Is DOOM 64 the best looking N64 game?

[TasAcri]

Because it doesn't suffer from the usual N64 limitations. Even the most popular choices for the best looking N64 games suffer from something N64 related like blurry/low res textures or/and frame rate issues or/and fog. You almost always hear one of those things (or a combination of them) about most N64 games, including the best looking ones.

 

But DOOM 64 seems like an outlier. It doesn't suffer from blurry visuals at all. The textures are filtered, sure, but still more detailed and sharper than 99% of N64 games. I'm saying 99% because i can't be sure there are other games with the same texture sharpness but i really don't remember a single one and i must have played them all. It's like N64's full screen filters don't apply at all. The quantity of textures is also great, you don't see many areas with a lot of repeated texturing. The frame rate is also pretty much perfect 30fps. No other popular N64 game, of the ones that are considered the best looking, is that stable.

 

Of all console ports of DOOM this one seems like the smoothest running, despite being most advanced looking. The best console port of DOOM at the time (the PSX version) features simplified maps from the PC originals but DOOM 64 features new maps that have even more complex geometry than those PC originals. PSX version also features some colored lighting but DOOM 64's new lighting and gradients are superior in every way. It's the best looking DOOM game regardless the platform and i think it's also the best looking DOOM engine game as well.

 

It's funny because back in the day nobody would notice that. Games like Turok and Goldeneye would make most people forget about DOOM 64. And i get it, these have fully 3D engines with polygonal enemies. DOOM 64's sprites are nothing compared to Turok's amazing polygonal dinosaurs. But both Turok and Goldeneye haven't aged as well as DOOM 64. Turok runs smoothly but has repeated textures and this horrible fog while Goldeneye, a very detailed game without fog issues, has unstable frame rate. Later N64 games would also suffer from similar issues. Meanwhile, DOOM 64 was completely forgotten.

 

I think it's the best looking N64 game along with Banjo-Kazooie and World Driver Championship, the later having the best balance of good 3D graphics, no fog, reasonably detailed textures and sharpness and stable frame rate on average.

Edited June 19, 2023 by TasAcri

[Redneckerz]

I'd say Battle For Naboo.
 

 

[Kyle07]

6 hours ago, TasAcri said:

The textures are filtered, sure, but still more detailed and sharper than 99% of N64 games.

I don't know if this is true, but I thought I read upon the release of the DOOM 64 remaster in March 2020, that the game was originally unfiltered on the N64. So playing it unfiltered, would be a vanilla experience. Not sure if this is true?

[Lippeth]

On 6/18/2023 at 8:26 PM, TasAcri said:

The frame rate is also pretty much perfect 30fps. No other popular N64 game, of the ones that are considered the best looking, is that stable.

F-Zero X and its 60fps would like a word.

Spoiler

 

And So would Super Smash Bros.

 

 

I remember renting Doom 64 as a teen and being impressed by the intro presentation, and then disappointed by nearly everything else, namely the monster and weapon designs/animations, colored lighting and the cryptic map design. It's still not my favorite by any means but I've come to appreciate aspects of it, especially the sound design (at least when not lost in reverb) and music, but the sound effects are used in so many classic Doom mods that I almost lose association to Doom 64.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Lippeth

[Midway64]

4 hours ago, Kyle07 said:

I don't know if this is true, but I thought I read upon the release of the DOOM 64 remaster in March 2020, that the game was originally unfiltered on the N64. So playing it unfiltered, would be a vanilla experience. Not sure if this is true?

 

Try booting up the game on an N64 console (or via emulation) with default settings, and there you have it!

Texture filtering on by default.

[TasAcri]

On 6/19/2023 at 5:24 PM, ValveMercenary said:

 

Try booting up the game on an N64 console (or via emulation) with default settings, and there you have it!

Texture filtering on by default.

 

Yeah, there is texture filtering for sure (3-point filtering). No N64 game has the pixelated look of a PS1/Saturn game.

 

However, texture filtering isn't the only thing N64 does. The reason why most games look blurry is a second pass of full screen filtering + antialiasing. Not sure how it's called, but some graphics plugins like Parallel RDP and Angrylion (the ones that emulate it) call it "VI filters". You can also disable those filters on said plugins.

