense)

 

Also, if you use frames from the SS or Keen, under “things” you should make it so they don’t spawn, just set all the stuff like “spawn frame” and “death frame” and such to 0 so that you can use all their frames without worrying about them getting called out of order or anything like that.

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

54 minutes ago, Doomkid said:

Basically, you have to get it to use frames from other enemies like the SS Nazi or Commander Keen. A sprite can have frames from A all the way to Z and beyond even, so you can just use the SS Nazi’s frames to add more for another monster instead. (It’s a bit hard to explain - hope this makes sense)

 

Also, if you use frames from the SS or Keen, under “things” you should make it so they don’t spawn, just set all the stuff like “spawn frame” and “death frame” and such to 0 so that you can use all their frames without worrying about them getting called out of order or anything like that.

I'm still I bit confused. why don't you make a video on it?

Edited June 11, 2021 by SLOTH MARINE (CB)

[magicsofa]

46 minutes ago, SLOTH MARINE (CB) said:

I'm still I bit confused. why don't you make a video on it?

It's not someone else's job to teach you modding. If people offer help, they are volunteering their time, effort, and experience, for free, for your benefit. Please be respectful of that.

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

2 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

It's not someone else's job to teach you modding. If people offer help, they are volunteering their time, effort, and experience, for free, for your benefit. Please be respectful of that.

well I'm sorry, I'm just really confused, and it's not like I'm demanding him to make it now, I was just suggesting it, and yes I know it's now someone's job to teach modding to me, and I do respect people who offer help, It's just that sometimes I don't understand it, and need a little extra help, and also if he did make a video lots of other people besides me would know this very hard to learn topic.

[RDETalus]

You should try following this tutorial step-by-step, it teaches the very basics of what Doomkid is talking about:

 

Start off simple, make a pistol that shoots a two shot burst. Then edit the Imp so it shoots two fireballs instead of one, etc…, that’s how I learned dehacked

Edited June 11, 2021 by RDETalus

[SLOTH MARINE (CB)]

41 minutes ago, RDETalus said:

You should try following this tutorial step-by-step, it teaches the very basics of what Doomkid is talking about:

 

Start off simple, make a pistol that shoots a two shot burst. Then edit the Imp so it shoots two fireballs instead of one, etc…, that’s how I learned dehacked

thanks :)