Ultimate Doom “In Name Only” - [Limit Removing] - Artist for titlepic/M-Doom etc needed

[galileo31dos01]

31 minutes ago, dobu gabu maru said:

Thanks for playing! Due to how constrictive the map is, I can't do a lot to mitigate the player swiping the shotgun off a dead sergeant; I figure it's always like an extra bonus if you manage to grab one, as like 60% of the map still has to be chainsaw'd to death. Thanks for the info on the armor stuff too.

 

Fair enough, in a circumstance where a player is low on health and has no reliable chance to saw cacos safely, having some backup shells would help. I grabbed around 16 counting the backpack, could have been more if I tried harder. Even so, there was never an urge to use any, and hopefully other players will realize chainsaw is the default tool and that max kills is perfectly achievable. It's very clear imo, but you know in common practice most people instantly ditch it and look for anything else. I think it's nice that this wad includes a map that the IWADs should have had.

[cannonball]

Finally time to play the newer maps

E4M3 - The relative size means that it won't take long for most to figure out, I really couldn't handle the fight beyond the blue door though that might just be me but it felt like there was no strategy really that worked for me though it might just be that I am a bad player but it felt like the monsters always had an opportunity to crowd me out as you couldn't stay out in the open for too long before having to dive down one of the branches for a radsuit which tended to result in around a dozen monsters crowding the entrance effectively ending your run.

 

E3M8 - Effectively what Dobu said, the map seems to run correctly for me at least though it needs some real renovation work. Also the cyberdemon can be baited to do the dirty work for you regarding the Mastermind as the sheer distance gives a near 100% chance of victory to the cyber and even if the mastermind does win you only need a little ammo to finish the job. That cyber needs to be removed or placed somewhere on route where it cannot infight with the "final boss".

 

E2M3 - Whilst I think progress has been made here, I still think this needs more tweaking to give a better player experience, the playing space is well contained but I still think more interconnectivity can be achieved here. 

[dobu gabu maru]

Updated E4M8. Now includes difficulties, a simplified automap, and black textures so the map isn't so line heavy (I was going to avoid them altogether but Scotty uses them in his map, so :P). I thiiiink this is probably my favorite map I've made for Doom.

 

8 minutes ago, cannonball said:

Finally time to play the newer maps

Mmmm I feel like that blue key door section in E4M3 is the one thing I can actually handle haha. I typically just try and aggro one branch, chainsaw fellas with my back to the wall at the northern section or in one of the cubbies, and then grab the radsuit once it starts blinking. The other branch is simple once you have a lot more breathing room. Guess I'll have to see what others think.

 

Also I dunno if E2M3's issue is the interconnectivity. Honestly, there probably should be a lift or something to allow the enemies at the top of the map to down there and fight the player, but I think the bigger problem is just that it's designed boxy room by boxy room and long hallway by long hallway. There's only so many walls you can remove before you have like 200 enemies that the player is easily circle strafing across multiple "zones".

Edited March 7, 2019 by dobu gabu maru

[cannonball]

I suspected that I just sucked :P

I guess E2M3 will need to be revisited at some point in the near future. I don't know whether there is some way of being able to use the barebones to make something neat. On thing I forgot to mention was that obvious the blue key trap is a little pointless as there is no lock-in trigger due to the edits made.

[Walter confetti]

Fixed by the Dobu feedback:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/i8e0qpk01ik4ee1/dai-hop.wad/file

 

hoping this time will be ok.

 

Also it was like 3 years i let untouched my map before these days...

Edited March 10, 2019 by Walter confetti
fixed link

[_bruce_]

Did a bit of fine-tuning and as a side effect I got the vis-plane count high enough to require a limit-less .exe.

I guess... the map fits in now.

E4M1_v17.7z

[cannonball]

@Walter confetti - The download doesn't appear to work for me, all I get is an "upload in progress" message, seems to be a regular problem for mediafile.

@_bruce_ - Your map is fine now, though I suspect the random voodoo doll is not supposed to be there (By the berserk pack)

[_bruce_]

Good catch - yes, this was an oversight. THX

[Walter confetti]

link is fixed now

[Quantum Dranger]

http://www.mediafire.com/file/psgudsw3ff3a7pl/E3M8B.wad/file

 

I reoriented the right path to stop the cyber demon from infighting with the mastermind. This also makes the right side an option for reaching the mastermind, which is something that I think worked out well.