Some games do disable those filters on the real N64. Quake 64 has such setting in the option menu for instance. But it's extremely rare, if i had to bet, i would say there is no way to disable this in 99% of N64 games normally. There is a way to disable it in many games though, if you use a cheat device like Action Replay.

 

Anyway, DOOM 64 seems like it's one of those rare exceptions. In fact, i think it's the only game where this type of filtering isn't present at all and the textures are made with this in mind. Maybe that's what the information the poster you quoted was reading about.

Edited August 24, 2023 by TasAcri

[Biz!]

I'd say that Goldeneye 64 or Perfect Dark has the best looking n64 game.

[Ozcar]

7 hours ago, Biz! said:

I'd say that Goldeneye 64 or Perfect Dark has the best looking n64 game.

Perfect dark maybe, but goldeneye 64.... i disagree.

[Biz!]

19 minutes ago, Ozcar said:

Perfect dark maybe, but goldeneye 64.... i disagree.

 

[TasAcri]

Now let's see how the real N64 game looks like:

 

 

 

And how DOOM 64 looks like:

 

 

Doom has sharper textures and output and a more solid frame rate. Though Goldeneye is a far more advanced game overall.

 

Also here's how another great looking N64 game (Banjo-Kazooie) looks with the VI filters ON and OFF

 

 

Edited August 24, 2023 by TasAcri

[eanasir]

Guys, Doom 64 is OBVIOUSLY no MATCH for Doom and Doom II on Game Boy Advance.

[BUYXRAYS]

On 6/19/2023 at 11:37 PM, gamingcooler said:

Guys, Doom 64 is OBVIOUSLY no MATCH for Doom and Doom II on Game Boy Advance.

What about doom on the 3do? That is sooooo much smoother

[eanasir]

3 hours ago, BUYXRAYS said:

What about doom on the 3do? That is sooooo much smoother

You might be right!

[Herr Dethnout]

If we talk the absolute best looking game... Then the n°1 is definitively this
 

Spoiler

I mean... Is literally the only N64 game that I has dynamic shadows (complete, not just a circle or basic ones like OoT/Majora's Mask)

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

You could say that is the best looking FPS in the N64... But Turok 3 exists...

 

Spoiler

So yeah... Doom 64 is one of the best looking n64 games, but no THE best.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Herr Dethnout

[eanasir]

43 minutes ago, Herr Dethnout said:

If we talk the absolute best looking game... Then the n°1 is definitively this
 

  Reveal hidden contents

I mean... Is literally the only N64 game that I has dynamic shadows (complete, not just a circle or basic ones like OoT/Majora's Mask)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

  Reveal hidden contents

You could say that is the best looking FPS in the N64... But Turok 3 exists...

 

  Reveal hidden contents

So yeah... Doom 64 is one of the best looking n64 games, but no THE best.

when your mom buys it thinking Conker is a kid friendly game:

[TasAcri]

Turok 3 comes with some of the series same limitations like the fog that doesn't let you see far enough. And the frame rate wasn't the best either. DOOM 64 has perfect frame rate, no pop-up masking fog and looks sharper on the real N64.

 

Conker has the most impressive tech, that's for sure, but the frame rate is again, a bottleneck.

 

One of the reasons i mentioned Banjo-Kazooie instead of Conker is because Banjo has a better balance of good graphics/tech and a mostly good frame rate to back it up. After that i feel RARE lost any restrain.

 

Now that i think of it, Shadowman was also a great looking N64 game with no major frame rate issues. It has huge open areas and it's fully 3D with no fog. And it's probably the only game that doesn't get a huge frame rate hit if you use the expansion pack high res mode. I remember beating the whole game this way while in every other game i had it disabled because it made them unplayable.

 

Edited June 22, 2023 by TasAcri

[Edward850]

5 minutes ago, TasAcri said:

DOOM 64 has perfect frame rate, no pop-up masking fog

So funny that, it actually does! There is a maximum Z-far draw distance that is carefully crafted to be just outside the range of the largest indoor room in any of the levels, and the map In The Void uses its fog to mask this limit as well (as most of the map is a large connected area, despite the limited walkways).

