1994 tune-up challenge (*updated /idgames link*)

[Malinku]

I'll get a new version of my map done sometime soon. Now that I have more time for mapping.

[CodenniumRed]

TAREDONE.zip - 0.09MB

This is it! I finished this sucker and it's playable from start to finish! Compare the old and new ones! And forget 'CodenniumRed' - my new screenname is ShadesMaster.

And, @ Traversed - yes, please do put the switch on the wall, not the crate - you can see it through the gap, AND it doesn't look unrealistically hideous as it does on the crate, either.

[Snarboo]

Updated the first post with your submission, Codennium. I'm using your current name for now to avoid confusion.

[traversd]

CodenniumRed said:

TAREDONE.zip - 0.09MB

This is it! I finished this sucker and it's playable from start to finish! Compare the old and new ones! And forget 'CodenniumRed' - my new screenname is ShadesMaster.

And, @ Traversed - yes, please do put the switch on the wall, not the crate - you can see it through the gap, AND it doesn't look unrealistically hideous as it does on the crate, either.

I haven't played it in full yet CR but one quick thing to change I think is the skin cut-outs in the ceiling that are present in the hallway that surrounds the red-key. I think you need to draw more attention to them. Perhaps make them light level 255 (or close to it) using a ceiling light transfer?

the new additions look great.

I think you are referring to tatsurd-cacocaco's outland.wad tune-up re:the switch. TC made the change for the switch to the wall and it looks good. easier to get the players attention and make them investigate the crates.

cheers,

Travers

[traversd]

BCS01 by Masayan

Short and sweet. Seems we certainly have a nice number of small maps to go at the beginning of this map pack.

This map needs a little tinkering I think. I played on HMP. I'm not a great player so I found the start of the map hard as you don't get anything other than a chainsaw until after you get past the red-key door (there is one hidden in a secret earlier though) and even then you've just had to get past 4 shotgun guys *L*

I modified my copy to include a small alcove in the hallway leading to the red-key door that held a shotgun and 8 shells. The start is still hectic but the added fire power allows you to fend off the revenant and demons.

Linedef 665 needs type 123 and tag 11.

Linedefs 995, 996, 997 and 1007 need the mid texture changed (I think) from the 'midbrn1' to either 'midbars1', 'midgrate' or 'midspace'. The reason for this is that at a distance that area disolves into a solid brown colour due to the small gap between the bars.

the 'redwall' used on the sides of secotr 93 didn't really fit given the landing teleport used the more common metal texture. perhaps make the destination pad use redwall as well? or vice versa.

cheers,
Travers

[traversd]

ttadom11 by CodenniumRed

Nice effort CR. I made a comment earlier about the skin cut-outs in the red key area perhaps being lit up on the ceiling. Maybe even do this after the red key is collected?

The doorway to the final room needs to be widened as it makes it easy to get out and snipe the PE's and LS instead of fight in the room. Perhaps lock the player in upon activating the PE's and have part of the walls behind the PE's fall away as well to give the player some columns/cover to work with?

Also I think the map will finish better without the Hell knight in the exit room - maybe leave it there on multiplayer?

Cheers,
Travers

[printz]

[maggot202]

traversd said:

ttadom11 by CodenniumRed

Nice effort CR. I made a comment earlier about the skin cut-outs in the red key area perhaps being lit up on the ceiling. Maybe even do this after the red key is collected?

The doorway to the final room needs to be widened as it makes it easy to get out and snipe the PE's and LS instead of fight in the room. Perhaps lock the player in upon activating the PE's and have part of the walls behind the PE's fall away as well to give the player some columns/cover to work with?

Also I think the map will finish better without the Hell knight in the exit room - maybe leave it there on multiplayer?

Cheers,
Travers

I also thought that the radiation suit before the nukage could be a little more obvious, as i completely missed it on the first run, and given the layout of the map, it's almost a must to survive.

[Walter confetti]

printz said:

A lot of these are no more.

???

And, about pure evil, i erased monsters and outdoor, and i just adding few more details on the map, as td says...

whatever, is cool watching than two megawads i made something are "finished" in the same time (this whit 32 levels, and pcorf got 4 maps to be end!)

