The DWmegawad Club plays: Valiant

[scifista42]

Map25 - “The Eagle Has Landed”

Playing on UV again.

Sweet, clean design, with nice curves and colors. Fun gameplay, mostly about slaughtering low-tier enemies, dealing with revenants behind windows was also kind of entertaining. This map plays it safe, no radical ideas, just time-proven-enjoyable smooth playability with certain challenge involved. The new monsters made an appearance - briefly, appropriately for a starter level. I've beaten the map with a certain amount of saving/loading, and I've found one secret out of the two (the berserk one). Good.

[scifista42]

Map26 - “Blast Wave”

Excellent intense music! It makes the map itself feel much more intense than the map really is. Nevermind, it feels epic thanks to layout and architecture too. The map reminds me of Duke Nukem 3D: Great sense of space, freedom of movement and easy navigation, dispersed enemies in half-setpiece, half-fluid setups, and all of this allows great fun. The placement of Radsuits + damaging floors was well done. Everything was well done. I liked the map quite a lot.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP27: Rocket Zone II
100% kills, 3/4 secrets

I haven't played the original Rocket Zone, so any similarities will be lost on me, but it's a damn good map in its own right. A high monster count (almost 800) may seem daunting, but about half of those suckers are stuck in a secret bonus battle; I finished the regular map at 372 slain on UV. I also kinda ruined the secret for myself, as about halfway through the map I was thinking "man, I would really love a backpack, I wonder if this level has one..." and the only one is in the secret area. Which I likely never would've found otherwise, mind, as it's stuck behind an unmarked wall you'll need to wallhump for...

Anyways, it's a good map, continuing the balance of not being too tough but still demanding some sort of skill when it comes to proper positioning. The two battles that really stick out are the two Demon mentioned - the canyon trap with the two forces pincering from both sides (which I did just fine on until the second wave with demons would 'port in, causing me to die in several 'rocket launcher at point blank because I'm Good At Doom' moments) and the triple Arch-Vile ambush in the rocket bay (which can easily be survived without taking a hit with some good awareness and maybe a little bit of luck from the Vile pathing). The only sour note I had was dealing with the arachnatron battery in the building overlooking the red key, just not fun to try and take them out at long range (are the arachnatron projectiles sped up at all in this? They seem a bit faster than usual...)

Also, I'm playing in GZDoom and didn't get a changed music track... some sort of setting I need on? I was disappointed as I was thinking "ya know, this would be a perfect moment for a certain tune..."

[Pirx]

25 - the eagle has landed

indeed a refreshingly unconventional ending of a megawad with a return to the moon instead of continuing to the core of hell, and remarkably rounded airlocks, hangars and whatever those structures resemble. the music is more relaxed and game-like, contrasting the dark sounding tunes in ep.3

my second "good at doom" moment here, after getting fried in the exit in map19: i flip the switch and run straight into a kamikaze, attempting to escape the obvious ambush... which consists in a few zombies and imps.

however, it's rather easy until you get out in the open to retrieve the red key when the fun with arachnotrons and mancs sniping from a distance starts - i find this very annoying when i can't shoot back. i didn't find any heavier weapon than the chaingun and exited without killing the 2 super mancs.



26 - blast wave

a start in a crossfire, the only thing i didn't like so far, but it gets really annoying to have arachnotrons constantly fill the air with their plasma crap. otherwise, the cybruisers are an excellent replacement for the slow nobles. just their walking sound could be a bit slower and less loud. once you clean up the starting area and kill those spiders, it gets less hectic.

a map very reminiscent of duke3d's ep.2 due to its lunar sci-fi theme and the presence of arachnorbs, which look much like the octabrains. funny ambush in the end.



27 - rocket zone

i'm also playing in gzdoom and didn't notice any music change. now that's a lunar rocket base with plenty of warning stripe textures and the fights mentioned above.

i blew myself up on those demons in the pincer trap and almost did it again on the second try, it's better to get the chaingun and cut through the small ones to avoid being swarmed.
leading the imp mob into the fire of the arachnotron battery was hilarious, i just had to save here and repeat the thing for best effect :p

the triple vile trap... had the rocket launcher ready and killed them all without getting hit, but the damn imps on the crater edge brought me from 100/100 to 7 hp before i could pick up the megasphere.

didn'T find the secret, i guess i'll play this map again, as it was very entertaining, especially those 2 fights.