[TasAcri]

31 minutes ago, Edward850 said:

So funny that, it actually does! There is a maximum Z-far draw distance that is carefully crafted to be just outside the range of the largest indoor room in any of the levels, and the map In The Void uses its fog to mask this limit as well (as most of the map is a large connected area, despite the limited walkways).

 

In all other outdoor maps, the darkness covers any texture details far in the distance but you can still see all distant geometry like building shapes or the walls that surround the maps.

 

IIRC, the Void is the only map where the fog covers everything in the distance. Though i think its pushed a bit closer than it could for aesthetic reasons.

[PraoLmao]

I think it's the best looking Classic Doom game, I'm not so sure about best looking N64 game though because it has quite a lot of competition to go up against.

[Individualised]

On 6/20/2023 at 12:58 AM, Biz! said:

 

N64 emulation is notorious for being inaccurate graphics-wise. Plus this is running at a non-native resolution and there's clearly a texture pack being used judging by the HUD so this is not a fair comparison. Best not to use emulated screenshots even at native resolution.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Individualised

[TasAcri]

3 hours ago, Individualised said:

N64 emulation is notorious for being inaccurate graphics-wise.

 

Graphics wise, N64 emulation has reached near perfection. Both Angrylion and Paralled RDP are accurate, pixel perfect LLE plugins. Parallel RDP can even upscale those graphics, including all the filters, while retaining it's accuracy.

 

The problem with N64 emulation are the emulators outside those plugins. Those are old, inaccurate things. Many games run at the wrong speed or frame rate. It's only the last few years where we see a push for timing fixes.

 

I do agree about how upscaled graphics (accurate or not) should not be used for comparisons. And the ones posted in this thread are not accurate either (mip-mapping emulation is missing so you only see the best textures from all distances).

 

Btw the texture pack in those screens only affect the HUD elements. Textures are native.

Edited June 25, 2023 by TasAcri

[Cursed Lemon]

I mean Turok 2 looks pretty great

 

[aboyes1989]

14 hours ago, Cursed Lemon said:

I mean Turok 2 looks pretty great

 

 

People always rag on the blurry textures of N64 games, and the low resolution overall, but this looks brilliant. So sharp. Great lighting too. 

[Kyle07]

But this is a screenshot from the night dive remaster, isn't it?

[Individualised]

Yeah it's clearly not an N64 screenshot. You can make any N64 game look better than Doom 64 if you take the Doom 64 screenshot from hardware/an emulator with hardware-accurate settings and the other game running at widescreen 4k with a texture pack.

Edited August 24, 2023 by Individualised

[TasAcri]

Also, Turok 2 runs at an atrocious frame rate on the N64, even in low res mode. In high res i consider the game literally unplayable and it still doesn't look nearly as good as that remastered screenshot.

 

So, it doesn't have the visual/performance balance Doom 64 has. I would say Doom 64 is the best thing the N64 has ever done at steady 30 fps, along with World Driver Championship.

Edited August 24, 2023 by TasAcri

[Redneckerz]

On 8/22/2023 at 9:26 PM, Cursed Lemon said:

I mean Turok 2 looks pretty great

 

Yep, especially considering that's not a native N64 shot and its from the remaster, which you should have mentioned.

[JM_andtheArgonauts]

Imma let you finish, but Doom64 is the greatest N64 game of all time. 
 

second only to Top Gear Rally…

 

…maybe Ocarina… 

 

(I kid of course, but I really do freaking love Doom64. Beat the game Soooooo many times back then, and it was awesome Nightdive remake with the extra 6 (?) levels that were longer. Anyone know the full story where the levels came from?) 

 

 

Edited September 28, 2023 by JM_andtheArgonauts

[Individualised]

On 6/20/2023 at 5:18 AM, TasAcri said:

Now let's see how the real N64 game looks like:

 

 

 

And how DOOM 64 looks like:

 

 

Doom has sharper textures and output and a more solid frame rate. Though Goldeneye is a far more advanced game overall.

 

Also here's how another great looking N64 game (Banjo-Kazooie) looks with the VI filters ON and OFF

 

 

Wow that GoldenEye screenshot looks awful. Hard to believe the game actually shipped like that

[Rudolph]

Then again, Nintendo 64 games were meant to be played on a television screen. Blurry textures are not as noticeable from afar.