thoughts on The Doom Awards™

[Agent Strange]

Mini rant about this since I saw my name pop-up. 

 

Oh, brother. OH, BROTHER. Let me tell you a story about the Doom Awards. For my part, I took everything they told me about what they were doing at face value. "New Doom community? Sounds good to me. Don't know why you're using drama involving the ZDoom forums as justification for starting this but okay." It was only after I had given them a shoutout that I thought to myself, "I should look into this more. Something seems fishy." Checked the website, read their lauded Transparency Statement, found the connection to the Boomers Dimension Discord, and then joined the Doom Awards Discord itself. All while this was happening, I had the Doom Awards Twitter account (aka Hakros) DMing about their beef with Major Arlene. I very promptly told them, "Hey, that's between the two of you. I don't want to know about it, I don't need to know about it." After that, I took a cursory glance at the Doom Awards Discord and found some posts that looked pretty bad at out of context. By that point, I was starting to realize that a good portion of the people running this thing were not native English speakers. I spent the first half of my life growing up overseas and from that I know that a lot can get lost in translation. Different languages, different cultures, different worldviews, all that coalescing into what I believe was a repurposed Discord that used to be used for a couple of friends to joke around in. That set off some alarms in my brain. I told folks to check out this cool new thing and there's some questionable stuff just floating there out in the open. If this thing becomes popular, then the chances of this stuff getting out there is only going to grow exponentially. So, with all of that in mind, I decided to ask for clarification on the posts that I saw. What followed, was a rollercoaster of smack coming from one the Discord's moderators. "Oh, Agent Strange. You're just some content creator who likes to play God and you're going to try to cancel us like you did with Sgt Mark. You ruined his career. Blah, blah, blah. Cancel culture is cringe and so are you. Long live Freedom of Speech!" That stream of word vomit went back and forth for two or so hours while I tried to politely inquiry about what I had seen. Eventually, I spoke with Hakros about it. He explained that they're Spanish speakers and that it's all just jokes and nothing to take seriously. I knew better by this point but decided to just leave it at that. I thanked Hakros for "explaining", left the server, briefly mentioned their beef to Major Arlene in private, and washed my hands of the whole affair. They were right in that I had unfairly repeated a lot of the stuff that Sgt. Mark was infamous for back in the day. That was wrong of me, and I realized that back in August 2021 when I spoke with Mark directly and buried the hatchet with him. I did not want to go through something like that again with these Doom Awards folks and after the verbal thrashing that I received from this moderator; I wanted nothing to do with this situation period. I didn't want to expose or "cancel" them. I just wanted to move on. If the Doom Awards was truly as toxic as I thought, then I don't need to get on a high horse and inform people of that, they can reach that conclusion on their own. Fast forward to now and that seems to be what's happening. I've heard that some people who were involved with the Doom Awards at the beginning are no longer associated with it. I haven't verified that, but I just remembered one of the names that were involved and deleted a tweet that highlighted some their content to be on the safe side. I am responsible for the community, for lack of a better term, that I cultivate on social media and it's up to me to make sure that it remains a safe place for EVERYONE to participate in. I did take screenshots of my time in the Doom Awards Discord but I don't want to go full Sherlock Holmes/Hbomberguy on this unless it becomes absolutely necessary. I would prefer that this be the final nail in the coffin that was my very brief endorsement of that goober website.

[Lizardcommando]

Jesus, what a shit show. Whatever "alternate Cacowards" get made in the future, hopefully it doesn't end up as messy as the Doom Awards.

[Trar]

Looks like it was...

 

Doomed.

[JoJo_BadDoom]

Sounds like it's got too many assholes involved in it. Think I'll skip paying attention to it

[DNSKILL5]

Yawn

[Man of Doom]

Welp, I don’t really have all that much to add in regards to new revelations, so all I’ll say is this:

 

At times I may struggle to write something like the Doom manga (like anyone does with a project like this), but at least I’m not using anything like ChatGPT to cheat my way through it.

 

For everyone struggling to write something (whether it’s Doom-related or not), know that your writing voice will always be uniquely yours; don’t let an algorithm take that away from you.

Because even on your worst day, your own writing is still going to be better than an AI on its best day.

 

(same goes for artists too, because I still remember the Doom Awards’ egregious use of AI art as well)

[Kwisior]

These are the REAL Codeawards.

[Kaapeli47]

18 hours ago, kevansevans said:

Most of us may think to ourselves "No one here is that petty", but I'm sure people like @Kaapeli47 or @Kaminsky can tell you about all the bad actors they know of who purposefully DDOS zandronum servers over far pettier shit. A certain butthead comes to mind.

