Embryo: where each map is smaller than the last

[solidago]

Progress on my map has been a bit slow, I'm somewhat close to finishing the layout but I haven't got much going in terms of thing placement and visuals yet. February still sounds like a very reasonable deadline though, I'm fine with it.

[Makedounia]

I've been working on my map for a bit. I've got a theme for it and the layout is around 30% ready, I've also got some ideas for fights which I may or may not use. February deadline is alright with me

[Large Cat]

Although I have my map pretty well-formed in my head, I need to chew through a couple other projects first, so I won't be starting mapping on this for at least another few weeks. A February deadline should be plenty of time for me, though.

[Moustachio]

Alright, I think the majority of mappers are cool with February.

 

I’m setting a hard deadline on February 1st, 2024.

 

I’ll cut it off at midnight -12:00 UTC. As long as it’s Feb. 1 anywhere on Earth feel free to hand it in.

[IvanDobsky]

Sorry for taking so long to respond, I'd say im about halfway done with my map but i'm gunna be preoccupied this october with nanowadmo. I should probably be finished by the end of november so feburary should be perfectly fine.

[Raith138]

Is this still going? Nothing has happened here for a while.

[Moustachio]

I’m sure the holidays have just made everyone busy, but yes this is still going. Friendly reminder that we’ve set the deadline to Feb. 14, 2024, so mappers will have plenty of time to finish up their submissions.

 

I’ll ping everyone in the thread this weekend once the holidays start winding down.

 

Happy Holidays to those who celebrate and those who worship.

Edited December 26, 2023 by Moustachio

[Moustachio]

Okay, we've officially got 43 days until the deadline. Just a friendly reminder. Feel free to share your status, whether have one linedef drawn or you're one linedef away.

 

@TJG1289

@IvanDobsky

@Arno

@yourlocalchef

@solidago

@Philnemba

@Makedounia

@PRO-RC

@spineapple tea

@signaturereverie

@russin

@whybmonotacrab

@macro

@SharkyChip

@Jakub Majewski

@Alaxzandarz

@ViolentBeetle

@taufan99

@Large Cat

@LoatharMDPhD

[whybmonotacrab]

4 hours ago, Moustachio said:

Okay, we've officially got 43 days until the deadline. Just a friendly reminder. Feel free to share your status, whether have one linedef drawn or you're one linedef away.

Doing an automated map where stuff opens up on a timer forcing you to have to prioritise targets and kill swiftly.

Edited January 3 by whybmonotacrab

[ViolentBeetle]

I'm planning to start working on my map soon, have an idea that should work.

[spineapple tea]

I hadn't looked at mine in a bit and there's honestly less progress than I remember, but I have the layout and everything already there in my head and I've finished ~85% or so of the environmental detailing surrounding the actual map (because priorities am I right?). I'll post a screenshot later if I remember to.

Edited January 3 by spineapple tea

[yourlocalchef]

I have the layout and placement of keys and items done. No monsters or teleporters yet. Also i vaguely remember that the exit needs to be a death exit so i need to implement that. Definitely on track to completion.

[Arno]

I have about 80% of the linedefs in place. The remaining 20% is mostly secret rooms and stuff outside the playable area. My main focus will now shift towards monster and item placement. So still on track.

[TJG1289]

I admittedly still haven't touched my map in months. Partially due to Doom burnout in general, and also frustration that I can't map as fast as I would like. I am planning on starting back up with the map making this weekend, and I feel if I can really hunker down and start working on it, it shouldn't take me too long. I reckon I'm about 1/3 of the way done. I have 3 main fights planned out for it, and have the first one done. I'm going to do the layout and combat first, then work on texturing and detailing the map. A few areas are slightly textured already so I could remember what I wanted to do with them. I still have the idea of having monsters being launched out of a cannon, and that's probably going to take the longest for me to figure out how to do. Using dummy sectors to make a column rise from the ground took me like 2 hours to figure out how to do, so I don't really want to have too many advanced (for me) mapping tricks in it, just to save time. All my other ideas I had anyway are pretty easy to make. I also thought it would take me a little fooling around to figure out a potential progression problem, but I literally just had an idea on how to do it as I was typing this sentence, so that's one thing solved! 

[Large Cat]

I've been sitting on a plan for quite some time, yet to put it in the editor. I think the map will come together swiftly once I start mapping proper; I've simply been focusing on other, more pressing things in the meantime.

[SharkyChip]

Thanks for the heads up! I haven't touched or progressed on the map for the last few months, but I do have a few rooms laid out and have an idea of how to progress with the level. It's in my plans to get it done this month so I'll be updating when I have something functional

[IvanDobsky]

I'd say im about halfway done with mine. Just gotta finish up the final part of the layout, set up some boom conveyor belt stuff then pick a midi and a skybox.

