Doom 4 should have...

[DASI-I]

What I loved about Doom is not the imp nor the zombies that was seen so often in doom1, 2 & 3 but rather the more unique ones, especially the big monsters. Doom 3 was supposed to be a remake/reimagining of doom 1, I was excited to not only see a Mastermind(my favorite monster) with doom3 graphics but also excited to see Hell for like the last 1/3 of the game, Naturally I was disappointed to discover that 85% of the game took place in labs and corridors that pretty much all looked the same, 5% in caverns, 5% in Hell and 5% in ancient ruins with the game ending with the CyberDemon only.

I hope Doom 4 goes back to the formula seen in the first 2 doom games: all the levels are unique and more spacious with a greater variety of monsters, you know, more insanely menacing ones, with more run'n gun than a Call of Duty style gameplay.

Thats just my opinion, any other ideas?

[Xeros612]

Doom 3 was never a remake, it was a re-imagining. I rather liked the System Shock-style play(story told mostly through audiologs and whatnot, how good the levels looked when considering the lighting and shadow work, even on the gimped xbox port that should've waited a year or two and ported to stronger consoles) and attempt at a more horror and less AAAARGH RIP AND TEAR BLOW EVERYTHING UP gameplay(that I've already got the classic Doom and Serious Sam games for), even if the horror was more "oh hi doggie imp" than "OHSHITWHATWASTHAT", and I kind of hope Doom 4 continues that, only doing it better.

[40oz]

I agree with the hell part but not so much the 'needs bigger monsters' part.

I suppose that the new lighting technology seen in Doom 3 was able to be used to its fullest advantage in the labs than in an eerie unpredictable place like hell which probably explains that. But yeah, when I think of Doom 1 and 2 I think of an entire journey through different planets and unrealities, while Doom 3, like my experience with Half-Life 1 and Stronghold, felt very contained in an elaborate layout of rooms and corridors that were different but thematically felt exactly the same.

I feel like I could google any screenshot of Doom 3 and be like "oh i remember that part" even though I might not have even seen it. The only version I played was the Xbox version and from what I've read, a lot of the game was omitted in that version.

About the bigger monsters, I do think it's cool to be fighting things that make you feel small and insignificant. I remember reading about some kinda medieval game that looked really cool because it revolved around being the one brave hero fighting a series of obnoxiously huge bosses that each have a specific weak point. It looked like a pretty sweet game, I don't remember the title of it or if it even became really popular. It looked pretty awesome in a disastrous cinematic type way though.

However, I remember reading a post that kinda won me over by the differences between Quake and Doom, and that quake, from the beginning introduces you to big bad monsters and gives you all the big weapons right at the start of the game to fight them with. I actually liked that part of the game, but then they went on to talk about Doom's inclusion of many relatively weak monsters to make the game allow for more progression, instead of consistently bigass monsters. And quite honestly, I totally prefer an insurmountable number of dumb weak monsters than a group of horrendously terrifying ones.

Doom 3 however kinda treated every monster like it was a horrifying abomination and used low lighting to make them more frightening, but suspense aside, I don't recall ever fighting more than two or three monsters at a time.

[Xeros612]

Xbox port did cut a lot out. Some I hear was due to hardware limitations, some to lack of disk space. If they had omitted the useless multiplayer nobody played and -not- had separate maps made for the co-op mode, they probably could have kept most of those spots in.

[printz]

What I love about Doom 3 is the xenoarchaeological theme. Simply put, gigantic alien underground demon-filled ancient caves are always interesting. It's also cool they have a backstory which can be expanded indefinitely. It's also a theme inexistent in Doom 2 (no lore to back it).

Gigantic monsters are good actually. If they're large enough, they start to overpower you in terms other than hit points or strength. For example, their walking speed becomes faster than your running. They can just squash you.

What I'd want for Doom 4 would be a faster marine. Not as fast as in Doom 1, just as fast as in Quake 1. With the current Doom 3 speed, most fights are "please leave me alone die already OUCH" rather than even and there's too much try-and-reload gameplay. Dumb.

