Music with vocals or only instrumental?

[Harden]

I'm doing a mod that replaces the Doom 1 OST with the music they were inspired by, and I don't know if I should put the songs with the vocals or only instrumental. Which would be better?

[Stabbey]

It's probably not the greatest idea to put in copyrighted work, especially the full vocal versions of songs, into wads without permission. If nothing else, it'll annoy any streamers/Youtubers who would otherwise play your map.

 

In addition, vocals can be more distracting than instrumental.

Edited February 20, 2022 by Stabbey

[Hitboi]

On 2/20/2022 at 4:21 PM, Stabbey said:

If nothing else, it'll annoy any streamers/Youtubers who would otherwise play your map.

I agree with you, I'm assume that the OP is doing a music-replacement mod and not a map that includes music, but if he does a map(s), then this could be prevented by adding the music as a separate file from the wad, or any way that can make the music optional.
But, still, copyright infringement is not a very okay thing to do in your mod, and personally, music with vocals is not a cool idea to be in Doom (Russian Overkill is exceptional), it can distract the player.


Btw there are games that use vocals in their music correctly, Metal Gear Rising is an example.

Edited February 22, 2022 by Hitboi

[Xim]

The only vocals that really work in video game music are choir chants and stuff like that, and usually in a dead or fictional language. Actual lyrics and verses are usually distracting.

[Doomkid]

Vocals in Doom music just doesn’t seem right. It’s against the natural order!!

[Faustrecht]

Choirs in ambient okay. But with lyrics i see no sense behind it.
Imagine Doom is played with Anime sounds like "He is the Doomguy who kicks azzes"🤣

Edited February 24, 2022 by Faustrecht

[Gradius]

On 2/20/2022 at 1:35 PM, Hitboi said:

But, still, copyright infringement is not a very okay thing to do in your mod

Copyright infringement is hella cool and all the other kids do it. If we started shutting down every wad that packaged altered Doom / Doom 2 textures, are ones from the Raven games or Duke 3D we'd have maybe five maps on the site. If we cut out every wad that had a midi rendition of 90s metal songs we'd... technically not even really have the original Doom either.

 

The important thing is to not flagrantly infringe on heavily protected works such as films and music. A cover of a song or a still image meme from a movie might be fine, but wholesale copying is just gonna bring on the cease and desist notice alongside DMCA takedowns.

 

Minor infringements that don't really step on anyone's toes in a serious way and aren't likely to piss anyone off are the bread and butter of modding communities (and the ability to play as a Barney the Dinosaur fighting Stormtroopers with Deckard's pistol in Left 4 Dead is a life experience I'm not going to get otherwise), but there's a line that's just unwise to cross. Bundling in full mp3s of popular songs is definitely one of them. Whether it's morally okay is up for discussion, whether it'll get immediately taken down for the copyright violations is definitely not.

[Borg]

Glad to hear vocals are a no go in Doom. I spent hours extracting them and replacing with an instrument.

Plus my vocals suck. I wouldn't want anybody on DW to hear them.

[Antkibo]

Copyright infringement is a tool by the rich (which they control however they want, e.g. Disney) and is not a moral principle by any means. As long as you don't profit from other people work, it's okay.

 

Vocals (not choirs) are rarely heard in DOOM music, or game music in general for that matter. You can experiment, however. Atlus' Persona series show how vocals can work fine in such environments.

Edited February 26, 2022 by Antkibo

[Nikku4211]

On 2/24/2022 at 1:37 PM, Gradius said:

Copyright infringement is hella cool and all the other kids do it. If we started shutting down every wad that packaged altered Doom / Doom 2 textures, are ones from the Raven games or Duke 3D we'd have maybe five maps on the site. If we cut out every wad that had a midi rendition of 90s metal songs we'd... technically not even really have the original Doom either.

 

We're not talking MIDI renditions, we're not talking covers, we're talking about a planned music replacement WAD that has the original songs.

 

Vocal or instrumental, they're certainly not MIDI renditions by any means.

6 hours ago, Antkibo said:

Copyright infringement is a tool by the rich (which they control however they want, e.g. Disney) and is not a moral principle by any means. As long as you don't profit from other people work, it's okay.

 

It takes a huge sum of wealth to fight someone who has a huge sum of wealth in the courtroom.

 

It makes sense to worry about copyright for a community where a lot of people don't have thousands of spare dollars or equivalent in other currencies.

6 hours ago, Antkibo said:

Vocals (not choirs) are rarely heard in DOOM music, or game music in general for that matter. You can experiment, however. Atlus' Persona series show how vocals can work fine in such environments.

 

I don't even know how you would encode vocals that speak actual lyrics in the MIDI/MUS format supported by Doom's own DMX sound engine for music.

 

But yeah, English vocals during gameplay is distracting.

 

I don't need to hear some guy's bars while I'm trying to fend off demons.

[Antkibo]

2 hours ago, Nikku4211 said:

It takes a huge sum of wealth to fight someone who has a huge sum of wealth in the courtroom.

 

It makes sense to worry about copyright for a community where a lot of people don't have thousands of spare dollars or equivalent in other currencies.

Yeah, that's why franchises won't pursue legal actions against small artists. At the most, a cease and desist notice, like what happened with Another Metroid 2 Remake.

[Nikku4211]

Just now, Antkibo said:

Yeah, that's why franchises won't pursue legal actions against small artists. At the most, a cease and desist notice, like what happened with Another Metroid 2 Remake.

What do you think will happen if someone doesn't follow a cease and desist notice?

[Antkibo]

2 minutes ago, Nikku4211 said:

What do you think will happen if someone doesn't follow a cease and desist notice?

That's just asking for trouble. But AMR2 is still out there. His creator did follow the cease and desist, but once a work is on internet it's impossible to track. I count that as a win for all players out there (great game, btw).

Edited February 27, 2022 by Antkibo

[Harden]

On 2/18/2022 at 7:09 PM, Harden said:

I'm doing a mod that replaces the Doom 1 OST with the music they were inspired by, and I don't know if I should put the songs with the vocals or only instrumental. Which would be better?

bruh i just wanted to make a music replacement mod that had music from metallica, slayer, etc.