PSX Doom: The Lost Levels - New Pre-Beta Available courtesy of Salahmander2

[mrthejoshmon]

Dragonsbrethren said:

It has a gameinfo lump so everything should autoload if you drag and drop it onto GZDoom. Alternatively, you can edit PSXDOOM.CFG and add it there after the other files.

(You can remove .zip from the file extension. My host will try to render PK3s as text files.)

So that's what I did wrong, thanks.

EDIT: Sewers (LOST64) has no Player 1 start.

[Avoozl]

I don't think my music choices are horrbile but I could probably change what I picked for Open Season, I used the one which is mostly just random machinery noises which I thought suited that particular map, but the original Open Season had more desperation sounding music.

[Dragonsbrethren]

I wasn't referring to ones that already had assignments. For the ones that didn't, I just ran down the list of music so they'd have something, without really considering if the tracks fit the levels or not. It's a pre-beta for a reason, it's not done enough for me to consider it beta quality. I just wanted to have something out today.

[BaronOfStuff]

mrthejoshmon said:

Sewers (LOST64) has no Player 1 start.

Yes it does, it has all four player starts appearing on all difficulties. The error is with the secret exit on LOST05; 'Position' should be '0'.

For what it's worth, LOST64 leads back to LOST05 when it should be LOST06 (I just checked the ZMAPINFO).

[Devalaous]

Well, I know where all my time is going to go.

[Job]

I'm several levels in so far, and I'm impressed. It definitely feels faithful to something that would be ported to the PSX.

[mrthejoshmon]

BaronOfStuff said:

Yes it does, it has all four player starts appearing on all difficulties. The error is with the secret exit on LOST05; 'Position' should be '0'.

For what it's worth, LOST64 leads back to LOST05 when it should be LOST06 (I just checked the ZMAPINFO).

I will access just it via the ZDoom console to take a look at the map instead of using the bugged exit, I also found out that entering then going from Betray will have you also play Industrial Zone twice (and you can also initiate an endless loop of the same two maps just by using the secret exit continuously, which is a shame as I always used the secret exit to get out of Industial Zone).

Other than these little issues, nothing wrong so far (well except texture alignments, but that doesn't bother me).

[Dragonsbrethren]

Oh damn, sorry on the mapinfo stuff. I caught those, but accidentally closed without saving once and didn't realize I never saved after making those corrections, I just thought I did all music-related stuff.

[Dexiaz]

Ok, it's very nice that beta was released.



Also on PSX E3M2 is texture bug "animation" (the sector with cacodemon in the rightmost corridor: when door opens, textures on right and left sides are moving. But it's rock texture, it's impossible ;))

And why Industrial Zone's secret exit goes to "Betray"? It should be "The Castle"

[Dragonsbrethren]

Another little mapinfo mistake I missed, I reordered the maps but forgot to update the secretnext field.

[Devalaous]

So is there anything in particular I should be looking for in these beta maps?

[Dragonsbrethren]

Mainly test it as an episode, but still bring up any map-specific bugs or areas don't conform to the guidelines if you find those too.

[RichardDS90]

Where will Betray be accessed from?

[Devalaous]

Please go for authenticity and make it accessible from a Doom 2 level. (Not a hump random wall deal though, lololol)

[Devalaous]

After playing a few levels, I have to say, WOW. Some of these feel way different. I felt nervous in Dis of all things, no doubt thanks to Baron's great work on the hallway leading to the ominous open area with the fire sky. Sucks though that the only mastermind is already dead on the third level..

Nearly died to her too, went into the next level nearly dead (timer was 333, not quite!)

They Will Repent is, honestly, fucking terrifying. The use of darkness is brilliant, I'm never really willing to charge into things like I do in the PC version, I also keep getting jumpscares when a zombie shoots me in the back from the shadows (Especially if it kills me, which it generally does thanks to Dis)

EDIT: Slough of Despair, while much better, still felt the same mostly. Maybe a hidden guest monster or nightmare spectre somewhere? I honestly cant tell if anything really changed aside from the firesky, textures and lights. Also, the little rock step behind where you start, the top step is missing an automap line. Not sure if this a proper bug or not, but still, a missing lie is a missing line.