 

I haven't been that long in the Zandronum community to know the entire history of those bad actors in multiplayer, but yes, I know which certain butthead you're talking about, and yes, some people are that petty. That butthead has proved that some people indeed spend that much time and energy in trying to find ways of attacking or corrupting a system. A voting system like the one the Doom Awards had is vulnerable to that behavior, especially if it can't be moderated well enough without spending more than half of your own staff's time and energy on it.

[Murdoch]

Getting uppity about the results of any awards show is absolutely silly. They are arbitrary and meaningless. Did you enjoy the thing? Then that should be all that matters to anybody.

But especially getting upset about the handling of an unofficial awards thing for a 30 year old game is just plain fucking daft.

Edited December 21, 2023 by Murdoch

[Panzermann11]

Honestly, this is the first time I've heard of them. Reading the story, the guys in charge seem like a bunch of whiny shitbags.

Edited December 22, 2023 by Panzermann11

[TheHambourgeois]

Frankly its about time someone overthrew, ah... The Aristocracy But For Doom Community Awards

[hakros]

Hello everyone, guys and girls, I'm glad that the topic has disturbed you enough to waste time commenting on it.
 

When we started the initiative, it wasn't intended to undermine anyone, neither the CACOWARDS nor you.
 

As I've already told various people, the previous administrator was expelled precisely because he was determined to bring up controversial issues. But since I took over, we haven't had any more conflicts, and the only conflict has been your incessant complaining about the use of AI.
Seriously, don't you have anything better to do?
 

Honestly, at first, we thought you wouldn't even bother commenting, given that you've had the Cacowards for 20 years and we assumed you wouldn't care about our initiative.
 

However, the criticisms you've made from the beginning have been more than obvious, so clearly, some of you seem to have felt offended.

 

As I already told Endless at the beginning of our relationship with him, we always publish messages when there's a conflict to show the TRUTH. When he said he wanted to break the partnership, I told him it was fine, but since we fulfilled our part, he should fulfill his. However, he told me he wouldn't honor his part of the agreement because we were dishonest. Does anyone catch the irony?

 

I posted the notice that the partnership was canceled just so everyone could see the reason. But the only response I got was that you thought it was wrong to expose the conversation?? Seriously?? It seems some of you are too lazy to read.

 

Regarding the use of AI, as I said, we've used it when we saw fit, and yes, we used it for promotional images. And the question is, you don't like it? Well, I respect that, but you should respect what I want to do, or do I have to do what you want??

 

Regarding the articles, as I mentioned on DISCORD and told Endless, I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English. I'm sorry if this has bothered you so much that you couldn't even sleep thinking about it.

 

Like i said, I don't have to explain myself to anyone, like Batandy did a few days ago for example about Golden Souls 3, and people came out to give their opinion on how bad using AI is for development...(everyone knows who said it).

 

I DON'T ANSWER TO YOU AND CAN DO WHATEVER I DAMN WANT, SO PLEASE STOP TELLING US WHAT TO DO.
 

Do we go to your projects to give you orders? No, right?
 

Apart from this constant annoyance with te use of AI, as I say, we have no conflicts with anyone, of course, as soon as you read this message, I know the next comments will be the same as always and you'll continue like this for eternity....right?? I encourage you to prove me right.
 

In case I'm banned at some point, I take this opportunity to wish you a Merry Christmas, for those who celebrate it!!

Greetings.

 

Edited December 25, 2023 by hakros

[RDETalus]

14 minutes ago, hakros said:

I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English.

 

I think you should focus on writing more in-depth reviews next year. It would make your award much more interesting to engage with. The way you've done it this year, it's nothing more than a list of winners. There's nothing interesting about a list, right? Or as some people have mentioned before, a video presentation would be pretty cool.

Edited December 25, 2023 by RDETalus

[hakros]

7 minutes ago, RDETalus said:

 

I think you should focus on writing more in-depth reviews next year. It would make your award much more interesting to engage with. The way you've done it this year, it's nothing more than a list of winners. There's nothing interesting about a list, right? Or as some people have mentioned before, a video presentation would be pretty cool.

 

Thank you very much, you see? This is constructive criticism. I think it's a good idea and we will take it into account. As I said at the beginning, we lack experience, of course, because we have just started and we have a lot to improve.

[Kinsie]

36 minutes ago, hakros said:

I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English. I'm sorry if this has bothered you so much that you couldn't even sleep thinking about it.

I don’t know about anyone else, but I’d personally prefer an awards ceremony in your native language in your natural words. The community and machine translation will bridge the gap for the gwailo.

[Bobby :D]

52 minutes ago, hakros said:

Regarding the use of AI, as I said, we've used it when we saw fit, and yes, we used it for promotional images. And the question is, you don't like it? Well, I respect that, but you should respect what I want to do, or do I have to do what you want??

Do you even want criticism (or respect for that matter) with messaging like this?

