Do you guys like me and the things that I make?

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

Title says all, but I'll briefly explain anyways...

 

Since 2022, I've noticed that people don't really reply much to the things that I make (apart from some exceptions that is) which has caused a really sinking in my soul which has not left me for about a year now. I feel with each thing I share to you guys, this sinking feeling only gets stronger, tugging at the back of my brain to the point where I couldn't stop thinking about last night. And while people do recognize me and congratulate me for my oddball efforts at trying to make something good for you guys, this doesn't really help me get over that feeling of hopelessness, that every thing I make never gets off the ground which has made me think of things about my status here and just myself in general. And god I hope this makes sense because I just really need to vent about this. The feeling at first was of annoyance, then anger, then a slight bit of depression, and now whenever somebody gives me feedback for my works, it's like giving a man in the desert a glass of water if that makes sense. Therefore, I just want to make sure that you guys actually like me and the things that I make because I just really need some closure if that makes any semblance of sense.

 

I'm a bit split on whether or not this needs to be a status update or a forum thread but either way, I need to vent regardless. Thanks for listening and take care.

[7Mahonin]

If we didn’t, does that mean you just give up on yourself and the things you make? Don’t let people’s opinion about you keep you from living your best life. Even if everyone kissed your ass, you’d get humbled eventually. Learn to be happy with yourself and find pleasure in the things you make first and foremost, because otherwise you will never feel it is enough. 

[Caffeine Freak]

My genuine advice is that you should only be making things if you like to make things, first and foremost. Other people aren't always going to be there for you in that regard, especially online. Just keep making shit and having fun with the process of creation. If you try to chase upvotes and nice comments, you'll be miserable.

 

Also, since this is the internet I'm guessing no one here knows you personally, so the question of whether people here 'like' you is pretty immaterial and not something you should be overly concerned about.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Caffeine Freak

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

42 minutes ago, Caffeine Freak said:

If you try to chase upvotes and nice comments, you'll be miserable.

THAT would most likely be that sinking feeling. Perhaps something I should do in the future is completely ignore that clout-seeking side of my brain.

 

[Tiramisu]

I took a quick look at your profile, and

 

Quote

I'm nearly an adult as of me typing this but not quite there yet

 

Ah, that checks out! :p Not trying to belittle you, but it's very normal to have such thoughts at your age - in my experience it tends to mostly fade with time.

 

So you keep asking whether the people here "like you and the things you make" - but I want it to be absolutely clear that these two are not correlated in any way whatsoever. For example, I saw some screenshots of Dead Signal a while ago, and I didn't really like them (I think it's under-detailed for the level of atmosphere it's trying to sell), but that has absolutely zero bearing on my view of you as a person! It is very important that you don't confuse these concepts together.

 

Also, you shouldn't feel like you "owe" the community something, because that's another line of thought I'm getting from your post. You could not make anything at all, and still be a valued member of the community just by participating in the discussions. Heck, you could even not participate at all and still be a member just by playing some wads posted here! So even if you release a couple of works that only a few people end up liking, it's still a positive contribution and no one in their right mind will be "disappointed" with you or anything like that.

 

Finally, others have already mentioned this, so I'll just agree that you need to create for the joy of creating (and improve for the joy of improving!) first and foremost, any other motive will only lead to suffering in the long run.

Edited July 25, 2023 by sq. Tiramisu

[BGreener]

I’ve seen you’ve been working on cool weapon sprites and mods, some neat Dead Space-esque feels and levels, and yes I’ve loved seeing what you’ve been creating.

 

…And you’re “nearly an adult” and you’re this talented!?

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

15 hours ago, BGreener said:

And you’re “nearly an adult” and you’re this talented!?

I also have autism as well.

[Chezza]

You need to look at things at a third person perspective, as to help dissociate yourself and feelings that may cloud logical thinking. You're too self conscious about validation in a platform where it shouldn't matter.

 

There are many reasons why you may not get much responses or praise for your works and / or posts, and vast majority of them isn't because how someone feels about you or your talent. Chasing respect and attention in an online forum is just like your analogy of trying to find water in the desert. You will only get a little, and you will always be starved for more. A losing battle and will only feel like torture.

 

Sure there are exceptions, e.g. an extreme example is if John Romero makes a single map or post, then automatically wins awards and hundreds of people will flock to him like worshippers to a God. But these mega popular people / works are but the small iceberg standing out on top of a deep sea of very active, talented, creative and long standing members who may never get even 10% of the attention in their lifetime. And that's ok, as many of the best are more interested in their projects than receiving validation. Appreciation is just a plus.

