A little passion project; "What if I did E2 instead of ID?"

[aletaster]

The idea behind this project came to me about a week ago when I forced my friend to play The Ultimate Doom for the first time. He constantly commented how ugly E2 was compared to E1, so I took matters into my own hands, and started creating a "better" E2. Better is in quotes because I love the original E2 and this is just my take on the episode. The maps are not remade, but replaced with new concepts. There are probably a thousand projects like this, but who cares? This is if I did E2, my E2. 

 

So far I have almost finished 2 maps, need to work on item and monster placement on them though.

 

My common mapping themes include:

 

- Vanilla as fuck

- Attempt at interesting and abstract architecture

- Fun little occasional details

- DOORSTOP

- SUPPORT3

 

I'll try posting a few screenshots now, this is my first time linking images on here hope it works. For your viewing pleasure (or disgust, who knows).

 

And I'll keep you posted!

 

 

[Walter confetti]

Looks genuinely awesome! Episode 2 is my favorite too!

[Gez]

46 minutes ago, aletaster said:

- Vanilla as fuck 

https://www.moddb.com/mods/vanilla-as-fuck? :p

[aletaster]

54 minutes ago, Walter confetti said:

Looks genuinely awesome! Episode 2 is my favorite too!

 

ty! I love the abstraction, and the core idea that "hell is warping reality" but indeed some of the levels are sloppy. A major lack of bordering textures, overall ugly texturing and some levels are too flat and plain.

[aletaster]

27 minutes ago, Gez said:

https://www.moddb.com/mods/vanilla-as-fuck? :p

 

Haha nothing to do with this! I of course meant the resources. I have never used any other textures or resources outside of vanilla resources in my 7 years of mapping. Plutonia brick textures were the wildest I've ever gone.

[Gwarl]

Quote

There are probably a thousand projects like this, but who cares?

Not so many, ep. 1 remakes are abundant but ep. 2 remakes are a little thinner on the ground

[aletaster]

38 minutes ago, Gwarl said:

Not so many, ep. 1 remakes are abundant but ep. 2 remakes are a little thinner on the ground

Good to know. I especially enjoyed DTWID E2 a ton. Beautiful. This is pretty much in the same vein, but worse with little details and sector furniture.

[Gwarl]

Sorry for the self promotion but here's mine.. also 2 levels completed
 

 

[Jayextee]

3 hours ago, aletaster said:

The idea behind this project came to me about a week ago when I forced my friend to play The Ultimate Doom for the first time. He constantly commented how ugly E2 was compared to E1, so I took matters into my own hands, and started creating a "better" E2. Better is in quotes because I love the original E2 and this is just my take on the episode. The maps are not remade, but replaced with new concepts. There are probably a thousand projects like this, but who cares? This is if I did E2, my E2. 

 

This was very similar to the overall thought process of why I made The Becoming a couple of years back, as I too think E2 is an ugly episode in a few ways. Although judging from a review or two, the idea of a 'bridge' episode of transformation between the E1 and E3 styles didn't appeal to everyone; I nonetheless took that as an overall concept and ran with it.

 

Looking forward to see where yours goes, even if that floor-lettering looks distinctly not vanilla as claimed. ;)

[aletaster]

30 minutes ago, Gwarl said:

Sorry for the self promotion but here's mine.. also 2 levels completed
 

 

cool, i'll check this out!

[aletaster]

3 minutes ago, Jayextee said:

 

This was very similar to the overall thought process of why I made The Becoming a couple of years back, as I too think E2 is an ugly episode in a few ways. Although judging from a review or two, the idea of a 'bridge' episode of transformation between the E1 and E3 styles didn't appeal to everyone; I nonetheless took that as an overall concept and ran with it.

 

Looking forward to see where yours goes, even if that floor-lettering looks distinctly not vanilla as claimed. ;)

should have worded it better, vanilla resources and classic style maps with funky twists. idk. i like these little "floor signs", friends got some laughs out of them. hellification in progress!

Edited August 24, 2021 by aletaster

[Jayextee]

1 minute ago, aletaster said:

should have worded it better, vanilla resources and classic style maps with funky twists.

I gathered, but it's a growing bone of contention of mine when I see something labelled as 'vanilla' with detail levels I can smell VPO or HOM in just looking at them; this is from the POV of someone who does map for vanilla-compatibility mind you. :)

I will reiterate the interest in your E2 replacement though. It's my least-favourite episode of the original three, so reimaginings are always welcome in my eyes. :)

[Omniarch]

As a veritable connoisseur of E2-inspired pwads, this endeavour intrigues me! I'm really liking the look of dem screenies, very classy.