Edited December 25, 2023 by Bobby :D

[roadworx]

ruh roh raggy, this thread is gonna ignite

 

48 minutes ago, hakros said:

Regarding the articles, as I mentioned on DISCORD and told Endless, I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English. I'm sorry if this has bothered you so much that you couldn't even sleep thinking about it. 

okay. could you post all of the original spanish reviews to prove that? it'd make all of us look like assholes for calling you a lazy hack, so there's no reason not to do so

[Ludi]

1 hour ago, hakros said:

Like i said, I don't have to explain myself to anyone
 

 

Then why did you make a several paragraph post doing just that? :p

[No-Man Baugh]

@hakros What translation technique did you use for this post and your dms to endless? it certainly comes across more clearly, meaningfully, engaging, and human than whatever mangled and meaningless collection of disconnected phrases ChatGPT turned your writings into. I certainly think you should've use this one for the Doom Awards.

[OniriA]

1 hour ago, hakros said:

I CAN DO WHATEVER I DAMN WANT

 

I"ll be straight with you, I don't know who you are but I'm getting real "asshole" vibes from you based on these replies.

Edited December 25, 2023 by OniriA

[Li'l devil]

Yeah I don't buy into that it was a translation.

[Biodegradable]

4 hours ago, hakros said:

Honestly, at first, we thought you wouldn't even bother commenting, given that you've had the Cacowards for 20 years and we assumed you wouldn't care about our initiative.
 

However, the criticisms you've made from the beginning have been more than obvious, so clearly, some of you seem to have felt offended.

 

"Oh gosh darn it, you guys. Why do you have to exercise your right to have an opinion on a thing?"

 

How are we supposedly the offended party here with subtext like that? I love this kind of jump to a conclusion that suggests we're somehow acting emotionally and that the mere existence of your awards is somehow "offensive", rather than the idea that perhaps we're just talking about it out of curiosity's sake. Believe it or not, not everyone is frothing mad when they criticise or disagree with you.

 

Quote

I DON'T ANSWER TO YOU AND CAN DO WHATEVER I DAMN WANT, SO PLEASE STOP TELLING US WHAT TO DO.

 

Okay, then why did you bother logging in and writing this post in the first place? You would've been better off focusing on fixing up your awards project by firing your AI, actually writing the reviews and sprucing up the website in the time it took you to write this embarrassing diatribe.

Edited December 25, 2023 by Biodegradable

[TheMisterCat]

I'm confused.  If english is not your native language and you generally write in spanish, did you use translation to write this forum post?  Because it's clearly readable and doesn't seem by any stretch to have been generated by an AI.  If we compare it to the award articles, the style is completely different.  Are you sure that you didn't just use a prompt like "Please write me an article in the style of a review for a wad called X by an author named Y, including U and V?"  I've experimented a bit with this myself:

 

 

Title: A Rip-Roaring Review of "Bepis Bandits" Doom WAD by TheMisterCat

Rating: ★★★★★

Prepare yourself for a wild ride through the chaotic and exhilarating world of "Bepis Bandits," a Doom WAD that pushes the boundaries of creativity and intensity. Crafted with precision and a keen understanding of what makes a great Doom experience, TheMisterCat delivers a map that stands out in the vast sea of custom content.

 

From the moment you step into "Bepis Bandits," you are greeted with a visual feast that showcases TheMisterCat's attention to detail. The architecture is not only pleasing to the eye but also contributes to the immersive atmosphere of the map. The clever use of textures and lighting creates an ambiance that keeps you on the edge, ready for the next intense encounter.

 

The gameplay in "Bepis Bandits" is nothing short of a rollercoaster of excitement. TheMisterCat has expertly designed encounters that challenge even the most seasoned Doomslayers. The pacing is relentless, and the map keeps you engaged with a perfect balance of action and exploration. Each battle feels thoughtfully crafted, requiring strategic thinking and lightning-fast reflexes. The variety of enemies and the placement of weapons and power-ups keep you constantly adapting to the evolving threat, ensuring that boredom is never an option.

One of the standout features of "Bepis Bandits" is the ingenious level design. TheMisterCat has ingeniously crafted a nonlinear layout that encourages exploration without sacrificing the sense of direction. Secret areas are cleverly tucked away, rewarding the curious player with valuable resources and a satisfying sense of accomplishment. The map's size is substantial but never overwhelming, striking a delicate balance that ensures you're always discovering something new.

 

The custom soundtrack accompanying "Bepis Bandits" deserves its own applause. TheMisterCat has selected tracks that perfectly complement the frenetic pace of the gameplay, enhancing the overall experience and immersing you further into the adrenaline-pumping world of the WAD.

 

In conclusion, "Bepis Bandits" by TheMisterCat is a masterclass in Doom level design. With its stunning visuals, relentless gameplay, and innovative level layout, this WAD stands as a shining example of what the Doom modding community can achieve. If you're a fan of fast-paced, heart-pounding action, don't miss out on the exhilarating adventure that "Bepis Bandits" has to offer. TheMisterCat has not only created a fantastic WAD but has also cemented a place among the top-tier creators in the Doom modding scene.

