Azure_Horror Posted October 30, 2023 (edited) Votes: +++ Back To the Saturn e3 5-map teaser & Violence & Auger;Zenith +++ Pagodia & Zeppelin Armada & Hydrosphere +++ Abscission Episode 3: Agony within. The episode name may very well suggest that TormentSignGuny succeeds on the outside, but slowly and painfully Dies Inside. This implies horror and dark ambience. "Protagonist dies inside" also works coherently with cringe-worthy text messages all around and with some deliberately cruel gameplay setups. Basically, it will be hard to judge, if those elements are errors, or parts of grand plan... I played this episode with saves: I was not sure, if I'll have enough time IRL to no-save each of the maps properly. That said, I was able to replay some of the maps multiple times. Map 21 Misery Misery greets its players with dark ambience, and a gameplay loop like in TNT:Evilution: the map puts emphasis on exploration and the journey, while the combat is focused on smaller enemies, with some bigger threats appearing only occasionally. Difficulty is maintained through limited health items and through prevalence of deadly ambushes, be it hitscanners, revenants, or custom monsters. Points of interest:1) The map organically combines OTEX by @ukiro with other, more traditional texture sets. So the 5-yaers old question is solved: OTEX and more old-school textures may beautifully coexist in a same map, and even in a same room.2) The final episode promises to focus on black and grey colors the most. In those environments, ghost imps become almost invisible! The ghost imps made me as paranoid as shotgunner ambushes usually do! This is cool, IMHO: paranoia-inducing slow-projectile enemy is a fresh addition to Doom gameplay loop. And it also works well in the dark ambience of the map.3) The idea of silent teleporter ambushes, introduced way back in the Episode 1, really payed off in this level: the threat of previously visited rooms being non-empty kept me on my toes. (Funnily enough, the most devastating traps on Misery use normal loud teleporters from Doom 1-2) Conclusion: I like this level very much. In my opinion, it re-arranges gameplay elements from other Sign of Torment maps in a novel way. The end result - a dark and eldrich level, that matches famous Transduction (see TNT:Revilution WAD from 2017) in its ambience. The map also showcases the applications of Boom Sorcery quite well, despite the sorcery being somewhat minimal this time around. 23 hours ago, Celestin said: No Gods No Masters is the lowest point of the wad for me. It was clearly made as this epic conclusion, but I find it excessive in lenght, while alternating between fights that are completely brainless and frustratingly difficult. I agree that No Gods No Masters may feel* like the lowest point of the WAD gameplay-wise. But, IMHO it is a good thing overall. Narratively, the TormentSignGuy is very close to loosing his humanity at this point. And the deadly, merciless, slow slog through hellish armies resonates very well with this mood. The grim determination is the only thing that keeps TormentSignGuy alive. He may prevail and win against the monsters. But will he be a winner in the end? Or only a broken husk? *to be completely fair, No Gods No Masters seems to draw its gameplay designs from older schools of slaughter mapping, including, but not limited to Hell Revealed WADs, Alien Vendetta maps twenty-somethings and Scythe 1-2 finales. Such gameplay priorities are definitely divisive, but they do have their fans. Edited October 30, 2023 by Azure_Horror 4 Quote Share this post Link to post
UUN4 Posted October 30, 2023 MAP30: In The End UV | Pistol Start | Saves not needed K: 0% | I: 0% | S: 100% This serves as just an epilogue map (with MAP29 being the true "final" map) where the game tells you that "you are the real monster." The game's ending text then tells us how we teleport into a UAC facility then kill pretty much everyone there before getting ready to wreak havoc upon the earth. Even before this point I wasn't taking the story too seriously, so the ending (especially the part where "nothing shall fucking stand in your way") felt a little campy for me. There only being voodoo dolls throughout excerpts of previous levels and locations of a destroyed earth did feel somewhat unsettling at least, and in retrospect after going to bed serves the "you are the bad guy" plot the WAD was going for. Full WAD In regards to the whole WAD, I kind of feel like each episode started off pretty strong but generally petered off by the end. I tended to ignore the story for most of the WAD so I only really have what I remember of combat and environments to go off of. While there were some fun combat encounters (two that immediately come to mind are the small sequenced rooms of monsters in the white episode and the pyramid room in MAP29 [which I lowkey cheesed by slipping past the Cyberdemon and letting the revenants and mancubi kill him]); others also felt a little wonky, and even a few ended up being straight up unfun (the dark room counters come to mind, for example, although that might just be my developing personal preference). As an adventure map, I like the individual color theming of each episode, and locales within each episode were also cool to look at and tended to lend themselves to a good atmosphere (I think the black episode being a particular highlight in this case). As previously stated, I didn't really pay attention to the story, but the bits and pieces I did pay attention too definitely came off as edgy and campy (and there's a part of me that does enjoy something like that). I think I overall enjoyed my one playthrough of this WAD and it got me out of my comfort zone and kept me at least a bit intrigued for the past 30 days, but I don't think it's something I would replay. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post
