YouTube is becoming a pain- COVID edition

[Apprentice]

On 10/1/2021 at 8:02 PM, CBM said:

anybody else having these issues?

Not directly but I do know people who have some videos deleted because of their 'policy', which the Dutch court allows them to do so.

 

In all earnest: it's waiting for the day that videos and channels by people from one side of the political spectrum will be deleted because the CEO and the board of directors (or whatever) happen to favour the other side of said political spectrum. In a way, it is already happening with COVID-19 related videos which are being deleted under the "fake news" umbrella, regardless if you happen to agree or disagree with it.

 

I find this a dangerous precedent because what will happen when YouTube (or another platform) decides to state that the sky is green and the grass is blue and subsequently deletes everything that does not fall this line ?? Or that certain groups of people are allowed to be trashed, tarnished or ridiculed/portrayed in a somewhat negative viewpoint ?? I wonder if YouTube's 'Terms of Services' will be that sacred again or will (Dutch) court finally wake up . . .

[Graf Zahl]

3 hours ago, Apprentice said:

 In a way, it is already happening with COVID-19 related videos which are being deleted under the "fake news" umbrella, regardless if you happen to agree or disagree with it.
 

 

The big problem here, of course, is, that some elements on the right wing side persistently ignore all scientific advice and instead babble a lot of dangerous bullshit about COVID. While in most countries these are fringe parties that do not have a good standing with the vast majority of the population, in the USA they are part of one of the main parties which makes the entire matter highly alarming.

 

[ketmar]

6 hours ago, Graf Zahl said:

The big problem here, of course, is, that some elements on the right wing side persistently ignore all scientific advice and instead babble a lot of dangerous bullshit

people doing it all the time, about everything. but of course, youtube audience is so dumb that they will believe everything they'll see on youtube — that's why youtube had to protect them by removing videos. and of course, youtube audience won't be able to find such info in any other place (they're too dumb for this). at least this is how youtube (and most other services, and govs) are see people. so i don't expect anything good for them.

 

@Redneckerz psssst… mpv+yt-dlc — no logins, and it doesn't know about any age restrictions…

[Apprentice]

9 hours ago, Graf Zahl said:

The big problem here, of course, is, that some elements on the right wing side persistently ignore all scientific advice and instead babble a lot of dangerous bullshit about COVID. While in most countries these are fringe parties that do not have a good standing with the vast majority of the population, in the USA they are part of one of the main parties which makes the entire matter highly alarming.

At first glance, that is not something new and only limited to right-wing elements. Certain left-wing and religious elements also have a tendency to babble around on a broad range of various subjects which are at certain times just as dangerous and highly alarming. Although I agree with the removal of obvious fake videos ("Drink diesel oil to stop the virus" and such), I have a hard time accepting the current policy of removing well-argumented videos on why people don't want to be vaccinated in the example of Covid-19. Wetter you agree or disagree with their reasoning and argumentation, I believe that people should at all times be able to voice their opinions in this the Covid-19 pandemic and available vaccins.

 

Unfortunately, YouTube deleted those videos under their "fake-news" umbrella and are so far entitled and allowed to do so. For instance, I am not allowed to state on YouTube that I have concerns regarding the vaccins on a long term basis (10, 20, 30 years+) even though I can back my claims with certain scientific provable facts. From my engineering background, I cannot on YouTube give it the same line of thought as what we now know with asbestos and chrome-6, which both are proven carcinogenic and that certain types of cancer are directly related to asbestos and chrome-6.

 

Out of the medical world, I am not allowed to voice my concerns on YouTube when I make outline my fears with the 'medicine' Diethylstilbestrol. Altough the name won't ring a bell with the general Dutch public, the term "DES-dochter" (English: DES-Daughter) will sound more familiar in the general ear. Diethylstilbestrol was given to a lot of Dutch women between the mid 40's and mid 70's who were pregnant and was aimed to prevent mis-carriage(s) and premature birth(s), amongst other medical reasons (I do not know if it was also prescribed to women in other countries during the same period). Nowadays it is scientificly proven that the 'medicine' didn't do what is was aimed to do and that specificly daughters of the women who were prescribed Diethylstilbestrol, had problems with their fertility and a higher risk of cervical cancer. Sons of those woman also had complications as in deformaties within their nether regions and the effects on grandchildren and great-grandchildren are at this point unknown plus there is a whole lot of symptoms related to Diethylstilbestrol which I will not bore you with.

