The DWmegawad Club plays: The Rebirth

[DFF]

Map28: Netherworld
K: 96 | I: 73 |S: 25
Gzdoom | Mods: Rebirth midi pack, Trailblazer 1.5, Corruption cards 5.0
Cards: Rev projectiles bounce off walls, masterminds get hell grenades, Imps fire cyberdemon projectiles

 

Imps are priority target #1 now, as they can launch missiles and leap at me to effectively suicide bomb. this caused quite a few deaths but an entertaining challenge nonetheless. The blue key was the trapped key spawning cybers down in the blood pit, and all of the monster gangs came out to play at various points in the journey. If not for the OP weapon set the cards would demand a more diligent playstyle from then then its currently asking.

Map28 is very evocative with its theming, halfway between maps 23 and 26 while being vaguely Spirit world-esque. I do really like the subtle but nice theming on this map, with the bright red hell energy being a very cool image next to the gray smooth walls. Its a very simple theme choice but is a very wonderful combo in my opinion. The combat I can no longer comment on as the cards have blown any monster fight out of proportion, however i can talk about the death pits.

I kept forgetting to mention the maps with annoying inescapable death pits, for the most part they were annoyances and mostly harmless, requiring a load or a shotgun jump to get out of. This map however features several death pits, including little cracks that if unlucky and not careful could mean a cheap death. I know there is a case to be made for these pits but i've always hated them since it ruins single-segment runs in the lamest way possible, and for maps with saves just wastes time from the player, in my opinion. Whereas escapable damage pits I like since often the penalty for falling in is some chipped health, which often for me seems recoverable or unworthy of reloading a save for. And this map has a mixture of damage pits that are both escapable and not, adding to the confusion of what is or is not safe. This map is definitely the worst offender of the maps of this and personally sours the experience for me greatly. Nice setting but man it didn't stick the landing.

Map29: The Abyss
K: 99 | I: 72 |S: 80
Gzdoom | Mods: Rebirth midi pack, Trailblazer 1.5, Corruption cards 5.0
Cards: A vile will try to assasinate you, aracs fire a volley of 3 random projectiles, Pain elementals shoot acid blood when hit

 

Cards have now become evil, this map alonce caused probably more than triple the deaths of the entire playthough so far. Mainly the map featured lots of imps in tight corridors, and almost 90% of my weaponry is projectile based (as they reflect all projectiles). The worst encounter was the red library, as the key was trapped. This meant the library was filled with hitscanners to start, the swich lowers two bookcases full of rocket imps, and then 3 cybers teleport in to massacre me. On top of all that the ghost horde decided to show up halfway though aswell. A tricky puzzle that was eventually solved though a mix of brute force and careful weapon selection. Otherwise the map was full of plenty of buffed up monsters and many nasty traps. An almost frustrating affair but doable with the weaponset.

The final regular map in the set is a nice living end homage with a twinge of blood church vibes with the masonry and the monk statues. The branching paths all bring rather enjoyable set pieces, and the map even improved on the final cyber arena from map29. Texturing is starting to feel a bit more passable by todays standards, and no inescapable death pits so a welcomed improvement. Its a fun map that does highlight some of the nicer features of Vader's early work. maybe not the best or most visually evocative, but solid for a penultimate.

 

Map30: Hell's Innards
K: 99 | I: 72 |S: 80
Gzdoom | Mods: Rebirth midi pack, Trailblazer 1.5, Corruption cards 5.0
Cards: Replace icon with a different boss, A gang of barons will spawn, Revenants will always focus the player

 

The new boss was a Mecha-romero a La wolfenstein, which in the arena felt a lot more engaging of a fight. At this point the whole premise of the map is kinda moot so i'll refrain from commenting on the map itself, but it seems like a fairly standard Icon map. The texturing and design is very cool and I wish we saw more maps and textures in the style of Rebirths gothic texturing. Another nifty effect from the cards gave the map a sort of pre-fight buildup, as the red hallway to the boss teleporter spawned the undead and was a very fun setpiece as the undead from maps long past tried to stop my final assault. No corners were safe and the ghosts were packed, requiring me to prioritize viles while watching for any sneaky ghost imps. The final arena also spawned a gang of mini-bosses which needed to be cleared before robo-romero attacked. All in all a fun sendoff.