[traversd]

maggot202 said:

I also thought that the radiation suit before the nukage could be a little more obvious, as i completely missed it on the first run, and given the layout of the map, it's almost a must to survive.

Thats true. Perhaps move it into the secret room adjacent the first switch and place a tall impassible window in at the bottom of the stairs for the player to see it?

the only other thing I would suggest is to mirror the room with the cacodemon and hwg and then also duplicate the hall leding into it and the stairs behind. The map stays linear but it present the player with some additional halls to run down ;)

btw what is sector type 71? I use Slade 2 for editing and it doesn't recognise it (it misses a few boom types etc).

-Travers

[ArmouredBlood]

Printz meant 4,5,13,18,22, and 25's links don't work anymore. Possibly snarboo didn't update them, though I think the mediafire links died simply because the accounts weren't active, and I think speedyshare does basically the same thing.

[traversd]

walter confalonieri said:

???

And, about pure evil, i erased monsters and outdoor, and i just adding few more details on the map, as td says...

Cool stuff Walter. Will be interesting to see how it plays out. I imagine some areas will need to be altered a bit to suit the incoming hordes in places etc. I'm keen to see how this goes :)


I think we are looking pretty good at present. We just need to re-ignite the enthusiasm for the project for a little bit now to test and finish up some of the maps. I've sent MajorRawne a PM to if they will look to complete Woodhal2. If notI can work on it in about 3 weeks. I'm renovating our kitchen. Once that's done I'm sure to have some currency with the wife to be able to polish/fix-up any maps currently submitted ;)

Below is where I think most maps are at:

(EDIT: put them in groups of status for easier reading, )

Maps completed (may need small fixes/alterarions for map order)
# Snarboo, Helipad
# ArmouredBlood, Elements
# 40oz, Tunnels
# Krispavera, The Fortified Castle
# maggot202, Melange
# tatsurd-cacocaco, Castle to Hell
# printz, A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood?
# traversd, WILLE1M1.WAD
# 40oz, Ultima 1
# walter confalonieri, Nefarious Chateau
# traversd, ORIGWAD.WAD
# walter confalonieri, Pie.wad
# 'rf, wetwrkd2.wad
# traversd, TECHBASE.WAD
# maggot202, Command Control
# CodenniumRed, TTADOM11.WAD
# traversd, Execute.wad
# tatsurd-cacocaco, OUTLAND.WAD
# masayan, Brian and Craig Sparks Map 1
# traversd, viper.wad

Maps that need more work/playtesting.
# Mr. Freeze, Hades House of Horrors - Part One
# masayan, Ice Nightmare 2
# ArmouredBlood, Fort Borg - AB fixed something for me so I now have to re-test but it's very close to complete.
# Mr. Freeze and Krispavera, SWEET.WAD
# UOD, SUBWAY.WAD
# lareman, Hades House of Horrors - Part Two
# Dragonsbrethren, Undersea
# GreyGhost, Xenomorph 'The Complex' - unfinished I believe
# MajorRawne, WOODHAL2.WAD - I playtested what looks to be an unfinished version but I noticed there is a link (that does not work) to a newer version.
# Malinku, Vampire5, I'm yet to playtest
# walter confalonieri, Pure Evil - Unsure, I'm yet to playtest

[pavera]

You can probably consider SWEET.wad dead and gone cause I have no idea what happened to that.

[Snarboo]

We're missing maps? Thankfully I downloaded every map that was finished and I even kept all the versions I was given, so I can upload what I have somewhere.

Edit:
Alright, here is a zip file with everything I had gathered for this project.

1994 tune-up challenge resource

[Insane_Gazebo]

Assuming these maps are going to be organised into one wad, what's going to be done in regards to the order of the maps? Left as is, or re-arranged roughly on difficulty? (Sorry if this has been asked before.)

[Walter confetti]

Snarboo said:

We're missing maps? Thankfully I downloaded every map that was finished and I even kept all the versions I was given, so I can upload what I have somewhere.

Edit:
Alright, here is a zip file with everything I had gathered for this project.

1994 tune-up challenge resource

Thanks a lot! Downloaded right now...

