How to make crawling bugs? and dirty bed sheets, drugs and stuff? (all things related to ruin and misery)

[poisonhead]

I'm attempting to make a Doom II map, preferably Vanilla but might consider using a source port if it's truly required. I was wondering how to create bugs, like cockroaches etc? I'd just need one kind, just to sell the image of ruin etc better. I don't think it needs height so at first I was thinking of animated flats but I don't think they're feasible. Now I'm thinking of making them as a harmless enemy but can enemy sprites be flat? Can I make some creepy crawler as a harmless enemy without having to draw it from every angle? And anyway besides height it wouldn't really need to have many pixels at all, just a few black ones. I've never made an enemy myself or much dehacked stuff.

 

Also I was wondering if anybody has free to use textures for things like dirty bed sheets (lol @ how hard it's trying to find textures of them as well as anything about the crawling kind of bugs using any search engine) and whatever I'd appreciate them. I've got way too much to do as is, more than a thousand photos to go through and make textures of. I'm so tired of seeing the same stock textures for almost thirty years and I'm trying to convey some kind of realism about ruin, substance abuse, dark poor gritty life in a junkie house (could use textures/sprites of needles, bottles etc) and also some surrealism, kind of like trying to show how a mentally ill junkie might see the world. I'll also be paying a tribute to things I've loved, love and have lost etc. This will be a personal and weird wad if I'll ever get it to alpha stage. My time is short. If you want to contribute in any way, either give me permission to use your stuff or come aboard to make the thing together send me a message, you'll be sure to get credits. I have so many ideas, like having a needle, bottle, pipe etc as a weapon sprite and I just got to thinking about how to portray the effects of drugs? Changing color palette would be corny. Any and all ideas and even more so, executions, are very welcome. I'd like the wad to start with doomguy's life gone off the tracks after he saved the world, he wakes up really hung over and fucked up with low health and must find drugs soon or the demons of the mind start coming for him, or something like that. Any and all help and ideas etc would be so very appreciated.

 

I'm very sorry that it's hard to write good english when I'm this hangoverous, tired etc f*cked up and this isn't my mother tongue. I've already spent weeks in photography, design, making textures etc. I'd be so happy if I could find some bored graphic artists to help me turn photos into textures, flats and sprites and could use your donations if you have any stuff I might use? I'd also like some junkie sprites but don't have time or skill to draw enemys/npcs. Also I'd like to stay Vanilla in order to have limitations as I've found them to breed creativity and help not get overwhelmed. I bet if the Beatles had modern technology they would've drowned in thousands of channels and wouldn't have produced the gems they did with 4 track recorders.

[Kappes Buur]

7 hours ago, poisonhead said:

I'd like to understand doom2.wad. Why there's F1_START, F1_END, F2_START, F2_END, F3_START and F3_END and so forth between F_START and F_END? Why aren't all flats just between F_START and F_END? Which program can I use to edit TEXTURE1.lmp and PNAMES.lmp etc? I'm using XWE to work with WADS. I can't get Slade to work on this ancient slow Win7 machine. I find it weird how there isn't flats and textures for dummies or anything? All information is so scattered everywhere, part of it contradicts itself and I'm at a loss on how to use my own flats and textures without editing and replacing them in doom2.wad. Sorry for being so dumb.

 

Any and all help _much_ appreciated!

 

See this tutorial by Kappes Buur

[Dexiaz]

It's impossible to make the sprite flat, BUT you can use the flat 3D model with image of crawling bugs. You might seen flat blood in Brutal Doom or any modern gore mod. Those blood splats on floors are 3D models. But it will require to move your map from Vanilla to UDMF.

 

But at first I've thought about making animated texture. I can't say where you can get a source to make your own textures, but Half-Life 1 used some bug's sprites for same decorative reasons as you want.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Dexiaz

[Dusty_Rhodes]

You can use Dehacked to give Doomguy low health in vanilla. Check out the Artica Series

 

https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Artica_(series)

 

Making animated flats in vanilla Doom is pretty simple, just give the flat the names of an animated one, like FWATER1 - 4. You can also use animated textures and flats from Doom 1, as the exe has the same code pointers. 

 

Also, it may not be my place, but I think you should get some help. I hope you're okay.

[poisonhead]

On 4/4/2022 at 5:38 PM, Dusty_Rhodes said:

Also, it may not be my place, but I think you should get some help. I hope you're okay.