[Dragonsbrethren]

Yeah to be honest, I think Slough of Despair could do with some more simplifications/tweaks. Right now, even though I don't think it breaks any of the actual guidelines, it just doesn't "feel" like it would run well on the PSX. I suspect that thing collisions would be an issue, the console ports use simplified detection compared to PC, and I think you'd probably get stopped by at least a few of the trees.

For Betray, I figured we'd work the exit into Downtown, as was suggested. I'm not sure exactly where would be best though, so feel free to make suggestions! If I were more familiar with the map, it'd probably be easier.

[Dexiaz]

Guys, don't forget that Habitat map is not finished. I specially "forget" about teleport near the exit (pit). I thought that yellow key will open door to secret map.

Anyway, you can just delete this sector, because it's useless for anything else.

[RichardDS90]

For the secret exit in Downtown, I'd say put it where the invisibilty spheres are?

[Devalaous]

Dragonsbrethren said:

Yeah to be honest, I think Slough of Despair could do with some more simplifications/tweaks. Right now, even though I don't think it breaks any of the actual guidelines, it just doesn't "feel" like it would run well on the PSX. I suspect that thing collisions would be an issue, the console ports use simplified detection compared to PC, and I think you'd probably get stopped by at least a few of the trees.

For Betray, I figured we'd work the exit into Downtown, as was suggested. I'm not sure exactly where would be best though, so feel free to make suggestions! If I were more familiar with the map, it'd probably be easier.

I got stuck on a few objects in Slough, yeah. Moslty the torches at the beginning, but I like tohse torches...

Downtown secret exit location, how about the three (mostly) empty alleyways at the top of the map? The other areas are "too busy" for an extra area. How to trigger the area? I'll think about this when I reach the map tomorrow and look for stuff

Where is Warrens accessed from btw? If it has no current access point, I suppose Slough could get spiced up that way, with a "What!? I JUST completed this level!" thing. Maybe make that little staircase at the start usable for this purpose.. Literally go back to level 1!

[RichardDS90]

Ragnor said:

Where is Warrens accessed from btw? If it has no current access point, I suppose Slough could get spiced up that way, with a "What!? I JUST completed this level!" thing. Maybe make that little staircase at the start usable for this purpose.. Literally go back to level 1!

You sir! Are a genius! That is actually a brilliant idea!

[Job]

I'm going to jump on the bandwagon and say that Slough of Despair seemed...a little empty for lack of a better word. Most lost souls can be dispatched with a shotgun blast and most of the other enemies are dealt with as you encounter them. But somehow it didn't seem as chaotic as the PC counterpart. I also noticed that in the first map, the enemy count jumped pretty significantly from HMP to UV. Overall, though, the ammo balance seems to be there. They Will Repent and Against Thee Wickedly were awesome, btw. I didn't really see any issues with those.

[Devalaous]

Slough was pretty tough with PC speeds. In usual PSX fashion, zombies and so on would get me from behind..

About the Warrens thing, something else I thought of after I made that post, no matter what exit you choose, you are GOING to fight a boss with early weaponry. Unless the Warrens Cyber was removed of course :p

[RichardDS90]

Ragnor said:

Slough was pretty tough with PC speeds. In usual PSX fashion, zombies and so on would get me from behind..

About the Warrens thing, something else I thought of after I made that post, no matter what exit you choose, you are GOING to fight a boss with early weaponry. Unless the Warrens Cyber was removed of course :p

Do bear in mind, you can get a plasma gun on Slough Of Despair and of course, a Rocket Launcher on Forsaken Keep.

[Devalaous]

Yeah, the PR is how I killed the mastermind. Nearly died doing so (because I suck lololol), but it beats players charging into her with the BFG for a one-shot.