 

Now I don't say that it will happen and that we all get cancer from the vaccin in 30 years time and especially with a vaccin that has been developed in a little over a year where 'normally' there is a route of 10 to 15 years before human trails are even considered, not to mention certain treatments that are available abroad but not in my native Holland (For instance, there is a treatment available in Russia that hugely benefit MS-patients, which is not allowed in the Netherland). Agree with it or disagree with it, this is my reasoning and argumentation on why I am fearful of the vaccin on the longer term and with the current policy, I am not allowed to state them on YouTube since it falls under their "fake news" umbrella, even though it is well argumented and only voices my concerns and why I don't get myself vaccinated . . .

[Graf Zahl]

2 hours ago, Apprentice said:

 I am not allowed to state them on YouTube since it falls under their "fake news" umbrella, even though it is well argumented and only voices my concerns and why I don't get myself vaccinated . . . 

 

 

Too bad for you, but to be blunt, your entire argument fails to consider what a vaccine actually is. No, it's not some chemical substance where prolonged exposure can have poisonous side effects. Yes, there are a few cases where there's a negative reaction to it, but in the grander scheme of things it's minor to the number of deaths COVID causes.

 

But since we're talking about freedom of opinion, let me tell you that in my opinion it's people like you who drag out the entire pandemic for far longer than necessary, so forgive me for not feeling sympathetic to your cause. The harm you indirectly cause is far, far greater than the vague fears you voiced.

 

Last but not least, I am convinced that the medication I get for my tennis elbow will most likely do more harm than those vaccination shots I got - I'll take it anyway because without it I'd be in constant pain.

[Major Arlene]

the biggest thing about the COVID shot is that its side effects far, far pale what will happen to you if you get COVID. and let's be real, the reason so many people aren't getting vaccines is not because they had a well-educated scientific thesis or a thoughtful conversation with their doctor, they went to Google University and did their "research" and found that eating horse paste is a safer alternative, somehow.
if anyone's seen the movie Contagion you'll know there was a journalist peddling an alternative cure that didn't even work, claiming to have used it to cure himself of the virus when he didn't have the virus, and he fooled millions of people. You want to talk about misinformation? start right there.

[Nine Inch Heels]

3 hours ago, Apprentice said:

At first glance, that is not something new and only limited to right-wing elements. Certain left-wing and religious elements also have a tendency to babble around on a broad range of various subjects which are at certain times just as dangerous and highly alarming. Although I agree with the removal of obvious fake videos ("Drink diesel oil to stop the virus" and such), I have a hard time accepting the current policy of removing well-argumented videos on why people don't want to be vaccinated in the example of Covid-19. Wetter you agree or disagree with their reasoning and argumentation, I believe that people should at all times be able to voice their opinions in this the Covid-19 pandemic and available vaccins.

Just going over this real quick, because it is the exact kind of problem that has been greatly exacerbated by social media platforms such as YouTube, FaceBook, and the rest of them...

 

Your obvious fault is putting "well reasoned arguments" on equal footing with "opinions"... To put this into perspective, we're in the middle of a pandemic, where any "well-reasoned argument" would point towards scientific data and statistics that clearly and irrefutably show that vaccination is effective, and that it is necessary to keep the death-tally as low as possible...

 

The danger comes from people who are basically uneducated idiots, like for example Joe Rogan, who now enjoy the privilege of having a reach in the millions, while they're espousing opinions such as "young people don't need the vaccine", as well as "I'll be taking ivermectin"... Joe Rogan is not a virologist, he is not a specialist on the subject of pandemics, he has a degree in absolutely no field of science, and nobody should care how "well reasoned" his supposed "arguments" are, because at the end of the day he is far from the smartest person in the room, and all he has are unfounded and baseless opinions people like you and others take at face value and choose not to get vaccinated at their own peril and those of others, because unvaxxed people do not exist in a vacuum... These opinions are dangerous, these opinions are, quite literally, killing people, all because "successful at something person said stuff that sounded smart on the internet"...