[aletaster]

1 minute ago, Jayextee said:

I gathered, but it's a growing bone of contention of mine when I see something labelled as 'vanilla' with detail levels I can smell VPO or HOM in just looking at them; this is from the POV of someone who does map for vanilla-compatibility mind you. :)

I will reiterate the interest in your E2 replacement though. It's my least-favourite episode of the original three, so reimaginings are always welcome in my eyes. :)

totally get that. i have only tested these in gzdoom and i'll be sure to make the episode more compatible when i drop it. i'm really new in these sorts of things, i downloaded slade for the first time 6 months ago; i have only been mapping for myself and made hundreds and hundreds of maps that just sit on my computer, never seeing daylight. this is the first time i'm planning on releasing something. i think doomkid had some videos that will help with joining the maps together and all that. could barely rename the maps a min ago!

 

also i'm glad to hear the interest! this is coming together nicely even though i just started the project.

[Omniarch]

50 minutes ago, aletaster said:

totally get that. i have only tested these in gzdoom and i'll be sure to make the episode more compatible when i drop it. i'm really new in these sorts of things, i downloaded slade for the first time 6 months ago; i have only been mapping for myself and made hundreds and hundreds of maps that just sit on my computer, never seeing daylight. this is the first time i'm planning on releasing something. i think doomkid had some videos that will help with joining the maps together and all that. could barely rename the maps a min ago!

 

also i'm glad to hear the interest! this is coming together nicely even though i just started the project.

If you need a playtester, I'd be happy to render assistance. This sort of project is right up my alley, and there can never be too much Ultimate Doom-inspired content out there from my perspective.

[7Mahonin]

While I absolutely disagree with the idea that episode 2 is ugly; the screenshots look quite promising as an alternative episode 2. I’m looking forward to trying this out. 

Edited August 24, 2021 by TelicAx7
typo

[LordEntr0py]

Love these images!

And you can count me as a second playtest offer/request.

[aletaster]

I will now attempt making a more vertical storage level in place of E2M2. Will I succeed? I don't know. Will the level have a sector truck crashed through a wall? Hell yes! So uh this is some of the progress, I started an hour ago. 

[Omniarch]

Damn nice sector truck, that. Very creative use of textures there (is that SKY1 I spy, standing in for broken glass?). Actually, that's a very nice room in general, somewhat reminiscent of Jan Van der Veken's work. Elegant, well-composed, well-lit. Very nice indeed.

 

[aletaster]

Just now, Omniarch said:

Damn nice sector truck, that. Very creative use of textures there (is that SKY1 I spy, standing in for broken glass?). Actually, that's a very nice room in general, somewhat reminiscent of Jan Van der Veken's work. Elegant, well-composed, well-lit. Very nice indeed.

 

Yes it is :D! I usually have used something like MODWALL for vehicle windows, but since this is Doom 1 I had to improvise. It actually even looks better!

Thanks for the kind words, all of the nice comments on here have had my work speed doubled!

[aletaster]

I'll now try uploading a map that I consider finished, so I can get criticism on the difficulty and everything. This is the first map of the episode, it is supposed to be an artifact research facility, that you just teleported in after being killed at the end of KDITD. I only made my friend play it, he said that it was too dark so I brightened everything up by a notch. I'm personally pretty happy with it, but of course people are gonna have different tastes. I'll link a dropbox download.

 

Be as harsh as you need to be, please! :)

[aletaster]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gbieIT_WIwIWjXDxE392pXekd5iywJWy/view?usp=sharing dropbox deez nuts

[Omniarch]

Just finished the map now, and I really enjoyed it! To be quite honest, this map is better than it has any right to be. I found every aspect of the map enjoyable; progression, combat, atmosphere, the whole lot.

 

I'll highlight a few key features that stood out to me:

 

1) the lighting is really strong for a newer mapper, and rock-solid even in absolute terms. Good OG Doom-style high-contrast stuff.

 

2) the visual style of the map is a very interesting and unique hybrid of almost DTWiD-style design mixed with a sort of pseudo-realism, reminiscent of Zylinderkatze's URE2020. Its actually quite difficult to carve out one's own aesthetic niche in such a well-trod "genre", but you managed to pull it off with your first release. Most impressive indeed.

 

3) I really appreciate the Doomcute touches as well, like the flesh monster or the various chairs and consoles scattered about the place. Additionally, I love the small "off-map areas" exist soley to give the impression of a world beyond the playspace. Reminds me somewhat of No End In Sight in that way (a massive compliment coming from me, possibly the biggest NEIS fan of them all).

 

4) I found the map's progression really satisfying in the way it loops around in on itself. It feels like making one's way through a semi-real facility, with some governing logic behind it's design.

 

5) I played the map with Crispy Doom, and yet, discovered no bugs whatsoever. Normally, maps made by newer mappers and only tested in Geezy are riddled with bugs caused by differing port behaviour, but there were no instances of this here.