Final Thoughts

 

Personally i'm kinda glad the club played two maps I played rather early on in my life/doom experience, since i can come back to both mapsets after years of not touching them. Both I knew would have some biased nostalgia but interestingly one I felt succeeded in holding up where the other not so much. Fragport while incredibly dated and flawed in many places kept its very signature charm and style throughout the whole set. Despite some stinker maps, I felt fragport had less filler and was wholly much more memorable because it had its own unique identity. When i think of fragport, I can name features and styles present in the majority of the maps, and can recollect several maps from the set.

The Rebirth was initially the same, with me fondly remembering some of the maps but not all. After replaying the set, even after just replaying the WAD there are several maps that i can't even remember either designs or features. So many of Rebirth just feels like forgettable filler. Its serviceable, and i'd say there was not really bad maps, but nothing that stuck with me. That being said the third episode seems to be almost everything that I remember from Rebirth, and funny enough its because this one feels the most cohesive in terms of its own visual style. All the maps feel more unique and stick around with me. Honestly I think the reception for this WAD would be much greater had it only been the third set. There were some gems in the other two thirds, but none really feel like they are 'Rebirth' maps, they feel like generic 2000s-esque community maps. I was glad to replay fragport, but i think replaying rebirth soured my view on it slightly.

 

I also have to admit if not for the mods I likely would have grown bored long ago. And the soundtrack definitely helped. The tracks here are all very good and easily amplified the feeling of the original maps. Im not sure if Rebirth was deserving of the community music pack treatment, but its a welcomed gift.

 

Rankings:

Spoiler

 

Map32
Map31

Map26

Map22
Map14

Map29

Map27
Map05
Map10

Map25

Map28

Map20
Map03

Map21

Map24
Map19

Map11

Map17
Map16
Map08

Map30

Map23
Map18
Map13
Map09

Map15

Map07
Map12
Map02
Map04
Map06
Map01 

 

 

 

Cards:

Spoiler

 

Replace icon with a different boss
aracs fire a volley of 3 random projectiles
Imps fire cyberdemon projectiles
One key becomes trapped by spawning 3 bosses
Imps gain all card effects chosen
A gang of mini-bosses will spawn
Aracs cast archvile attack upon death
Cybers shoot seeking missiles
several monsters get random enhancements
Demons may transform into hell knights on deat
aracnotrons reflect projectiles

all monsters can 'dunk' (leap) on the player

Aracnotrons get hell grenades
Cacos can stich together corpses to reanimate the dead
Mancs summon portals that can teleport projectiles

zombiemen get pumpkin bombs
double spawn pods
Double the amount of nobles
The player will be attacked by the specialists: 'The murder corp"
Enemies can come back to haunt the player
spawns urns that give nearby monsters random enhancements
plant pods spawn random monsters
One cursed enemy grants random enhancements to enemies on death
demons shove things
former humans get grenades
Demons occasionally transform into pain.E when damaged
pinkies become fast
Zombies can turn into imps when damaged

Some Pinkies lunge at you
Imps have improved aim
Pinkies consume lesser monsters

double former humans

 

 

[KickAss]

GZDooM 4.10, PB 3.0, HeXeReTiC HUD PB3 v8.3RC2e, Weapon Neural Upscale, Destroyable Decorations Definitive Edition, Glory Kills v29b, SilentDoomguy, Flashlight, -iwad doom2.wad (ver 1.666), -skill 4 (UV), continuous play, no saves.

 

MAP25 - “The Tower”

 

MAP26 - “Burning Canals”

 

MAP27 - “Wired Hive”

 

Still haven't seen anything floating around about the new month and the DWMegawad Club plays ... ?