Edited March 19, 2019 by Quantum Dranger

[cannonball]

Just an update for E4M5

This should make the map a little less evil in terms of spots where infinite height could cause some hassle, the map should also play a little bit quicker and more fluidly now.

E4M5 - CB.zip

 

E3M4 is a little on the easy side, but no real issues otherwise from myself, plenty of environmental hazards to watch out for which is good.

 

Edited March 21, 2019 by cannonball

[Steve D]

I've had some problems over the last couple months, between a heavy IRL workload and a nasty tooth infection that not only drained my energy, but gave me a full day's worth of "Shoot me in the face to make it stop!" agony. I accomplished very little in April except to realize that the over-complicated E4M6 I was working on totally sucked. It was too big and too ugly. So I started a new E4M6 that's going a lot better and should be done in a week or so, afterwhich I'll go hard on E1M2 so we can get this project finished.

 

Here's a couple pics from the new E4M6. I'm not sure how many tricks I'll pull to generate the proper wickedness, but for one thing it has a lot of lava and zero radsuits. ;)

 

 

[Nine Inch Heels]

Just wanted to let you guys know I'm also still working on my map, but I really had to take a break from it earlier due to being limited to og roster being pretty frustrating, and spring time is generally a phase of high stress and ample workload for me. All things considered, the map is in a half-playable state on UV, needs the final section and secret exit worked in properly, and when it's entirely playable I'll post it here to get a better idea of what manner of difficulty adjustments people may want/need for HMP and below.

[Aquila Chrysaetos]

Got to speak up on what's going on with me.

Had my computer crash on me (just like last year, I almost can't believe it), and as a result I lost most of what was on the hard drive. I hadn't backed up my map, so I don't have that anymore,so I'll have to give up the E1M7 slot.

[Guest Unregistered account]

22 hours ago, Steve D said:

I've had some problems over the last couple months, between a heavy IRL workload and a nasty tooth infection that not only drained my energy, but gave me a full day's worth of "Shoot me in the face to make it stop!" agony. I accomplished very little in April except to realize that the over-complicated E4M6 I was working on totally sucked. It was too big and too ugly. So I started a new E4M6 that's going a lot better and should be done in a week or so, afterwhich I'll go hard on E1M2 so we can get this project finished.

 

Here's a couple pics from the new E4M6. I'm not sure how many tricks I'll pull to generate the proper wickedness, but for one thing it has a lot of lava and zero radsuits. ;)

 

 

It's simple but the effect of the dark cavern with the bright sky shining through the cracks looks awesome.

[Noiser]

13 hours ago, Aquila Chrysaetos said:

Had my computer crash on me (just like last year, I almost can't believe it), and as a result I lost most of what was on the hard drive. I hadn't backed up my map, so I don't have that anymore,so I'll have to give up the E1M7 slot.

oh, that sucks man =/
I know how it feels when you lose everything on a HD crash. Maybe you can recover some files one day.
 

Edited May 8, 2019 by Noiser

[Steve D]

The E4M6 beta is finally ready; Against Thee Wickedly

 

Music track is Godhood Part 8 (The Void), by Jimmy

 

There's lots of lava.

 

There's no radsuits.

 

There's no monster closets, about 95% incidental combat except for one trapped item.

 

A lot of the areas are extremely dark. Hello, Mr. Spectre! ;)

 

Difficulty settings are enabled. 

 

It's a pretty nasty map, though some players may breeze right through. I died like a dog. ;D  But hey, this is E4, right?

 

There are 2 keys you have to jump for, so beware of getting infinite-talled. There's also a lot of weird angles and alcoves, and sometimes monsters can get stuck in them, so maxing the map can be a challenge, especially if you get low on health and have to cross  lava.

 

I considered making some diorama detail and/or adding glimpses to an inaccessible outdoor area, but decided to get this out fast instead. I can also spruce up the Rockred tunnels, which are kind of bland. As it stands, the map is relatively low detail, but the room shapes are complex, which IMO tends to balance things out. I also wanted the dark areas to be really dark, without any wall lighting, to make combat more difficult. You'll see green slime and maybe even Cyb rockets emerge from the shadows. The darkness and the lava make up the "wickedly" part. 

 

I can make the map easier or harder as required. I've only tested UV so far.

 

I'm going to take about a week off before starting E1M2.