LadyMistDragon Posted October 30, 2023 Map 30: The End Here we are. An entirely monsterless map where the only presence is you almost everywhere. That's right, we are the demons and the its even suggested somewhere we were naught but a demonic vector all along. Elsewhere can be found the locations of our past adventures like the hanging square from Map 22. Perhaps, unsurprisingly the journey concludes where it all began: the base we were sent to 'investigate.' But the terrifying truth is only revealed once the game has ended: we seemed to have received a false vision in order to instigate us to enact the atrocity we were following in the first place! Honestly, I could probably do with the dialogue that sounds ripped chapter and verse from Hatred, but it does the genocide of Map 29 in better context somehow Final Thoughts. Sign of Torment is quite the curious case of a megawad. While it's clear Kain was learning on the job to a large degree, the disparity between the last third and first two thirds is still quite striking. Combat is originally quite undisciplined, despite Kain showing a flair for teleporter ambushes early on, with 04 and 06 and possibly 11 being the most memorable. There's a noticeable uptake in ambition in Episode 2, to its failing due to the perception that if more than 3 keys are required, that's automatically assuming all six keys are required. This leads to a number of uninteresting and half-baked situations that are nothing more than fillers. While this flaw carries over to Episode 3 to some degree, it's actually muffled adequately in all but 2 maps. Just putting aside the emphasis on atmosphere raising the megawad's rank from vaguely interesting to sharply nihilistic, level quality and encounters are far more tuned and Kain knows exactly what effect he's achieving here. Maybe it's not quite enough to overcome the drawn-out nature of several of the earlier maps, but the secret maps actually don't feel entirely like regular maps this time. That's always appreciated and raise the estimation of this megawad quite highly in my eyes. Final Score 7/10 No, I'm not going to do power rankings because they're stupid anyway and Episode 3 would probably dominate anyway. Be rest assured that 16 would be somewhere at the bottom though, with 15 not much higher. I do plan to play 32 at some point in the future, but who knows when that'll be. If Ichinichi wins next month, I'll probably take a break since I saw a friend play it and understand it well enough to do....other things. See ya next time! 4 Quote Share this post Link to post
espilka Posted October 30, 2023 (edited) Concluding comments - Sign of Torment This set certainly tests the rule. My love of Doom doesn't stray into (post-)modernist creations, but despite having to shotgun (or worse!) a Revenant while being practically forced to use berserk in the first map, the ethos of the set combined with the strange amalgamation of classical and grotesque aesthetics, with a difficulty curve that quite quickly went, first on HNTR and now on HMP, beyond what i'm comfortable with, i just love absolutely everything about this set. My other two favourite, above all, Doom II sets are I C H I N I C H I and Moonblood, and only factor they have in common with this (or each other) is that all three are creations of an idiosyncratic auteur. Episode 1 - Above Hell Itself - drenched in blood! Episode 2 - Surface of Another World - Cyberdemons and ice! Episode 3 - Agony Within - eldritch! Artistically speaking, the escalation of threat through first the episodes themselves, and at same time the vastly differing episodes, and the gradual introduction of devices used with increasing severity in episodes themselves and then through all the episodes, and the increasing visual strangeness and grotesqueness culminating in pure horror and eventually mindless slaughter, is all incredibly well realized. But do not get me wrong - i do not enjoy this as a Doom II megawad because of the artistic vision and its realization. For me the standard gameplay, progressions, and gimmicks of the set are all good in themselves, it's only that they are supported to a high degree by the visuals and the story creating a very unusual mood for a megawad, which on the other makes some of the absurd over the top design decisions acceptable. There are indeed parts of gameplay that i would not tolerate in a standard set, MAP14 Alteration being a good example, but here they are necessary and feel not same as they would in a standard set, where i would dislike them immediately as too modernist for standard Doom. It was downright bizarre for me to read most of the highly critical and even dismissive reviews from others, as while i could understand the words, i could not relate them to my experience or evaluation :D But i think interesting creations are often polarizing, and while there's surely a point where our tastes converge, there will also be the other end of the spectrum, where i would not understand their fascination. Total score: 5+ out of 5 Favourite maps: MAP32 Layers of Time - magnum opus MAP01 Rooms and Shadows - intriguing 1st room sets the journey off MAP04 Legacy of Blood - secrets and blood, and crates! MAP16 Them Bones - the journey - could be another couple maps, but the central teleporting death-island does it! MAP20 the Decay of Disregard - the changing rooms mechanic used to maximum effect here MAP22 Whispers - the progression taken to another level in true horror environment Least favourites (with a grain of salt, there's no bad map in the set): MAP09 Seytanu Akbar - just too difficult for me! MAP23 Die Alone - only because of the finale, it's not bad, but am not a fan of it Edited October 30, 2023 by espilka more exposition 4 Quote Share this post Link to post
