Hexen and Heretic, what are they like?

[DeathevokatioN]

magicsofa said:

If you think the heretic weapons are weak, you aren't using enough tomes of power. There's a shitload of them in the IWADS

QFT. :) And not to mention artifact items like time bombs and the thing that transforms enemies into critters all contribute to opening up different gameplay strategies. And when you race through the game as quickly as you can the levels become entirely different beasts, especially the wonderfully chaotic E4 & E5.

I think the statements in 90's the (and on these forums as well) that dismiss it as a Doom clone that doesn't have anything new to give are bullshit, considering it uses the same engine it is very distinct from Doom, it has a different art direction, unique level design, unique level themes, a completely different atmosphere, you can see they went for a different gameplay style and a different monster cast.

[Creaphis]

fraggle said:

No it isn't.

Most of the content in the page you linked to disagrees with you. I'd agree with you anyway, though, because of the single most important line in that entire article:

Most instances of verbal irony are labeled by research subjects as sarcastic, suggesting that the term sarcasm is more widely used than its technical definition suggests it should be

Therefore, the technical definitions are lagging behind.


On topic: Heretic is fun if you don't play it like Doom. Look for ways to use the weapons and items creatively.

[Koko Ricky]

I only ever played Hexen 2, which of course used the Quake, not Doom, engine. I never beat it but I had a lot of fun with it. It was really atmospheric and the RPG elements (having upgrade-able weapons, mana and hit points) were a nice touch. I liked the art directions and the general layouts.

[b0rsuk]

Heretic
Is very fun to play. Feels like reskinned DooM and actions is fast and furious. Better balance than in DooM. Tome of Power is the best implementation of Quad Damage, and the thing most people love in this game. Levels are often non-linear, and as stated design is very good. It has some nice touches like always the same order of doors: Yellow, Green, Blue. When you find a key you always know where to go. It is a bit corny, though.
Do yourself a favor and play on the hardest difficulty. It's much more fair than DooM, monsters don't respawn and you can actually complete on the first playthrough. Monsters can otherwise be a bit too easy.

Hexen
I have a soft spot for this game. First, the flaws:
- very low enemy variance, even in power (most take 2-3 axe hits)
- extremely linear, the first heavily scripted FPS. You can finish any DooM or Heretic level starting with "idclev" cheat and no weapons. Some Hexen levels are impossible (no connection) or extremely hard this way.
- almost no secrets. Instead, secret switches are required for progress, which manages to make secret hunting not fun. You can get stuck and frustrated.
- many traps of the "haha, you die !" variety, trial and error, no warning.
- bad balance, particularly cleric's ultimate weapon and mage's weapons. Cleric's first weapon is pathetic.

The good parts:
- Amazing atmosphere, theme not story
- Presentation, graphics and sounds probably best among DooM engine games
- doesn't feel like reskinned DooM, it's its own thing
- enemies have very interesting special abilities
- levels play bad, but look amazing.
- great looking weapons
- playing as Warrior is unlike any other FPS experience I had, you don't have a ranged weapon for a looong time.

If you like Hexen, check out my Vavoom gameplay mod for it. It has balance fixes and cool ideas (Wraithverge reduces monsters to 1 HP instead of killing, Bloodscourge projectiles guarranteed to pick separate targets, +50% Frost Shards damage, weak Sapphire Wand, Stalkers hold you in place until you hit them - currently punishingly hard, flamethrower afrits with flames gliding on surfaces...and more). It is a work in progress - or rather a nearly dead project. If you want to try it, PM me and I'll re-upload it.
http://vavoom-engine.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3384

[Hellbent]

fraggle said:

No it isn't.

Yes it is.

[Snakes]

I just played some of Heretic's first episode for the first time in 2 years... I remembered nothing. Definitely going to burn through it one of these upcoming weeks. It's a seriously awesome game.

[Captain Red]

I really don't get why people are praising heretic level design so much. I barely remember anything about it other then lots of moss and stone walls. Hexen's setting is much more interesting but I got really burnt out on the switch hunts after a while (still managed to finish it though).

[Gez]

You forgot the medieval towns with their wood and cob walls, the cathedrals with their stained glass windows, the crypts with their white marble, the icy caverns, the fiery volcanos, and the watery palace of D'Sparil with its mosaic walls. With surprisingly few textures, they managed to create very distinctive places for 45 levels. The architecture is both convincing (the levels look like what their name implies they are) and fun (gameplay isn't sacrificed).

[Vordakk]

Gez said:

With surprisingly few textures, they managed to create very distinctive places for 45 levels.

It's true that there are very few textures, but the ones that are available are all really good. There aren't any "filler" textures in there, in my opinion. Raven software had good artists.

[b0rsuk]

Hexen 1 is very different from Hexen 2, Goat Lord. What is today Hexen 2 was meant to be a different game, a medieval themed FPS. The original sequel to Hexen was meant to be Hecatomb. Hexen and Heretic had more of its own stuff, while Hexen 2 has lots of generic medieval themes. Riders of apocalypse, angels, egypt, meso america, etc. World of Cronos is very different.

Also, Hexen 2 feels much emptier. Enemies are much less numberous, although some are very powerful (archer lords). Less gore. Hexen even has enemy respawn by default, to keep you on your toes. I think Hexen 1 even has more ambient sounds, which is unusual because early games rarely had them.