 

In short, this is a very strong first release, and bodes well for things to come. I look forward to the rest of the episode!

[aletaster]

8 minutes ago, Omniarch said:

Just finished the map now, and I really enjoyed it! To be quite honest, this map is better than it has any right to be. I found every aspect of the map enjoyable; progression, combat, atmosphere, the whole lot.

 

I'll highlight a few key features that stood out to me:

 

1) the lighting is really strong for a newer mapper, and rock-solid even in absolute terms. Good OG Doom-style high-contrast stuff.

 

2) the visual style of the map is a very interesting and unique hybrid of almost DTWiD-style design mixed with a sort of pseudo-realism, reminiscent of Zylinderkatze's URE2020. Its actually quite difficult to carve out one's own aesthetic niche in such a well-trod "genre", but you managed to pull it off with your first release. Most impressive indeed.

 

3) I really appreciate the Doomcute touches as well, like the flesh monster or the various chairs and consoles scattered about the place. Additionally, I love the small "off-map areas" exist soley to give the impression of a world beyond the playspace. Reminds me somewhat of No End In Sight in that way (a massive compliment coming from me, possibly the biggest NEIS fan of them all).

 

4) I found the map's progression really satisfying in the way it loops around in on itself. It feels like making one's way through a semi-real facility, with some governing logic behind it's design.

 

5) I played the map with Crispy Doom, and yet, discovered no bugs whatsoever. Normally, maps made by newer mappers and only tested in Geezy are riddled with bugs caused by differing port behaviour, but there were no instances of this here.

 

In short, this is a very strong first release, and bodes well for things to come. I look forward to the rest of the episode!

Absolutely heartwarming to hear! I have been doing these off-map areas for a while now, just to make the world seem bigger. I'm strict with how they should look, either with darkening hallways or with the DOOR3 texture. NEIS, DTWiD, and Doom Zero have been major recent contributions to my mapping, so it's nice you that noticed a couple of those.

 

I tried to make the map so, that you could go either left or right from the flesh monster, both routes about as difficult. As you noticed, the left side gives you the shotgun more early, but about nothing else. On the right side you have to survive with your pea-shooter for a while, but you get full armor and a chaingun.

 

Hope my other maps will be worthy as well! I'll need to work on the difficulties on this map yet, because as for now the monsters and pickups are the same for every difficulty level.

 

Thanks for testing!

[Philnemba]

I'm definitely intrigue by this judging from those fancy screenshots especially since episode 2 is my favorite episode ;)   

[rouge_means_red]

I recorded a demo 7souldemo.rar (gzdoom)

 

I don't have much to say... I like the detailing, specially the rails and machinery. I think it could do with some impassable lines so I'm not climbing on computer terminals and other decoration for no reason.

I also had some trouble locating the weapons... the shotgun was behind some pinkies (and not really visible from the point you come in from), and since I only had a pistol I just turned around immediately. The chaingun... I'm not sure how I didn't see it, maybe the demo could make it clearer

Edited August 26, 2021 by 7Soul

[aletaster]

1 minute ago, 7Soul said:

I recorded a demo 7souldemo.rar (gzdoom)

 

I don't have much to say... I like the detailing, specially the rails and machinery. I think it could do with some impassable lines so I'm not climbing on computer terminals and other decoration for no reason.

I also had some trouble locating the weapons... the shotgun was behind some pinkies (and not really visible from the point you come in from), and since I only had a pistol I just turned around immediately. The chaingun... I'm not sure how I didn't see it, maybe the demo could make it clearer

Right! I was gonna do those impassable lines but forgot. The chaingun was up in an open hallway in the brown building after the "lava river", I'll show. I thought it would be obvious! I could accent it more I guess.

 

I'll figure something about the shotty in the pinky hall if people continue having trouble with it. I personally think it's quite visible due to the flesh texture and the bright red details, but I get if the pinkies make you just do a 180 :D. Thanks for playing and critique!

[aletaster]

7 minutes ago, 7Soul said:

I recorded a demo 7souldemo.rar (gzdoom)

 

I don't have much to say... I like the detailing, specially the rails and machinery. I think it could do with some impassable lines so I'm not climbing on computer terminals and other decoration for no reason.

I also had some trouble locating the weapons... the shotgun was behind some pinkies (and not really visible from the point you come in from), and since I only had a pistol I just turned around immediately. The chaingun... I'm not sure how I didn't see it, maybe the demo could make it clearer

right there! the way to there is through the nuclear canal with the garg faces. I'll update the drive file in 15 minutes, fixing some things.

[rouge_means_red]

Maybe add a little 64x64-unit pedestal with lights on top?

[aletaster]

2 minutes ago, 7Soul said:

Maybe add a little 64x64-unit pedestal with lights on top?

i added some blue lights on the inner walls. imo muuch more seeable now