[Azure_Horror]

Map29 The Abyss

UV pistol start

 

I always liked the design of The Living End and maps like it (Hell Revealed map 24, Plutonia maps 24 and 27, etc).

Visually, such maps tend to be highly abstract in minimalist in details. Arguably, this a part of their charm, but I always was curious: what if somebody made a more detailed and cozy version of The Living End?

 

And here comes The Abyss! Conclusion: additional art and detailing does not detract from enjoying The Living End style of maps. It nice to have a definitive prove at hands, even if the result was expected...

 

In the context of Rebirth Megawad, The Abyss feels like a natural development of map 29. The fight difficulty remains roughly on par, and navigation is a bit more straightforward, but in many ways map 29 follows the footsteps of map 28: exploration+combat synthesis, smaller-scale (Scythe-esque) fights, Doom 2 IWAD approach to layout.

 

Another cool map.

 

Map30 Hell's Innards

UV pistol start

 

Push all the buttons, entrench yourself on a battlement, and fire lots of rockets in another Demonic Wall Monstrosity!

And this is how one makes a jankless Icon of Sin map! Arguably, Hell's Innards is a bit boring, but a jankless Icon of Sins are hard to come by.

So, despite some flaws, this map is definitive win in my book.

 

Rebirth a whole:

Like I said a few weeks ago, this WAD is not for me for the most part.

However, some parts are definitely deserve credits:

- There is a lot of Scythe 1 mapping designs deployed. Some maps may be undercooked, but the fundamentals are sound in all of them. Good short maps often are in short supply (pun not intended). Thus, any collection of short maps is a good sight.

- 2020 Rebirth MIDI pack is a really solid MIDI collection. Since its inception, many of those MIDI-s found their way into other pWADs. I think that Rebirth meagWAD deserves its share of the credit, as the mapset which inspired all those great soundtracks.

- And finally: maps 25-30 of Rebirth are all very solid. They almost feel like Scythe 1 episode 2-and-a-half of sorts. I am really glad that I played those maps!

 

My favorite 5 maps, in order:

1)  Map 28 - looks gorgeous, and some of its visual designs double up as unususal mini-hazards. Also, this map has very solid use of death pits: they feel justified from artistic perspective, and they are not too obnoxious from the gameplay perspective. All in all, I see Map 28 as a perfect refinement of Doom 2 Hell-on-Earth designs.

2)  Map 29 - another strong refinement of Doom 2 IWAD designs, this level also felt extremely solid all around. Arguably it is a bit less extreme than map 28, but there is nothing bad with that. Map 29 together with map 28, those levels create a perfect double-team.

3)  Map 26 - In my mind, I like to describe this map as "Inmost Dens but, for Vanguard". By that, I mean "a map sorta like Inmost Dens, but with Vanguard midtier-focused combat". A very solid level, in my book at least.

4)  Map 27 - Doom has tech maps. Doom has flesh maps. And doom has all kind of fusion map designs. Rebirth map 27 is a cyborg map! I was really surpised that "cyborg map" is such a rare concept, given all the doom goodness, but here we are. This map also gets additional points for successful implementation of Spider Mastermind + Aracnotrons monster combo.

5)  Map 25 - Restricted resources and a non-conventional "chainsaw into all the rockets" weapon progression sounds like a recipe for deisaster. But map 25 did succeed with this concept. So I like it!

 

Other outstanding maps:

Map 30 - jankless IOS fight is always a fun find, even if it is a bit by the book.

Map 31 - very cozy snow-filled map, fun to walk around and admire. Combat is a bit on a beefy side for my taste, however.

Edited July 1, 2023 by Azure_Horror

[Veeda Vidlak]

Map30 “Hell’s Innards”

 

It’s a basic IOS map. You go through the obligatory weapons grab and arrive at a chamber with a vile and Beelzebub’s face. A sequence of switches lets you reach the roof where you can fire rockets into his brain on nice, solid ground. It takes a good number to win, there’s some meat walls blocking the passageway that need clearing.