[Moustachio]

@IvanDobsky You gonna finish that steak? Looks tasty!

Edited January 6 by Moustachio

[TJG1289]

I spent a few hours today on my map, and while it has been slow, I made some good progress! Added some things I hadn't planned on and that I'm pretty happy with. Will work on it more tomorrow, and will hope to be at least halfway done with the map by then. I might be halfway already, but I don't know for certain. 

[apichatpong]

Tried randomly some maps (01, 13, 21 and 28) and it looks very promissing !!

Varied atmospheres and gameplay, nice ideas related to the project's line.

Look forward to the global release, bravo guys !

[TJG1289]

I have the layout and combat finished, now it's just on to texturing and detailing! The only issue I'm having so far is my cannon idea works perfectly in GZDoom, but not in DSDA. Where in GZDoom the elevated cannons shoot the enemies out and they sail over parts of the map so they hit the platform I want them to, DSDA pretty much has them warp right down to the floor immediately so they don't soar over the level like I want. Is there any way to make them soar over the map like in GZDoom, or is this just not a thing that can happen? I have a backup platform directly under the cannons implemented for DSDA just in case I can't get it to work like in GZDoom, and that seems to work fine. But yeah, other than that no issues in DSDA! So just gotta make it look pretty. Or at least make it not be all STARTAN2.

[BeachThunder]

11 minutes ago, TJG1289 said:

I have the layout and combat finished, now it's just on to texturing and detailing! The only issue I'm having so far is my cannon idea works perfectly in GZDoom, but not in DSDA. Where in GZDoom the elevated cannons shoot the enemies out and they sail over parts of the map so they hit the platform I want them to, DSDA pretty much has them warp right down to the floor immediately so they don't soar over the level like I want. Is there any way to make them soar over the map like in GZDoom, or is this just not a thing that can happen? I have a backup platform directly under the cannons implemented for DSDA just in case I can't get it to work like in GZDoom, and that seems to work fine. But yeah, other than that no issues in DSDA! So just gotta make it look pretty. Or at least make it not be all STARTAN2.

I'm not really sure I understand your cannon idea. I'm guessing you're using spawn cubes? If you provide a link to your level, it'd be much easier to see if it can be fixed.

[TJG1289]

42 minutes ago, BeachThunder said:

I'm not really sure I understand your cannon idea. I'm guessing you're using spawn cubes? If you provide a link to your level, it'd be much easier to see if it can be fixed.

Nah, I'm using closets with Scroll Floor, Move Things, that hit a Teleport to Line With Same Tag line (silent, monsters only), with the other line with the same tag being directly in front of the cannon(s). Here's a link to it. (This is literally my first time using a Google drive to upload a map, so hopefully this works). The cannons are at the east end of the map. 

 

I guess since I've got the link, if anyone wants to play through it and give some feedback, I'd appreciate it. Like I said, I still need to texture and detail a lot of it, but the layout and combat is pretty much done, and there is a death exit. Still very much WIP tho.

Edited January 14 by TJG1289

[BeachThunder]

1 hour ago, TJG1289 said:

Nah, I'm using closets with Scroll Floor, Move Things, that hit a Teleport to Line With Same Tag line (silent, monsters only), with the other line with the same tag being directly in front of the cannon(s). Here's a link to it. (This is literally my first time using a Google drive to upload a map, so hopefully this works). The cannons are at the east end of the map. 

 

I guess since I've got the link, if anyone wants to play through it and give some feedback, I'd appreciate it. Like I said, I still need to texture and detail a lot of it, but the layout and combat is pretty much done, and there is a death exit. Still very much WIP tho.

Huh, okay. This seems super finicky. I think you might have no choice but to add some supports along the cannon's pathway.

 

This is something I put together - sometimes it doesn't seem to work at all though. And it can break pretty easily if you make some slight adjustments to the supports. Generally, it seems you'd need to place a bunch of supports at a slight downwards gradient.

 

Honestly, I'm not even sure that this is really worth doing. It seems like it can work, but, unless someone knows a better technique, it also means adding a bunch of supports - and that's just going to look really sloppy once you head downstairs. Personally, I'd probably say that this cannon idea would be better suited to a GZDoom-only project.

 

Anyway, the level itself seems good, although probably a little harder than I'd expect from the second level.

[TJG1289]

4 minutes ago, BeachThunder said:

Huh, okay. This seems super finicky. I think you might have no choice but to add some supports along the cannon's pathway.