Celestin Posted October 30, 2023 MAP30: In the End A playable cutscene, made out of pieces of earlier maps. Ending the map in a reversed version of MAP01 is a nice touch. The ending, though, is just depressing. It explains the black shadow's motive to get you through this gauntlet, tormenting and trying to kill, while in some way attempting to guide you through. Conclusions I don't know what to think about Sign of Torment. It's a wad of undeniable ambition and vision, but also one which wasn't able to fully realise it. I don't like being this negative and there are things here I like, however I can't just overlook the serious issues I have with Kain's debut megawad, most that can be grouped under an umbrella of "lack of restrain". The biggest complain is the homogeneity, something I touched upon a couple of days back. A lot of maps look and play the same. There is a strong devotion to a concept of a three-way hub, where each spoke is this self-contained scenario - sometimes it's a big fight, sometimes a platforming section, sometimes a plain weirdness. This in itself is not a bad idea for a map, but when it repeats over and over and over, it gets stale and by Episode 3, I was wishing for some change of style. Speaking of E3, this is where the wad heavily adopts the voidscape aesthetic, with fragments of its maps being linked by teleporters, jump pads and extradimensional corridors (it also appeared in previous episodes, though not to this extend). This makes the maps even more disconnected, reinforcing their hub-and-spoke nature. Again, not a fault in itself, but it gets repeated way too much, to a point I had trouble visualising the maps merely days after playing them. Regarding the combat, I find it very uneven. Episode 1 is almost entirely incidental, meaning few encounters sticks with you. Episode 2 and 3 are better in that regard, though another thing bothers me here: Kain's approach to healing. I feel like recovery items are rarely placed in a way that allows you to heal mid-fight. In other cases, you are expected to get through several waves or encounters without replenishing your health. This create some truly aggravating sections, with the early parts of MAP29 being the worst in that regard. This must be a concious decision, since ammo is usually provided. Now, here's a part I know will be controversial: the wad's usage of Boom features. I think that, while technically impressive, they would have made a bigger impact on me with more restrained use. I understand their purpose in a wad like Sign of Torment: to take the player out of their comfort zone of Doom they know inside out and put them in a truly alien situation. However, if every other room uses jump pads or non-Euclidean geometries or some other trick, it becames the new normal and it loses its effect. As for the individual episodes, E1 is very rough - the maps' geometry is simple, textures are bland (with a heavy abuse of marble and bloodfalls) and, as I've said, the combat is forgettable. E2 improves a lot and it's my favourite part of the wad. Partly of its the snowy theme, partly because the level design feels the most grounded. As for E3, that's where the issues I have with Sign of Torment became especially noticible. I can't deny it has the best (and the most creepy) atmosphere, though. In the end, Sign of Torment reminds me of Fragport somewhat - both were made by a single, relatively inexperienced mapper, who wanted to push Doom beyond what it was designed for. In both cases the end result, while impressive, feels rough and repetitive. I see Sign of Torment found its fans (enough to be awarded with a bronze Cacoward in 2022), sadly, I'm not one of them. And while I ended up disappointment and I'm unlikely to revisit it, I'd still say you should give Sign of Torment a chance. Maybe it will just click with you. Top 3 maps (and also ones that stuck with me after playthrough): MAP32: Layers of Time MAP11: F.O.A.D MAP18: Stellar Tombs 4 Quote Share this post Link to post
Pechudin Posted October 30, 2023 MAP30: In the End So, I think most people expected this but yes Johnny, you were, in fact, the Demons. A bit underwhelming but I think the story was not really the strong suit of the WAD (at least the explicit part of it). The closing words were somewhat tainted by the inappropriate usage of "fucking" - not because I think the word is not to be used in a Doom WAD, but because it just did not feel like it fit. But yeah, it seems that this entire ordeal was a sort of training for the Entity (or whoever they are) to turn the protagonist into a sort of an Avatar of Destruction. Perhaps they saw something in the prisoner, some quality and decided to test them. World ends I guess? The WAD as a whole So, a replay of SoT somewhat lessened my initial thoughts of it, but I still think it's a worthwile play. When I tested it what drew me in was the unorthodxy of it, and also the technical stuff - as a mapper this greatly interested me. This is a wad of extremes - great dedication to the theme (sometimes to the WAD''s detriment I'd say), impressive trickery and combat that has high highs and dreadful lows (that 64-unit maze in MAP15, I think, was ugh). In the age of the highly polished stuff this willingness to experiment was something admirable I'd say. The strongest part of the WAD was the middle bit I'd say. Kain hit his stride with ligh-on-the-eyes color scheme, dreamy MIDIs, more engaging combat (MAP32 being my absolute favourite) and bigger handle on the Boom tricks. The final episode is better than the first one but the