Post Your Doom Picture (Part 2)

[Phade102]

15 minutes ago, Bauul said:

I reckon it's three reasons:

 

1: Many maps that target ZDoom do a lot differently to vanilla Doom (custom monsters, weapons, scripts, etc. etc.) which some people don't like, so as a result the source port itself gets lumped into the same dislike.

 

2: Because (G)ZDoom supports a lot of advanced features, even if you don't play with them turned on some people don't like the feel that they're even options.  You can set ZDoom to look basically identical to Crispy, but because all the other options are there it just doesn't feel the same.

 

3: ZDoom's underlying engine was rewritten, so there are a variety of very small, subtle differences to the vanilla experience.  Individually they're not huge, but add them all together and the overall feeling is just a little different if you're really used to how something like Crispy or Chocolate feels.

Fair enough. see, I'm a bit biased because when I got my first source port for doom, besides doom 95, it was zdoom. Its the only one i've used, which makes it the one I love. I love mapping for it, I love the advanced features and making the game a bit more updated. But I can understand why people prefer others.

 

I just dont understand the people that say "Your map looks awesome, I'd play it if it didnt use zdoom" If they like the look of the map, and it interests them, it shouldn't matter what source port its on.

[Misty]

12 minutes ago, Phade102 said:

Fair enough. see, I'm a bit biased because when I got my first source port for doom, besides doom 95, it was zdoom. Its the only one i've used, which makes it the one I love. I love mapping for it, I love the advanced features and making the game a bit more updated. But I can understand why people prefer others.

 

I just dont understand the people that say "Your map looks awesome, I'd play it if it didnt use zdoom" If they like the look of the map, and it interests them, it shouldn't matter what source port its on.

 Did you try post your mapset in zdoom forums or in fb(if you have account here) too? 

[Phade102]

23 minutes ago, MysteriousHaruko said:

 Did you try post your mapset in zdoom forums or in fb(if you have account here) too? 

Nah, i'm only posting it here because I have faith in this community a lot. ill probably post it in the zdoom forums eventually, but for now, here is fine. Plus, I love your reviews of my maps, Haruko.

[Not Jabba]

5 hours ago, Phade102 said:

Fair enough. I'm trying to figure out what the stigma about Zdoom is from other people =)

 

The thing about ZDoom features is, you can't just do a regular Doom level and throw a few of them in. They feel random, they don't mesh with the overall experience of Doom, and they feel out of place to people who are used to the more classic feel of the original game. And like 80-90% of ZDoom maps are just that -- Doom levels with a few features thrown in, or a few monsters that get used a couple of times each, rather poorly, so that it feels like it would have been better if they weren't there at all. The problem is compounded by the fact that more people map for lower-tech formats, without custom monsters, and so they've gotten really good at it. It's easier to use relatively new features or content in a noobish way, because their use hasn't been perfected.

 

Based on my experience as a player and a reviewer, the only way to make a really good ZDoom level is to completely overhaul the game and use a ton of the more advanced features in a cohesive way. It's best if it doesn't feel like Doom anymore, and it's also important to use any new content (custom monsters, etc.) in a well-balanced, consistent way. Shadows of the Nightmare Realm is a fantastic example of this. Path Over the Abyss, Plutonium Sandpit, and Water Labs are some other good recent ones, or, if you want to go a little more classic, something like Dutch Devil's Total Control. I think as more of these maps keep appearing, some of the stigma may go away, but there will still always be crap maps -- and if a vanilla map is bad, nobody's going to blame vanilla Doom, but if a ZDoom map is bad, people will probably continue to blame ZDoom.

Edited June 1, 2017 by Not Jabba

[Phade102]

3 hours ago, Not Jabba said:

The thing about ZDoom features is, you can't just do a regular Doom level and throw a few of them in. They feel random, they don't mesh with the overall experience of Doom, and they feel out of place to people who are used to the more classic feel of the original game. And like 80-90% of ZDoom maps are just that -- Doom levels with a few features thrown in, or a few monsters that get used a couple of times each, rather poorly, so that it feels like it would have been better if they weren't there at all. The problem is compounded by the fact that more people map for lower-tech formats, without custom monsters, and so they've gotten really good at it. It's easier to use relatively new features or content in a noobish way, because their use hasn't been perfected.