[Maes]

DASI-I said:

I was excited to not only see a Mastermind with doom3 graphics...

Where? The only thing vaguely resembling a spider mastermind was Sarge (in his monstruous form), and there were several spider-like enemies too like the Vagary and the Trites, but nothing quite like Doom's Spider Mastermind. Maybe you mean the one in the Asmodeus mod?

[Foodles]

I think he means that the prospect of a spider master mind in Doom 3's graphics excited him, i.e. he assumed before its release that there would be a spider mastermind, and was looking forward to seeing it.

[printz]

Maes said:

Where? The only thing vaguely resembling a spider mastermind was Sarge (in his monstruous form), and there were several spider-like enemies too like the Vagary and the Trites, but nothing quite like Doom's Spider Mastermind. Maybe you mean the one in the Asmodeus mod?

There was a famous spider mastermind (actually Arachnotron, but who gives a shit) concept art hyping it.

Second, I was becoming happier to see more Doom 4 threads in Doom General than Doom 3 General after awhile, hoping that Doom 4 will be indeed more like Doom 2 than 3...

[DASI-I]

Ok, maybe I dont have very good grammer, I meant: that I was "expecting" a mastermind but was disapointed to discover that the game ended with a cyberdemon only. and when I mean menacing, horrorfying monsters I don't actually mean they all have to be huge!
Just...Scarier and harder to beat.

[Edward850]

Xeros612 said:

Xbox port did cut a lot out. Some I hear was due to hardware limitations, some to lack of disk space. If they had omitted the useless multiplayer nobody played and -not- had separate maps made for the co-op mode, they probably could have kept most of those spots in.

Except it wasn't. The limitation was a lack of RAM, not lack of disk space.
Think about it. Both games were released on 1 DVD (and you don't install games on an xbox), so by logic, storage wasn't the issue.

[Xeros612]

Except many PC DVD games end up 7+ GB in size after installation, while at least on the first Xbox I think they were still using "standard" DVDs rather than dual-layer, so that would be a 4.3 GB limit unless I'm mistaken.

[Edward850]

Except Doom3 on the PC is less then 2GB in size (it recommends 2.2GB though, oddly enough). Try again.

[DASI-I]

The problem is the Xbox' CPU was too slow, it's only a 733MHz Pentium III processor, Doom3's min requirements is a 1.5GHz Pentium 4.
The software required to run this game also needed DirectX 9.0b which the original Xbox did not have (it was using a version similar to DirectX 8.1).

[Xeros612]

Edward850 said:

Except Doom3 on the PC is less then 2GB in size (it recommends 2.2GB though, oddly enough). Try again.

Except.... something. Ah well, just further helps my point that they should have ported it to the 360 (and PS3?) a year or so later instead of the old Xbox.

[printz]

Hello people,

What is your opinion on Doom 4's 30Hz plan (probably in order to allow more detail and better performance)? It's even less than Doom 1's 35Hz. Will it be masked so as not to appear choppy, probably through motion blur use?

[phi108]

I think I'd rather have a higher framerate than a lower framerate with motion blur. Only if my computer can do significantly above 60 FPS would I want a motion blur effect applied to my 60 fps output.

And it seems like the latest fads like Bloom, HDR, and motion blur are all things that could be done on the MONITOR end of things (like my old CRT), instead of stressing my CPU/Video card for the work.

[DASI-I]

I play all my first-person shooters without v-sync which allows the game to run above 60fps, it affects not just output speed but also effects input speed, I do this because the delay between input to output is reduced.
30hz will result in poor gameplay because the delay will be greater. this is a bad idea!
...unless...the input will run at 60hz while the graphics runs at 30, a 2 in 1 ratio. That would work, although I don't know if it's been done before or if it's even possible.