doom-and-gloom wears off quite quickly for me. The main culprit here is the music. Don't get me wrong - I love me some slow, creeping horror but the horror needs light spots lest it becomes background noise. The aesthetics are very weird. Mostly it's either boxes or organic amoeba-like shapes. Very rough at the edges - angular, spiky. Unfriendly to modern combat, you will snag on them and eat a Cyber rocket. The hostility of the spaces can work in the atmosphere's favour though, and at other times is infuriating. On the usage of Boom features, I will voice some dissent here: 3 hours ago, Celestin said: Now, here's a part I know will be controversial: the wad's usage of Boom features. I think that, while technically impressive, they would have made a bigger impact on me with more restrained use. I understand their purpose in a wad like Sign of Torment: to take the player out of their comfort zone of Doom they know inside out and put them in a truly alien situation. However, if every other room uses jump pads or non-Euclidean geometries or some other trick, it becames the new normal and it loses its effect. This supposes that the tricks are supposed to be "flavour", and should be in service of regular Doom stuff (combat etc.). While that is a valid (and probably a view that even I would subscribe to), I think that that's not what Kain was going for. Tricks are in large part the point (but perhaps I am reading it wrong here and you don't disagree with that - just that you think it was not a good decision). So yeah - SoT. If you like weird stuff or want to see some Boom trickery, like sporadically great atmosphere and are willing to forgive some rough edges, this is a good one to try. If you liked A.L.T. then this should be up your alley. 5 Quote Share this post Link to post
Pechudin Posted October 30, 2023 Oh yeah, @espilkar's taste seems to be towards the weirder stuff, so I am curious and will vote for +++ I C H I N I C H I 1 Quote Share this post Link to post
General Roasterock Posted October 31, 2023 (edited) Map 28: Loneliness Spoiler If this was the first map that did the whole “Jumping back and forth through portals” before any of the others did, I would be quite fond of the idea. Having a late term map exist to go through the story beats and atmosphere is always something I’m quite fond of, or even simply anything that breaks up the usual incidental monotony, much like Scythe’s map of the same slot. The ending fight was a slammer too, the highest the difficult has been by a longshot, and then mellowed out with an entire invuln. So of course I did the fight without it. Map 29: No Gods No Masters Spoiler TormentFest 2023, where the Boom wad forgets. Nothing creative about the slaughter nonsense here. Sometimes you’ll have a Cyberdemon teleported into your colon as you are faced with hundreds of Blood Demons, sometimes you’ll have to blindfire rockets into a pitch black crag with no indication of anything being alive aside from Arachnotron footsteps. It’s boring and obtuse for deeper reasons than many of the other maps, but the change of pacing was a surprise for sure. Map 30: In the End Spoiler I had a theory running since the middle of E3: the red text that we see on the floor everywhere is actually not some malevolent force, but rather TormentGuy’s inner monologue. All the history of the prior events, all the intimidation of hell’s incomprehensible environments, all the badgering of negative emotion overwhelming him to the point of spattering across the map in one word chants, all of this was coming from his mind and being communicated to the player through this text. Yes, there are some hard instances to argue, like “we own this dimension” and the like, but I figured it was either something just forgotten about, or a tell of how overwhelmingly powerful the UAC was in this story. It came to a head in the last map. After all the cries of depression, his very soul demanding that he end his life to stop the pain, his resolve had hardened, his thoughts turned to determination, and he knew that, no matter what his crimes were in the past, human life was worth more than pure evil, and thus he pushed through that pretty annoying slaughtermap. Betrayed by man, hunted by demon, the only person deeming you worthy of life was yourself, and your word meant far more than any beast could challenge. Boy was I wrong about that or what? Instead, I’m shown a vision of several maps I previously fought through, now populated with marines, and I get possessed by le evil darkness and go on a killing spree, implied to begin a culling of Earth. Where did this come from? How is getting the word “rot” yelled at you for minutes on end a catalyst for TormentGuy to turn on his whole species? Where did the white text go? I have so many questions, yet most of them have the simple answer of “oh actually we were lying to you because it was just a test to see if you were really strong” which means I can disregard everything the darkness has said up until now. Why even bother with all the other shit then? Just see if I can survive that dumbass Mancubus waterfall in No Gods No Masters and call it a day. Ultimately it leaves every question you could have about the darkness unanswered, and you’re forced to assume that it’s just a crazy supernatural being that likes telling people to neck rope. I still think the interpretation of internal struggles leading to damage to more than just yourself is still fair, and that’s the moral I’m gonna cope with. Cool industrial ambience though. Edited October 31, 2023 by General Roasterock 3 Quote Share this post Link to post
