Stutters on new hardware - DSDA DOOM and others

[nobleflame]

I've got a i7 13700KF, 4090, 32GB build with NVME SSDs. Modern games run absolutely fine. However, old games like Quake 1, DOOM (via DSDA source port) and a handful of others show frame rate drops and inconsistent frame times using RTSS. I cap frame rates at 141 (-3 on my refresh rate) at 1440p.

I'm on Win 11, but my older PC (i7 9700KF, 3070) ran these games flawlessly.

Any ideas on what I can try to fix this?

[ImproversGaming]

There seem to be a lot of threads around about similar issues. I am not not even at a novice level with this but am bored and on a long train journey (7 hours so far today).

You have a very capable system. I suggest:

• Check GPU drivers are up to date
• Make sure you have the latest release of ports used
• Set fps cap as a multiple of 35fps (the base game tick rate - you are pretty close)
• Check in-game settings for graphics, specifically Opengl/hardware rendering (not software as maybe 1440p@141fps is heavy going for the CPU)
• Play with in-game render settings and any system v/g-sync settings (try on and off) - see what works best
• Wait until someone with some knowledge turns up on the thread

[nobleflame]

Just now, ImproversGaming said:

There seem to be a lot of threads around about similar issues. I am not not even at a novice level with this but am bored and on a long train journey (7 hours so far today).

You have a very capable system. I suggest:

• Check GPU drivers are up to date
• Make sure you have the latest release of ports used
• Set fps cap as a multiple of 35fps (the base game tick rate - you are pretty close)
• Check in-game settings for graphics, specifically Opengl/hardware rendering (not software as maybe 1440p@141fps is heavy going for the CPU)
• Play with in-game render settings and any system v/g-sync settings (try on and off) - see what works best
• Wait until someone with some knowledge turns up on the thread

 

Thanks for your time. I've ended RMAing my GPU as per the company who built my PC's suggestion. There was a very strange smudge on the branding logo of the card (GEFORCE RTX bit) and it looks like the card may have been damaged some how. I was going back and forward testing my hardware with customer support (they were really helpful) and they suggested replacing the GPU as potentially the main culprit - I should get the new one on Friday. 

 

Hopefully that'll sort it out. I'll also DDU the drivers and go for the latest Nvidia drivers to be sure. 

[CravenCoyote]

You shouldn't need to use DDU, really.

 

I'm not a genius when it comes to Doom tech, but my understanding is that it only uses a single CPU core, so CPU clock speed  has an impact here.

 

If you're using software rendering with a high frame cap, 'big' resolution and a demanding wad, then this might be a contributing factor. I'd think hardware rendering would help a bit here, but not sure if you were using that or not. Hardware rendering doesn't help with the in-game calculations, though, that's all on the CPU.

 

Not long for your new card now, let's hope it fixes it!

[dpJudas]

Try go to "Settings -> System -> Power & battery" in Windows and change the power mode from Balanced to Best Performance.

 

In some situations you can experience stutter from games if the load is not high enough for the CPU in the Balanced mode. Doom only ticks 35 times per second, so if the tick itself is heavy, but the rendering is not, then it can end up in a nasty cycle where it keeps changing the CPU clock speed up and down between frames where the playsim ticks and those where it does not.

[nobleflame]

Thanks for the advice folks. I appreciate it.

 

I should add that this is all through DSDA’s fantastic hardware renderer. 
 

Also, I am able to play at a locked 141 fps with zero frame time variance on a different PC with older hardware - i7 9700KF, 3070.

 

I will hopefully get the new GPU tomorrow so can continue testing. The support guy seemed to be quite confident that was the issue. 

[nobleflame]

Tested everything and I’m all out of ideas.

 

weird thing is I tried disabling all vsync gsync and fps caps and let the games run uncapped.

 

I was getting fps in the thousands and a relatively smooth experience. This isn’t great though because it puts a completely unnecessary load on my CPU. 
 

Please help!

[Lucius Wooding]

I hope you didn't get rid of the old PC. If nothing else it's ideal as a dedicated Doom machine.

[slowfade]

I'm sorry I can't help with any of this because I don't know anything about hardware, I only have a somewhat related question: Could there be a pc build that had like 200 graphic cards, one for each horizontal line of the 320x200 resolution, enabling insane framerates? Assuming the drawing algorithms can work in parallel.

[nobleflame]

35 minutes ago, Lucius Wooding said:

I hope you didn't get rid of the old PC. If nothing else it's ideal as a dedicated Doom machine.

I’ve still got it. I’m tempted to send the new one back. No point playing new games on a high end rig if I can’t also play DOOM.

[Lucius Wooding]

Are you running any mods of any kind, or using maps with 50k linedefs? Or just playing standard WADs in DSDA?