Besides, these levels could end up tuned a bit more to be more Episode-like.

[Dexiaz]

As always it's hardcore. Don't play this on Ultra-Violence, if you feel that can't defeat monsters :7

[Dragonsbrethren]

I usually just distract the Mastermind by letting at least one of the other monsters infight with it. It's never seemed that tough to me, otherwise I'd probably suggest moving the fight to the end of the UD maps. (I'm not opposed to doing this, still, though, if we think it would feel fairer. Tower of Babel got moved in the PSX mapset, afterall. Granted, that was probably because of using JagDoom as a basis.)

[NoneeLlama]

Ragnor said:

EDIT: Slough of Despair, while much better, still felt the same mostly. Maybe a hidden guest monster or nightmare spectre somewhere? I honestly cant tell if anything really changed aside from the firesky, textures and lights. Also, the little rock step behind where you start, the top step is missing an automap line. Not sure if this a proper bug or not, but still, a missing lie is a missing line.

I thought about putting a Pain Elemental in place of the lost souls in the second finger from the left, but then I scratched that idea. But if people want more change in the map, then it can be implemented.
The "missing line" is also in the original map, and I think that's the way Sandy designed it (you can't see back up where you came from).

Dragonsbrethren said:

Yeah to be honest, I think Slough of Despair could do with some more simplifications/tweaks. Right now, even though I don't think it breaks any of the actual guidelines, it just doesn't "feel" like it would run well on the PSX. I suspect that thing collisions would be an issue, the console ports use simplified detection compared to PC, and I think you'd probably get stopped by at least a few of the trees.

Removing some of the things could be done (as I done the same at the beginning of Forsaken Keep), but I don't know how much I can simplify the geometry without changing a lot. I could give it a try though. Maybe cutting off some of the "passagese" inbetween the collums what the Midway people would have done to keep a steady framerate?

Job said:

I'm going to jump on the bandwagon and say that Slough of Despair seemed...a little empty for lack of a better word. Most lost souls can be dispatched with a shotgun blast and most of the other enemies are dealt with as you encounter them. But somehow it didn't seem as chaotic as the PC counterpart. I also noticed that in the first map, the enemy count jumped pretty significantly from HMP to UV. Overall, though, the ammo balance seems to be there. They Will Repent and Against Thee Wickedly were awesome, btw. I didn't really see any issues with those.

I removed some of the enemies from the very beginning, just to make it a tad easier. Maybe I shouldn't have?

On the first map, the only change in the monster count I did was removing 2 demons, and putting in a Nightmare Spectre instead on UV.

DeXiaZ said:

Also on PSX E3M2 is texture bug "animation" (the sector with cacodemon in the rightmost corridor: when door opens, textures on right and left sides are moving. But it's rock texture, it's impossible ;))

I think I left that in there because that's how it was in the original, and thought just leave it there as is (like with the texture misaligments). Of course I have no opposition fixing it.


On an other note, I think we should put Dis after the E4 maps. It's kinda strange to have a boss map so early.

[Dragonsbrethren]

NoneeLlama said:

Removing some of the things could be done (as I done the same at the beginning of Forsaken Keep), but I don't know how much I can simplify the geometry without changing a lot. I could give it a try though. Maybe cutting off some of the "passagese" inbetween the collums what the Midway people would have done to keep a steady framerate?

I'm not sure, exactly. The similar section of Perfect Hatred stayed the same, but that's a very small area compared to the whole of Slough. I'd probably take Megamur's DOSBox cycles suggestion to see what areas (if any) cause framerate issues in the original, and then simplify those for the conversion.

Also, putting the secret exit on the stairway at the start is brilliant! We should do that :)

[BaronOfStuff]

DB behaved long enough for me to finish things somewhat so here's Tombstone for testing and all that bullshit.

LOST54 is the mapslot.

[RichardDS90]

I couldn't resist now that every map has been converted. :P