Crusader No Regret Posted October 31, 2023 map 28: 100% everything It's different at least, having a map 28 be this desolate. It's a bit of a puzzle to access the first key, assuming one doesn't stumble into the solution by chance. The cybers guarding the next key I feel is the most difficult part of the map. Didn't really work out a reliable way to hide from them for the duration of their timer, instead opting to accept an attempt where I took about 80 splash damage in total. My choice of gameplay mod has some interesting side effects here. Because the cybers are telefragged by voodoo dolls, it counts as damage coming from the player. This gives a lot of weapon EXP leaving to a decision behorehand about which weapon to give it too. Pondered some before opting to pour it into the BFG. I end up adding the following: - Thunderbolt: The same momentary freeze effect I've been putting on plasma gun. Not the biggest deal but it is a prerequisite for the next upgrade. - Chain Lightning: Killed enemies produce lightning that seeks out other enemies for added damage. Damage does scale based on max health of killed enemy and overkill damage so I like the effect on a high power weapon. Enemies killed by Chain Lightning will trigger the effect again for potentially massive chain reactions. - Submunitions: On a weapon that can already knock off many enemies per shot, this enhances the devastation potential. Combined with Chain Lightning, this can waste large swaths of monsters with one shot. Also added more damage and the acid upgrade. This is a gloriously overpowered weapon of mass destruction. The last key, I was expecting an ambush or cage fight (sure looks like a setup for one) on grabbing the key but there isn't one, a welcome subversion of the norm. There are some small ambushes hitting the switches as well as a few harmless fakeouts (well harmless as long as one doesn't impulsively shoot a voodoo doll) Instead, the bulk of the monsters await in the final arena. Hands out an invulnerability to get a head start on going to town multiple revenants, archviles, and cybers. Mainly a chance to let off some steam. This went easier than intended due to all the buff I stuck on the BFG. There's a top-of-skyscraper view accessed via a secret that I don't have an idea of its narrative significance. Could it be a reference to Going Down (which I've never gotten around to)? Maybe it's an internal self-contained reference to the WAD's story. Hell if I know. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post
_goofyguy Posted October 31, 2023 MAP30 - In The End "You are the real monster, not them." A city filled with dead bodies. Former soldiers, frozen in time. Levels you've passed through already, feeling familiar, yet different. No monsters? Right. This level is very anti-climactic. Apparently, you are now their killing machine and now you go and murder all life on earth. What? What about the white text? Why am I murdering everyone now? What the hell game?Sign Of Torment - The Last Word Well, this has been a rollercoaster. Episode one seemed to be very akin to a first time modder's experience, starting off crap and getting sort of better. Episode two was much better, and I think this is where the WAD peaks. Episode three leaned very into edginess. The main problem I see here is the fact that almost all the levels play more or less the same: a central hub, several paths to take and collect keys to open the door. There's not enough variation to make me actually remember these levels very much, and it's one of the reasons my reviews have been so short; there's not enough new things to distinguish levels from each other. I can barely remember what my favorite level is, they all blend together too well. The combat is a bit unimaginative, mostly teleporting ambushes and 'kill everything in this room to progress.' The healing and ammo is more or less very hard to come by mid battle, resulting in some of the most tedious dodging I've seen. The BOOM tricks are sort of like a half-broken fog machine: they're there, to be sure, but they're not executed all that well, which is exaggerated as they then are used in every single level from then on. Level decoration actually is pretty good. The use of different colors every episode is pretty unique, and the decoration within is well done. Again it all tends to get a bit samey though. My favorite level? Stellar Tombs. The one-time use of the Egyptian like crypts was pulled off well, and it sticks in my mind as significant. The low ceilings, the buried entrances, it's all very well done. Overall? Decent WAD. It's got its letdowns, but overall I enjoyed it a fair bit. I haven't figured out the story at all, so its confusing, but who cares? It's DOOM. If you ignore the duct tape and Deja vu, it's a pretty damn good WAD to try. Enjoy your Halloween candy everyone. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post
Azure_Horror Posted October 31, 2023 Map 22 ; Map 23 Die Alone; Map 24 Save My Life Those 3 maps are notably different. But they are links of the same chain. Those levels keep the haunting and horrifying ambience of map 21, while escalating the gameplay into more explosive, more Scythe-like direction. Whispers steps into Scythe/Plutonia/Cydonia design space. The lowtier threats from map 21 are still there, but many of the key fights are focused on the bigger demons. Luckily only 1 of the 2 white-color keys needed to leave the map. What a nice surprise! Enjoy it while it lasts, what else can one say here? Die Alone has less Plutonia, and more Scythe. Cyberdemons join the final episode. Archviles are also happy to roam around. Platforming is still there. Luckily, the nebulous IT from Scythe map 28 is absent... There is only a crowd of revenants. But platfroming on jump-pads under the cyber fire is a also a nasty race against the odds, you know... Save My Life goes so far into explosive Scythe designs, that it feels like Sunlust at times! Most important items are guarded by at least two archviles each! And the cyberdemons are also happy to join the fray. The Red key fight, which includes 1 cyber, 4 viles and minimal cover feels borderline slaughter-like! Like I said - Sunlust vibes are strong on this map... I love it! Map 25 Everlasting Pain Maps 21-24 were mean on a gameplay level. Map 25 is mean on a meta-gameplay level instead. Like judge for yourself: 1) There is 80 damage unavoidable damage right at the start. 