[phi108]

I think the input lag with Vsync is largely DirectX; Direct3D ZDoom and more modern games have had the input lag for me, while OpenGL applications and Doom ports never have input lag with Vsync on.

[Intel17]

printz said:

Hello people,

What is your opinion on Doom 4's 30Hz plan (probably in order to allow more detail and better performance)? It's even less than Doom 1's 35Hz. Will it be masked so as not to appear choppy, probably through motion blur use?

It'll be 30Hz on the consoles, but 60Hz on the PC. I'm not too worried.

[Xeros612]

Consoles it may be for, but that still bothers me considering I doubt any non-CRT TV still does 30hz and it's not like letting a game have unlocked framerate has caused any real issue, aside from idiot reviewers throwing a fit about things like Quake IV having a variable framerate(hey, just like PC games!).

[DASI-I]

phi108 said:

I think the input lag with Vsync is largely DirectX; Direct3D ZDoom and more modern games have had the input lag for me, while OpenGL applications and Doom ports never have input lag with Vsync on.

Thats weird, my Direct3D is fine with V-sync, My OpenGL lags with Vsync on, but that could be resolved in newer OpenGL apps, which makes me curious: Is the Id Tech 5 engine using Direct3D or OpenGL?

Xeros612 said:

Consoles it may be for, but that still bothers me considering I doubt any non-CRT TV still does 30hz.

Non CRT screens usually run at 60Hz and anything below that are easily displayed, don't sweat.

[888mikem888]

I had a few ideas for DooM 4. What if instead of going straight through all of the levels in one full go, the story was you were stuck on Mars for several days or weeks, so you would need to find food and water and find little safe spots to sleep for a while? It would make DooM seem much more like a SURVIVAL game. But don't make hunger, dehidration, and sleep constant to a point where its annoying and it takes away all the action. Also have it possible to find spare parts around the base to make costome made weapon mods. One other thing, instead of going down one lineal path simply from point A to point B make it a bit of an exploring game. You know go any where in the base and find things that work with the main story line. These are just my sugestions, I'd kind of like to hear some others from everyone els.

[Radon]

Overwhelming enemies, bigger guns, more blood, more gore and heavy metal music.

[Coopersville]

888mikem888 said:

I had a few ideas for DooM 4. ...

That sounds more like something for Bethesda Softworks to do once ZeniMax is looking to publish a Doom RPG.

I just want an arcadey level-based shooter with hordes of monsters, horror, macabre, and heavy metal.

[Grazza]

[Two very similar threads merged. Please check if there is a currently active thread on the topic you wish to raise before starting a new one.]

[888mikem888]

Coopersville said:

That sounds more like something for Bethesda Softworks to do once ZeniMax is looking to publish a Doom RPG.

Yea it kind of does now that I think of it. But Im not saying don't have action, I was saying make it feel a bit more like a survival. Maybe Im getting too technical but doesn't surviving involve like looking for food and water to eat and drink so you can keep going and... well, whatever. No like hardcore RPG stuff like level ups. That would be kind of dumb

[Radon]

If Doom were an RPG, i would say it should be set into the world of Doom 2, with the environment setting as the book had with "Hell on Earth." Holy fuck I love that book.

[Bishop]

Xeros612 said:

"OHSHITWHATWASTHAT"

As long as it practically makes me shit my pants, and keeps my eyes glued to the screen without even blinking once, then we're still good =)

For one I'd like to see an enhanced version of the Spider Mastermind, like... really scary.

[actinide2k9]

What I would like to see in a DOOM game is this:

The story of the classic DOOM books! Minus the alien part but keeping most of the locations and events etc.
I am just reading trough them again and I just love the story(from the first 2 books at least)
The only part I don't like is that it's about aliens. The rest is just awesome!

Then make it a little bit like fallout 3, BUT minus the lvling, vats, skills etc.
Mostly for the open areas and the way you interact with the npcs.

I would jizz in mah pants.

[Clonehunter]

Radon said:

Doom ... RPG

Uh... Strife?