 

Here's a few more screenies;

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 25, 2019 by Steve D

[Pegleg]

1 hour ago, Steve D said:

There's lots of lava.

 

There's no radsuits.

 

You, Sir, are a madman.

 

 

In all seriousness, the map looks great. And I see you went with sound pipes instead of merged sectors for your teleport closet.

[Steve D]

3 hours ago, Pegleg said:

 

You, Sir, are a madman.

 

Thank you, thank you very much. ;)

 

I've done a lot of merged sector teleport closets, but IMO they're a PITA, because you have to check to make certain your sectors are still merged at the end of construction, or your teleport traps break. That happened in Heat Miser, likely my most well known map, in Mayhem 2048. There's 3 Chaingunners who fail to teleport. I'm sure most players are happy about that, since they arrive at an especially unpleasant time in an already very unpleasant map. I forget which mistake made that happen, since it had worked throughout construction, but it was probably in the very last revision. After a few more sectors got unmerged in various maps, I grew tired of constantly checking them and went back to the old reliable sound tubes. To those who say, "That's so '90s" -- ironic in my case ;) -- I say, "Fine, because they always work!" :)

[dobu gabu maru]

Lovely map Steve—you scored two pelts off my back. I thought you were gonna get more but you're actually fairly generous with your health pickups in the darkness, and its a map that's really aided by foreknowledge. I personally didn't feel that it needed any peeking into outdoor areas, as I like the cramped, dark, spiraly nature of the map—it's very unlike you, which is a joy. I also loved the triple cyber surprise early on, as it really makes the player panic.

 

Dunno if it's intended or not, but the cyberdemons get caught up here on the map, and can't descend down to the lower levels (don't mind the missing textures, was too lazy to load them up). Also the bottom-left most tunnel on the map (the one that leads to the PG) was pretty easy to miss. The entrance to it might need to be a bit brighter, or have like a single candle to show you the way (I had to find it via the minimap). If you do that, I'd suggest taking the cell packs for the plasma gun and sprinkling them around the level, as the PG with 240 cell downright cripples a lot of challenge on the map (stick one in that mostly-useless secret hallway!). Having to run around and gather the cell is a much more balanced option. I'd also recommend making the key doors open fast with whatever that S1 key door trigger is—no one wants to die in lava waiting for slow doors to open :P Also mark that soulsphere a secret!

 

Lastly, I'd actually recommend making this a bit harder. Easiest way to do this would be to remove like 2-3 medikits and 3-4 stimpacks. Make the player feel like they have to fight for the health, or that they're always on death's door. IMO the map is actually really well-balanced as is, but it's also fairly easy—easy for even E3 I'd say. Here are some suggestions. Note that you should probably keep these health pickups for skills 2 & 3 (but seriously, ditch that green armor at the right—why give that to the player when there's a blue armor nearby?)

 

Cool map—I really like the radsuit-less nature of it a lot.

Edited May 24, 2019 by dobu gabu maru

[Steve D]

On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 7:33 PM, dobu gabu maru said:

I personally didn't feel that it needed any peeking into outdoor areas, as I like the cramped, dark, spiraly nature of the map—it's very unlike you, which is a joy.

 

Ah, I see what's going on. The regular Steve D maps aren't good enough! I have to step out of my comfort zone and be "so unlike" myself to measure up! ;D j/k

 

Thanks for the play and commentary. I liked your suggestions, and I'm always happy when someone says, "Make it harder." It's like getting a license to steal. :) 

 