2) There is a cyberdemon hub with 6 narrow doors, where killing the cyberdemon is forbidden. 3) There is that one BFG bait episode: the BFG-9000 is close by, but the Red Letters say "Not for You". Trying to grab the BFG kills the player charatcer insantly. Platforming and the hunt for 6 keys are ouright uxeocted after the above shenaningans... That said, after a few tries, I become quite skilled at dancing around the cyberdemons rockets... And there is a good batch of healthpacks right near the cyber hub... And i don't really need that BFG anyway, ya know? Circlestrafing around the rev crowds is better done with rocket launcher and plasma. So, in the end, Everlasting Pain does not feel unfair. But it feels outlandishly mean nonetheless - this is a fact. Map 26 Hopeless What a fitting map name! Map25 was mean on a meta-gameplay. Map 26 is mean on the most meta of meta level, period. Hopeless starts by sending you back to level 21, it continues by introducing the darkest corridors in the whole episode 3, it goes on to platforming through moving portals over the void, and it concludes with an ending switch, which tries to drop into the abyss! And inbetween all those surprises, map 26 includes many Scythe-like battles. One of which is pretty big, and filled with cyberdemons... Love this map for all manner of things. It is an work of art, IMO. It deserves a separate write up. I'll try that to post one tomorrow. Map 27 Black is the Soul This level is much more routine than map 26. Arguably, it is even welcoming and accommodating! Gameplay is less memorable compared to previous maps, but it still has its memorable spots. The BFG-Cyber Duel on a small platfrom is one of those moments. The timed area-control battle for the red key is another. On this map, the horror steps back into the shadows, and the more traditional Doom gameplay can have its time in the limelight - this is how I view Black is the Soul. Map 28 Loneliness Alone. You are alone. Or maybe not. Pump-action shotgun is there. Cyberdemons are there. Bombastic Invulnerability+BFG finale is there too. Not as alone, as one might fear, I'd say. Still, outside of the 2 fights described above, the map mostly feels like a quiet before the storm. With platforming through the void. And with one city-looking secret area... The meaning of this area will be revealed later... Map 29 No Gods No Masters As the Red Letters say, "So you have made this far". 1144 monsters on UV. One long slaughter gauntlet. No Gods No Masters tests persistence, endurance and slaughter fundamentals. Curiously, there is not a tiny element of combat puzzle in sight. Only straighforward, uncompromising chain of deadly intense battles, with only smaller battles and some backtracking to vary the pace of the map. This type of simplistic slaughter is very notable. Especially because @Kain D. did create more complicated slaughter-ish encounters in previous maps: - The arena from "It moves" section of map map26 is one such fight. - The 4-archvile+Cyber ambush of map 24 is another. - The finale of map 11 is yet another. - And there are also the map 09, the plasma-rifle testing grounds of map 13, the first fight of map 20... The list is quite long. For this reason, I think that @Kain D. deliberately filled the map 29 with more simplistic types of slaughter. As it stands right now, there is nothing to think about in map 29. There is only one thing to appreciate - the carnage! The Strength and Hatred, the Rcoket Launcher, BFG, and DarkInfused Plasma Rifle are the only companions you need. Hesitation is pointless. Thinking is not needed. Show your worth. Show your power! Prevail through your strength alone!!! This is one final test. After it is completed - there will be none to stand in your way, none to control you! Or so it may seem... Map 30 In the End In the end, the TormentSignGuy prevailed. Against all odds. All UAC otherworldly shenanigans be damned! Does TormentSignGuy need UAC at this point? No! Do those UAC bastards desrve any respect from TormentSignGuy? No! They sent TormentSignGuy towards certain death! Its only fair to hate them after all that happened! And with such thoughts in mind, the TormentSignGuy turns against both the UAC, and the whole humanity. Free from any chains, and serving noone... Noone but the Red Letter Entities. Now, he is kinda like the demons, which were unleashed onto the Snow World from Episode 2... But TormentSignGuys is not the demons! He have beaten all the demons! He is deadlier! Faster! Stronger! He is an even more perfect tool for destruction! The final thoughts for the WAD I will write tomorrow. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post