 

Based on my experience as a player and a reviewer, the only way to make a really good ZDoom level is to completely overhaul the game and use a ton of the more advanced features in a cohesive way. It's best if it doesn't feel like Doom anymore, and it's also important to use any new content (custom monsters, etc.) in a well-balanced, consistent way. Shadows of the Nightmare Realm is a fantastic example of this. Path Over the Abyss, Plutonium Sandpit, and Water Labs are some other good recent ones, or, if you want to go a little more classic, something like Dutch Devil's Total Control. I think as more of these maps keep appearing, some of the stigma may go away, but there will still always be crap maps -- and if a vanilla map is bad, nobody's going to blame vanilla Doom, but if a ZDoom map is bad, people will probably continue to blame ZDoom.

Thats a good way of putting it. I love UDMF, and now that i'm using it i'm trying to use more and more features and make it f eel more than just a vanillia episode. I may not be throwing 3d floors in everywhere and slopes, but it doesnt stop it from being a definite zdoom map.

[Gez]

7 hours ago, Not Jabba said:

The thing about ZDoom features is, you can't just do a regular Doom level and throw a few of them in. They feel random, they don't mesh with the overall experience of Doom, and they feel out of place to people who are used to the more classic feel of the original game.

Man, I don't really agree with that. The thing is that many ZDoom features can be used in vanilla or Boom/MBF through hacks, except they'll be more limited and/or harder to set up. Slopes? 3D floors? Custom monsters? Scripted events? Colored lights? You can replicate all that.

 

Vanilla slope from The Darkening, episode 2

 

So your slope is a bunch of 1-unit thick sectors and the illusion is ruined when you look at it too closely; your 3D floors use rendering hacks that means they have to stay in the distance, or instant-moving effects that are incompatible with multiplayer, your custom monsters rely on DeHackEd, your scripted events are triggered by voodoo dolls on conveyor belts, and your colored lights are created by using custom flats and textures with the color baked in. The thing is that despite all the kludges and limitations, nobody will find them out of place.

[NinjaLiquidator]

1 hour ago, Gez said:

your scripted events are triggered by voodoo dolls on conveyor belts

3D pickable items, more floors over themselves, and xy-move illusion can be also done that way.

 

Things you cannot do is to have custom map interconnection and custom monsters/weapons/items without replacing iwad ones.

[Phade102]

On 30/05/2017 at 10:41 AM, DMPhobos said:

The D64 lights really make a difference, here's a comparison with and without the colors

 

 

Just wondering, how are those ceiling lights done? Can they be done just with UDMF flat? or do they require an ACS script? O.o

[Dragonfly]

The ceiling lights are a tetxure that fades to transparent or black, and then has the additive translucency blending mode applied. I'll update this post with a demo wad, including a texture shortly.

 

Aforementioned demo PK3:

 

http://joshuaosullivan.co.uk/misc-doom/glowexample.pk3

 

Simply made a basic texture, set it as the mid-texture of the linedefs you want it on, then mess with the translucency settings (image below) until you're happy. I made this map for Doom2 IWAD, ZDoom based ports, UDMF format.

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2017 by Dragonfly

[Phade102]

3 hours ago, Dragonfly said:

The ceiling lights are a tetxure that fades to transparent or black, and then has the additive translucency blending mode applied. I'll update this post with a demo wad, including a texture shortly.

 

Aforementioned demo PK3:

 

http://joshuaosullivan.co.uk/misc-doom/glowexample.pk3

 

Simply made a basic texture, set it as the mid-texture of the linedefs you want it on, then mess with the translucency settings (image below) until you're happy. I made this map for Doom2 IWAD, ZDoom based ports, UDMF format.

 

 

 

Oh thats really cool =O THanks Dragonfly!

[Guest Unregistered account]

yeah so apparently if a hanging dude is too close to a door when it opens he just kinda

chills there

in the face of anyone who wants to pass through

Edited June 2, 2017 by Unregistered account

[scifista42]

Placing a thing that hangs from ceiling into such a position that the thing's hitbox overlaps another sector with a lower ceiling height, is just as bad as placing a thing that stands on the floor into such a position that the thing's hitbox overlaps another sector with a higher floor height. The thing will jump to that other height if the other floor/ceiling moves, and sometimes even if some completely another floor/ceiling in a completely different part of the map moves, so you should just avoid doing that.

[Phade102]

25 minutes ago, Kapanyo said:

yeah so apparently if a hanging dude is too close to a door when it opens he just kinda

chills there

in the face of anyone who wants to pass through

Thats a really doom 2 styled looking map! And hey corpses are cool.

