TNT Map 22: Habitat - Why the dislike?

[Jaysap]

I see Habitat getting thrown around as the worst map of TNT quite a bit. What makes it worse than some of the others?

[neubejiita]

You can finish the map in an absurd time in nightmare; skipping most of the enemies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DMCUBWgdPI

And I just do not like the look of this level very much. MAP17 and MAP20 are better maps to play. As well as MAP02.

[Jimmy]

It's stupidly huge. It's ugly. There's no flow to the layout. It just... sucks.

[Blue Shadow]

The stupid tunnels or tubes, or whatever you want to call them.

[qoncept]

Yeah, tons of long, identical, uninteresting tunnels with the same enemies placed totally predictably, boring big rooms that look like nothing, weak battles.

I see the author also created Icarus: Alien Vanguard MAP01, which I also didn't like at all, though for different reasons. The aesthetic was a LOT better, but there were stretches where you had to have a rad suit while exploring. Didn't find your way fast enough? Try again. We played it on coop and I STARTED in an area like this, couldn't find a way out, and quit before ever finishing the first level.

[ComicMischief]

I dislike it because it's shit. Best reason for disliking anything, ever.

[kmxexii]

It's one of the most distinctive levels from Evilution, for better or worse. It has some really cool bits like the cistern that fills with nukage but some of the sections like the pipe hatches and that rectangular yard with the archvile ambush are pretty polarizing. I don't dislike it.

[Snakes]

Everything.

[dew]

qoncept said:

I see the author also created Icarus: Alien Vanguard MAP01, which I also didn't like at all, though for different reasons.

interesting, i didn't know that. ic01 is not ev22-style terribad, but it's still a very unfortunate starter map. i for one always kinda ignored icarus because of it and the way it annoyed me.

[vdgg]

Habitat had a few interesting bits (I liked the elevator-like paths on the floor), but generally was forgettable. Shuttlecraft is the most memorable Icarus map and one of the best, I love it. BTW I managed to finish the map a few times on UV without taking a single hit. What I need is not to get hurt by lava as well which is far more tricky, strafe-50 is not enough if your timing is not absolutely perfect.

[Memfis]

I think it's a cool map. I like the music, the tunnels (they still confuse the hell out of me :) ), the green outdoor areas. And the major shortcut is a good thing in my opinion. The more ways to play the map, the better.
And ic01 is an awesome megawad opener, one of the best IMO.
Then again, I'm a TNT fanboy so my opinion is probably biased.

[DeathevokatioN]

I really hated Habitat, but the author's Map01 of Icarus is amazing.

[PRIMEVAL]

It's not a great map by any means, but it's not the worst of TNT, imo. I actually sorta enjoy it to an extent.

[j4rio]

It would have to be a lot worse to top terribleness of map 30.

[qoncept]

j4rio said:

It would have to be a lot worse to top terribleness of map 30.

Agreed. I'd like to know who thinks an instant death trial-and-error is fun.

In the last level of Super Mario Bros you keep taking the 2nd pipe after the first lava and don't instantly die.

In TNT MAP30 you take red, green (2X), blue, green, blue, green, blue, green (2X), red, blue, red, blue.

Genius.

[Snakes]

qoncept said:

Agreed. I'd like to know who thinks an instant death trial-and-error is fun.

In the last level of Super Mario Bros you keep taking the 2nd pipe after the first lava and don't instantly die.

In TNT MAP30 you take red, green (2X), blue, green, blue, green, blue, green (2X), red, blue, red, blue.

Genius.

It's not like there wasn't a way to figure this out beforehand. I thought it was at least a slightly clever puzzle, which is more than I can see about anything in Map22.

[Gez]

The easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: memorize the color sequence of the torches in the corridor just before the teleport puzzle.

The super-easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: use a source port that colors teleport lines differently (ZDoom does for example), move in automap or overlay mode.

The hyper-easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: idclip.

[Tristan]

That's true about map30, and quite frankly, I just ran through Map22 on ITYTD.
Very easy if you got crouch enabled, and that secret with the soulsphere at start is probably the one of the easiest secret areas I know of.

Granted, those tunnels probably took some time, but they could've been more varied.

[qoncept]

Gez said:
The easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: memorize the color sequence of the torches in the corridor just before the teleport puzzle.

I didn't notice that. Wiki should include it.

The super-easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: use a source port that colors teleport lines differently (ZDoom does for example), move in automap or overlay mode.

This is what we did, in skulltag. Except you can't tell if a line is a teleport until you've tried once, so we still died (in coop) a couple dozen times.

[Dragonsbrethren]

qoncept said:

I didn't notice that. Wiki should include it.

It already does.

[40oz]

DeathevokatioN said:

I really hated Habitat, but the author's Map01 of Icarus is amazing.

Same guy huh? Thats really cool. Icarus MAP01 is awesome but it's really hard for a starting level even on the easier skill levels.

[qoncept]

Dragonsbrethren said:

It already does.

Holy cow. Sometimes you just can't get through to me. :) I read that twice and somehow missed it both times.

[Ribbiks]

For some reason habitat is my 2nd favorite level in TNT. I like its weirdness.

[StevieWolfe]

I liked its obscure idea of being a testing/habitat lab for studying the demons. I hated that you could beat it with your eyes closed...

[Pirx]

Gez said:

The easy way to solve TNT30's teleport puzzle: memorize the color sequence of the torches in the corridor just before the teleport puzzle.

this. it's a nicely laid out puzzle, i discovered this when i played final doom for the first time in 1995, and felt really smart ;)

as for habitat, i generally can't stand plainly textured maps where everything looks the same, and that large, confusing map is the embodiment of this.

[Fluffles]

I remember when I first played it, was such a boring map

[Ralphis]

RE: TNT Map30. I figured this puzzle out on my second try when I was like, 10 years old. Is it really that difficult to figure out?

[Daiyu_Xiaoxiang]

I hate it because of the maze, I always get lost inside the maze!

[SFoZ911]

No Dislike, cool music. Acually I really like that level.

[Never_Again]

The dislike automatically puts you in the cool kids category.