Original LMP Hall of Fame Archive

[ewie]

I was wondering if anyone on here has a download or archive of the original LMP Hall of Fame, run by Christina "Chris" "Strunoph" Norman, which was run in January of 1994. I'm not actually interested in the demos themselves, but just the actual hall of fame list. 

 

Thanks in advance!

[DoomGater]

https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~fms27/dht/dht5/ might help.

And I guess all has been uploaded to the archives aeons ago?

and maybe it is included in the compete-n https://www.doom.com.hr/public/compet-n/compet-n_2019-01-21.zip ?

[ewie]

13 minutes ago, DoomGater said:

https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~fms27/dht/dht5/ might help.

And I guess all has been uploaded to the archives aeons ago?

and maybe it is included in the compete-n https://www.doom.com.hr/public/compet-n/compet-n_2019-01-21.zip ?

 

i have already checked the former link, and while it's led me to uncover all sorts of information on Christina, this does not include the original leaderboards.

 

The second link has no information on her leaderboards, as far as i can tell

[Andromeda]

Here: http://cd.textfiles.com/doomcompanion/RECORD/

 

I believe you can find what you're looking for under the FAME1/LMP or FAME2/LMP subfolders.

Edited May 1, 2022 by Andromeda

[ewie]

Wow thanks!

 

There is one interesting caveat here, which is that it seems to have been made and run by Michael Houston, and not Christina Norman. In fact, if you compare this to the original doom usenet groups, she doesn't seem to talk about an LMP Hall of Fame at all, and instead she's mostly asking about what hardware upgrades she'd need to make to run doom faster. Only Michael Houston's name comes up with regards to the Hall of Fame.

 

Was she ever actually involved in the original Hall of Fame? Or was this talking point something that was started by Frank Stajano only a few short months later?

[4shockblast]

I've tried scouring Usenet archives for this, but I couldn't determine this either; I'm not sure if anyone is even around from those times that could confirm or deny who really started the LMP Hall of Fame. It is likely that the above archive isn't complete as well, so hard to say for sure from just that. Are we sure this is even the actual LMP Hall of Fame and not something else with a similar name anyway?

[Andromeda]

1 hour ago, 4shockblast said:

I've tried scouring Usenet archives for this, but I couldn't determine this either; I'm not sure if anyone is even around from those times that could confirm or deny who really started the LMP Hall of Fame. It is likely that the above archive isn't complete as well, so hard to say for sure from just that. Are we sure this is even the actual LMP Hall of Fame and not something else with a similar name anyway?

Good points, admittedly I didn't spend long in my research - found this post by @Grazza and merely connected the dots.

 

[Grazza]

Anyone researching early demos might be interested in this.

 

Background info in this post.

[ewie]

That's a really interesting collection! Unfortunately, it's all DHT stuff, which came after the LMP Hall of Fame, but it's really interesting that it seems to completely lack any of Frank Stajano's claims about Christina Norman. I wonder where that claim started, because it doesn't seem like it originates from what you shared.

[ewie]

I know this has been dormant for almost a year, but I decided to dig around a bit more and I have found a major update. I have found definitive proof that Christina Norman did in fact start the original LMP Hall of Fame. It is a Usenet post made in January 24th, 1994 announcing the start of the project, and precedes all other known Doom LMP Hall of Fames, including the LMP Hall of Fame: Collector's Edition, made by Michael Houston, which was made in March of 1994. This guarantees that it did exist, although I have no idea where it's located.

 

I find this to be both exciting and frustrating. I had stopped working on my project of finding the original LMP Hall of Fame back in May of last year because I had assumed that we were all mistaken in thinking that Christine Norman had made it, since the archives posted in the thread included a hall of fame made before the DHT that had a similar name, but we now know for sure that there was an LMP Hall of Fame by Christine that was started in late January and stopped around early March.

 

Thank you all for your help in sending me archives of anything related, and if anyone is able to locate this original Hall of Fame, I'd really appreciate it.

[4shockblast]

15 hours ago, ewie said:

I know this has been dormant for almost a year, but I decided to dig around a bit more and I have found a major update. I have found definitive proof that Christina Norman did in fact start the original LMP Hall of Fame. It is a Usenet post made in January 24th, 1994 announcing the start of the project, and precedes all other known Doom LMP Hall of Fames, including the LMP Hall of Fame: Collector's Edition, made by Michael Houston, which was made in March of 1994. This guarantees that it did exist, although I have no idea where it's located.

Super cool that you have found info on this, but I cannot get this site to load at all for me. Could you post a screenshot maybe? Not sure what I'm doing wrong. :p

 

As for the early Hall of Fame archives, I feel like the only chance we have at this point is finding a CD that archived it from the era, but it feels like all of them basically copied over the same exact files, so they only had the ones that have been found, heh. Or maybe some personal drive/disk with an archive of early BBSes or FTPs or idgames...

Edited January 2, 2023 by 4shockblast

[Andromeda]

44 minutes ago, 4shockblast said:

Super cool that you have found info on this, but I cannot get this site to load at all for me. Could you post a screenshot maybe? Not sure what I'm doing wrong. :p

Try this link:
https://www.usenetarchives.com/view.php?id=alt.games.doom&mid=PENLNUtMci41NDFAdW5kZXJncmFkLm1hdGgudXdhdGVybG9vLmNhPg.

Edited January 2, 2023 by Andromeda

[ewie]

On 1/2/2023 at 11:09 AM, 4shockblast said:

Super cool that you have found info on this, but I cannot get this site to load at all for me. Could you post a screenshot maybe? Not sure what I'm doing wrong. :p

 

As for the early Hall of Fame archives, I feel like the only chance we have at this point is finding a CD that archived it from the era, but it feels like all of them basically copied over the same exact files, so they only had the ones that have been found, heh. Or maybe some personal drive/disk with an archive of early BBSes or FTPs or idgames...

 

A screenshot of the whole post is attached below as well, if that helps. after looking over all the information, it seems like there's only two questions that are left in regards to solving this whole thing

1. Where are those early Hall of Fame archives? The only available archives are those for Micheal Houston's Hall of Fame: Collector's Edition, but that doesn't seem to be the same as Christina Norman's Hall of Fame. However, 4shockblast was right though in saying that the only chance is finding a CD that archived it from the era.
2. What's the deal with Michael Houston's Hall of Fame? I can't really find any information about his hall of fame outside of it appearing in archives. I managed to dig up an archive of him announcing the Hall of Fame, and he mentions having an original "Hall of Fame" Project (It's called the Hall of Fame Classics in the Collector's Edition), that seems to date back to December of 1993, but there aren't any archives of alt.games.doom that go back that far. However, I did just find a reference to it from January 7th, where users where challenged to beat E1M8 with only their fists since Houston's pistol-only "Hall of Fame" challenge was considered too easy. Overall, Houston's seems to have next to no cultural legacy, not even being mentioned on the DHT website.

I wonder how Norman's Hall of Fame compares to Houston's.

 

Anyways, once again thanks for all the help! I really appreciate all these archives and help since I'm too young to really have any information about this on my own.

 

Edited January 3, 2023 by ewie
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