 

Note: The IOS is inactive upon arrival. It is easy to evade archie and the pair of hell knights guarding the switches, so I like to avoid firing until I’m in position on the roof. Makes the whole thing go by without complications.

 

Final thoughts

 

The Rebirth is an old wad, predating Community Chest 2 and a contemporary of Scythe and Hell Revealed II. It shows it's age, with design philosophy (both combat and progression) that's outdated old-school and looks quaint to a modern audience. Nevertheless, there's fun to be had and I thought some of these maps were pretty memorable. The community seems to agree, given an entire midipack was made for this megawad just a few years ago.

 

One of the most notable traits of The Rebirth to me was the gradual development of Vader’s mapping over the course of the megawad. Short, functional maps evolved into impressive outings (e.g., map28) with levels like 14 and 20 displaying constant improvement in technique. You could say it’s just standard map ordering but maps 26-29 are noticeably more advanced than pretty much all but one or two preceding levels. The Netherworld is probably the best example, with its intermixing of environmental dangers and monster combat.  

 

The other notable trait, and one I found less positive, was the constant lack of ammunition. Somewhere here is a conversation about the evolution of mapping philosophy involving pistol-start vs continuous and how that developed over the years but I’m not going to go into that. The bottom line is the megawad was not friendly to pistol starters and the placement of various secrets made it clear Vader was catering to continuous play. Maps like 09, 15, and 17 were contentious in reviews and examples of how neglecting pistol-starts can be problematic. And then there’s map24 which was egregious and probably the low point of the megawad. Given Alien Vendetta had been released two years ago I think Vader could have done a better job with the resource balance. Indeed, I’d argue it’s one of the techniques he improved on towards the end, the last few levels were much better in this regard.

 

One common criticism I noticed was that the levels in The Rebirth didn’t distinguish themselves, they were mid as the kids say. I would agree that most maps were ordinary, however, two things should be considered.

 

1.     This is true of a lot of mapsets. Most levels in a pack of 32 won’t stand out.

2.     This was a wad made in 2003 by one person, it isn’t fair to compare it to a major multi-author collaboration like AV or modern works with nearly two decades worth of advancements.

 

Given the above I find The Rebirth holds up rather well. There were several levels (14, 31, 16, 26-29) I enjoyed, and the vast majority were at least ok. Consistency in design is always going to have its positives/negatives, Back to Saturn X (1) received the “sameness” complaints as well. It doesn’t make the megawad bad or boring, rather it fails to appeal to certain players. While I personally prefer variety, I appreciate a mapset that isn’t constantly pissing me off (which this wad only did once) and The Rebirth started getting more experimental towards the end.

 

Overall? I had a good time, there were enough positive experiences to hold my interest throughout the month, culminating in a very satisfying final group of levels.

 

Favorite maps:

 

14

16

27

28

29

 

Least favorite maps:

 

15 and 24

[dobu gabu maru]

New thread will be up in 12 hours or so, sorry for the delay 

[Crusader No Regret]

Finishing up the thoughtdump:

 

map 25: I'm glad I played this on continuous so I didn't run into the frequently mention ammo issues.  I've seen more than enough hell maps but this one managed to be memorable in spite of that.  It appears to be possible to trigger the shootable eye switch early which may or may not be of some use; I didn't investigate closely.

 

26-28; First thing I remember about the end stretch was a prevalence of inescapable pits.  Left a bad impression.  Map 26 was one of the only (if not the only) map in the set where I got under 50% secrets, finishing with 2/7.

 

map 30: OK, I admit I phoned in my clear on this map and probably didn't deserve it.  Race to figure out what to do while dealing with infinitely spawning monsters is not a gameplay style that appeals to me.  I coasted through with the 40% damage reduction my upgrades had given me.  Since I'm using a custom weaponset, there was no guarantee the map would be winnable; it's a risk one takes when using custom weapons.