 

This is something I put together - sometimes it doesn't seem to work at all though. And it can break pretty easily if you make some slight adjustments to the supports. Generally, it seems you'd need to place a bunch of supports at a slight downwards gradient.

 

Honestly, I'm not even sure that this is really worth doing. It seems like it can work, but, unless someone knows a better technique, it also means adding a bunch of supports - and that's just going to look really sloppy once you head downstairs. Personally, I'd probably say that this cannon idea would be better suited to a GZDoom-only project.

 

Anyway, the level itself seems good, although probably a little harder than I'd expect from the second level.

 

Thanks for looking into it! I'd rather just take it out if the supports only have it work some of the time, just for consistency. I'll probably just have the enemies teleport in instead. Not as cool, but it is what it is. 

 

If it's too hard, I can definitely tune it down a little. I can think of a few spots that could benefit. I still have to go through and add difficulties as well, as only a few things aren't marked for all difficulties. I also was going to add some extra ammo in places as well, but didn't think about it until after I uploaded it.

[Moustachio]

Unfortunately, it would seem that Boom's physics won't allow ground monsters to fly through the air in quite the same way that the player can. Bummer. I think it's a really cool idea, so definitely keep that on the back burner.

 

As for the level itself, I'm loving it. It is pretty challenging for MAP02, but the general flow and environment are very fun in my opinion. Love the design of the rooftops and how the action winds up on the streets below. I'm reminded of Hacx MAP12 which has a similar flow. The combat was pretty engaging, and I don't think making it easier will take away from that. The ambushes never felt overwhelming, but they did give me a good jolt the first time around. I was able to find two of the secrets (I thought the soulsphere one was pretty clever).

 

It's a WIP, so I don't want to critique it just yet... buuut I would like to point out that it is possible to cheese the northeast elevator fight with the hell knights by stepping off of the elevator as it starts lowering.

 

Overall though, I am really excited to see the finished, detailed version of this map. I think it's a good sign when I pop it open in the editor and begin playing for the heck of it only to find myself finishing the level. A level currently caked in STARTAN2 at that! Great work, @TJG1289!

Edited January 14 by Moustachio

[TJG1289]

21 minutes ago, Moustachio said:

Overall though, I am really excited to see the finished, detailed version of this map. I think it's a good sign when I pop it open in the editor and begin playing for the heck of it only to find myself finishing the level. A level currently caked in STARTAN2 at that! Great work, @TJG1289!

I'm really happy to hear that, thank you! Being a relative newcomer to mapping, I wasn't sure how good the map really is, so this is some nice encouragement!

 

Do you have any ideas how to make the elevator fight less cheesable, tho? I like the time window there is for that while going down so you have just enough time to take them out before the revs see you, so I don't really want to speed the lift up if I don't have to. Is there a better way to trigger them where you have to be in the lift? I do figure most people wouldn't see that coming on a first playthrough, though the berserk just before it could be a clue. 

[Moustachio]

13 hours ago, TJG1289 said:

Do you have any ideas how to make the elevator fight less cheesable, tho?

 

The workaround that I found most faithful to your design was to place the switch on the other side of the room and have the door open and close based on walk-over line actions.

 

 

I used fast door triggers to open the door on approaching and close it when you get near the switch. The only way to open the door again is to clear the challenge, as I placed another door open action upon exiting. The doors open and close fast so that there's very little chance that you can run under the door and stop it from closing. You also can't run fast enough to hit the switch and leave before the door finishes opening/closing. A linedef skip may occur, but this would be very rare, especially with a diagonal walkover line. If the player tries to camp out on the lip of the door, the hell knights will still swarm around them, scratching the shit out of them in complevel 9 and forcing the player to jump down and engage in GZDoom.

 

I used action 106 for the doors opening and 110 for closing. You may also feel free to use W1 open line actions if the repeating door opening sound annoys you since co-op may not pan out fully for this project.

 

Check out the edited map for more detail.

 

And of course, there are variations that would work all the same, like using a voodoo doll sequence when entering the room for example.

Edited January 14 by Moustachio

[TJG1289]

@Moustachio I see! Yeah, that would work a lot better. As long as the door can reopen, we are good! I'll implement that method. I'm going to add it myself instead of just using your edit just so I have experience doing it. Thanks!

[whybmonotacrab]

@Moustachio I scrapped the level and started over. It wasn't fun, and it felt like a less good version of something I'd already done in another level. New level is shaping up nicely though. I was just wondering though, I know you say nothing but stock textures, but is it ok to use a waterfall texture? If not it's ok, I'll just use nukage for my idea rather than water, it'd just look more aesthetically pleasing if it were water.