Kama Sutra Demopack [Released!]

[Kristian Ronge]

I found one (well, two, really, but they're the same) trick to make map 22 go slightly faster. If you use strafe-50 you can grab both the yellow and blue key easily right from the start. I think it's possible with strafe-40 as well, but it would need more luck.

[Grazza]

A couple more shortcuts (switch tricks) in map22:
1) You can press the red key switch before it has become visible (i.e. risen up from the floor).
2) The switch in the area behind the player start guarded by a bunch of revenants can be pressed from the side. Not exactly easy though, especially with a lot of mancubus crossfire around you, and it doesn't save all that much time anyway.

Together with the key grabs Kristian mentioned, these two tricks (especially the first) mean that it's possible to skip several areas, but certainly aren't enough to make it a quick or easy run. As far as I can see, you need all three keys.

I noticed that it is possible to turn yourself into a zombie (the voodoo doll is accessible), but I don't see any way to make use of this.

[_MethoD_]

I did ks06 in time 4:55...My aim in demo is crap but time under 5 minutes is done.Now is your round mr.Gusta

I'll send it to Gusta..

[Gusta]

Method: Good time bud! Very nice to see you back in the game! (curaku zasranej:)
In map22 I think the keygrabs are posible with simple running forward too. Even with these shortcuts I can't imagine the good time this map can be done?

[_MethoD_]

I've tried it but revenants,archie and mancubus near the yellow doors got me :(
Gusta:Já myslim že jsme to nakonec dali dál a rovnì to nejde..Ale co tak jim to neøikej at se snažej :))

[Kristian Ronge]

Gusta said:
In map22 I think the keygrabs are posible with simple running forward too. Even with these shortcuts I can't imagine the good time this map can be done?

Tried the keygrabs with normal strafe-40; they worked, but required more attempts on average. So to get good times, I'd suggest strafe-50 (you almost always get the keys on the first try then!).

About ks22 in general: The best time I have is > 4 minutes. You just have to stand still and kill monsters sometimes (max style, ugh!). I'm guessing *at least* 2:30 could be done. I've done < 1:00 in nomo.

[Anima Zero]

Kristian Ronge said:

About ks22 in general: The best time I have is > 4 minutes. You just have to stand still and kill monsters sometimes (max style, ugh!). I'm guessing *at least* 2:30 could be done. I've done < 1:00 in nomo.

Yeah, so true. I just recorded a 4:30 UV-Speed for map22 a few minutes ago. Yes, I got the YSK and BSK early. Yes, I did have to spend time killing some monsters. Oh, and yes, the time probably sucks ^_^. I'll send it to Ops tomorrow if anyone is interested. Just let me know.

[Opulent]

Anima Zero said:

I'll send it to Ops tomorrow if anyone is interested. Just let me know.

Opulent raises his hand... heck yeah, we're interested. :)

[Searcher]

I will second that heck yeah! ;)

[Gusta]

I still have no reply from dobber - ksutra-n maintainer, so I'll send all remaining not yet published demos to Opulent if he does agree.
I just thought about map24 speed. That one will be also crazy, even if somebody would survive a route with AVjump for blue key, the time will be also aroud 4 mins because the rest of the route is similar to max run.

[Anima Zero]

Ok then, I've sent the map22 UV-Speed to Ops now. Hope it gets improved soon :).

[_MethoD_]

ks22-824 maxstyle done...I am sure time under 8 minutes is possible coz monsters which teleporting in front of yellow key are teleported too late..

Sent to Gusta

[Grazza]

I'm a bit embarrassed about this, as it involved no actual skill (unlike Angus's excellent demos on this map) ...

Map25 (Cow Face) UV Speed/Pacifist in 0:01.

[entryway]

Grazza said:

Map25 (Cow Face) UV Speed/Pacifist in 0:01.

:)))

[Angus Thermopyle]

:(((

I've worked the last two days on improving my Map2 speedrun, got a crappy 0:34, wanted at least 0:32. Well, I can stop this now.

Yeah, Grazza, I thought about this kind of exit, but I never tried it seriously. And I won't try 0:00. Cool demo, nevertheless.