   But it was winnable after all by properly aiming enough Photon Scepter shots at the brain.  There's no timing shots from a lift either which is a point in this iteration's favor.

 

May edit in map 29 comments later, maybe I'll forget and never get around to it.  Who knows?

[RonLivingston]

On 6/30/2023 at 9:57 PM, DFF said:

Map30: Hell's Innards
K: 99 | I: 72 |S: 80
Gzdoom | Mods: Rebirth midi pack, Trailblazer 1.5, Corruption cards 5.0
Cards: Replace icon with a different boss, A gang of barons will spawn, Revenants will always focus the player

 

The new boss was a Mecha-romero a La wolfenstein, which in the arena felt a lot more engaging of a fight. At this point the whole premise of the map is kinda moot so i'll refrain from commenting on the map itself, but it seems like a fairly standard Icon map. The texturing and design is very cool and I wish we saw more maps and textures in the style of Rebirths gothic texturing. Another nifty effect from the cards gave the map a sort of pre-fight buildup, as the red hallway to the boss teleporter spawned the undead and was a very fun setpiece as the undead from maps long past tried to stop my final assault. No corners were safe and the ghosts were packed, requiring me to prioritize viles while watching for any sneaky ghost imps. The final arena also spawned a gang of mini-bosses which needed to be cleared before robo-romero attacked. All in all a fun sendoff.

 

 

what I find weird about Hell's innards is the Icon of sin, the slow motion of it saying come and get it sounds creepy don't you think?

[KickAss]

GZDooM 4.10, PB 3.0, HeXeReTiC HUD PB3 v8.3RC2e, Weapon Neural Upscale, Destroyable Decorations Definitive Edition, Glory Kills v29b, SilentDoomguy, Flashlight, -iwad doom2.wad (ver 1.666), -skill 4 (UV), continuous play, no saves.

 

MAP28 - “Netherworld”

 

MAP29 - “The Abyss”

 

MAP30 - “Hell’s Innards”

 

and finally ...

 

... a really great megawad. I enjoyed playing all of the included maps! It was a lot of fun.

[Jimmy]

On 6/8/2023 at 4:08 PM, LadyMistDragon said:

Map 08: Pump Station (pistol-start)

 

The best map so far. Jimmy provides the midi this time and while it sounds like an inferior version of something more well-known, it probably sticks in one's head better.

 

On 6/17/2023 at 4:10 PM, LadyMistDragon said:

Map 17: Xenoblob (continoous)

 

"Junction" is probably not the most memorable midi in Jimmy's catalogue, but see, it's emotional and slightly rollicking mood don't have the feel of something copy-pasted like, oh, much of his BTSX material.

 

On 6/30/2023 at 10:46 PM, LadyMistDragon said:

Maybe this was ok in 2003, but these days, it would make about as much sense to revisit Massmouth or some other ZDoom mod beloved by Jimmy than something like this!

 

Just been reading through this thread in the hopes of some vaguely positive words about the optional music, and the scant few posts in it that mention me/my work specifically seem to be... on the snarky side, bordering on hurtful - even when framed as compliments. Dunno what warranted all this...

Edited July 3, 2023 by Jimmy

[Azure_Horror]

4 hours ago, Jimmy said:

Just been reading through this thread in the hopes of some vaguely positive words about the optional music, and the scant few posts in it that mention me/my work specifically seem to be... on the snarky side, bordering on hurtful - even when framed as compliments. Dunno what warranted all this...

Hey, when I said that Rebirth MIDI pack is one of the best out there, I really meant it!

I cannot remember a bad MIDI from that soundtrack.

 

Of your tunes, both title screen and map 01 themes really stuck inside my head in a good way.

 

I also really like your map 17 and map 27 themes ("Junction" and "Devil's Hive").

"Junction" is, arguably, my favorite part of playing map 17. The map gameplay itself feels very cruel at times. However, "Junction" gives the map a vague, Plutonia-2 kind of feeling, which vibes very well with the nefarious traps and narrow passages. A really on-point MIDI, unlike the stock "The Healer Stalks".