 

[Lucius Wooding]

1 hour ago, hakros said:

But since I took over, we haven't had any more conflicts, and the only conflict has been your incessant complaining about the use of AI.

Seriously, don't you have anything better to do?

 

You clearly did, which is why you used an AI instead of doing original, meaningful work to back up your awards.

 

It's not that hard to understand; this is a Doom hobbyist forum and we're all passionate about playing, creating content, and writing about Doom. It's a bit off putting when you have a machine do something for you that you're supposed to enjoy doing yourself. Why should any of us care if you're not even speaking with your own voice? Personally I'd much rather see a writeup done by a person with their own opinion, whether it's broken English or Spanish or anything else. 

[Noiser]

1 hour ago, hakros said:

Regarding the articles, as I mentioned on DISCORD and told Endless, I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English. I'm sorry if this has bothered you so much that you couldn't even sleep thinking about it.

Why not using a regular translator then? It's not a perfect solution, but a lot better than generating new text with AI.
This doesn't make any sense.

Edited December 25, 2023 by Noiser

[JackDBS]

2 hours ago, hakros said:

Hello everyone, guys and girls, I'm glad that the topic has disturbed you enough to waste time commenting on it.

I ain't reading all that.

Good for you

or sorry that happened

Edited December 25, 2023 by JackDBS

[Herr Dethnout]

3 hours ago, hakros said:

Regarding the articles, as I mentioned on DISCORD and told Endless, I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English. I'm sorry if this has bothered you so much that you couldn't even sleep thinking about it.

O sea, ¿desperdiciaron una excelente oportunidad de tener una premiación completamente hispana, para traducirlo con una IA?

 

Nah no jodas, hubiera sido un buen punto de diferencia y algo más único si lo hubieses mantenido en español.

Edited December 25, 2023 by Herr Dethnout

[Scuba Steve]

Why not the 'Boom Awards?' Instead of focusing on Doom, which is pretty well covered, highlight the best in the 'Boomer Shooter' genre? You could carve out a small section for best in Doom/Duke/Quake/Wolf mods, and then write about all the other shooters coming out?

[RataUnderground]

No es sólo el uso de la IA en los textos lo que hace malos los "Doom awards", pero sin duda es la parte más cómicamente incompetente. 

[Dynamo]

 

4 hours ago, hakros said:

When we started the initiative, it wasn't intended to undermine anyone, neither the CACOWARDS nor you.

You of course have a right to defend your work, but it would help if you didn't start doing that with an obvious lie. After the Cacowards 2022 launched your server was awash with, on one hand, insulting rants regarding the lineup and winners, and on the other hand people angry that the Bloom mod did not win one, including not coincidentally members of the Bloom team itself. And you, Hakros, were not an impartial observer, you were there nodding and agreeing with the others. You yourself have created a ChatGPT copypasta about "taking out "Cacoward judges" to obtain an award. And before you say that it was just a harmless joke, it sure does not seem that way considering just how frequently and how insulting the entire server was (and to be honest, is even now) towards the Cacowards, long before anyone even knew who you were. There are many logs I could post but I'd rather not indulge in disaster tourism. Also, according to another post I saw that I don't care to go back and find, you also let Antonivs back into the server and into a secret channel. So much for cleaning house, you never disagreed with what was being said, you just had the hindsight to shut down those chats so the public couldn't see them anymore. Too little too late, though.

 

4 hours ago, hakros said:

I wrote them in Spanish but due to lack of time, as I had to handle almost everything, I used ChatGPT to rewrite them in English.

Another obvious lie as explained in the other posts, but it is worth mentioning that Spanish-speaking Doomers have created unique contests and features, and these are still celebrated in the wider, English-speaking community because the passion for them is recognized. You didn't want to bring a Spanish perspective, your group of friends was just angry that one particular mod (Bloom) didn't win, that the Cacoward judges and winners (allegedly) had different political leanings than you and, because of all this, the major driving motivator behind this whole thing was spite.

 

I agree that you should be allowed to do whatever you want in your free time, but if you really have to come here to justify your own actions, maybe do so by saying the truth instead of made up falsehoods.

 

4 hours ago, hakros said:

I DON'T ANSWER TO YOU AND CAN DO WHATEVER I DAMN WANT, SO PLEASE STOP TELLING US WHAT TO DO.

If you want to repeatedly slam your car into a tree, be my guest, but I don't think saying lie after lie - or even acting like this for that matter - is going to make many sympathetic to your perspective. All you had to do was be upfront about who you are, what you do, how you do it and why you do it and that would've won more hearts and minds than your obscurantism campaign ever could. But hey, the tree beckons I suppose...