The stairs where the Cybs get caught up was a late-map addition. Originally, the only way out of that room was the side passage near the Backpack. The Cybs probably get hung up either because of the complex shape of the steps or because there's not enough room between the step edges and the wall for the Cyb's hitbox to pass. When I added this feature, it was mainly to satisfy the design philosophy of Amiga Demo Party maps, which calls for extreme non-linearity and multiple paths into and out of areas, on the theory that it's always better if monsters can pursue you, even if the cost is giving the player more escape routes. It would obviously cause more panic for the player -- and give me more pelts! -- if the Cybs could get down there. But there's another consideration. If the Cybs go down, they might be unable to get back up, and for me, it's more important for the Cybs to provide constant threat on the main level than to go down in the lower level, even if it means the Cybs don't kill players as often. In this case, the important thing is the threat, and the panic that comes from Cybs being almost everywhere, as you try to navigate all the dark tunnels. In my playtesting, I was almost never able to evade the Cybs no matter which path I took. It seemed they were either already in the area I was going to, or would turn the corner and threaten me within moments of my arrival, so I had to keep running. And as for deaths, the majority came as I was battling my way up the Yellow Key stairs because a Cyb followed me through the curvy tunnels and put a rocket up my ass while the riff-raff impeded my progress. Also, consider the impact on Maxers if the Cybs get stuck on the lower level. If they're having some health stress at the end, will they want to cross lava to go get the Cyb(s) trapped below, or will they be forced to exit instead? These are some of the considerations that were in my mind when I chose not to make the stairs bigger. As it stands, the Cybs can get far enough down to command most of the area below, essentially becoming turreted ledge snipers . The only safe spaces are behind the columns or near the Backpack. But the player should face pressure from Cacos and Imps while attempting to hide. As you know, it's also possible to grab the PG early and take out a Cyb from below, which will make a player feel good. That's not a bad thing, either, since it allows for strategizing.

 

After that long-winded explanation, I agree about reducing the health. In all my playthroughs, I only died twice from melting in the lava. It's a tricky thing to make this kind of map, and I obviously had ADO:2000's E3M6 by @Chris Hansen in mind. As you know, I loved that map, but most people felt otherwise. Chris also did a lot of nasty nukage work in his recent Gore maps, especially the second one. Beautiful work there, Chris! Suffice to say that I worried about players reacting badly if I forced them to tank too much lava damage, so I used a lot of health and created islands to promote survival. But when the health is used up, there ain't no more, so they'll be forced to make decisions. Mapping note: originally, there were no islands near the Rocket Launcher. I decided to add them once I had the full complement of Cybs, and trust me, it was no fun building them in the midst of already existing gradient lighting lines. Talk about genius planning! ;D

 

Your cell pack suggestion is really good, too. Originally, when I had only 1 Cyb, there were only had 3 cell charges near the PG. I replaced them with the 2 packs because of the extra Cybs and because I added more monsters up there.

 

I'll wait to see if there's any more commentary, but I'll be using most of your suggestions no matter what.

 

One last thing -- the midi is Godhead Part 8 (The Void) by @Jimmy. I often get a bit sloppy about crediting the music, so I wanted to make note of that. I changed my above post to reflect this as well.

 

[Nine Inch Heels]

Alright, sorry about the delay, work is a nasty habit. Here is the first playable version for E3M6, ready for examination: udino_E3M6v1.zip

Update: grab E3M6v3 here

(It's already slotted in its supposed spot, so make sure you warp/IDCLEV there respectively)

 

A few notes:
-UV and HMP have the exact same monster count (154), but one particular platforming section has been made significantly less difficult for HMP and lower, perhaps that also makes it more enjoyable/doable for keyboarders, the UV iteration might drive you up the wall (Dobu said platforming was fine, so I guess I went to town, heh).

 

-UV/HMP might be kinda stingy with ammo

-the easy settings have a few less monsters, and offer a BFG to help deal with an early and somewhat nasty fight in the map. If you find it too lethal on higher settings, try hntr, I promise it won't belittle you.

 

-Reaching the secret exit requires a rocket jump around a corner (just a small gimmicky jump), I've tested it on itytd to see if the reduced damage makes a difference, and it works fine as far as I can see.

 

-the last bits aren't entirely detailed yet, I'll add a few touches here and there to make it look a bit more interesting, but since I may still have to do stuff around I figured I'd wait with that.

 

-map might take somewhere between 10 and 15 minutes to finish, I believe.

-map has no inescapeable pits whatsoever

 

All that said, I'm looking forward to feedback, death threats, the usual stuff, basically :P

 

udino_E3M6v2.zip

Edited July 14, 2019 by Nine Inch Heels

[Magnusblitz]

I (stupidly) took a whirl on UV and, well... after savescumming my way past the baron/demon/cyber fight by running away with 8 health, I got to the marble column platforming section and gave up after one of the walkover triggers closed one of the doors again. Will try to take a look (on a lower difficulty) later.