EDIT: Played the malinku's remake of vampir51, nice map, maybe it could be more stuff, but is a good remake. However misses some lower-unpegged and upper-unpegged textures, and i found a missing linedef on the tech labyrinth... and maybe some textures needs better re-working (like the exit room). And what do you think aabout joining in this map also the e1m9 from original map? I like the concept of that map!

[Snarboo]

Insane_Gazebo said:

Assuming these maps are going to be organised into one wad, what's going to be done in regards to the order of the maps? Left as is, or re-arranged roughly on difficulty? (Sorry if this has been asked before.)

Most likely arranged by difficulty. That way the maps flow into each other.

[40oz]

Yeah it's kinda a combination of everything. I pay attention to all the aesthetics of the maps as variables to determine their position in the list. I still have to play a few of them. Some of them were extremely long and difficult to play so I have to give them another shot.

A lot of factors come into play as far as the maps position. In order of priority:

Difficulty (easy maps first, hard maps later)
Length (short maps first, long maps later)
Weapons acquired (bullets and shells first, rockets and cells later)
Monsters encountered (zombiemen and pinkies first, archviles and mancubi later)
Theme (techbases first, hell later)
Appearance (Prettier maps first, less tuned maps later)

[printz]

40oz said:

Appearance (Prettier maps first, less tuned maps later)

What about leaving the less pretty maps in the middle? It would be a bit anticlimactic and feel like a rushed commercial game (see Doom 2) if the less quality maps cropped at the end of the megawad.

[traversd]

also some maps were made to the traditional slots so they might need fixing up to suit difficulty.

techbase has a secret exit for map31 so i think this means it should sit in map15? i cant remember the map number needed.

execute is made with map07 specials.

Walter's pureevil is being altered to suit map30.

were any other maps made with a specific slot in mind?

travers

[Walter confetti]

great news! map is almost finished, just need to change some spawn camp positions, and fixing more ammo\health stuff, but the level is here.

[Guest]

This project has looked consistently good and has had an impressive array of screenies from many different maps.

Good work Snarboo and mappers for keeping this project afloat for this long.

Looking forward to this.

[DeathevokatioN]

printz said:

What about leaving the less pretty maps in the middle? It would be a bit anticlimactic and feel like a rushed commercial game (see Doom 2) if the less quality maps cropped at the end of the megawad.

Map28 and Map27 are two of the prettiest doom levels I ever played. So I don't know where your gettin that DooM 2 reference from.

That said, after playing Requiem I have to agree that the ugly levels (if any) get put in the middle. The player will lose motivation to keep pushing through to the end if he knows that all he has left are a bunch of ugly levels. So...

[traversd]

Mixed bag of map reports.


ABDITN by Printz
Played a bit of Printz ABDITN. faaark. It's most certainly a high 20's map ;)

I'm certainly not an awesome player and on HMP had my ass handed to me so many times at the start. I'd suggest moving the shotgun back to the start for the lower skill levels ( Please ;) there's all that ammo there and no gun *L*) And still fell short after stumbling upon the red key and activating the 2nd wave *L*

Printz has built into the map quite a few geometry alterations (the cracks through the building a great mate). I'd say with the "cracks" (lets call it stage2 of your level warping ;) ) you've made the red key almost superfluous. Perhaps simply open the red key doors at the same time as the cracks appearing and removing the local linedef types for the doors as well?

With 'stage1' when the river appears I noticed it's lighting is much lower than the adjacent sectors. Is that by design? Just looks a bit odd with the mancs hopping in and out of the river changing brightness so much.

In all this there are some areas that could possibly get some more tune-up love. At the end of the day this project is more about fun and having a crack but some rooms still have some lengthy linedef's that you might be able to break up a little (linedefs 376 & 637 for ex.)

The various linedef's that teleport monsters out of an immediate fight and into the street area causes one huge clusterf**k at the end *L* Perhaps let a few of them stay and need to be dealt with immediately?

Undersea by Dragonsbrethren
Sector 108 needs to have it's raise action moved to a walk over linedef or the walkover linedefs on it's edges need to move the the next sector out as the player can activate linedef 505 and walk over it to exit sector 108 skipping the main trap of the room.