Crusader No Regret Posted November 2, 2023 (edited) map 29: 100% kills, 0/1 secrets Over 900 monsters on HMP which rose to over 1,000 before it was over. Because ZDoom counting lost souls. Very much structured as a linear path forward and generally no turning back. Despite the large monster count, it's mostly basic. Most encounters can be solved by application of heavy firepower to packs of monsters advancing from one direction or circlestrafing and letting infights thin out the ranks. The challenge of the first leg is dealing with about a third of the population without any chance to restore health. Playing with a gameplay mod greatly expedited clearing out packs (pretty sure the large horde of red demons is designed to take more than one BFG shot to clear out, as one example). Next segment opens with being greeted by dozens of speedy demons charging your direction. Intimidating when played under intended conditions, I imagine. Me coming in with a mod definitely ruined that effect as 1-2 rockets or one BFG shot decimates the pack. Next big fight I made more difficult on myself by insisting on taking out the pain elementals without them spewing too many skulls (more than 30-40 being "too many") but without using the BFG to do it as all the buffs I stacked on it wipes out the cacos too and I want them around for infighting. One of the floating islands has a setup where the only ammo provided was rockets so I was using only that and berserk fist on the lurking monsters there (with a bit of chaingun use for the resident chaingunners). After overcoming the islands, there's one last megasphere going into the final set of challenges. The initial setup takes a bit more effort than just circlestrafing everything. Trying to bait infights without taking too much damage from cyber rockets or the dozens of other monsters lying in wait took a number of attempts. Ammo looks somewhat scarce for an aggressive approach. I had both cybers killed by infights in my successful attempt and I'd much rather face the flock of cacos in almost any instance. Three more challenges to overcome before the exit; I can see where others' complaints about repetitive setups are coming from. Beating back a pack of knights and barons was simple. The dark caves that get populated with arachnotrons and mancubi isn't really going to be much harder if one doesn't care about maximizing infighting. The two pyramids room has a lot more teeth and it looks like a setup from Combat Shock 2 or another dedicated slaughter map. Thanks to gameplay mod, my first crack at it ended up feeling too easy so i reloaded and did things differently so that it would take some work to win. Tangent: Unintended effects of gameplay mods Far as I can tell, seekers affected by Gun Bonsai's Personal ECM perk are treated as they came from the player. They'll give weapon EXP to whatever weapon the player has out even when not actively attacking. Monsters hit by reprogrammed seekers will treat it as a player attack for purposes of targeting instead of the monster that fired them. Most significant (in the case of this particular combat setup), is that reprogrammed seekers will trigger any perks of the currently held weapon. This includes all elemental effects as well as those that activate on a kill. I had the BFG out on the first go. So when a monster died to a redirected seeker, inevitable with all the scrambling I was doing, Chain Lightning + Submuntions would take out 2-4 more despite me never firing a shot. This trivialized things more than I wanted so I switched to a different weapon while running around trying to infight bait to not break things as extensively. (end tangent) Once again with less cheese. (actually more than once working out a strategy) I still want to get the cyber to infight but I cannot stand still for very long or other projectiles will find me with a wall of mancubi and the pyramids stuffed with revenants. Going in somewhat of a figure eight pattern seemed to eventually achieve what I'm going for without dying in the process. Eventually was able to squeeze past the cyber blocking the way out while it was distracted with another monster and the hardest part was over. Didn't have this thought until after the map was over but this doesn't feel like a part of E3 of Sign of Torment. It could be entirely retextured with a completely different texture set and would still be the same map. Same with map 27 too but that one's shorter so it didn't have as much time to sink in. Edited November 5, 2023 by Crusader No Regret 2 Quote Share this post Link to post
Crusader No Regret Posted November 3, 2023 (edited) map 30 No monsters spawner to put up with and no timing rockets from a lift. 10/10 . . . Oh all right, I'll say a little more. Looking at the monster counter does spoil a lot of the suspense but there's still ways to kill unsuspecting players without monsters. Surprise crushers, barrel traps, instant death pits, baiting into telefragging a voodoo doll, etc... Also, seeing that 0 on the monster counter at the start doesn't preclude the absence of a spawner. The journey through this map takes the player to a number of past locales. As an easter egg, any secrets in the revisited areas are accessed the same way as they were previously, though untagged. The way the map ends and the ending text unsettled me to a similar degree as the ending of A.L.T. How much of the resultant rampage is the protagonist's own doing (as they already had a bone to pick with the UAC even without some dark entity getting involved) and how much is from the influence of whatever entity has been stalking the TormentGuy through the maps is uncertain. Some concluding thoughts From my perspective, E1 is the "show off the Boom trickery" with gameplay a secondary consideration episode. E2 strives to combine the various elements into a cohesive package. E3 is the horror and gloom episode. The experiences of each episode feel quite distinct from each other and which one(s) a person will enjoy most will very well come down to personal preference. For me, E2 had the most enjoyable gameplay overall while E3 had the strongest atmosphere. E3 spooked me in a way that a slaughtermap with armies of thousands just isn't going to match. The