 

You're active on here, you create content, you contribute to a very credible Doom community. You'll forever be part of its history and seen as one of us to all outside people looking in, as well as fellow members. You're part of our history now whether you like it or not. Over the many years when people come back to this forum to observe Doom history, wouldn't you prefer to be seen as someone who simply contributed posts and content, as opposed to someone venting their insecurities?

 

 

Edited July 26, 2023 by Chezza

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

3 hours ago, Chezza said:

wouldn't you prefer to be seen as someone who simply contributed posts and content, as opposed to someone venting their insecurities?

You're right, I shouldn't be venting my insecurities and instead just keep going with what I love to do here.

 

I'd much rather be an active contributor as opposed to an insecure little idiot. Nobody is going to remember me because I made a thread about how I was the weird kid in school and how I'm worthless as a person. People will remember me however, as someone who actively contributes to an already large community, sparking ideas and adding something to the community where possible.

 

Probably best for me to stop worrying about myself and start chasing my dreams here instead.

 

3 hours ago, Chezza said:

And that's ok, as many of the best are more interested in their projects than receiving validation. Appreciation is just a plus.

I pretty much dropped out of high school to pursue the completion of my own projects, and you're right, appreciation IS just a plus. For nearly two years now, I've drowned myself with the fantasies of chasing validation and brownie points on the web. I feel that's about to change and I'll somehow find a way out of the pit that I dug and who knows, maybe I'll be able to work on my stuff a lot more better when this clout-seeking phase is behind me.

 

And I'll need to remind myself when I log on here from now on that validation is just a mere add-on product to the experience of being a contributor here that I don't really need... I just need to focus on just having fun with what I do.

[mrthejoshmon]

Question for you:

 

Why do you do it? Are you doing it for the recognition alone? Is glory all you desire or does it just motivate you?

 

If you are doing something and it is merely for attention then typically my friend it is not worth doing, I have long since abandoned any notion of recognition and have become content with making things I wish existed. You can try to pander to an audience in the hopes you can penetrate the market (so to say) but is it worth the sacrifices for it just to fail? Why railroad yourself into something not guaranteed to please anyone when you can instead please yourself (and potentially secure a niche audience)?

 

When attempting to please specifically, passion dies, creative endeavours (be it mapping or drawing or anything else) are inherently an artform and sacrificing one's artistic desires and style is never worth it.

 

What I'm trying to say is do what you want to do, fuck whatever you think someone else wants, fill the void you have always wished filled and find satisfaction in your own satisfaction.

 

And if it is objectively bad? Just remember, Overwatch still has fans so clearly being terrible doesn't matter.

Edited July 26, 2023 by mrthejoshmon

[Merry Widow]

Never forget. You are a valuable person in your own right. That counts.

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

1 hour ago, mrthejoshmon said:

Why do you do it? Are you doing it for the recognition alone? Is glory all you desire or does it just motivate you?

I just... Dipped my toe in and ended up here. Honestly, a part of me does want to do it for the recognition, that part of me also wants just glory from what I do and nothing else. It's fucking maddening what my mental state has become because of this little niche that I found, just this clout-hungry, glory-seeking side of me that's spreading throughout like a cancer. And I plan to cut that cancer out.

 

In total:

• I do it because it's a means of escaping reality. Not much to be said here otherwise.

 

• Not really. I do want people to know that I at the very least, exist. But that isn't why I started in the first place, I started doing this because I want to just make something people can at least enjoy to some unknown degree.

 

• I don't even know to be honest. it's just a small motivator that has, over time, started to blind me and slowly warping my perspective on this little hobby that I have, going from a niche little thing I can do, to a potential ticket of fame. I don't like this glory-seeking mentality that I have developed over the span of roughly two years (as a matter of fact, I fucking despise it) and I do genuinely want to change that side of me, and I want go back to what I was like way back when, when I was making cute little mods that people can pick up and enjoy. In that case, it's a bit of a 50/50 question.

If you guys have any more questions just let me know and I'll try to answer them as best as I can. Hopefully when this phase of mine is over, I can go back to my roots and make stuff for fun rather than recognition or glory.

[MrFroz]

I remember feeling somewhat like this earlier this year.

