What’s your Doom framerate?

[Doomkid]

Just got triggered by a video with over a million views by a popular YouTuber named Noodle saying that higher framerates for video games are “objectively better”.

 

When I play Doom, I pretty much need it to be capped at 35. Anything else feels loose, my tight controls and ability to stop turning on a dime are gone, and it almost triggers motion sickness in me. Weird to know that not being able to aim as well and feeling nauseous are “objectively better”, seems like the sort of thing that pretty obviously falls under the realm of subjectivity.. 🤔 (Similarly Classic NES and SNES games, like the Mario ones for example, feel floaty and “off” when using anything but their native framerate).

 

That’s just my opinion on this clearly subjective topic though. How do you feel?

[HavoX]

More than 60 FPS.

I do have a fairly powerful PC, but the only weakness I have is the video card... but that's another story.

[Chopkinsca]

I'm probably an odd one out, but currently in GZDoom, I have FPS capped at 40.

[ketmar]

original headbobbing always gives me motion sickness. it could be fine for 320x200 and small displays, but for higher resolutions… nope. that's why i made in much smaller in k8vavoom.

 

the other thing is that in most sourceports you still control Doomguy at 35 FPS, so it may feel slightly unresponsive on higher framerates. i.e. you cannot change direction or speed in interpolated frames. most people won't notice that (or got used to it), but for some it may be noticeable.

 

Spoiler

of course, it's not true for k8vavoom, because k8vavoom is not a lockstep engine, it doesn't interpolate physics movements at all, it just advances the playsim (and physics) by the exact time that was passed from the previous frame. and it has the option to remove the oil from Doomguy boots, so he won't slide like he's moving on some ice. that's because k8vavoom is Teh Best Doom Sourceport In Our Galaxy!

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by ketmar

[Biz!]

Unlimited

[omx32x]

i use the 35 fps cap 60 fps makes my mouse feel really weird above that feels ok but i have to disable vsync with makes the game really ugly on my opinion

 

35 feels perfect mouse is precise i dont feel any input lag and is the way i like to play the most

 

im still baffled that the unity port lacks the option to cap frames at 35

[forgettable pyromaniac]

35 fps on Crispy, Choco, ect.
60 on anything else.

I actually more commonly go with 65 because small frame drops happen sometimes and it's annoying :p

[Dexiaz]

Well, I'm pretty fine with 35 FPS, and I'm playing with it if I'm playing on Chocolate/Crispy/AnyVanillaSourceport Doom. But in GZDoom I can play it with 60+ FPS, and I'm kinda fine too with it.

[HAK3180]

I generally prefer the look of greater FPS if I'm nitpicking, but sometimes I don't even notice at all. Performance-wise, I definitely go lower sometimes, but I still wouldn't say higher is objectively better, assuming same performance.

 

One of my least favorite things is purporting subjective preferences as objective facts, which, of course, happens all the time. ^{(I'm looking at you, texture filtering.)}

[Stupid Bunny]

I always play with 100x.wad loaded, so about 20 seconds per frame usually

[Clippy]

Is noodle that guy that talks to me on Romero's discord I think he likes noodles I showed him pictures of my cats

[LUISDooM]

No matter the source port, I always go with 35 fps, anything else feels too smooth... I guess my eyes just got used to that framerate lol

[Doomkid]

31 minutes ago, HAK3180 said:

One of my least favorite things is purporting subjective preferences as objective facts, which, of course, happens all the time. ^{(I'm looking at you, texture filtering.)}

See, that’s what ground my gears - If he had said “far more people prefer higher framerates” or something, I could dig it. But nope. He had to go and use the dreaded O word..

 

He even claimed he could prove it scientifically (or something to that effect) before moving on, so he doubled down on the wrongness! I guess my body not reacting with feelings of nausea to 35 fps in Doom is doing so in an “objectively incorrect” manner 😂

[Devalaous]

I set everything on my PC to 75 FPS maximum, ie the refresh rate on my monitor, as I play EVERYTHING in borderless windowed mode (why arent sourceports adding this yet? We arent THAT stuck in 1993 are we? :p)

[OldDoomer]

I'm a bit ignorant on things but what purpose would playing something as old as Doom on such a high framerate actually serve? Hit scan fire arms for example stop at whatever thing or solid linedef they come into contact with, working more akin to something like a light gun. A higher FPS isn't going to make you or enemies be able to react more quickly, and how someone mentioned above could actually introduce more of a challenge with a quicker mouse movement. Am I looking at this all incorrectly?

[MattFright]

@Doomkid I hope i don't come off as trying to push the same "objectively always this way" narrative, but i'm not sure i agree with either one of you entirely. I consider myself pretty good at games that involve fast reaction times and i DO feel like higher framerates do improve my performance at games (i suggest you watch this video to avoid an overly long explanation here).