 

The thing is that I did and I was fed lies and placed in this mold and bug infested hellhole full of drunks and IV junkies. I'm not gonna last for long, just trying to escape to Doom editing besides music. It's sad that my mind/brain isn't working much any more. I can push pixels and play music and stuff but forgotten so much and hard to learn things. I'm struggling to learn how to import custom textures and flats with their own names and stuff, like without replacing existing ones 'cos that's what I've done before but there's no simple site/way of seeing how textures form a patch so it's bound to be pretty tiresome in Doom Builder only using the parts of the patches I replaced so I'm trying to learn how to import my own patches and flats....

 

I found some bug crawling gifs and went through a lot of trouble to make animated flats, really hoping this time I'd manage to break the 4 frame limit 'cos I remember trying to make longer anims but despite frames being between the first and last image of said animation I never got them to work. Also I can't find copyright info so guess it's stealing but I don't care. Just struggling to gather the necessary gfx to start mapping (it's the easiest part).

 

But I'm looking for DIRTY TEXTURES, FLATS and SPRITES, of walls, bed sheets etc and EVERYTHING DRUG RELATED, ALSO BEER AND BOOZE BOTTLES, CIGARETTES, ALL KINDS OF THING related to ruin, misery, dirtyness. I don't have time to do _everything_ from scratch.

 

If somebody wants to collab I have a dropbox folder with a few gigabytes of images besides the ones I've already converted to Doom size and color palette. I'm sure many great textures could be made and I just wanna make sure my map's the first one to use them if I'll get that far. After that I'll give permission to use them freely.

 

And one last thing..... has anybody tried to make a train/spaceship/whatever level using only animated textures and flats to convey the sense of movement? Like if player is inside a train, plane or something so trees, skies or stars etc would go by? I don't mind it being repetative. Just been googling and seems a hassle to do.

 

Last question for today, are there any (example or otherwise) maps showcasing swinging doors? (like https://www.doomworld.com/tutorials/fx11.php ) I wouldn't mind having other vanilla tips and tricks in the wad too. It's easier to learn from example than trying to follow a guide.

 

Sorry for this mess of a post. My brain has been replaced with smashed potatoes. Yet I'd like to make something happen in Doom before I croak.

 

Thanks for the previous replies! Happy easter etc and please don't ask me to get help etc 'cos I'd be so happy if there was any available but not in this country and my health is terminal anyway and I haven't got reasons to stay. Making Doom stuff or playing songs badly for nobody in loneliness isn't too fun...

[poisonhead]

I'd like to understand doom2.wad. Why there's F1_START, F1_END, F2_START, F2_END, F3_START and F3_END and so forth between F_START and F_END? Why aren't all flats just between F_START and F_END? Which program can I use to edit TEXTURE1.lmp and PNAMES.lmp etc? I'm using XWE to work with WADS. I can't get Slade to work on this ancient slow Win7 machine. I find it weird how there isn't flats and textures for dummies or anything? All information is so scattered everywhere, part of it contradicts itself and I'm at a loss on how to use my own flats and textures without editing and replacing them in doom2.wad. Sorry for being so dumb.

 

Any and all help _much_ appreciated!

 

EDIT: Took me whole damn night to trial-and-error but now bugs are crawling on my blood stained floors! Still find it weird how there's no easy guide to making texture wads. My texture wad now contains these entries:

mygfx
SS_START
mysprites
SS_END
PP_START
mypatches
PP_END
FF_START
myflats
F_END
PNAMES
TEXTURE1

 

Is this 100% correct? I'm aiming for vanilla compatibility even though I'll most likely go over the limits. I'm happy that I got 10+ frame animation to work and am not limited in just replacing default textures and worrying how they'll show up. Got my own names for stuff. Just wondering if there's a limit to how many textures and flats I can add? Also I tried to run UDB with other texture packs and many of them had only the textures from those packs when selecting textures from such wad. Now when I'm selecting textures from my wad it shows all the Doom II default textures before mine. Also wanna make sure it's normal that even though I've got iwad paths and stuff configured properly in UDB I still have to select Doom2.wad in resource wads first before my wad or I get gazillion missing this and that errors? I noticed the same thing with two other texture packs I tried. But guess now it's just work work work to make more flats and patches as well as building the map. But such a relief not having to replace DII's defaults anymore, can just keep on making them, not worrying where and how they'll show up and how bad they'll mess original/other levels.