 

Context: about 5 years ago I was working in a Blood-inspired mod which had bonus levels similar to the ones from Doom 64, small maps that were thematically different from those of the main campaign. I already had some success making a copy of Duke Nukem: Time to Kill's wild west level for one of the bonus maps, so I thought about recreating the city level from that same game next for my mod. However, even though I made pretty much all of the geometry and most of the texturing for this map, there were still some sprite assets missing and I hadn't really worked on the lightning/gameplay at all. Since I already had more work than I could handle updating Blood: Dead on Arrival regardless if I made a new map to come with the upgrade or not, I burned out and decided to stop working on the map indefinitely, simply making sure to keep a copy of the map stored in my cloud storage service in case I ever decided to finish it. So this year when it was summer (I live south of the equator) and days could become unbearable with up to 43 C° of temperature to make me not want to stay indoors at all, I still wanted to work on something and decided to try and finish that map, which eventually I did and it became my latest Doom 2 WAD, Overlook City.

 

I remember feeling pretty insecure at first of even bothering to work on that after all this time. Knowing the hyper-accelerated growth of the Doom community, I was thinking "this idea might have been neat for 2018 but it has probably been done many times and better than I could ever had since" and stuff along those lines. There was also "maybe I got too rusty at mapping and I couldn't do justice to the vision I had at the time". I made up my mind to continue working on Overlook City because I'm a guy who doesn't like to have unfinished projects at all, so I did and in spite of my insecurities, after releasing the map a lot of people played it on YouTube and the Doom Wads channel made a video featuring Overlook City in the thumbnail which eventually became the most viewed one from that channel, and with many people showing interest for the idea in the comments.

 

So basically, my advice for OP would be that sometimes we are our own worst enemies and think we can't do jack, but in reality there is always potential for contributing to whichever community or workplace you are in.

Edited July 27, 2023 by MrFroz

[Azuris]

18 hours ago, DELTA256 said:

I just... Dipped my toe in and ended up here. Honestly, a part of me does want to do it for the recognition, that part of me also wants just glory from what I do and nothing else. It's fucking maddening what my mental state has become because of this little niche that I found, just this clout-hungry, glory-seeking side of me that's spreading throughout like a cancer. And I plan to cut that cancer out.

 

In total:

• I do it because it's a means of escaping reality. Not much to be said here otherwise.

 

• Not really. I do want people to know that I at the very least, exist. But that isn't why I started in the first place, I started doing this because I want to just make something people can at least enjoy to some unknown degree.

 

• I don't even know to be honest. it's just a small motivator that has, over time, started to blind me and slowly warping my perspective on this little hobby that I have, going from a niche little thing I can do, to a potential ticket of fame. I don't like this glory-seeking mentality that I have developed over the span of roughly two years (as a matter of fact, I fucking despise it) and I do genuinely want to change that side of me, and I want go back to what I was like way back when, when I was making cute little mods that people can pick up and enjoy. In that case, it's a bit of a 50/50 question.

If you guys have any more questions just let me know and I'll try to answer them as best as I can. Hopefully when this phase of mine is over, I can go back to my roots and make stuff for fun rather than recognition or glory.

 

To be honest, to have the wish to have some kind of recognition of the work you have done is totally normal.

 

Ofter stuff will be overseen by many, as there is a big output of the community

and nearly 30 Years of Maps.

 

So don't be ashamed to bring your maps or stuff also out by callout to testers, to promote it and give it maybe a bit more of steam with that

 

I think it is also better to throw out stuff in the summer than in the winter, as there is lesser output from others and so it does not go under so fast.

 

I can't promise nothing, as i have a little so  and he takes much time, but i'll try to look into your stuff.

 

 

[Murdoch]

22 hours ago, DELTA256 said:

how I was the weird kid in school

 

The overwhelming majority of people felt like that, albeit to greater or lesser degrees. 

 

22 hours ago, DELTA256 said:

how I'm worthless as a person

 

No, you're not. Throw that attitude in the fucking bin, right now.

 

I can only reaffirm what many others have said - creative projects need to satisfy you, first and foremost. You need to look at the end result and be happy with it, even if it represents only a small improvements over previous attempts. No one is good at anything straight away. That applies to life in general too. Things worth having and worth doing take effort; a determination to keep trying to get to where you want to be. You only lose when you quit.

[aloysiusfreeman]

On 7/26/2023 at 1:28 AM, DELTA256 said:

I also have autism as well.

 

Myself, I've sometimes thought I'm somewhere on the spectrum - though I certainly have ADHD. I am very well versed in having multiple fixations where it gets to a crippling feeling.