Possibly use a light transfer to all the areas with FWATER on the ceiling to make it brighter than below? Not sure how it'll look but I recall that generally the sea above is always brighter than below.

Also the lift room could do with some more tuning I think. Maybe put some computer equip in sector 15?

The two secrets in sectors 129 & 130 are pretty obvious. Seemed a bit of a gimme to have them flagged as secrets.

The sound tunnels linked to sector 289 don't have to be joined that way. You can link them to a portion of sector 289 that is separate from the map and still have the sound travel through. Just makes it easier to work the room, and keep the sound tunnels separate.

BTW I know they were in the original but the 2 blue torches still feel out of place. maybe replace with tech lights or light columns? maybe remove and build into the walls around the door way soem bluelite detail?


That's all for now. I need to re-re-play woodhal2 by majorrawne. The mancs are owning me at the start *L*.

Snarboo what shall we do with any maps that need alteration but the submitter is no longer present?

-travers

[printz]

traversd said:

ABDITN by Printz
Played a bit of Printz ABDITN. faaark. It's most certainly a high 20's map ;)

Heh, thanks. But I seriously need to learn how to playtest the maps. While they're playable but tricky by me, others will find them quite unfair. As for the episode number and sky anomaly: in the original's text file, it says explicitly that you see the ep3 sky beyond the wall crack at the start. I think the above sky has to be different.

This map has been tagged MAP17 for vestigial reasons: so it has the Doom 2 city sky (no more with fdgfxd2) and for the original music (eventually replaced with Metallica's "Eye of the beholder" MIDI -- tell me if I have to replace this with something legit).

I'm certainly not an awesome player and on HMP had my ass handed to me so many times at the start. I'd suggest moving the shotgun back to the start for the lower skill levels ( Please ;) there's all that ammo there and no gun *L*)

Will likely do, considering all the pain to shoot that sergeant to retrieve his shotgun (or going in the open to take that shotgun on the ground, DON'T REMEMBER).

And still fell short after stumbling upon the red key and activating the 2nd wave *L*

You mean ammo or something else? If it's ammo, well do mind that there's 600 energy cells before getting out, just like in GEM's original.

Printz has built into the map quite a few geometry alterations (the cracks through the building a great mate). I'd say with the "cracks" (lets call it stage2 of your level warping ;) ) you've made the red key almost superfluous. Perhaps simply open the red key doors at the same time as the cracks appearing and removing the local linedef types for the doors as well?

If this ended up looking ugly, I might do, though the original did use that red keycard specifically for those two secret doors. Those timber cracks were added to aid the player the way.

With 'stage1' when the river appears I noticed it's lighting is much lower than the adjacent sectors. Is that by design? Just looks a bit odd with the mancs hopping in and out of the river changing brightness so much.

I don't remember offhand how is the river sector lit before it sinks. But it's dark afterwards because I wanted to give it a contrast and unnatural effect. Like a warning things are going to get more fucked up.

In all this there are some areas that could possibly get some more tune-up love. At the end of the day this project is more about fun and having a crack but some rooms still have some lengthy linedef's that you might be able to break up a little (linedefs 376 & 637 for ex.)

I understand, though I have to figure out how to detail some areas that I think should look unattractive. I find that facade detail always makes things look pretty instead of depressing.

The various linedef's that teleport monsters out of an immediate fight and into the street area causes one huge clusterf**k at the end *L* Perhaps let a few of them stay and need to be dealt with immediately?

That's more of a technical difficulty. You mean the "zoo" (the area with the second energy cell batch)? There are some monsters teleporting out of that area into the main room (you just never see them there), and I can't just remove the linedef triggers like that. I'm not decided whether to really remove them: I like how all those barons and cacos taunt you a little, then disappear into the main street.

[printz]

Ok, here's version 5, with the shotgun provided for easy/medium skill right at startup, and linedef 376 detailed a little bit.

Map17.

[Snarboo]

traversd said:

Snarboo what shall we do with any maps that need alteration but the submitter is no longer present?

We have two choices: leave the map as is with a disclaimer that the original author is no longer active or have someone fix the map and mark the map as having two authors.

Edit:
First post has been updated with your map, printz.