[Guest Unregistered account]

25 minutes ago, Phade102 said:

Thats a really doom 2 styled looking map! And hey corpses are cool.

Well, thank you! I guess it was more inspired by Plutonia, but yeah - corpses are cool.

I hope nobody takes that out of context.

[Gez]

52 minutes ago, Kapanyo said:

yeah so apparently if a hanging dude is too close to a door when it opens he just kinda

chills there

in the face of anyone who wants to pass through

That could make a neat effect if the sprite looked more convincing (no "I'm hanging from a rope attached to empty air" thing). Open a door, a corpse falls, kinda jumpscary.

[Guest Unregistered account]

40 minutes ago, scifista42 said:

Placing a thing that hangs from ceiling into such a position that the thing's hitbox overlaps another sector with a lower ceiling height, is just as bad as placing a thing that stands on the floor into such a position that the thing's hitbox overlaps another sector with a higher floor height. The thing will jump to that other height if the other floor/ceiling moves, and sometimes even if some completely another floor/ceiling in a completely different part of the map moves, so you should just avoid doing that.

Thanks, I'll work around it in future. I was always under the impression that, as long as more than ~half of a thing was overlapping one sector, it would remain firmly planted on that sector. Clearly not.

[Guest Unregistered account]

11 minutes ago, Gez said:

That could make a neat effect if the sprite looked more convincing (no "I'm hanging from a rope attached to empty air" thing). Open a door, a corpse falls, kinda jumpscary.

I actually did something similar in an entry to Battle of the Bits, where you're walking through darkened wood-and-metal corridors, and suddenly a corpse instant-lowers into your face. Unfortunately, due to Vanilla limits and the fact that I accidentally released an unfinished and unbeatable version, it didn't win in any categories other than architecture.

Edited June 2, 2017 by Unregistered account

[Guest Unregistered account]

 

Making something for that game I mentioned a few pages back. This is going to be a forest area, although clearly it's still made of ambiguous angled blocks here. Also still using Doom textures, of course.

I actually just made this area after finishing some music that'll play in here. This particular area is more ambient and exploration-based than scary.

 

 

BTW, does anyone know of a way to disable the aliasing for low-resolutions? I'd prefer to play with a pixelated screen.

Edited June 2, 2017 by Unregistered account

[scifista42]

In GZDoom, see Display Options -> OpenGL Options -> Texture Options -> Texture Filter Mode.

[Guest Unregistered account]

Thanks again, @scifista42! You're the best =D

[Guest Unregistered account]

Oh, it's already set to none. I think it must be a quirk with my laptop itself; the same thing happens with Yume Nikki, another low-res deal. It must not happen with Chocolate Doom because that's just displaying the game, not actually changing the res.

Thanks anyway!

[scifista42]

Try other options in the OpenGL Options part or its subparts. Or, are you even using the OpenGL renderer in GZDoom? If not, look into the Software Renderer options instead, which also include some kinds of filtering.

[Phade102]

3 hours ago, Kapanyo said:

Well, thank you! I guess it was more inspired by Plutonia, but yeah - corpses are cool.

I hope nobody takes that out of context.

I can see Plutonia in it too! I was just thinking like, inmost dens, monster condo sort. But I guess those maps also helped inspire Plutonia as well.

[scifista42]

^ "Helped inspire" is an understatement. Plutonia literally copied their themes and architectures. :)

[129thVisplane]

Spoiler

There's no gameplay here, only crazy amounts of video lag. Move along.

[Fuzzball]

That's not Doom! :P

[Guest Unregistered account]

Oh, bloody hell, that looks insane.

[Da Werecat]

1 hour ago, scifista42 said:

Try other options in the OpenGL Options part or its subparts. Or, are you even using the OpenGL renderer in GZDoom? If not, look into the Software Renderer options instead, which also include some kinds of filtering.

It's not the port, it's how some monitors treat low resolutions - they get interpolated.

 

[edit]

 

No, wait. Why does it show on the screenshot then?

 

Edited June 2, 2017 by Da Werecat

[Guest Unregistered account]

Well, the screenshot is taken directly through Zandro, so... I dunno.

[Phade102]

2 hours ago, scifista42 said:

^ "Helped inspire" is an understatement. Plutonia literally copied their themes and architectures. :)

See, I never really knew that! I mean, I saw similarities, but I never knew for SURE that they copied it. I really loved the look of inmost dens and monster condo, Monster condo being one of my favourite doom maps.