[nobleflame]

51 minutes ago, Lucius Wooding said:

Are you running any mods of any kind, or using maps with 50k linedefs? Or just playing standard WADs in DSDA?

 

Just standard wads, like the early levels of Sunlust, Fractured Worlds, Nostalgia 2, etc. Nothing demanding or extreme.

 

• DSDA will stutter unless I use gsync, and even then you get the odd slow down / stutter
• Eternity Engine is unplayable in full screen mode and requires windowed mode - this disables gsync and no amount of tinkering will let me use it in windowed mode, even if I allow gsync windowed mode in NVCP.
• GZDOOM is unplayable unless its in windowed mode with gsync active. 

 

The only other games that are behaving like this are VKQuake and DUSK. Both displaying a lot of frame time spikes that I wasn't seeing on my old PC. I can run RE:4 Remake and Cyberpunk at very high frames without stutters or FPS drops. 

 

One other thing of note is that if I remove all of the caps, gsync and vsync in DSDA DOOM and let it run uncapped, it will go as high a 1,000 fps and feel incredibly smooth. This isn't ideal however, because it's obviously taxing on my CPU and produces screen tearing.

Edited October 28, 2023 by nobleflame

[CravenCoyote]

I do wonder if this is something to do with the efficiency cores on the 13th gen Intels. A quick search online shows you're not the only one with this problem. 

 

Out of interest, are you using XMP for your RAM? Does turning it off or on change anything?

 

Are you setting your frme limits in game or elsewhere? You could try removing all frame limits in game and using only vsync.

[nobleflame]

8 minutes ago, CravenCoyote said:

I do wonder if this is something to do with the efficiency cores on the 13th gen Intels. A quick search online shows you're not the only one with this problem. 

 

Out of interest, are you using XMP for your RAM? Does turning it off or on change anything?

 

Are you setting your frme limits in game or elsewhere? You could try removing all frame limits in game and using only vsync.

 

I've tried switching XMP off but it didn't seem to do anything. 

 

The only 'fix' I've found is by turning off fps caps, gsync and vsync and letting the games run completely uncapped. This actually fixes DUSK entirely as the game just runs at 300+ fps. Not an ideal solution though, as I'd like to set an FPS and ensure the game keeps to it. 

Edited October 28, 2023 by nobleflame

[CravenCoyote]

11 minutes ago, nobleflame said:

 

I've tried switching XMP off but it didn't seem to do anything. 

 

The only 'fix' I've found is by turning off fps caps, gsync and vsync and letting the games run completely uncapped. This actually fixes DUSK entirely as the game just runs at 300+ fps. Not an ideal solution though, as I'd like to set an FPS and ensure the game keeps to it. 

 

You can use the Nvidia software to set fps caps rather than within the game itself. Does this make any kind of difference? 

[nobleflame]

Just now, CravenCoyote said:

 

You can use the Nvidia software to set fps caps rather than within the game itself. Does this make any kind of difference? 

 

To cap FPS I've tried NVCP, RTSS and the in-game caps. Its preferable to use NVCP as it's at driver level. Sadly, this doesn't help. It's so weird because no matter what cap I set, I'm getting loads of fluctuations. It's like G-sync isn't working properly... 

 

On my older PC, all of the aforementioned games would run at a locked 141 fps without variance.   

[CravenCoyote]

4 minutes ago, nobleflame said:

 

To cap FPS I've tried NVCP, RTSS and the in-game caps. Its preferable to use NVCP as it's at driver level. Sadly, this doesn't help. It's so weird because no matter what cap I set, I'm getting loads of fluctuations. It's like G-sync isn't working properly... 

 

On my older PC, all of the aforementioned games would run at a locked 141 fps without variance.   

 

Here's an idea, but no clue if it'll work.

 

Reset any custom changes you've made in NV software

 

Disable gsync (might need to turn it off on monitor, too, so NV Software doesn't get confused)

 

In game, turn on vsync only (don't set a frame limit, not that it should matter with vsync on)

 

 

[ImproversGaming]

There are a lot of posts out there that found issues with frame rate when using the "razer chroma option". I believe it is a lighting system and you may have their keyboard, mouse or other products. Thought it was worth a mention.

 

Check these out if so:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/379720/discussions/0/1290691308584866946/

 

[nobleflame]

Hi all, I feel pretty stupid saying this but I've fixed the issue:

I've completely fixed the issue with a windows reinstall. Not sure what happened along the way, but perhaps a driver didn't attach properly. Who knows. Any way, for posterity, just reinstall windows! It seems to have fixed my issues at any rate.

Sorry for the confusion - I feel pretty silly. Thanks to all who offered me help!

[nobleflame]

One more thing to add: it was icue that was the culprit. Completely ruined my FPS.