[SleepyVelvet]

21 hours ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

E3M6, ready for examination: udino_E3M6v1.zip

here is fda noisy_udino_E3M6v1_ fda.zip.  first on uv. second on hntr. third on nomonsters because good music choice and kinda wanted to stroll through it like a somber park.  I died on all of them :)

 

On 12/14/2014 at 4:21 AM, cannonball said:

To this there is a small resource pack with the various liquid fall textures which can be used for this wad.
Download - http://www.mediafire.com/download/p0efqobbx62cxpp/udino_liquids.wad

oops, that explains the homs i was seeing

Edited June 29, 2019 by NoisyVelvet

[Magnusblitz]

Okay, taking a whirl on E3M6 on HMP...

 

- Not a fan of some of the first couple fights (which I believe are the same on HMP and UV?) The first one (barons/imps/RL/green armor) feels very RNG heavy in that you're just hoping the monsters don't decide to walk up within splash range of the rocket launcher - it's certainly doable, but relies on the AI playing nice. You can always retreat and fire from down below but it's really easy to waste rockets shooting from that far away and I'll be damned if I'm going to climb around that tower again. The third fight (demons/barons/cyber/PG) I've ended up just running every time, not sure how it's intended to be done (heavy infighting I suppose?). Both fights basically feel like they're asking to be run away from and never returned to, which to me feels bad.

 

- No real problems with the water/crusher and the thin ledges at the end (each took me maybe 3-4 attempts) but just could not do the square tower section. Not sure what the difference is between HMP and UV, seemed the same for the half I played. Most of the time I was failing on the W-bend by the second switch, the few times I got past the second door I ended up falling off. And I really don't know why there's a tripwire that closes the first door and requires hitting the first switch again, just seems a bit mean since it's already so tough. I think I'm one of the more pro-platforming folks here, so I wouldn't be surprised if this section alone garners you much rancor.

 

- Overall it's certainly an impressive map, both visually and gameplay-wise. The half after the red door does feel a bit less striking, but you mentioned that you hadn't finished detailing it yet.

 

Bugs:

- The two 'steps' before the lava right behind the start (sectors 339 and 340) are tagged as damaging which I assume was unintended (the other steps aren't, just the lava)

- This vinewall clips into the ground on my port (software ZDoom), not sure about others. I believe it can be fixed by making the two sides of the vine midtexture different sectors, and changing the brightness of one by 1 (which won't visually show, but will fix the graphic error).

- HOM here (again, may be limited to software ZDoom), should be fixable by just moving around one of the vertices of the offending sector and letting the map redo the node building.

- You said no inescapable pits, but I couldn't find my way out of here (the pit around the water/crusher puzzle).

- You can spy some unslightly brown off in the distance over the edges here and here.

[Nine Inch Heels]

9 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

Okay, taking a whirl on E3M6 on HMP...

Finally some good feedback. Cool, let's see what we have.
 

 

10 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

Not a fan of some of the first couple fights (which I believe are the same on HMP and UV?) The first one (barons/imps/RL/green armor) feels very RNG heavy in that you're just hoping the monsters don't decide to walk up within splash range of the rocket launcher - it's certainly doable, but relies on the AI playing nice. You can always retreat and fire from down below but it's really easy to waste rockets shooting from that far away and I'll be damned if I'm going to climb around that tower again.

Yeah, all fights on HMP and UV are identical. First fight you have to either play patiently, which is recommended anyway due to how easy it is to run out of rockets, or you can use the platforms outside along with the added real-estate that comes with hitting the switch to make it easier. Sure, falling off the platforms might be an issue here, in which case I think it's probably best to make one of the first platforms just a bit bigger to encourage that approach more. If the cybie-turret turns out to ruin that backup-method too often to be worthwhile I'll move it a bit, or place an obstacle to make it safer for the players. Frankly, that fight isn't really meant to get beaten without a few bruises anyway, and since it's followed by a "health-reset" I thought I could "get away" with how it plays, but sure, I'll see what I can do there.

 

17 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

The third fight (demons/barons/cyber/PG) I've ended up just running every time, not sure how it's intended to be done (heavy infighting I suppose?).

3rd fight has basically built-in cheese to make it easier to get the cybie tethered to something else, but it's not required to beat the fight to begin with. Getting rid of the pinkies quickly, making the cyb infight just about anything, while fending off whatever goes for the player works fine for me. I can see what I can do to make it a bit more forgiving, if needs be, but I'm not exactly sure what I'm going to go for just yet.