 

But I'm still hoping to find some stuff online, it's such a chore to do _everything_ by myself. Am I really making the first semi-realistic wad portraying drug usage and ruin? Surely there's some beer bottles and dirty looking urban surfaces somewhere? Damn I'm tired...

Edited April 15, 2022 by poisonhead

[Dexiaz]

@poisonhead, I've read your posts here and I have a suggestion that you must move your project to UDMF format (GZDoom). Even if you want to create a "vanilla" experience (like Doom without jumping, crouching and mouse aiming), you can still make your wad in UDMF. I'm saying that because it's pretty much easier to work with. Especially if you don't have time to fight agaisnt restrictions of the original id Tech 1.

 

For example, you don't have to think about _START and _END markers, you can simply create a .PK3 file (it's a WAD analog, but easier to work with) and put every FLAT textures to "FLATS" folder inside PK3. And all walls you can place to "TEXTURES" folder instead of thinking about PNAMES and TEXTURE1 lumps. You will just skip all this shit and get to the core of modding instantly.

 

Also, all things you need to create like moving train is easier in UDMF format. And creating swinging doors (like in Duke Nukem 3D) is easier in UDMF format.

 

About textures to make a bad looking places with dirty things - someone ripped textures from Max Payne 1. You might know that Max Payne 1 events related to drugs, so there are a lot of places which normal citizens will avoid by any costs. You can get it from here. Also, you will find here "KINGPIN TEXTURE PACK", it's also good for your tasks. Beer bottles can be extracted from games like Duke Nukem 3D and Ion Fury. I can provide them for you. But I think you need not only bottles. So you could ask me for things you still needed (except things I've mentioned above) and I could try to help you here.

 

 

[SplinkWizard]

I suggest using the white pebble texture and a small block sector to create the illusion of cocaine.

[poisonhead]

On 4/22/2022 at 9:15 PM, SplinkWizard said:

I suggest using the white pebble texture and a small block sector to create the illusion of cocaine.

 

Haha.

 

I've been busy at work, all the time not spent doing music, sleeping, feeling like shit, being too out of it. I've done over three hundred textures and flats (mostly from my photos/scratch but borrowed a few). I still have the problem that in Ultimate Doom Builder it shows Doom II's flats/patches + mine when selecting my resource wad. In other wads it shows only those in them but I can't find the difference between them and mine. How do I fix this? It's driving me nuts having to search Doom II's flats/patches every time I want to use my own. I attached an image showing how my resource wad appears in UDB.

 

And it's hard enough to do Vanilla stuff (and I spent hundreds of hours trying to make stuff fit into Doom palette etc) so I started mapping in plain Doom II format, even though I'm sure I'll go over the limits. I thought that the level could start in real world setting but very soon gets more and more surreal and crazy. Got some twisted, weird, f*cked up, hellish, psychedelic etc gfx to work with. Hell has never been the same.

 

I was thinking of maybe borrowing a monster or two. I'd like to find civilian/human type sprites/monsters that'd work in Vanilla (have to dehack 'em to be friendly). Where could I find some?

 

Also regarding the size of textures, when starting this project I read that just don't make height more than 128 and keep width divisible by 2 and you're okay but after doing a several 40x128, 96x128, 106x128 etc sized patches I now read that they should be divisible by 16 (16, 32, 48, 64, 128 etc). So will these work in Vanilla? How about ZDoom? Wondering if it's worth the trouble to redo them...

 

PS. Still looking for sprites, patches and flats suitable for this project. Mainly drug and booze stuff and dirty linen etc. I'm still going through other games' resources though, maybe I'll find some but if anyone knows places other than realm667 etc or maybe wanna join me in this project. I'm afraid that one day I won't wake up any more and it was all for nothing. I'd also be _really_ interested to see what other people can do with my flats and patches but only after if I complete my map if my lifetime is enough...

[Dexiaz]

2 hours ago, poisonhead said:

I still have the problem that in Ultimate Doom Builder it shows Doom II's flats/patches + mine when selecting my resource wad. In other wads it shows only those in them but I can't find the difference between them and mine. How do I fix this?

Looks like you have copied everything in your TEXTURE1 lump from IWAD, that's why it's dublicated. You need to read this first. Or just throw away Vanilla format and start doing it in UDMF (GZDoom), it's more easier to work with.

 

2 hours ago, poisonhead said:

I was thinking of maybe borrowing a monster or two. I'd like to find civilian/human type sprites/monsters that'd work in Vanilla (have to dehack 'em to be friendly). Where could I find some?