[Grazza]

Sorry. :(

Maybe the pack will/should include some alternative-route demos (as easter eggs or whatever), so that good/interesting demos aren't lost just because they don't happen to feature the quickest route.

At least no one can take NM100S away from you with this route (I'm assuming kn25-000 is feasible, but don't have the patience right now to try it).

As for ks25-000, the cybers seem quite slow to fire on UV, though I don't doubt that it can happen. Possibly it can be done just with running though - I'm not sure how much speed you can achieve within that little square, or how much is needed.

[Kristian Ronge]

kn25-000.zip :-)))

Map 25 NM speed, 0:00. Used doom2.exe with quick start. Very easy, 5 tries. I'll try for 0:00 in UV as well.

Grazza said:
As for ks25-000, the cybers seem quite slow to fire on UV, though I don't doubt that it can happen. Possibly it can be done just with running though - I'm not sure how much speed you can achieve within that little square, or how much is needed.

It could be done with running only, I think. As I said, I'll try it.

EDIT: It's not a NM100S though. You don't teleport to that secret sector...

[Opulent]

Anima: http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks22-430.zip

[Anima Zero]

Decided to improve one of my maxdemos today. Target: Map 13. Improved the UV-Max time on it to 7:05, a 1:03 improvement over my previous max run on this level. Still some minor mistakes in the demo, but nothing time consuming. Sub 7 should be possible on this map.

Sending the demo to Ops now.

[Opulent]

Anima: http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks13-705.zip

[Gusta]

Eh.. is that map25 exit as easy as you write guys? I was never seriously sure if this is possible because I was never able to do it. I just theoretically supposed that it is.
Grazza: To let the pack include some alternative-route runs on a few maps is a good idea. At least Angus' nice run on map25 deserves to be there. Maybe the other ones which will be suggested. (I would suggest Anima's map23 long run too)

[Kristian Ronge]

Gusta said:
Eh.. is that map25 exit as easy as you write guys?

In NM it is extremely easy, as the right Cyber will always fire at you immediately. I first tried it just standing still, but as that didn't work, I figured you had to move a bit before you're hit. I then got it in a handful attempts. So yes, it's easy. In UV, though, I only got one exit (and in 0:02). BTW, I no longer think the trick's possible without a Cyber rocket, so getting 0:00 in UV will be very hard.

Maybe the other ones which will be suggested.

I would also suggest Grazza's map 3 pacifist run (which is excellent).

[Kristian Ronge]

Sorry for the double posting, I thought this deserves a new post? Anyway, just another speedrun ->

Map 15 UV speed (secret exit) in 0:59.

This one has a funny anecdote. I recorded it THREE WEEKS ago, because I wanted to complement Anima's "normal exit" speedrun. (Blame ksutra-n! It listed his demo incorrectly! That's where I was looking for undone speedruns...)

When I got this run, I thought I must've missed some trick (since Anima got to the normal exit in just 1:01)... That is, until I saw his demo, which of course was made for the secret exit. Ugh... :-/

Well, then I felt very stupid, and I never got around to improving this, so ... is someone else up for it?

[Anima Zero]

Kristian Ronge said:

Sorry for the double posting, I thought this deserves a new post? Anyway, just another speedrun ->

Map 15 UV speed (secret exit) in 0:59.

This one has a funny anecdote. I recorded it THREE WEEKS ago, because I wanted to complement Anima's "normal exit" speedrun. (Blame ksutra-n! It listed his demo incorrectly! That's where I was looking for undone speedruns...)

When I got this run, I thought I must've missed some trick (since Anima got to the normal exit in just 1:01)... That is, until I saw his demo, which of course was made for the secret exit. Ugh... :-/

Well, then I felt very stupid, and I never got around to improving this, so ... is someone else up for it?

Heh, nice job!

Oh, and you just had to add that little comment near the end about how I should try to take the crown back :)?

Well ok, if you insist :). Took about 20 or so minutes, but I improved map15 UV-Speed to 0:56, 3 seconds faster. Obviously I took the secret exit as I did before.