 

22 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

No real problems with the water/crusher and the thin ledges at the end (each took me maybe 3-4 attempts) but just could not do the square tower section. Not sure what the difference is between HMP and UV, seemed the same for the half I played. Most of the time I was failing on the W-bend by the second switch, the few times I got past the second door I ended up falling off. And I really don't know why there's a tripwire that closes the first door and requires hitting the first switch again, just seems a bit mean since it's already so tough. I think I'm one of the more pro-platforming folks here, so I wouldn't be surprised if this section alone garners you much rancor.

HMP and UV have a different "tightrope section" in there. Pathing on UV is longer, and therefore requires running across the "rope" faster, with little leeway for fuckups, HMP and lower have that section shortened, which means you can do fine without SR40 and afford making a few more mistakes as well. All the remaining platforms and switches are identical, because those are the easy part of the whole "trial". Linedefs resetting the opened the doors is part of how the whole thing can reset, and I don't plan on changing/removing that aspect at all, even if it's perceived as mean, sorry.

 

29 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

The two 'steps' before the lava right behind the start (sectors 339 and 340) are tagged as damaging which I assume was unintended (the other steps aren't, just the lava)

Ah, I was afraid I'd miss any of that. Easy fix, done.
 

29 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

This vinewall clips into the ground on my port (software ZDoom), not sure about others. I believe it can be fixed by making the two sides of the vine midtexture different sectors, and changing the brightness of one by 1 (which won't visually show, but will fix the graphic error).

Hmm, okay I'll see what I can do there. If it ends up not working out at all, I'll simply put something else there. I mean, the area feels a tad barren anyway, so giving it another look definitely won't hurt anyway.

 

32 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

HOM here (again, may be limited to software ZDoom), should be fixable by just moving around one of the vertices of the offending sector and letting the map redo the node building

Yeah, doesn't show for me in GLBoom at all. If I can "replicate" that in a software renderer it's an easy fix tho.

 

33 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

You said no inescapable pits, but I couldn't find my way out of here (the pit around the water/crusher puzzle)

I... could have sworn I put a teleporter down there.... Must have been lost when I had to undo a bunch of stuff, sorry about that. Also noticed just now that something else got undone in the process as well :/

 

36 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

You can spy some unslightly brown off in the distance over the edges here and here.

Alright, good to know, truth be told I didn't yet do any of the "cleaning up", but knowing these 2 spots are prone to showing anything helps, thanks.

 

Alright, I'll give this map a slight overhaul around and about the next weekend, thank you so much for giving the map a shot.

[Magnusblitz]

2 hours ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

3rd fight has basically built-in cheese to make it easier to get the cybie tethered to something else, but it's not required to beat the fight to begin with. Getting rid of the pinkies quickly, making the cyb infight just about anything, while fending off whatever goes for the player works fine for me. I can see what I can do to make it a bit more forgiving, if needs be, but I'm not exactly sure what I'm going to go for just yet.

 

I might try giving it some more tries, what usually happens for me is that upon everything teleporting in I would go out to one of the semicircles and get penned in (running out of plasma before being able to kill all the demons/barons). I had better luck retreating a bit, waiting for the cyber to teleport behind, then getting him infighting with the others, but sometimes I'd just eat a rocket or again get hemmed in. The latter is admittedly more skill-based and not unfair, though it does kinda require some knowledge (which, whether needing to 'learn the map' is good or bad is its own debate and up to the author).

 

HMP and UV have a different "tightrope section" in there. Pathing on UV is longer, and therefore requires running across the "rope" faster, with little leeway for fuckups, HMP and lower have that section shortened, which means you can do fine without SR40 and afford making a few more mistakes as well. All the remaining platforms and switches are identical, because those are the easy part of the whole "trial". Linedefs resetting the opened the doors is part of how the whole thing can reset, and I don't plan on changing/removing that aspect at all, even if it's perceived as mean, sorry.

 

Ah, gotcha. I wasn't sure if the door closing linedef in front of the second door was required as part of the technical design or not. Either way it wasn't really the tough part (reaching the second door was) but it just felt like insult to injury. ;)

[Nine Inch Heels]

33 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

upon everything teleporting in I would go out to one of the semicircles and get penned in (running out of plasma before being able to kill all the demons/barons).

Yeah, you're really supposed to get rid of some meat first before dodging/hiding in the semi-circles. I know it's not impossible to squeeze even past the cyberdemon if he tries to get in there with you at times (if you can react early enough), but it's depending on the RNG ever so slightly, and it's definitely not the intended way to beat the fight to begin with. Sticking to rockets first, and only using the PR either when getting cornered such that you need an emergency tool, and to oust a slightly weakened cybie is the better approach as far as I'm concerned.