[traversd]

@printz (ABDITN) - No probs mate. I meant high-20's re:the maps difficulty.

shotgun is damn handy at the start now. well for those of my low skill set. similar to the shotgun move would the below be ok as well?

move green armor (thing id:266) to sector 433, and then move the medikit to just next to the dead player (thing id:323). Where it is now it's difficult to see and given the next armor is a blue armor in the nukeage halls.

Also some other ideas I had whilst playing the map again.

1. Set light level to 192 or higher for sector 376 (exit sign).

2. split sector 377 and raise the back part 64 units and tag it 5 so that it lowers like the exit sector. You can also texture the visible linedef with plat1 so it mimics the exit door opening.

3. linedef 616 needs bigbrik2.

4. the crates in sector 375 need texture alignment. Sorry i missed these the first time through because I activated the switch to lower them before I went into the room *L*

5. In the nukeage area and the room with the switch to open the exit room there are a few medikits that could be positioned just off the path of the player. I found esp. in the nukeage area that a hwg would nick me and i would not be able to then save the medikit for later as i had to walk over it.

6. speaking of the room with the switch that opens the exit room maybe move linedef 1892 up closer to linedef 2044 so there is more of a chance that one of the cyb's or archvile will stay in the room longer to attack the player?

cheers :)
Travers

[traversd]

Ice Nightmare 2 by Masayan

Overall the map is very clean and complete. Masayan has amped up the monster volume but strangely reduced the weapon count. In fact you don't get a weapon other than the BFG until after the first few rooms, and even then its a RL *L* clever setup but it was beyond my skill I'm afraid. I might have had more luck if there were more cells or a shotgun etc in the early parts of the map. Infighting only got me so far and then it got difficult to avoid the horde whilst getting them to infight.

There are two pits that cannot be escaped from. Sectors 171 and 202. Maybe some teleports out of them?

Alot of the switches in the map are set too high so when the player gets up to them you cannot see the switch itself in some cases.

The arrow (sector 52) is something that could go either way. straighten it up to stand out a touch more as an arrow - it's not too bad as it is but I missed it ;) I think the issue is more that there is no real indicator that the back linedef triggers the soulsphere cage. Perhaps remove sector 52 and place a single linedef from vertex 555 to either 557 or 558 as the plat activator and signify it's presence with a torch at each end of the linedef?

Also I'd recommend raising the ceiling of sectors 94 and 105 to 256 high so it breaks from the exterior walls and also avoids the potential for LS and caco's to disappear in the sky.

All in all a nice tune-up and will probably play easier for us avg doomers when we enter the map in sequence (ie: we start pre-armed). But I'd still suggest increasing either the weapon count early on or ammo as you really need each BFG shot to count.

cheers,
Travers

[traversd]

SWEET.WAD by Mr. Freeze and Krispavera

This is a tune-up of SWEET.WAD (version1) --> http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=184

There is a version2.1 on idgames that is about 4 times as big.

The map is clean and simple with detail bits in each room.

The HWGs at the start will catch most players on the first go I would say. sneaky sneaky ;)

Things I spotted:

-linedef 403 needs to be bronze3.
-linedefs 190 and 204 need a metalX texture I think.
-sectors 35, 151 and 147 don't need to be tagged as secrets.
-sectors 29, 32, 129, 130, 131 and 132 don't need to the sector tag 6.
-line 57 needs to be type '195-SR teleport' for multiplayer
-need multiplayer starts.
-the slime cut outs in sector 9 have type 8 'pulse'. tbh honest I think it looks nicer with no pulse just a high light value and then use a light transfer to darken the ceiling.
-the teleport in the same room maybe change the brown144 to brownhug for consistency and would I offend by suggesting the teleport area is re-done up. It may just need some bordering etc but to me it sorta feels out of place in the room (not in a hellish kind of way, just out of place texture and design-wise).
-maybe also put a teleport pad in sector 29 to allow players to return to the main map to pick items/secrets etc.

I'm not sure how many of the original contributors are around or have time/desire to work on the submitted maps so Mr Freeze&Krispavera let me know if your happy for someone else to make alterations to the map you both submitted.

cheers,
travers