Things about Doom you just found out

[Gez]

William Blazkowicz said:

The Master Levels don't work in zdoom, skulltag, or, to my knowledge, any other source ports

lol

[glenzinho]

William Blazkowicz said:

The Master Levels don't work in zdoom, skulltag, or, to my knowledge, any other source ports

Ho ho ho this is the merriest christmas of all!

[BaronOfStuff]

William Blazkowicz said:

The Master Levels don't work in zdoom, skulltag, or, to my knowledge, any other source ports

gr8 gag m8

[Guest Unregistered account]

I think that post is on its way to becoming a Doomworld Meme™.

[ASD]

1994 wads don't run on modern source ports cuz they're old.

[Blastfrog]

William Blazkowicz said:

The Master Levels don't work in zdoom, skulltag, or, to my knowledge, any other source ports

Wrong. You're probably mistaking that for the lack of a menu that many ports have to select the levels from. The original game had a launcher, but many ports lack any such thing since it was external.

Eternity actually does have its own built-in launcher for the Master Levels. Though not official, there is an add-on PK3 somewhere for ZDoom/GZDoom to run them from an in-game menu using ACS.

ASD said:

1994 wads don't run on modern source ports cuz they're old.

That shouldn't be happening. Which WADs and which ports? I know Batman Doom and ZDoom don't get along for some reason to do with weapon switching behavior, but other than that I have no idea what problems you could be running into as I never experience anything like that in any port I use.

[scifista42]

Sodaholic, I think that ASD's post was a joke, judging the context.

[Doomkid]

I once tried to run a 1994. It was devastating.

LigH said:

DoomKid

WHO WHAT WHERE

[Gez]

Sodaholic said:

I know Batman Doom and ZDoom don't get along for some reason to do with weapon switching behavior

That's been fixed since (though I think there's still some issues on two or three levels, but not because of the weapons).

[Krazov]

I learned yesterday that “Hexen” cannot run a map with only one sector (not always but still).

Generally, as I started making my first map, I learn some new stuff about Doom engine and company, which is very interesting because allows me to see Doom from yet another angle. I thought that it would be playing Doom with steering wheel but no—it’s mapmaking.

[William Blazkowicz]

glenzinho said:

Ho ho ho this is the merriest christmas of all!

wait nevermind just played with the files in the steam version and found out you can... except they are still all individual so you have to keep closing and relaunching skulltag to play them

[june gloom]

You're new to this, aren't you?

[Zed]

William Blazkowicz said:

they are still all individual so you have to keep closing and relaunching skulltag to play them

I think I (we) must insist.

[William Blazkowicz]

dethtoll said:

You're new to this, aren't you?

Yes, yes I am. Only like, mid last year I started playing DooM.

[june gloom]

Okay well to put it real simple for you the Master Levels are literally just WAD files, same as any you could get off /idgames. Matter of fact many of the authors WERE prominent map-makers of the time: Chris Klie, Dr. Sleep, Tom Mustaine, among others. In fact, many of Dr. Sleep's levels are part of a series he was working on.

As such all of the levels, save Bad Dreams which is a secret level accessed in The Express Elevator To Hell (TEETH.WAD) are single maps in each .wad file and must be loaded as if it were any random wad you pulled down off /idgames. Many if not most of them occupy the MAP01 slot as well. However, true to their age and nature they are strictly vanilla wads and do not require doom2.exe to run -- they'll run in anything.

Alternately you could use the links Zed gave you, OR if you're kinky like me you can use the utility provided hyeah that combines them all into a single wad based on a number of possible configurations. ZDoom derivative required.

[Zed]

If you're having trouble with the ZDoom ML Launcher, try doomworld.com/vb/post/1289362]this.

[40oz]

When I ever I heard the term "lighting" or "light gradients"when someone talks about a map they played or are editing a map, the train of thought that usually comes to mind is usually to find and brighten up sectors that are near or directly attached to a light source. I see a lot of other mappers do that too.

I've recently decided to try another approach, which is to design the map with a generally bright light level, and instead look for things that are blocking a light source draw sectors for shadow casting instead. The lighting turns out much more believable and realistic, and if you're careful about using too many textures with lights on them, and use pillars, doorways, and windows, you can create some really sharp light contrast in some places in your map. You can also use it for game play by hiding monsters in the shadows.