 

Reading what you said resonated with me because I've felt that shit a lot too. I think it's par for the course with neurodivergent folks - we think a lot and we think of big ideas all the time. And the beauty (and challenge) for communities like doomworld is that we'll see projects that get a bunch of acclaim - 10+pages of people discussing something awesome that was from a big idea makes us think why we cant do that with our big ideas. 

 

As far as the "recognition and glory", I think a bit of that is if you're spending a lot of time on something makes it feel like it's part of your identity, being acknowledge for what makes you you is important. The tricky thing is that what people think about you is a bit beyond your control.

 

It's been said elsewhere, but doing this to satisfy you first is the goal. Satisfying others is just a byproduct. The dopamine from praise is great, but definitely can't make that be the end all. 

 

That said, I remember you posting textures not too long ago and they looked fantastic. 

[Ludi]

I am autistic myself (albeit high-functioning), and I struggled with that for many, many years. Really, it's just a different way of thinking, and that's what we need more than anything right now. Whatever you're doing, keep doing it. it's for the best.

Edited July 28, 2023 by Ludi

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

5 hours ago, Ludi said:

(albeit high-functioning), and I struggled with that for many, many years.

Same here. It was difficult for me to cope with it too, but I managed to scrape through.

[kwc]

@DELTA256

I saw this post earlier in the week and been meaning to reply. 
Looks like other members have covered the self-esteem and validation aspect, as well as some chat about your ASD. Take these positive comments to heart.

 

I want to directly address what I’ve seen in your work, I can’t claim to know how/why you‘ve noticed a lack of response, but maybe it will help to at least have one perspective in this context.

 

I know you’re working on a conversion/partial-conversion with a drastic change in visual style and assets. The textures you’ve shared in one thread have been very dark visually, sometimes even appearing to be solid black. However, you’ve shared screenshots of your levels in another thread with these textures and i feel like I have a better understanding of what the use-cases are.
 

I think you’re making a very striking and ambitious project and when you are sharing your works-in-progress it can be hard for me to comprehend what I am looking at without context, which leaves me with an absence of mind to respond. I think I would feel more compelled to engage with your posts if there was more context and visibility when you’re sharing your work. I imagine it is meant to be dark the way that it is, and if that is the case, I think having more of an understanding as to why it is and maybe some in-motion examples (gameplay gif perhaps? Level fly through?) would help showcase your work better.

 

Ultimately, I want to echo the sentiments that have been said so far, this is a creative space with people from many different background and perspectives and opinions on a wide range of topics relating to art and design. Your work belongs here and is appreciated, and I think this ongoing project of yours is significant and I hope you continue to have the motivation to see through this unique vision of yours so that members here will be lucky enough to experience it.

Edited July 29, 2023 by kwc

[RDETalus]

On 7/26/2023 at 10:29 PM, DELTA256 said:

I don't like this glory-seeking mentality that I have developed over the span of roughly two years (as a matter of fact, I fucking despise it) and I do genuinely want to change that side of me

 

Don't despise that part of yourself. Seeking and winning glory is completely normal behavior. It is how people attain self-confidence.

 

HOWEVER: You should only engage in glory-seeking mentality when you know you are good enough to win (or know that you can learn the skills to become good enough). If you can't, then you should just enjoy what you're doing as a hobby for your own satisfaction. 

 

It's not wrong to seek glory, you just need to be selective about when and where to do it. You're still young, as you get older you will learn new skills that eventually make you competitive in different creative communities. I know this one guy who is a metalworker at a factory. He used his unique skills to make a suit of armor from Dark Souls and ended up winning the highest costume award at his state's biggest anime convention. Won a huge trophy in front of a massive crowd of hundreds people. You can win glory too, you just need to patiently develop your skills.

Edited July 29, 2023 by RDETalus

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

3 hours ago, kwc said:

I think having more of an understanding as to why it is and maybe some in-motion examples (gameplay gif perhaps? Level fly through?) would help showcase your work better.

What ways would I be able to submit gameplay gifs and all that? would imgur work here or would I need something else?

 

13 minutes ago, RDETalus said:

I know this one guy who is a metalworker at a factory. He used his unique skills to make a suit of armor from Dark Souls and ended up winning the highest costume award at his state's biggest anime convention.

So from what I'm gathering here is that I just need to start somewhere small, then slowly but surely, work my way up to where I want to be and then I'll be able to achieve a high status amongst my peers? am I correct in assuming that?