 

What the entire fight really tries to do is to pin you down somehow, so anything that occupies a relatively large amount of space is high on the list of priority targets, so basically pinkies and cacos are worth paying attention to early on while trying to get the cybie tied to a baron, for example. If you can pull that off and get like 1-2 barons angry at the cybie, you should be able to clean that area up reasonably well. Conversely, if you can get the cybie to infight the cacos, you can either lure a few free-roaming barons over for "support", or just rocket a few of them down and use plasma to kill the cyb quickly. Depending on how the fight develops early on you just have to adjust your play somehow. I know the fight is slightly nasty, which is why hntr/itytd hand out a BFG instead of the PR.

 

Note that before anything spawns in, the cybie has line of sight from across the lava-lake, so if you want to give yourself an easier start into the fight, that's your window of opportunity right there. ;-)

[galileo31dos01]

Not-that-constructive feedback incoming for @Nine Inch Heels's map. Could not resist to taste it. HMP, Crispy Doom, saving after each set piece. 

 

Spoiler

 

- First of all, marvelous work on the visual/layout department. There was no moment I wasn't impressed by the attention to careful texturing, detailing and curvy figures, all kinds of geometry, from the metal trims to the combination of different flats. My favourite parts being the sections with highlighted platforms on black background. 

 

- On a gameplay side it would also be close to 10/10, personally speaking, mainly because I was stubborn to conquer the platforming setups legally, which I did, big surprise to me, all manageable with keyboard-only and the OG status bar present, fairly medium/slightly hard-ish IMO, and I gotta say the one prior the RK was incredibly fun. Perhaps the absence of death pits contributed to my own experience being smooth, like far far away from loosing my sanity. Man that felt rewarding.

 

- Fight by fight: the RL bit, I will agree with to resize one of the platforms to have some more equilibrium, in order to kill the dudes there, because I jumped out and skipped them seeing there was no way to avoid splash, of course whether you have to sacrifice a bit of your health or not isn't the problem if you get a boost later, the thing is how consistent it is to come out alive, and that I can't tell right now. Will give it a more in-detail try later to check alternatives. Possibly the cover from the cyberdemon is a good idea.

 

- Berserk part, all fine. After killing all the stuff that spawned in first, up when climbing the first step of the stairs some belated dudes teleported in, I suppose that's part of the intention to distract you from the baron if you get closer?

 

- PR part, yes this one's tough but saying something NIH makes is "tough" is like saying water is wet. I dig the idea, used the distant cyber to distract the barons, then the closer one for obvious purposes, though I will point out in one of my attempts it took like 5 seconds for the cyber to spawn, which screwed me. What linedef would trigger him, same as pinkies/barons? anyways, also are there cacodemons on UV?

 

- Raising platforming, personal highlight of the map, ingenious idea. Took me multiple attempts and it was super tricky to reach the last bit in time, without skipping switches. A small suggestion would be to apply scroll action to sp_face teleporter, being static looks odd to me.

 

- Crushers, how did I not die... all good I guess, just stand on the candles and you'll be fine, very intense.

 

- Descending platforms, my only issue was that most imps survived even up to two shots (or punches), because that's how crappy the SG can be sometimes, and being so quick not to burn my health on the lava meanwhile meant I had to skip kills, simple setup but I think a boost at the end would be a good idea for lower skills, a berserk maybe or a couple more medkits, so one could still exchange some damage to stay another second to kill those imps as effective as possible. Perhaps rockets would have been more viable as I was carrying a lot, but I didn't know what was coming next.

 

- Close quarters in the cave, meant to carve through low-HP with rockets and reduce some barons until there's enough space, tricky and fun. 
 

- Orchasm section, sure to be expected at some point. There was one attempt where the middle cyber decided to shoot just at the exact millisecond I got to the last bit of platform to the teleporter, leaving me with no escape. Outside of that it was lovely to see a sexier version of the gimmick. I will admit the moment I saw the cybers released I daringly called you a name, nothing personal though, just that sort of reaction you surely wanted :P

 

- Secret exit, liked how it's well telegraphed what you gotta do, took me a few wrong attempts to get the point as it's not something you'd find common in most wads.

