What has kept us from creating a true HD remaster of the original games?

[Koko Ricky]

Mods like Beautiful Doom, Brutal Doom, and Smooth Doom, as well as neural upscaling experiments and voxel packs, have been earnest attempts at visually refining aspects of Doom. The iconic music and sound effects have all been updated to modern standards. We have Knee Deep in ZDoom, an ambitious but ultimately bloated reworking of Doom's E1, with no word on subsequent episodes in more than a decade. And the less said about 3D model replacements, the better. In all examples, only parts of the games' presentation have been updated, and in some cases (model replacements and HD textures), it almost feels like a downgrade. 

 

With all that in mind, what is stopping us from truly overhauling the original games; truly offering an HD version of sound, music, graphics, and layouts? Is it a matter of money, being that a paid team will get more done than volunteers? Is it that we can't decide on method, as there is a stark difference between HD sprites, 3D models and voxels? What precisely has kept such a project from coming to fruition? 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Koko Ricky

[DannyMan]

Maybe it would be too ambitious?

[Nefelibeta]

Ehh, a bit boring perhaps? You know, people have been playing the original iwads since 1993.

[cannonball]

I think in the end l, the original game was built around the technology of the time. As such I don’t think a full remaster would be an easy task to do well. The same applies to many FPS games in particular, it isn’t like other genres like platformers where updating the graphics and in particular the mechanics of the moving parts doesn’t really change the game that much. For example placing monsters from Doom 2016/Eternal into a OG Doom layout might not have desirable results.

Sometimes it is just better to leave the original game be and play the newer games (Which are great) that in part fulfil that rule with levels that are bespoke to the modern characters (both player and demons).

Edited February 19, 2022 by cannonball

[Dark Pulse]

Lawyers.

 

Also lack of talented people interested enough in doing it.

[esselfortium]

Doom has its own style that works well within the limitations of its tech. Modernization-for-modernization's-sake attempts usually leave it looking like an awkward bargain-bin PS2 game instead. To do it "right", you'd need consistent art direction, completely overhauled level geometry, a new lighting system, and a lot else. And considering that a big part of Doom's longevity has come from community addons with their own levels and resources (i.e. you can't just autoload "modernized doom" with them and have consistent results), putting a modern commercial game production's amount of work into updating the original levels from 1993 is a pretty tough sell for most people who would have the capability to do it.

[Graf Zahl]

Even the, what would be the point? I'd say the interest in a HD remaster of the original game does not exist among the game's regular players. We like Doom for what it is, not for what it could be when using all aspects of modern tech.

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Graf Zahl

[LexiMax]

I think something along the lines of a Nightdive remaster would look quite nice, but I don't think a full HD remaster would do the game any favors.

 

Just play Doom 2016 or Doom Eternal instead.  Either one of those is going to be a better game than any HD remaster of Doom could ever possibly aspire to.

Edited February 19, 2022 by AlexMax

[HavoX]

3 minutes ago, Graf Zahl said:

We like Doom for what it is, not for what it could be when using all aspects of modern tech.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[BlueThunder]

Doom has come along way since 320x200 is dos days,  I'm sure many would agree with me,  I mean now you have higher resolution, widescreen, countless wads and mods to play with, and so many source ports to play it on,  Doom in HD kind of already exists to me, I grew up with this game and it has grown as well into the modern age,  just my opinion however.

[BoxY]

Many over the decades have tried, all have failed.

[Wadmodder Shalton]

None of these HD packs for Doom go anywhere after a certain number of years. An example is the Doom High Resolution Pack from the early-2000s designed jDoom (now referred to as the Doomsday Engine), that has never been updated since like the mid-2010s.

Also, the 3D models Pack for jDoom, Risen3D, Vavoom and even GZDoom/Zandronum have never aged the best either.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Wadmodder Shalton

[Dweller Dark]

A remaster akin to Strife: Veteran Edition would be great, but I don't think a full HD remaster would work as well. A remake would likely be better, if enough attention and care to the original style was given, and it has the right aesthetic. Doom remade with the style of Dusk would be interesting, with blocky 3D models and pixelation, and whatever Andrew Hulshult can come up with.

[esselfortium]

7 minutes ago, Eddie 2077 said:

Doom remade with the style of Dusk would be interesting, with blocky 3D models and pixelation

Quake?

[Doomkid]

A game with Doom Eternal-like graphics but with gameplay that aligns far more with that of Classic Doom in terms of player speed and general weapon/monster functionality absolutely is possible and would be a lot of fun.

 

The idea that a much closer approximation of Classic Doom’s gameplay couldn’t be recreated in 3D has always struck me as a limitation in the human imagination moreso than an “actual limitation” because I can envision it very clearly when I close my eyes, and it’s by no means “undoable”, haha. Problem is I’m not a several-dozen member development team so for now it stays in my brain.

 

Some things would of course need to be a little different, maybe the specific animations of demons walking around would feel a little different in practice due to having smoother movement, but there would be absolutely no need to change anything drastically. It could be done in a way that still aligns with their classic Doom behaviour closely enough to not throw people for a loop.

 

I wouldn’t want the same old maps, though. Maybe some texturing and theming that harkens back to the OG Dooms, but new layouts would be preferred for sure, and would be better able to adapt to any minor differences in the gameplay loop resulting from the newer tech.

 

The long-short is that it’s absolutely possible, but would (personally) feel like a bit of a waste if we just played the same old bases yet again.

 

I made a similar thread about 10 years ago by the way, and the responses were pretty similar back then, although I was told with stark, unwarranted confidence that nothing even remotely close to Doom could be done with modern tech.