I do go down to 1% health during a part of the run, for those who like low-health situations :P.

Still room for improvement here as I got caught on a couple monsters in the RSK room. Perhaps a 0:53 or lower is possible on this map?

Sending the demo to Ops now.

[Grazza]

Gusta said:

Eh.. is that map25 exit as easy as you write guys? I was never seriously sure if this is possible because I was never able to do it. I just theoretically supposed that it is.

On UV, I found it difficult at first, but once I had got one exit, I started getting them quite frequently. I think that for both UV and NM, it is easier if you use Doom2.exe (my initial half-hour recording session on UV with prboom yielded just the one exit), as you can get a quicker start, and so have more time to manoeuvre. Firing a weapon as soon as possible also seems to improve your chances (I don't know exactly why, since the cybers can already see you - it must just muck about with the RNG). BTW, my best UV times were 0:01.4x, and I don't recall the cybers ever firing quickly enough to make a 0:00 feasible (though of course I didn't have the timer showing when recording, only during trial runs).

To let the pack include some alternative-route runs on a few maps is a good idea. At least Angus' nice run on map25 deserves to be there. Maybe the other ones which will be suggested. (I would suggest Anima's map23 long run too)

Angus's kn25-045 is still a valid NM100S record, so that should stay in any case. I guess my map03 Pacifist can come too (as Kristian suggests), though it should really be 0:06 to be up to scratch quality-wise. Whichever the fastest ks16 Speed is using the alternate route (I think you mentioned a 0:42 by Radeg) is an obvious candidate. And maybe some of Anima's other UV Speeds "done the hard way". Personally, I'd love to see a speedrun on map09 without the trick.

Since I don't have much time to play right now, I might as well upload my Map32 UV Pacifist in 0:45.

[Anima Zero]

Grazza said:

Personally, I'd love to see a speedrun on map09 without the trick.

Alrighty then, took another half hour or so recording session and got a map09 UV-Speed in 0:58 without the trick and getting both keys(BK and YK). Not hard at all. Could go a couple seconds lower or more since I had a slip-up in the YK room.

Will send to Ops now.

EDIT: Heh, just was bored a little while ago, so I decided to improve my map09 UV-Speed w/out the wallrun trick. Knocked off 3 seconds from my previous time, making the time 0:55. Still room for improvement as I got hung up on a couple monsters. A :53 or lower should be possible on the normal route, but I'll just leave at this for now. Zipfile also includes one WTF incident which should give off some laughs. Sending the demos to Ops now.

[Opulent]

Anima:
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks09-055.zip -- inculdes bug demo with lift Led-style. ;)
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks09-058.zip -- old speed demo
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks15s056.zip -- small improvement on Kristian's demo.

Radek/Method/Gusta:
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/Ks07-127radeg.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/Ks07-210radeg.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/KS16-042radeg.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/Ks16-039gusta.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/Ks14-018gusta.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/Ks17-043method.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks22-824method.zip
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks06-455method.zip

sorry, I'm too lazy to 'url' these links.

ps. been working on a DSDA update... slowly but surely.

[Kristian Ronge]

Anima Zero said:
Oh, and you just had to add that little comment near the end about how I should try to take the crown back :)?

That was just for motivation! :-)

Well ok, if you insist :). Took about 20 or so minutes, but I improved map15 UV-Speed to 0:56, 3 seconds faster.

Well done! Now it's a respectable time, I think.

EDIT: Doug ... nice to hear about an update! B-)

[Anima Zero]

Ok, after about a couple hours worth of attempts, I've come up with a new UV-Speed for map22. Time for it is 3:19, 1 min and 11 secs faster than the last run. Does look a little ugly in spots (getting caught up on monsters, couple missed SSG shots, and of course, the keygrabs. I'm surprised I got both keys in only a few attempts each).

I don't think I'm gonna break 3 min unless some miracle occurs where the monsters all cooperate with me. A low 3:1x probably is a better goal for this level IMO. Prove me wrong if you'd like :).

Sending the demo to Ops now.

[Opulent]

Anima: http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/ks22-319.zip