Things about Doom you just found out

[idbeholdME]

Piper Maru said:

Playing through Doom II, first time in a very long while. On map 03: The Gantlet I never knew about that backpack secret (unmarked), and that the teleporter that can also bring you to it. I think that's the first backpack of the game?

Same here, I remember, when I first saw the little irrregularity on the wall in the room that opens after you pick up the mega armor, I was 100% sure it is a secret, but never found a way to open it and I didn't think about coming back there later in the level, because the game claimed I have all the secrets. Same with the other entrance to the secret (you can just open the wall where the backpack is after raising the bridge), it is possible only after I already eplored that area, so no reason coming back. I think it's only several months since I found out about that "secret".

[ABRACADABRA]

I just thought. Quake 2 IS Doom 3. it has everything from doom and more!
here's a short list:

-Big Fucking Weapons including Super Shotgun, Chaingun, Plasma Gun and BFG;
-Same monster balance design: in Quake you fight with mainly tough single monsters. in Doom and Quake II you just overkill them massively - guards are zombies, berserkers are pinkies, gunners are hell knights, medics are arch viles and so on;
-General concept - linked to previous - kill, not survive.
-Intermission maps. In Doom they appears after each level, in Q2 after each unit, displaying player's progress (this concept and the one with monsters approved by id);
-sky changes when progressing further - linked to previous;
-Episode structure: yes, it's not obvious, but originally Q2 had 3 large episodes divided by smaller units;
-Items - health and armor bonuses returns alongside with backpacks, berserk (in the form of adrenaline)
-Music. When talked to Sonic Mayhem they have been asked to make something with "Doom feel" and like Metallica;
-Monster visual design: mechanical parts connected to living flesh.

And this is hardly even half of things that came directly from doom. not to mention vertical opening doors.
and most of this was said by id employes.

[PsychoGoatee]

ABRACADABRA said:

I just thought. Quake 2 IS Doom 3. it has everything from doom and more!
here's a short list:

-Big Fucking Weapons including Super Shotgun, Chaingun, Plasma Gun and BFG;
-Same monster balance design: in Quake you fight with mainly tough single monsters. in Doom and Quake II you just overkill them massively - guards are zombies, berserkers are pinkies, gunners are hell knights, medics are arch viles and so on;
-General concept - linked to previous - kill, not survive.
-Intermission maps. In Doom they appears after each level, in Q2 after each unit, displaying player's progress (this concept and the one with monsters approved by id);
-sky changes when progressing further - linked to previous;
-Episode structure: yes, it's not obvious, but originally Q2 had 3 large episodes divided by smaller units;
-Items - health and armor bonuses returns alongside with backpacks, berserk (in the form of adrenaline)
-Music. When talked to Sonic Mayhem they have been asked to make something with "Doom feel" and like Metallica;
-Monster visual design: mechanical parts connected to living flesh.

And this is hardly even half of things that came directly from doom. not to mention vertical opening doors.
and most of this was said by id employes.

Why not Quake 1? Even with it's own Cthulu-esque (I haven't actually read Lovecraft) style, to me it feels more like Doom than Quake 2 does. I do love Quake 2 though, especially the multiplayer at the time.

Quake 2 is another id shooter, it's good, to me it has more of a standard sci-fi flavor to it. But sure, Quake and Doom are blood related.

[Li'l devil]

I've just found out that Doom Retro is actually a really good and unique port. I've always thought that it's just slightly enhanced Chocoloate Doom with nothing new to offer (in other words, just like Crispy Doom), but in reality, even though it doesn't really offer many new gameplay features, it greatly enhances the atmosphere and feeling of the game. Dark areas are darker, more blood, textures with lights actually have those lights glow (switches glow in the dark, looks awesome) etc. It also offers some fixes to gameplay, which were never implemented in other ports, such as when the door or crusher crushes corpse, the gibbing sound is heard.
Great port, I'm playing Ultimate Doom on it and really enjoying it.

[Lila Feuer]

Piper Maru said:

Playing through Doom II, first time in a very long while. On map 03: The Gantlet I never knew about that backpack secret (unmarked), and that the teleporter that can also bring you to it. I think that's the first backpack of the game?