 

Unlike most people who are used to playing modern games at higher framerates, i have grown up with low refresh rate displays, terrible keyboards/mice and incredibly slow machines (such as the one i'm using right now) so i'm not only used to playing at 35-ish FPS (or even as low as 15), but my brain has also adapted to make up for a lot of that "missing information" and delay so that difference is largely irrelevant to me (at least if we're comparing 35 to 60 FPS... i've never had the hardware or monitor refresh rate to try anything higher).

 

My point being: yes, i do think higher framerates can improve your play (as they certainly do for me), but from my experience at least it's nowhere near as life changing as people who aren't used to lower framerates claim it is... And the fact that it causes some people nausea or w/e other effects is why i say that it can be better, not that it always will for everyone.

Edited August 3, 2021 by MattFright

[xX_Lol6_Xx]

35 fps, only when viddumping demos I use the uncapped framerate 

[Boaby Kenobi]

40 minutes ago, Clippy said:

Is noodle that guy that talks to me on Romero's discord I think he likes noodles I showed him pictures of my cats

 

That Noodle is a she.

 

 

[ASD]

I play vanilla only, so there's no option.

[Bauul]

I also played uncapped above 60fps, although if my fps drops anywhere between 30 and 60 I don't mind. Below 30 starts to get a bit too choppy.

 

A big issue with 35fps these days is that it doesn't neatly divide in the refresh rate of most modern monitors (which is 60hz), so 35fps would end up with either a bunch of uneven frame times or screen tearing. That feels extremely offputting to many people (Digital Foundry for example would tear any game that targetted 35fps a new one).

 

That was never how id Software intended the game to be played, as they were working off 70hz monitors. So it's not like sticking to 35fps on a modern 60hz monitor is even giving you the proper original experience anyway.

 

43 minutes ago, OldDoomer said:

I'm a bit ignorant on things but what purpose would playing something as old as Doom on such a high framerate actually serve?

 

From a basic visual point of view, it's smoother, so looks nicer to most people. Smooth feels nicer than jerky.

 

From a gameplay point of view, you have slightly more opportunity to spot that Cyberdemon rocket appearing from the side of your vision, or that charing Lost Soul about to make your RL life a misery, but it's such a tiny window (~12ms between 60fps and 35fps) that I highly doubt most people would actually benefit from it in a practical sense.

Edited August 3, 2021 by Bauul

[baja blast rd.]

*squints* FPS as in...frames per second??? I thought it was seconds per frame.

 

 

(This runs way better under other conditions but I found this amusing.) 

[Deadwing]

The more, the better

[NuMetalManiak]

Noob question but relevant, how do you check frame rate in Gzdoom? I feel as if I’m 60 but even on some levels I’m not certain

[MFG38]

1 minute ago, NuMetalManiak said:

Noob question but relevant, how do you check frame rate in Gzdoom?

 

Open the console and type "vid_fps 1". That'll display the FPS counter in the top right corner.

[GarrettChan]

35

[Mike Stu]

I usually just let the FPS uncapped and it will lock around ~162 FPS with gysnc on. I get people's arguments for 35 FPS but it personally just feels terrible to me. This of course has a lot to do with how you first experienced Doom and your perceived notion of how it should look, sound and play. 

 

Nonetheless, that was kind of a bad hot take from Noodle. People just like throwing the "O" word around 'cause it generates engagement easily (case in point, this thread). He's usually a pretty chill and funny dude tho, definitely check out his stuff.

 

54 minutes ago, OldDoomer said:

Am I looking at this all incorrectly?

 

Well... Yes, Doom was designed around the limitations of 35 FPS, so you're not missing out on much when compared to say, playing Doom Eternal in 35 FPS. The main thing is movement. People feel like higher frame rates are more responsive because they just are - that's where the "objective" factor comes in. A 60hz refresh rate offers a 16ms response time tops. Going higher or lower will either make it better or worse. That's why all the fastest displays in the market are 165hz+.

 

As to how much difference that will actually make in a game with an internal logic of 35FPS I can't quite say from experience. You will certainly feel it in your mouse tho, that's for sure, and I'd imagine that would give you a competitive advantage in deathmatching. 

Edited August 3, 2021 by Mike Stu

[HLRaven]

I cap it at 75 FPS, because at this point I am just really used to it.

[Immorpher]

When I play with mouse turning, I usually like an uncapped frame rate as the turning feels smoother to me when I do that. I could see that feeling loose though because of interpolation!

When playing with a controller, the turning rate is capped, so its fine for me to have a capped frame rate.

On a semi-related aspect, when I play games like Quake, I prefer not to have interpolated enemy animations. I like how jerky and disturbing low frame-rate motions look!

[Endless]

200 FPS or nada.

[Loud Silence]

Of course 35.