 

This thread can help you. If you find something you'll interested, don't forget to ask a permission to use (in cases if author of sprites didn't wrote something like "You can use it if you want").

 

Also you could check the Strife WAD. Those civilians are more "medieval styled", but it's better than nothing. Also there was the Ashes TC, but I don't know if it's allowed by author to reuse sprites from this mod.

 

2 hours ago, poisonhead said:

So will these work in Vanilla? How about ZDoom?

 

GZDoom can work with any sized textures.

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by Dexiaz

[poisonhead]

3 hours ago, Dexiaz said:

Looks like you have copied everything in your TEXTURE1 lump from IWAD, that's why it's dublicated. You need to read this first. Or just throw away Vanilla format and start doing it in UDMF (GZDoom), it's more easier to work with.

 

GZDoom can work with any sized textures.

 

 

_I_ haven't copied everything, at least on purpose. I use XWE. I said earlier that my graphics wad is like:

mygfx
SS_START
mysprites
SS_END
PP_START
mypatches
PP_END
FF_START
myflats
F_END
PNAMES
TEXTURE1

 

I click "Add to patch names" and "Add to texture" and it creates PNAMES and TEXTURE1. If I remove default Doom crap from PNAMES I get zillion errors or the whole UDB crashes and I don't know how to remove stuff from TEXTURE1 as it's displayed like I uploaded the image. I can only edit stuff but don't know how to remove.

 

I find it weird how there's not a single comprehensive guide to XWE telling me how to fix this issue. Somebody help me please? I wanna have my resource wad be as vanilla compatible as possible because I've been through hell and back many times working images into Doom palette and size limitations. I'm also mapping a vanilla map ATM. I will not go GZDoom as it does not run on my computer, neither does Slade. I'm working on ancient laptop.

[Dexiaz]

Well, that's the problem. You have to generate the normal version of PNAMES and TEXTURE1 lumps. And I don't know how to do it in XWE.

 

9 hours ago, poisonhead said:

I'm also mapping a vanilla map ATM. I will not go GZDoom as it does not run on my computer, neither does Slade. I'm working on ancient laptop.

 

That's pretty sad. I'm sorry I can't help you anymore since I'm only working on Slade3 and in GZDoom.

 

Maybe @Doomkid could help you, since he is more into classic modding.

[Kappes Buur]

9 hours ago, poisonhead said:

 

..... I find it weird how there's not a single comprehensive guide to XWE telling me how to fix this issue. ....

There never has been a manual for XWE.

XWE is old by now but is still useful, however it seems not to work for everyone.

Before using XWE for editing I would suggest to make a backup fist.

 

A short video importing patches

Edited May 4, 2022 by DOOM mapping enthusiast

[Redneckerz]

13 hours ago, poisonhead said:

I will not go GZDoom as it does not run on my computer, neither does Slade. I'm working on ancient laptop.

Please humor me on the specs of this machine as GZDoom now has GLES support and should run on any GPU from the past 15 years and SLADE, well..

 

I suspects a retro laptop of some sorts.

[poisonhead]

10 hours ago, DOOM mapping enthusiast said:

There never has been a manual for XWE.

XWE is old by now but is still useful, however it seems not to work for everyone.

Before using XWE for editing I would suggest to make a backup fist.

 

A short video importing patches

 

I did _exactly_ like in the video but with the same results as before! What the heck could I be doing wrong? I was thinking that if no solution is found after this post, maybe someone could take a look at my wad?

 

6 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

Please humor me on the specs of this machine as GZDoom now has GLES support and should run on any GPU from the past 15 years and SLADE, well..

 

I suspects a retro laptop of some sorts.

 

Not sure of all the specs, I'm not so technical (especially these days) but some 2GHz 2GB Windows 7 budget machine for working from 2009. Real slow. I tried again and GZDoom works! Before it gave me some error when I tried to run it. But still I prefer ZDoom as a port of choice and wad/map making in vanilla style except going a bit over the limits. Slade complains about missing VCOMP140.DLL even though I once followed some guide to try to remedy this. If I copy the file from Windows/System32 directory to Slade directory I get "The application was unable to start correctly (0xc000007b). Click OK to close the application." Any ideas why that might be?

[Redneckerz]

51 minutes ago, poisonhead said:

I'm not so technical (especially these days) but some 2GHz 2GB Windows 7 budget machine for working from 2009. Real slow.