What's interesting is that secret didn't exist in versions of Doom II prior to the final v.1.9, they also removed the redundant silver bars from map02's first switch. It sounded like a lot of people grew up with earlier versions of the IWAD which was 14mb vs. the final 13.9mb because the former had unused graphics from Doom 1.

[RichardDS90]

Some of the animated liquid flats are animated merely by having different graphic offsets.

[MaxRideWizardLord]

Cyanosis said:

brings back the dead by using his hands which become highlighted.

Arch-Vile is a true Jesus Christ. It's all clear now!

[Mattfrie1]

The soundtrack of 32X Doom has some minor differences if played on the actual hardware instead of emulation. Can you hear the difference?

[ABRACADABRA]

I don't know how, but I just found that sometimes when loading level is in progres in shareware doom 1.0 you can trigger run key to be always on. don't know how, I was able to reproduce that only a few times running to an exit button holding shift and mashing space or control

[Li'l devil]

ABRACADABRA said:

I don't know how, but I just found that sometimes when loading level is in progres in shareware doom 1.0 you can trigger run key to be always on. don't know how, I was able to reproduce that only a few times running to an exit button holding shift and mashing space or control

You probably accidentally hit caps lock.


Alright, I've just found out that E3M8 is textured entirely in marble, not grass. For years I've been thinking it was grassy. I've even made a couple of posts about my disgust of E3M8's texturing, but it turns out everything was fine and I was a dumbass all along!

Also, a small question a bit out of place, but anyway: I've managed to beat E4M2 on UV starting with only 5 health. Does it mean that I'm really that good at Doom? I mean, lots of peoples are saying that E4M2 is really fucking hard.. or people are just overexaggerating it's hardness? Tbh, this map wasn't really much of a problem for me..

[nxGangrel]

I just realized Map 04 had lights you could switch on and off... I never knew that. Or at least forgot.

[Li'l devil]

nxGangrel said:

I just realized Map 04 had lights you could switch on and off... I never knew that. Or at least forgot.

I've been playing this map for years, but I, too, only found that out recently. Before that, I've always wandered what that switch in the crate room did.. We really need more maps with features like that.

I've also found out that I really love pinkydemons. They're so damn good at blocking projectiles! I actually now think it's their main purpose.

[ABRACADABRA]

ChekaAgent said:

You probably accidentally hit caps lock.

Good joke. that may be. but unfortunatelly it's not.
there is no always run option in doom.

if you hit a shift button again, the effect will disappear

ok, seems like I've got it. you have to very quickly skip intermission screen mashing space and control to the point untill you'll see a blue disk image apeears in the right corner of thr screen. then just tap shift once and you will have an always run enabled

[Li'l devil]

No always run in Vanilla? Didn't know about that.

[LogicDeLuxe]

ChekaAgent said:

I've been playing this map for years, but I, too, only found that out recently.

Funny, I immediately noticed when I first played it and wondered why it never was used in Doom 1. Then I realized that they have introduced that linedef when the Doom 1 maps where already done.

[nxGangrel]

I also just realized the Berserk pack weren't in Episode 1.

[CheeseOnTheMoon]

This is pretty stupid for someone who has played E2 over and over again, but I just found out about the tower of babel thing during the intermission screens. I guess that a combination of the changes being rather subtle and me trying to skip to the next level as fast as possible made it slip right pass me.

[vadrig4r]

ChekaAgent said:

No always run in Vanilla? Didn't know about that.

You can set joyb_speed in DEFAULT.CFG to 29 to force always run on, but using the run key won't make you walk.

[ABRACADABRA]

vadrig4r said:

using the run key won't make you walk.

actually this is a modern feature debuted around Quake 2 release time and still missed from many games released after

[vadrig4r]

ABRACADABRA said:

actually this is a modern feature debuted around Quake 2 release time and still missed from many games released after

I'm still baffled when I play a game and for example left + right inputs doesn't equal neutral but one (always) overrides the other. There must be a name for this but I remember trying to google this for Commander Keen was a pain. Non-vector movement?

