Backpacks - Item Total

[Frolik]

I'm completely new to Doom mapping, I mean REALLY new. Have never made a map, never done any scripting, etc... so forgive me if this has already been addressed (I couldn't find it anywhere).

I'm on the verge of getting my first ever map rolled out, but had one or two problems to sort out. I have now sorted them and eventually worked a way around the final problem I had, but am still stumped as to why it is a thing.

I first noticed it because I was testing my map on each skill level, and always ended up two items short every single time when going for 100%. After going through all the things classed as items and finding nothing wrong, I played the map slowly while constantly checking the item count. Whenever I picked up the first backpack, no matter which one it was out of several, it added two to the item count (the total required, not the number picked up). This didn't happen with subsequent backpacks in the same map... only the first  I got around it by making dummy backpacks that ran an ammo scipt, but why does this happen?

I was using GZDoom Builder 2.3 with GZDoom v4.10.0

[Kappes Buur]

Picking up backpacks adds ammunition to a weapon, for example

for pistol and chaingun 10

for rocket launcher 1

for each backpack picked up.

[andrewj]

Sounds like a bug in GZDoom to me.  If your map does not require GZDoom, I suggest trying it in another port like PrBoom+

[shroomzy5000]

Could be a difference between the older version and the newer version of the editor.  I now a lot of people still use DoomBuilder 2 but I use ultimate doom builder for GZdoom maps and this problem doesn't occur for me because as far as I know, backpacks and ammo are not classified as items by the game, or they are but like they dont go towards the end level % count.  Wouldn't it be weird if they were?  As I think about it, even if you got 100% kills, & secrets, you would have to go back and find every bullet pick up you missed to get 100%? that doesnt seem right lol.  I tried to recreate your problem in a dummy map and I simply cant.  I can place 5 backpacks on the map but if i hit the end switch, doesn't matter if I pick up 0, 1, or all, i end with 100% items.  Im using GZDoom in UDB so this is what leads me to believe its a difference in the editors.  I think its weird that they are being counted as items in the first place, if you dont have a specific reason for them to be counted as items, IDK if doombuilder 2 has this flag but I would use it.

 

 

I guess another thing we need to clarify is when you say "item count" are you using like a HUD modifier that counts your items like the one in GZDoom, or are you referring to the level end screen when it gives you the percentage out of 100%?

 

I do not use a HUD based pickup counter, so everything I said above is based from the level end screen

Edited December 2, 2023 by shroomzy5000
revised wording

[jaeden]

Some GZDoom technical things that came to my mind:

 

Backpack by default does not count towards item totals.

 

However, when backpack is picked up, it spawns all ammo types registered in the game (including from other games than Doom), that the player does not have yet, at (0, 0) position, before giving that to the player. (If giving that ammo to player fails, the item stays unpicked on that (0, 0) position.)

 

Ammo items by default also do not count towards item totals, but if you play with any mod, then that mod can have its own ammo types, and those could be set to count towards item totals.

 

Do you play with any extra mods when you encounter this item total problem?

[shroomzy5000]

I just made a quick test as an unlisted video. my results further support what @jaeden says

 

https://youtu.be/DQS_NvXJKd0?si=EI-ixV-8F5VuEUYE

Edited December 2, 2023 by shroomzy5000

[Frolik]

As a roundabout reply to several comments... I wasn't playing with any extra mods, no HUD modifer, etc. Completely vanilla.

That said, I was using v4.10.0 when I first downloaded Builder, so stuck with that throughout making it. Yesterday I downloaded the latest version of GZD and it doesn't happen, so I'd have to assume it is either a bug in 4.10.0 or something I inadvertently caused.

 

Fortunately, as I mentioned, I had already got around it and was merely curious.

 

Now all I have to contend with it that the latest version has scaled back some of the sector lighting options, and certain parts look weird. Not a problem, but time consuming.

 

Ho hum.

 

Many thanks to you all for the replies.

 

[Shepardus]

1 hour ago, Frolik said:

Now all I have to contend with it that the latest version has scaled back some of the sector lighting options, and certain parts look weird. Not a problem, but time consuming.

If your map is intended to be played with one of the legacy sector lighting options, you can specify it in MAPINFO - see this page on the ZDoom wiki.

[Frolik]

Thanks for the info Shepardus. I didn't know you could specify it in MAPINFO.

 

Unfortunately this was not the case as I had been basing it on the 'Doom' setting (option 2 in the wiki), then when I downloaded the latest version of GZD (with only Vanilla, Classic, and Software available), all the slightly darker areas looked inpenetrably dark.

 

It isn't a problem, more an annoyance. It has just set me back a few days. I was hoping to have my debut map out a few days ago, but had to run through it a few more times to make lighting adjustments.

 

Almost there.

 

Thank you to everyone for the help.

[Shepardus]

15 minutes ago, Frolik said:

Unfortunately this was not the case as I had been basing it on the 'Doom' setting (option 2 in the wiki), then when I downloaded the latest version of GZD (with only Vanilla, Classic, and Software available), all the slightly darker areas looked inpenetrably dark.

I meant that you can set it to any of the old lighting modes using MAPINFO. Sorry if I caused confusion, I meant "legacy" as in old/deprecated and totally forgot that it's also the name of one of the lighting modes. I think "Classic" is the same as "Doom" from old versions, just renamed, so setting your sector light mode to that should look the same as it did before.