 

This shtick you pulled there that was comparing asbestos to a vaccine is complete nonsense and utter fear mongering... Same shit Kennedy Jr pulled a couple years ago, when he said that some vaccine back in the 70s or whatever caused some damage to somebody, or was not 100% effective (which by the way no vaccine really is)... If you think people aren't any better at doing their jobs, and that no standards have increased over the course of those 50 or whatever years, you have lost contact with reality.... And by the way asbestos is not a vaccine...

 

And believe it or not, I'm all for getting these dangerous opinions off the internet, because it turns out that turning something as serious as a pandemic into a means by which to accumulate political capital is a highly dangerous game to play...

 

There's precisely 1 reason not to get vaccinated, and that's if the immediate impact of the vaccine is too dangerous for whoever is getting vaxxed, and that's a decision professionals, aka doctors ought to be making - not some idiot who confuses civic duties with a threat to their personal freedom... And just to bring it home, because I can, this is the shit that happens when people refuse to listen to those who actually know what the fuck they're talking about: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-dorset-58080116

 

Edited October 4, 2021 by Nine Inch Heels

[LordEntr0py]

@Major Arlene @Nine Inch Heels already said everything I want to say, but to distil the point further:

 

3 hours ago, Apprentice said:

I have concerns regarding the vaccines on a long term basis (10, 20, 30 years+)

 

There are no long-term effects recorded from vaccines, ever. Not in any sensible study. The only study that attempted to link long-term negative effects with vaccines came from someone with vested interest in launching his own private alternative and has already been retracted, refuted and thrown in the bin. A thorough, fully-referenced and entertaining summary can be found here.

Long-term studies were baked into the vaccine trials. The papers were peer-reviewed by scientists who'd love to pick holes in them but couldn't (that's how they even get published).

As Arlene already said, the chance of long-term side effects (or death) from contracting the virus greatly outweigh anything associated with the vaccine. Results show that "Long Covid" cases are significantly reduced in Covid-survivors who were fully vaccinated. I live with someone who has the symptoms of Long Covid, and believe me it will fuck your life up. You do not want to take that risk.

Do a simple risk-assessment and it really is a no-brainer. Get vaxxed.

[Azuris]

16 hours ago, Apprentice said:

Not directly but I do know people who have some videos deleted because of their 'policy', which the Dutch court allows them to do so.

 

In all earnest: it's waiting for the day that videos and channels by people from one side of the political spectrum will be deleted because the CEO and the board of directors (or whatever) happen to favour the other side of said political spectrum. In a way, it is already happening with COVID-19 related videos which are being deleted under the "fake news" umbrella, regardless if you happen to agree or disagree with it.

 

I find this a dangerous precedent because what will happen when YouTube (or another platform) decides to state that the sky is green and the grass is blue and subsequently deletes everything that does not fall this line ?? Or that certain groups of people are allowed to be trashed, tarnished or ridiculed/portrayed in a somewhat negative viewpoint ?? I wonder if YouTube's 'Terms of Services' will be that sacred again or will (Dutch) court finally wake up . . .

 

The Problem is that People use the same Tactics by spreading fake News over Covid and the Vaccines as Antisemitic People do over the Holocaust.

 

It isn't as big, it never happend or exists, it is fake news from another Force that wants to put "us" down, they censore out "Opinion" .

 

As Major Arlene says, People go to Google and else and they find People ignoring everything historical, scientific and biological that we gathered Knowledge of the last few thousand Years.

 

We know how Evolution changes Life Forms to find a Way to survive (even Viruses), we know how Pandemics worked in the Past, we know how Vaccines work, but those People that ignore all this Knowledge and contradict it are those to believe.

People sadly tend to believe what is the easiest Explanation by using some intelligent Sounding Frases.

 

Misleading People by lying is not an Opinion, it is not an ideologic Censoring to Block lies that can be proved wrong, we've seen Republics and Democracies fail because of Forces just misleading People.

[Doomkid]

Please find somewhere else to debate this topic - this is a Doom forum. There are plenty of other places where you all can have hot-button political debates (and deny science..)