[Gez]

vadrig4r said:

I'm still baffled when I play a game and for example left + right inputs doesn't equal neutral but one (always) overrides the other.

It can be simply caused by the way the input code was written. Look at this pseudocode for example:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
else if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

With code like this, if the left key is pressed, the game won't even bother looking at whether the right key is also pressed.

And now look at this one:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

The only difference is the lack of "else". Now what happens if both keys are pressed is that the player movement is set to be to the left, and then it's overridden to be set to the right.

[kb1]

Gez said:

It can be simply caused by the way the input code was written. Look at this pseudocode for example:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
else if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

With code like this, if the left key is pressed, the game won't even bother looking at whether the right key is also pressed.

And now look at this one:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

The only difference is the lack of "else". Now what happens if both keys are pressed is that the player movement is set to be to the left, and then it's overridden to be set to the right.

Unless the set_move actually happens. Then they effectively do actually cancel each other out.

[scifista42]

^ Well, that depends on how "set_move" itself is coded.

Let's label Gez's first code as A) and his second code as B), and study which movement (left/right/none) would happen if both left and right keys were pressed, assuming that:

1. "set_move" just sets a value to a variable that is read later and then a respective movement is performed.

- A) the result will be LEFT movement
- B) the result will be RIGHT movement

2. "set_move" just increments/decrements a variable (initially set to 0) that is read later and then a respective movement is performed.

- A) the result will be LEFT movement
- B) the result will be NO movement

3. "set_move" performs the actual movement immediately.

- A) the result will be LEFT movement
- B) the result will be LEFT+RIGHT movement (which might or might not appear to be equal to NO movement)

Apparently, only code B combined with option 2 (or an equivalent one, for example setting different bitflags which are later interpreted with regard to each other) is the correct solution.

[vadrig4r]

Gez said:

It can be simply caused by the way the input code was written. Look at this pseudocode for example:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
else if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

With code like this, if the left key is pressed, the game won't even bother looking at whether the right key is also pressed.

And now look at this one:

if (key_left.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(LEFT);
}
if (key_right.is_pressed())
{
    player.set_move(RIGHT);
}

The only difference is the lack of "else". Now what happens if both keys are pressed is that the player movement is set to be to the left, and then it's overridden to be set to the right.

Thanks for the discussion guys, was always interested what was going on in these cases! Will definitely help me know how to structure things when I'm working on my own projects.

[40oz]

The BFG secret in MAP31 is totally new to me.

[Jon]

40oz said:

The BFG secret in MAP31 is totally new to me.

I remember when I first discovered that; I loved it, it's the first and only part where it really breaks from the Wolfenstein theme.

[scifista42]

I've just found out that MAP25 of Doom 2 was made by Shawn Green. Until now, I believed that all Doom 2 maps were made by McGee + Petersen + Romero only (and MAP10 was based on Tom Hall's layout).

[Li'l devil]

Watching Azuruish's Brutal Doom speedrun of Episode 3 on his YT channel, I've discovered where the normal exit in E3M6 is located. Yes, that's right, I always exited E3M6 via the secret exit and had no idea where the normal exit is.
That's probably because that secret exit is so famous, that it's actually easier to find it, than the normal one....

[baja blast rd.]

http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Cyberdemon

A skilled player can somewhat nullify the cyberdemon's low pain chance by straferunning towards it to get within point blank range, and then hitting it with the super shotgun. The monster will flinch roughly eighty percent of the time when hit by the full twenty-pellet blast, giving the player time to retreat, reload, and repeat the process. This can take the cyberdemon down in fewer than 25 shots, but is very risky, and only recommended in areas where the rocket launcher is impractical, or to conserve rocket and cell ammunition. This tactic is common amongst high tier speedrunners.

This is a troll or someone who doesn't know what they are talking about, right. If not I just learned something new. O_o

[Li'l devil]

rdwpa said:

This is a troll or someone who doesn't know what they are talking about, right. If not I just learned something new. O_o

I don't know what's wrong with that. Or you don't agree that the cyberdemon can be killed in 25 SSG shots? Technically, if you're unbelievably lucky, you can kill the cyberdemon in 14 SSG shots. It sounds crazy, but according to stats, that's true.