"Devil's Hive" tune ebbs and flows between good old Doom ambience and something action-focused, and this is a perfect fit for the map 27, which incorporates both scary exploration and scary combat.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Azure_Horror
better choice of words

[LadyMistDragon]

1 hour ago, Azure_Horror said:

Hey, when I said that Rebirth MIDI pack is one of the best out there, I really meant it!

I cannot remember a bad MIDI from that soundtrack.

 

Of your tunes, both title screen and map 01 themes really stuck inside my head in a good way.

 

I also really like your map 17 and map 27 themes ("Junction" and "Devil's Hive").

"Junction" is, arguably, my favorite part of playing map 17. The map itself is borderline unbearable. However, "Junction" gives the map a vague, Plutonia-2 kind of feeling, which vibes very well with the cruel traps and narrow passages. A really on-point MIDI, unlike the stock "The Healer Stalks".

"Devil's Hive" tune ebbs and flows between good old Doom ambience and something action-focused, and this is a perfect fit for the map 27, which incorporates both scary exploration and scary combat.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Jimmy said:

 

 

 

Just been reading through this thread in the hopes of some vaguely positive words about the optional music, and the scant few posts in it that mention me/my work specifically seem to be... on the snarky side, bordering on hurtful - even when framed as compliments. Dunno what warranted all this...

 

Map 01 and also "Devil's Hive" themes was genuinely good like Azure Horror says here  (not to mention Map 11 but I don't recall who did that one). And it's not even like this is really all that bad. I just think that Revolution Midi pack stood out a lot more in most ways. Some midis are great and some are good and that's just how it is sometimes when one is prolific, definitely nothing personal. I think the lack of personal memorability for several midis may have translated as snarkiness and that was indeed unfortunate. If anything, I was probably making excuses for the maps flowing into each other at times. It definitely isn't meant to be personal to say I didn't like such and such midi. Sorry if this sounds mechanical but I'm bad at speaking off the cuff. I just  want to sound like less of an insensitive ass in responding which takes effort.

 

 

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by LadyMistDragon

[plums]

@Jimmy you're a treasure to the community and a musical powerhouse. Plus Faithless is one of my top 5 wads of all time.

Some of the rebmidi tunes I enjoyed most:

 

MAP01 (Jimmy)

MAP06 (@Varis Alpha)

MAP07 (@8Bit Shocker)

MAP08 (Jimmy)

MAP09 (Jimmy)

MAP11 (@stewboy)

MAP31 (Varis Alpha)

MAP16 (@dial-up)

MAP18 (@Tristan)

MAP22 (dial-up)

MAP23 (Varis Alpha)

MAP24 (Tristan)

MAP26 (Varis Alpha)

MAP27 (Jimmy)

MAP28 (Varis Alpha)

MAP30 (Jimmy) (which I barely heard because IoS fight lol)

 

I also liked Vader's original compositions. But even for the new music I didn't care so much for it was nice to have something different than the stock Doom 2 music, and oh look getting that started is Jimmy's doing once again. It's unfortunate if people didn't bring you up too much in this thread, for my own part I just didn't post very much here, but your contributions were definitely appreciated!

 

edit: While I'm talking about music, I spent like 20 minutes trying to remember where I first heard the music from MAP22. It turned out to be E2M2 in Deadly Standards 2 by @Capellan, which is kind of funny because his playthrough videos are always with no music :p

Edited July 3, 2023 by plums

[Capellan]

5 hours ago, plums said:

edit: While I'm talking about music, I spent like 20 minutes trying to remember where I first heard the music from MAP22. It turned out to be E2M2 in Deadly Standards 2 by @Capellan, which is kind of funny because his playthrough videos are always with no music :p

 

The first thing I do on firing up any computer game is turn the music off.  Unless the game doesn't support that, in which case I get mildly annoyed, instead.