New imp?

[leileilol]

http://www.doomworld.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28022

As you can see there, I modeled Firebrand, and textured him.

Suppose if I stripped his wings, colored him brown, and give him some spikes here and there, and maybe other design alterations, and then render him on sprites... could this probably be a new imp for us?

Personally, I don't like the hydralisk-ish imp. It just doesn't have a true monster feeling to it. You can't even give it impse.

If that idea was too doom-ish, then we should at least have something humanoid.

[SyntherAugustus]

Sounds like a good idea. I really dislike that 'cobra' imp.

[Julian]

gargoylol said:
Suppose if I stripped his wings, colored him brown, and give him some spikes here and there, and maybe other design alterations, and then render him on sprites... could this probably be a new imp for us?

I'm all for it... but rendering to sprites and getting a decent result is far from being that easy.

[boris]

As I see it this character is copyrighted by Capcom, or at least they are using it. So it might be a good idea to modify your model so that the similarities are not visible.

[leileilol]

Yeah yeah, but I've at least done the effort on the anatomy bit. He might still have cuffs, but he shouldn't look anything like Firebrand in the end.

[david_a]

Julian Hope said:

I'm all for it... but rendering to sprites and getting a decent result is far from being that easy.

Yeah, but if you have complete control of the model you could take steps to help this along the way, like running some smoothing algorithm to make it like 10,000 polygons and making a nice Doom palette skin for it... I don't think model conversions are necessarily bad, it's just that when people base them off stuff from Quake2 or HL they get the worst of both worlds - all the limitations of sprites, plus all the detail limitations needed in the original model to make it run well in the game.

Worst case scenario is that some one would have to manually recolor every frame pixelart style, but that's still easier than drawing an enemy from scratch since the perspective and proportions should be correct.

[leileilol]

Most of the problems I see in model-to-sprite conversions is the blurry-arse antialiasing and the shiny CGI speculars on models without skins. I'll try not to do any damage like that.

[Jon]

gargoylol said:

Suppose if I stripped his wings, colored him brown, and give him some spikes here and there, and maybe other design alterations, and then render him on sprites... could this probably be a new imp for us?

If that idea was too doom-ish, then we should at least have something humanoid.

Good idea - although there's no requirement for it to be brown or spiney. Indeed I think it would be better if it wasn't! I've long been playing with the idea of drawing an alien gray for the imp, for example. It'd be humanoid, could fit the frames and wouldn't resemble the original imp at all. (I'll never do it, of course.)

Why not knock-up a mock up shot and then you could get s'more feedback?

[leileilol]

I will soon.

The FreeDOOM imp won't be abandoned, it could become the Ophidian (doomers ball shit snakes creature) in my FreeHeretic project :P

In addition i'll try modeling some more low poly gargoyles and maybe they'll become good bases for other monsters that don't have graphics yet.

[Jon]

gargoylol said:

FreeHeretic project

FreeHeretic is a good idea; but quite a lot more ambitious than freedoom... you need a free engine too! :P

[leileilol]

How so? Is it the whole non-gpl license thing?

Well someone can start from scratch with the doom source and "emulate" heretic like what others are doing from Strife. Heh

[Jon]

gargoylol said:

How so? Is it the whole non-gpl license thing?

Well someone can start from scratch with the doom source and "emulate" heretic like what others are doing from Strife. Heh

Yes, and er, yes. :)

[leileilol]

Thank god I have an engine coder by my side (badsector, he wrote a couple utils that really REALLY helped my project, such as null wad making, he also wrote a SDL BadDOOM port)

[leileilol]

Well, I drew a quick "concept" on what he may end up looking like in FreeDOOM

http://www.planetgargoyle.com/fdimp2.JPG

I also drew one for the Hell Knight which also looks similar, but much stronger, more horns and no wings
http://www.planetgargoyle.com/fdhlk2.JPG

Don't know if the lokito thing will take hell knight's place though (A bit of variety won't hurt :P then again i could say that about my artwork :()

[insertwackynamehere]

Jon said:

FreeHeretic is a good idea; but quite a lot more ambitious than freedoom... you need a free engine too! :P

Couldnt he just use the ZDoom engine?

[leileilol]

Heretic's code has a different license.

[andrewj]

Jon said:

FreeHeretic is a good idea; but quite a lot more ambitious than freedoom... you need a free engine too! :P

I believe Legacy has heretic support, and is GPL (it's on SourceForge). EDGE (also GPL) may get heretic support eventually too, someone is working on a DDF conversion, and we would code any needed features in EDGE from scratch.

[sargebaldy]

Jon said:

FreeHeretic is a good idea; but quite a lot more ambitious than freedoom... you need a free engine too! :P

Well, considering Heretic only has like 20 wall textures it's a lot less work in some respects :P As for an engine, Eternity would be the best selection once it has Heretic support. And it is getting there, the EDF for all the monsters is done. And the Heretic-style HUD was added recently, although still isn't supported in Heretic mode. The biggest challenge left is EDF weapon support and definitions.

[DOOM Anomaly]

gargoylol said:

I also drew one for the Hell Knight which also looks similar, but much stronger, more horns and no wings
http://www.planetgargoyle.com/fdhlk2.JPG

That Knight looks awesome with all those horns. :D

[geekmarine]

Two things: Firstly, you think you could make it into a sprite yet, even just one frame, so we can really get a good idea of how it's going to look? Secondly, a critique of your gargoyle-thingy... I hope you change it muchly in turning it into a sprite, because as it is, it's just wayyyyyyyyyy too smooth. It's good, but just the skin looks absolutely fake. By the way, for color, I'd vote more of like a dark red, not quite brown but getting there, you know... Just my opinion here - and keep in mind that I suck, artistically speaking, so I really have no room to talk.

[leileilol]

It's not going from sketch to sprite - I will have it modeled first.

[Jon]

Ajapted said:

I believe Legacy has heretic support, and is GPL (it's on SourceForge). EDGE (also GPL) may get heretic support eventually too, someone is working on a DDF conversion, and we would code any needed features in EDGE from scratch.

Legacy does have heretic support, as a result of incorporating the heretic code, which is a violation of both the heretic source code licence and the GPL. The team are aware of this and I know that Hurdler has been working to get the heretic code GPLd (raven are interested but you have to convince activision). In the mean time, it's basically illegal. See http://bugs.debian.org/264816

[leileilol]

http://www.planetgargoyle.com/chpimp.wad

Only one problem - he is slightly tall.

[Jon]

gargoylol said:

http://www.planetgargoyle.com/chpimp.wad

I can't get this one to work.

[leileilol]

oh shi

FIXED

[Jon]

gargoylol said:

oh shi

FIXED

Brilliant, looks really good. so are you done?

[leileilol]

For the moment, yes, i'll be fixing his tallness problem and color contrast too

I do plan on doing that Hell knight soon now too

[leileilol]

OK "finalized", scale is correct and is now more visible.

Censored the crotch too incase it offends anyone (he has a pseudo-penis modeled)

http://www.planetgargoyle.com/chpimp.wad

[sargebaldy]

Oooh, I like this second version better, they're creepier when they're short. I much prefer these to the old snakey ones.

[Scuba Steve]

It needs alot of cleanup.