 

Of course, Doom 4/Eternal blew this absurd proclamation out of the water, but there still seems to be a struggle getting people to realise that it could have been even closer to mimicking OG Doom gameplay almost 1:1... Not that I would have necessarily wanted “unchanged” gameplay in Doom4/E anyway - the new mechanics were interesting and a good idea to prevent abundant sameyness through the series, but still, it’s plain as day that something which plays a lot more like Doom2 would be possible and enjoyable even when transposed to a modern engine.

[Dweller Dark]

10 minutes ago, esselfortium said:

Quake?

 

Pretty much, but with some software style pixelization filter and whatever else that might make it look retro. A remake using EDuke and big Ion Fury-esque levels would be interesting too, replicating the Doom aesthetic but making the levels large and almost seamless with each other.

[Edward850]

35 minutes ago, Eddie 2077 said:

Pretty much, but with some software style pixelization filter and whatever else that might make it look retro.

You are still describing Quake. Except it didn't do that with filters, given it is the original "software rendered" style that games like Dusk went on to emulate.

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Edward850

[Dweller Dark]

5 minutes ago, Edward850 said:

You are still describing Quake. Except it didn't do that with filters, given it is the original software rendered style that games like Dusk went on to emulate.

 

True, I probably should have just referenced Quake's software rendered style instead of Dusk's. The idea would be to remake Doom with a mix of Dusk, Quake, and Doom elements. Or alternatively, using Ion Fury/Build elements instead of Dusk's.

[Marisa the Magician]

What has kept us from creating a TRUE hd remaster? I'd say the other currently-existing hd remasters. They're shining examples of just how slapping "HD" on everything simply does not work at all for a game like this.

 

You'd have to do a remake, rather than a remaster, because there are inherent limits in the engine and gameplay that will not work in favor of more modern graphics at all.

[Astronomical]

The fact that the audience would be very cynical of such a remake.  People are dismissing the unity port despite that being a free update.  Also source code.

[Sneezy McGlassFace]

I don't think Doom needs that. And I don't think people would care about an HD remaster of it. For games like Grim Fandango that were near impossible to get working on modern systems, that makes a lot of sense. It's a game people liked, you could polish the textures and models, bump resolution, improve controls, add some quality of life improvements, etc. But Doom lives on community content for nearly three decades. There are heaps of source ports of all flavours, replacement textures, weapons, monsters, and maps, gameplay tweaks and enhancements, controls are nicer, resolution goes as high as you like, endless options menu.. The community has already remastered Doom.

 

The one thing I would like seeing is enemy sprites with 16 rotations. But that alone is a ton of work.

[Faustrecht]

4 hours ago, Dark Pulse said:

Lawyers.

This !!! https://www.pcgamesn.com/doom/doom-remake-4

 

For Brutal Doom: I understand this more as a parody 

Still tho its a fun mod and i dont want to miss it.

Sidenote: In Germany Doom was banned.

 

Sure as many state "we love it as it is" i can fully understand people who just want pure nostalgia. But i also like to see what if... or even things i thought about when there were less hardware restrictions.

 

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Faustrecht
Shalton posted a video that shows already what i tried to post

[ENEMY!!!]

I'm reminded of some of the discussions I was involved in with the Classic Doom 3 mod back in the 2000s.  Legal issues were mentioned regarding remaking the 2nd and 3rd episodes, but a far more important reason why the team only remade the first episode was that they got bored with remaking existing maps and wanted to start coming up with products that allowed more originality.  I reckon this issue, tiring of remaking existing maps after a while, is probably the main thing that has prevented a proper HD remake of Doom.

Edited February 19, 2022 by ENEMY!!!

[Koko Ricky]

I'm curious as to how a realistic, high detail version of Doom would look with say, the fidelity of Blood. 

[Edward850]

1 hour ago, Faustrecht said:

This !!! https://www.pcgamesn.com/doom/doom-remake-4

 

On 6/9/2019 at 9:52 PM, Edward850 said:

The mod was packaging itself with freedoom and releasing it as a standalone package, with Doom in the name. While advertising itself as a "Doom remake", and of course you can't do that. If it was including the IWADs than that's just frosting on this incredibly silly cake. 

 

Addendum: there's also a rumour going around that the author was trying to put it on store shelves in eastern europe? Take that with a grain of salt, but if it's true, sheesh. 

 

Remember kids, make your own stuff, don't just take 20 other mods and mapsets and call it your own work. 

[GraphicBleeder]

I would much rather play a new, expansive, eye-catching megawad over an ""HD"" remaster of the original IWADs. I just don't see a point to it.

[ant]

Let's modders remaster the game.

[Biodegradable]

I think a big reason why a lot of us don't particularly like the idea of some kind of fangled HD one-to-one remake of Doom is because the community has been constantly creating new content and technology for the game that has kept it alive and well for nearly 30 years. We're always pushing it to new and exciting heights all the time with different technologies and art assets/animations that blend with and complement the base game's engine and art style to the point where the need for a "remaster" just feels kind of redundant.

 

I'd prefer a complete and total remake with a different engine, art direction, mechanics, etc similar to what they did with Doom 2016 and Eternal. Something that pays respects to the original game, but also does a lot of its own thing in a similar vein.  

Edited February 20, 2022 by Biodegradable

[Avoozl]

Despite its faults I actually quite liked the HD mod for Duke Nukem 3D.

[Wadmodder Shalton]

Doom Remake 4 to me often looked like a crappy dollar store discount low-budget bootleg version of Doom 2016 and Doom 3 than an actual gameplay mod.