overall set does live up to the premise of a unique experience so I suppose it is a success in that area. One more gameplay mod experiment I want to do with this mapset. map 11 - UV with Touhou Doom enemies and weapons The showdown with the cybers is more fun and frantic with this mod set. All the invisibility artifacts as well as the computer map are replaced with spellcards, which increase the variety of tools available to use. Having spellcards to cancel shots in case enemies line up a shot when going after the monster release switches is a welcome addition. The weapon in slot 5 is more fun to use than the stock rocket launcher and also has three firing modes for more flexibility. Also, the cybers can be replaced by character bosses for more variety. The bullet hell can get really wild with two or three character bosses/dammaku cybers prowling around. Also, there's higher infighting potential which will result in less monster HP to grind down. Wasn't able to complete the map though, in an instance of "user beware" when using mods the mapset wasn't designed for. Whatever wizardry is used to open up the path to the exit when killing the cybers, Touhou Doom enemies breaks it. Some monsters don't teleport in at all. I tried this map 2-3 times and each time, there were 40 living enemies when the dust has settled vs 1 when I didn't mess around with enemy replacements. So it goes with using mods. I suspect the finale of 20 would be much harder with this modset with 4 or more boss tier monsters in an enclosed space compared to the triviality of 4 masterminds and an invisibility but haven't tried that one yet. Assuming map progression doesn't break in some other way before then. Edited November 5, 2023 by Crusader No Regret 2 Quote Share this post Link to post
General Roasterock Posted November 3, 2023 Summary The irony of DGM calling this wad a “Frankenstien experiment” is not lost on me. The original work goes much deeper than “weirdo experiments with creepy results”. Creating a monster was Victor Frankenstein’s obsession. The idea of life was something that rattled around in his brain with such tumult that it drove him to horrid acts. He looted tombs and graves for flesh and bone, stapling them together with indifference toward their incompatibility and decay. His studies, remedies, and methods did just enough to reach his goal of reanimation, only to then be appalled by the mass that stood before him, offensive to the idea of living. I’m not saying that’s what Sign of Torment is, but I can see parallels, especially in the picking and choosing of components. Arrogant is far too strong of a word to describe the set that is clearly a first stab at mapping. Yet the first thing that caught my eye when heading to download this is the reference that “it might be something that has never been done before”. After nearly thirty years of Doom, that is a pretty intriguing claim, albeit backed up with zero evidence in either advertisement or presentation. In fact, the whole wad is more similar to corridor connected grids of the past in the layouts that it provides for its toolkit. It’s evidently, and anecdotally, mapped chronologically for three episodes with effort made to reach the full 32 maps, structured around an unobtrusive difficulty curve, and scored to midi up until E3. If you didn’t tell me, I’d sooner think this was meant to stay closer to Doom II. The colormap immersion was more often an eyesore than not, the jumppads, although defeating the reasoning of my initial reaction, are still fickle as to what they do on a case by case basis, the silent teleports fall between magician tricks and crutches to keep the layouts together, the custom monsters barely stand out amongst the decades old troops, the ogg ambience blends together into one ghoulish snore, and the story was ultimately pointless as it overwrites all of TormentGuy’s interactions with his world by mind controlling him. What I think Kain does the best in this set is the introduction of individual ideas. From the introduction of the frozen wastes, to the assigning of the brand new Plasma Rifle to kill a parade of Cybers, to passing through a monochromatic tunnel for the first time (certainly not the 40th). These features were awesome on their own, but became watered down as the wad was filling space in order to fill every slot. If Sign of Torment was just eight maps, it would be a juggernaut in presentation, highlight after highlight. The only thing really holding it back is the notion that it had to be a megawad, a very startling thing for a new mapper to have to pull off. I respect the ambition, but it had just as many skewers in the wad as any of the impaled corpses did. The best I can say on Sign of Torment is that it’ll be wonderful to look back five years from now to see how far you’ve come. It’s a shame Kick Ass missed out, I imagine he would’ve loved this with GZDooM 4.9, PB 3.0, HeXeReTiC HUD PB3 v8.3RC2e, Weapon Neural Upscale, Simple Upscaled Enemies, Destroyable Decorations Definitive Edition, Glory Kills v29b (v30b did not work with overboard), SilentDoomguy, Flashlight, -iwad doom2.wad (ver 1.666), -skill 4 (UV), continuous play, no saves. Power of Rankings: Spoiler Alteration Layers of Time Black is the Soul Absence of Reality The Decay of Disregard Die Alone Loneliness F. O. A. D. In the End Misery Destined Ways Arctica The Loudest Silence Hopeless Blood and Chaos The Abyss Broken Mirror Dark Lantern Rooms and Shadows Apocalyptic Omen Stellar Tombs Whispers In This Hell Legacy of Blood Inside the Fire Seytanu Akbar No Gods No Masters Them Bones Rule of Nines Forever Save My Life Everlasting Pain 5 Quote Share this post Link to post
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