That sounds like a budget Celeron to me (Not a Intel Atom though)

51 minutes ago, poisonhead said:

But still I prefer ZDoom as a port of choice and wad/map making in vanilla style except going a bit over the limits.

ZDoom's discontinued. To  make maps without breaking the hardware bank, use Doom Builder X.

51 minutes ago, poisonhead said:

Slade complains about missing VCOMP140.DLL even though I once followed some guide to try to remedy this. If I copy the file from Windows/System32 directory to Slade directory I get "The application was unable to start correctly (0xc000007b). Click OK to close the application." Any ideas why that might be?

Yes, you shouldn't copy it from system32 to SLADE.

 

You will need the Visual C++ Redistributable for Visual Studio, version 2015. When that's installed, also try to utilize the 2022 version.

More details see this link.

[Kappes Buur]

Since you want to stick to mapping for the original DOOM format there is nothing wrong

with using Doom Builder X to lay down the architecture and editing lumps with SlumpED.

SlumpED is the forerunner to Slade and may suit your system better.

[poisonhead]

I gotta try SlumpED. I still suffer from the same problem as before. Also I cannot figure out how to make 512px wide (let alone 1024px) sky in XWE? I imported custom sky textures but now I can't find sky at all in UDB?
 

edit: SlumpEd gives me "The program can't start because MSVCP71.dll is missing from your computer. Try reinstalling the program to fix this problem." :( Also I managed to get the sky to work I think, or atleast half of it. How to make 1024px vanilla compatible sky with XWE still remains the question? How to make several patch graphics to one patch?

Edited June 4, 2022 by poisonhead

[poisonhead]

I've made some cutbacks and had creative visions toward the project. Trying to remain respectful and in good sense even though dealing with serious issues.

 

Anyway I'd need for _vanilla_ Doom II:

-flying monster (easily incorporable through XWE and .deh or sumtin)

-civilians

-human opponents (ones that could pass for junkies or I could edit)

 

The assault I prevented today with a knife prompted me with a vision of the player maybe only having fists and/or a knife. How would one most easily disable the pistol and are there any proper free-to-use vanilla Doom II knife mods? I'd also love to have the option of having enemy the option to back away like if I present a knife but know it'd probably be impossible without having to resort some port-specific stuff?

 

I've also ran into a problem where XWE won't produce over 12MB files and in general at around over 1000 new assets if I put new ones in, old ones disappear, at least in UDB. Really sucks how both Slade and SlumpEd give me error messages :/ I like to have a lot of resources. I really hope to release at least a bad texture pack if nothing else. I'm in a pretty bad way, withdrawaling from some hard stuff and alcohol tastes too good etc but my mind's on Doom, gotta escape to somewhere. Got these separate pieces of map. Just need human baddies, civvies and some winged demons to start with :)

 

May the force be with those who help me.

[poisonhead]

I hate problems like this :( Thought it was hell enough to have to go through Doom II textures every time when applicating my own ones and now have this unknown limit of how many patches before patches start disappearing :/ Like at the moment my resource wad has 1192 patches and the latest aren't seen by UDB. Is the limit with XWE, UDB, Doom itself or what? Is there other programs beside XWE, SlumpEd and Slade? I wonder why the latest two don't work :( I spent one day making skies thinking I could use 512 to 1024 px ones but can't think of how to make larger than 256px ones with XWE and now facing this limit where I have to start pruning textures instead of being able to gather and make more of them :/ I like to have variety and options and Doom scale is hell, had to make many versions of electrical plugs, lights switches etc to find the right size...

 

BTW. Because I've got many textures that are custom sized (even though they are divisible by two and max 256x128) I'm sure they too break real Vanilla compatibility? But because of geometry too I'm going for limit removing, just trying to stay as Vanilla as I can. Even made a silent teleport. I'd like to find monsters for Vanilla Doom and how about sacrificing a few to play sound fx? I know it can be done but am so dumb that can anyone help me or link some good guide?

Sorry for replying to my own post, just could use some help, I'm in semi-rehab hell (not sober but no more snow), very easily lose my nerves, am depressed as shit and trying to continue this ever-growing project. Got a few real nice textures, great assortment of resources to build forests and stuff especially if I can resolve this weird limit where patches start disappearing. Just hoping to come up with something, shitty weird learning experience map with personal stuff and a texture pack for others to use.