[Mr Masker]

 

13 hours ago, aloysiusfreeman said:

Reading what you said resonated with me because I've felt that shit a lot too. I think it's par for the course with neurodivergent folks - we think a lot and we think of big ideas all the time. And the beauty (and challenge) for communities like doomworld is that we'll see projects that get a bunch of acclaim - 10+pages of people discussing something awesome that was from a big idea makes us think why we can't do that with our big ideas.

I've struggled with making stuff in the past due to similar things, whether that be Doom Mapping or some other creative hobby that I feel like, "getting into".

 

I'll have a super overambitious idea, go to try and create it, and then give up early because I'm just not ready yet. I get that you need to start with simple stuff and work your way up, but I just find that simpler stuff hard to engage with as much. That's why I've struggled to have creative hobbies.

(On the topic of ASD, yeah I'm on the spectrum too, high functioning or whatever the terms are. Not sure if that's related to what I've said, but it's hard to tell)

Edited July 29, 2023 by Mr Masker

[Naarok0fkor]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3njZSDjW7Q4&ab_channel=AreaEightyNine

[RDETalus]

6 hours ago, DELTA256 said:

So from what I'm gathering here is that I just need to start somewhere small

That's not exactly what I am saying, but that's probably a good idea anyways. Have you ever released a full complete map? Not something that is a part of a community project or a work-in-progress?

[aloysiusfreeman]

12 hours ago, DELTA256 said:

 

So from what I'm gathering here is that I just need to start somewhere small, then slowly but surely, work my way up to where I want to be and then I'll be able to achieve a high status amongst my peers? am I correct in assuming that?

 

 

I think it's always good to have your sights set to an ultimate goal, with just being mindful of where you are currently at with your skillset and limitations. 

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

13 hours ago, RDETalus said:

Have you ever released a full complete map? Not something that is a part of a community project or a work-in-progress?

Not that I would recall...

[RDETalus]

1 hour ago, DELTA256 said:

Not that I would recall...

You should probably do that. You'll receive more attention and criticism on a finished map than a WIP. Just come up with something simple like "escape the barracks and get to the shuttle bay" and finish it inside a month or two. I've seen your work, you already know how to use all the tools to make a map. If praise and attention are what motivates you, get something finished out there so people can see it

[ＤΞＬＴΛ]

2 hours ago, RDETalus said:

You should probably do that. You'll receive more attention and criticism on a finished map than a WIP. Just come up with something simple like "escape the barracks and get to the shuttle bay" and finish it inside a month or two. I've seen your work, you already know how to use all the tools to make a map. If praise and attention are what motivates you, get something finished out there so people can see it

Got it.

[Yousuf Anik]

On 7/25/2023 at 11:05 AM, DELTA256 said:

Title says all, but I'll briefly explain anyways...

 

Since 2022, I've noticed that people don't really reply much to the things that I make (apart from some exceptions that is) which has caused a really sinking in my soul which has not left me for about a year now.

@DELTA256 Like the title I ask the same question to myself sometimes. Do people here like me and my contents? You can see most of my contents are about speedrunning or mostly Brutal Doom playing. You can also see recently I started playing UV-Tank demos. What I see from my YouTube channel is that none of my contents really get any replies or comments or whatever, the same thing is here. Now have I stopped making contents or stopped speedrunning? No, because I do the thing I feel like doing and I love to share them here. You see my UV-Tank demos here, which I doubt anyone really likes here but I do because I found it interesting. It doesn't matter who likes my contents here or who not, I always love to share them here and in my YouTube channel too, no matter how trivial it may look to others. Even if there is one person who watches my content, replies back to me or share some advice or criticism, I love to appreciate it and wholeheartedly accept it. What I learnt here is that engaging with lot of people, projects helps you grow, make you feel better. That's why I try my best to help people even if it's is very little and contribute to a project where I believe I can do something. That's how I feel better here.

Note: Sorry for my bad english :D

[Perrito]

I believe that wanting recognition from others is not necessarily a bad thing, it is even natural and helps us feel useful and give meaning to life. But many of those times we lose focus on what we really want in our soul. I make music and I had an experience about it. For a long time I wrote songs with the purpose of pleasing different people, making my work inconsistent and not very personal, but moving away from that approach I have managed to put my personal stamp on my art and create pieces that I consider authentic.
I think it's good to seek recognition but we must be clear about the limit. Not only do you have to do things for others, from time to time give yourself something. Cheer up.