 

 

[Nine Inch Heels]

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Fight by fight: the RL bit, I will agree with to resize one of the platforms to have some more equilibrium, in order to kill the dudes there, because I jumped out and skipped them seeing there was no way to avoid splash, of course whether you have to sacrifice a bit of your health or not isn't the problem if you get a boost later, the thing is how consistent it is to come out alive, and that I can't tell right now. Will give it a more in-detail try later to check alternatives. Possibly the cover from the cyberdemon is a good idea. 

I have a close to 100% success rate there without having to back off and jump out the building. But sure, I'll give an option to fight them from the outside on a platform, fits with the map's overall "tone", and is relatively easy to implement. Won't be the largest of platforms, though. ;-)

 

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Berserk part, all fine. After killing all the stuff that spawned in first, up when climbing the first step of the stairs some belated dudes teleported in, I suppose that's part of the intention to distract you from the baron if you get closer?

Yeah, on some occasions there are a few dudes showing up late, due to how the teleport destinations are placed, they're simply prone to getting blocked. Not something I'd consider a big issue, but perhaps I can make it a bit more forthcoming, I'll have a look.

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

I dig the idea, used the distant cyber to distract the barons, then the closer one for obvious purposes, though I will point out in one of my attempts it took like 5 seconds for the cyber to spawn, which screwed me

Joke's on you, there is only one cyberdemon. ;-) that might be part of the reason he didn't show up quickly that one time. I'll see what I can do to make it more consistent in behaviour to prevent huge delays like 5 seconds. Can't make any big promises there though, because if he decides to simply fire 3 salvos right after another he'll simply not move across the teleport linedef anyway. I could warp him out into a crusher sector and warp a different cybie in, but that would also ruin the "built-in-galaxybrain-cheese-strat™" of that fight, so unless that cybie turns out to be too much of an issue I'd rather keep it as is in terms of method.

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

anyways, also are there cacodemons on UV?

Hmmm? there should be. Since I can't use voodoo dolls here, and don't want to work in a mikoveyor setup since this is a CP and maps might have to be compatible with GZDoom, I used stacked linedefs to get the whole fight started and release everything at the same time. If it turns out that it doesn't work reliably I'll "rewire" the whole setup, but I've never had any issues with stuff spawning in PrB+ or GZ, so if there are any, let me know.

 

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Raising platforming, personal highlight of the map, ingenious idea. Took me multiple attempts and it was super tricky to reach the last bit in time, without skipping switches. A small suggestion would be to apply scroll action to sp_face teleporter, being static looks odd to me.

Glad somebody likes that part :P Yeah, I can make the SP_FACE scroll, in fact I've already had that on my radar, but since the map is still WIP not everything is entirely fleshed out yet.

 

1 hour ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Descending platforms, my only issue was that most imps survived even up to two shots (or punches), because that's how crappy the SG can be sometimes, and being so quick not to burn my health on the lava meanwhile meant I had to skip kills, simple setup but I think a boost at the end would be a good idea for lower skills, a berserk maybe or a couple more medkits, so one could still exchange some damage to stay another second to kill those imps as effective as possible. Perhaps rockets would have been more viable as I was carrying a lot, but I didn't know what was coming next.

Rockets are definitely the way to go there, that reminds me I still need to add a chaingun and some bullets for itytd/hntr. It was one of those ideas I put in my first ever map, and I figured I could just "remix" it for this one because it fits :P
 

2 hours ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Orchasm section, sure to be expected at some point. There was one attempt where the middle cyber decided to shoot just at the exact millisecond I got to the last bit of platform to the teleporter, leaving me with no escape. Outside of that it was lovely to see a sexier version of the gimmick. I will admit the moment I saw the cybers released I daringly called you a name, nothing personal though, just that sort of reaction you surely wanted :P

Also a remix from my first ever map. It still needs tweaking for HMP and lower. You are given a grace period before the cybies engage, so racing across the platforms quickly is preferred. HMP and lower will end up having a slightly longer grace period than UV does. UV on the other hand is supposed to be mean in that there's a small chance you can get sniped before telefragging anything, so using the slightly wider marble platform at the end to dance around that possibility is arguably the best course of action there.

 

thanks a bunch for writing this up, really glad not putting death pits at the RK-platforming part is something somebody appreciates.;-) I made that platforming part after playing Majora's Mask and felt the sudden urge to construct something like a Doom-y timed action sequence, seems like it was worth it.