Its not a major discovery but I just found it makes my mapping look much better this way than any of my approaches before.

[_bruce_]

40oz said:

When I ever I heard the term "lighting" or "light gradients"when someone talks about a map they played or are editing a map, the train of thought that usually comes to mind is usually to find and brighten up sectors that are near or directly attached to a light source. I see a lot of other mappers do that too.

I've recently decided to try another approach, which is to design the map with a generally bright light level, and instead look for things that are blocking a light source draw sectors for shadow casting instead. The lighting turns out much more believable and realistic, and if you're careful about using too many textures with lights on them, and use pillars, doorways, and windows, you can create some really sharp light contrast in some places in your map. You can also use it for game play by hiding monsters in the shadows.

Its not a major discovery but I just found it makes my mapping look much better this way than any of my approaches before.

Interesting - looking forward to a map of yours which lighting was implemented in said way.

[Krazov]

Using 0 and 255 brightness level one could manage to make a chiaroscuro kind of thing. Or so I’m planning to check some day.

But after 21 years someone might have done that already, actually.

[Linguica]

Krazov said:

Using 0 and 255 brightness level one could manage to make a chiaroscuro kind of thing. Or so I’m planning to check some day.

But after 21 years someone might have done that already, actually.

Like in D2INO Map28?

[Krazov]

I just checked, and not quite what I meant. I was thinking about idea mentioned by 40oz but with maximum contrasts. So where is light, there’s 255, and where there’s no light—it’s 0.

Let’s say, “Spawning Vats” beginning but more radical.

[june gloom]

Duke 3D's levels were very strongly like that, particularly episode 2.

[Krazov]

Second episode was my least favourite. But I have to admit, I haven’t seen properly executed chiaroscuro I’m thinking about. Maybe it’s beyond enginge’s possibilities, or maybe it’s something yet to be done.

[Da Werecat]

Urban Brawl?

The levels there are essentially fullbright, with pitch black shadows made of textures.

[mouldy]

Something that dawned on me watching my brother play doom for the first time in 20 years is how all the well established play-skills and mapping conventions we take for granted in this game don't necessarily exist beyond the walls of doomworld. Even stuff like knowing certain textures will be lifts or switches or key-hints, or the mechanics of infighting and how the bfg actually works. Watching someone unfamiliar with the game trying to play it reminds me of a time when I didn't even realise that archviles won't hurt you if they can't see you. Feels like quite a high mountain of doom experience we are sitting on top of here.

[june gloom]

Found that out for myself last year when I got some people to play and they just flailed around with no clue how to reload their guns.

[Jaxxoon R]

You gave them mouselook, at least? Because fuck Vanilla neckbrace mode.

[june gloom]

Man I had a whole nice setup with GZDoom going and they still fuck it up.

[jmickle66666666]

mouldy said:

Something that dawned on me watching my brother play doom for the first time in 20 years is how all the well established play-skills and mapping conventions we take for granted in this game don't necessarily exist beyond the walls of doomworld. Even stuff like knowing certain textures will be lifts or switches or key-hints, or the mechanics of infighting and how the bfg actually works. Watching someone unfamiliar with the game trying to play it reminds me of a time when I didn't even realise that archviles won't hurt you if they can't see you. Feels like quite a high mountain of doom experience we are sitting on top of here.

But this is also really great, too! We can rely on that knowledge when mapping to create very specific and intricate scenarios that you wouldn't be able to rely on when also trying to ease the player into the game/teach them the mechanics. Of course, it all depends on the audience you are mapping for and it is such that new players find the game more difficult to pick up when you throw them into pwads

[joe-ilya]

MAP13 has some new stuff I just found out.
Skybox fail

The outercrusher is quick, the inner is slow

Wierd room, liquid ceiling, marble texture, a single metal bar on the wierd scrolling tech-rock thingy while the other sides have none

Dummy sectors are made of marble for some reason

You can't push the switch behind the crates I'm shooting at, even when the switch is revealed.

This door is unopenable from this side

It's possible to run through these pitch black windows from here instead of opening the blue door.

Another skybox fail

This cage is cutoff and you can jump into any cage at the level.