[scifista42]

Map27 - “Rocket Zone II”

Another very impressive and fun to play map. Great everything. I've recognized some traits of Lunatic MAP03, the most memorable was the slaughterfight enclosed between 2 high walls. I've missed all secrets and over 400 monsters, I don't blame anybody else than myself, of course. I've returned to the map and cheated to get into the Lunatic MAP05 secret area, and I did get a music change in Zandronum. The homage was fine, it didn't make me excited, though.

[Lingyan203]

hey guys, sorry if I'm so late starting the video playthrough; I was busy finishing up other wads but now I finally got around to this.

Here's my video playthrough of it (I only have the first level up so far):

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLgS1ZoidySwM9lFZQ7Jsp7LY-2hxV67sa

[scifista42]

Map28 - “A Lightbridge Too Far”

I really liked it. The bridges were cool. The accompanying music fitted greatly. Everything was less hectic than the past 2 maps were, at least I've got the impression. Anyway, the challenge was more than decent and fun. Some fancy architecture + unique gameplay moments = excellent!

[Magnusblitz]

MAP28: A Lightbridge Too Far
100% kills, 2/2 secrets

The first thing that hits me about this level (and most of the episode, actually) is that it's really brightly lit and happy - seems like a nice moonbase to live on, pre-invasion, at least. I think Demon said, its certainly less grim than most interpretations.

The lightbridges are really cool, and certainly make this map stick out. The pulsing color effect is nice, and the circular ones especially look really cool. Not sure what terrible UAC engineer decided the ones in the first base need to be sprinted across, though. Probably the same guy who created "UAC Shopping."

This map is pretty standard (lightbridges aside) for the first half, then the second half creates a huge canyon and unceremoniously dumps a whole crapload of monsters on the player. But there's a huge area to run around in so it never feels overwhelming or rushed. Good stuff.

[scifista42]

Map29 - “Red Shift”

This map does a great job for being a penultimate one. Player is likely tired, looking forward to the end of this experience, and the last thing he wants now is frustration. So the map gives motivation right away: Epic scaled non-linear layout to explore and addrenaline pumping action on every step! Lots of enemies (low + high tier), lots of resources and powerups to deal with them, lots of varied battle setups, and of course the eye-candy. I've found the map very fun and awesome, again. I better exited the map as soon as I could instead of searching for secrets anyway. I do look forward to the end of this experience, I have to admit. But I'm also excited! Valiant is great.

[SyntherAugustus]

Level 28

This level is plenty of fun and quite a challenge at first. However there's a few quibbles.

-Again, too many rockets
-The cyberdemon fight can pretty much be bypassed by a zdoom player (see 16:30). I didn't even realize it until the 3rd time I played the map.
-The midi, although nice sounding, could have been longer since it was a 20 minute level.

[scifista42]

Map30 - “Electric Nightmare”

Impressive build-up and reveal of the boss. The battle was top exciting (no static camping or dumb circle strafing!), but bloody impossible without save/load abuse for me. As a result, I felt both satisfaction and frustration which counteracted each other. Nevertheless, this was a good finale with great atmosphere and brilliant challenge, and I'm glad this boss fight exists.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP29: Red Shift
94% kills, 1/3 secrets

The penultimate map, now placing us under an ominous red planet, which I suppose is supposed to be Earth about to be overtaken with Valiant, or something, I dunno. (Also, I forgot to mention earlier, but the moon isn't nearly that close to Earth that the Earth would appear so large... maybe supposed to assume the aliens moved it? On the other hand, the name of the episode is "New Moon, Old Grudge" so maybe it's a new moon? I'm so confused)

Anyways, nothing fancy here, just a crap load of enemies strewn around a large free-form layout to explore and find the three keys in. Took a little while to get my bearings but figured it out eventually. Like Scifista I basically just decided to run onto the last map instead of stick around and try to find all the secrets/remaining monsters.

[Dime]

You should play the older boss version too scifista just as a fun way to see how it played out before. I believe RC3 is fine but might need to go back to RC2.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP30: Electric Nightmare
100% kills

Yeah, this one is a doozy. Looks really nice here (good use of the red/white/grey color scheme) and the lifting up of the monster tubes while collecting ammo is a cool idea. The actual fight itself is really tough, I too had to save/reload many, many times after getting splattered repeatedly. If you're in the open and you get hit, you'll get hit multiple times and probably die, and if you get stuck on a corner you'll get hit... lots of little nubbins to get stuck on, unfortunately. At 7500 hit points (and difficulty to just sit down and get a lot of hits in) its a long fight. Need to find a way to throw in some hit point bars. ;) But I like having a final boss map like this MUCH more than the typical Icon of Sin fight.

Dime said:

You should play the older boss version too scifista just as a fun way to see how it played out before. I believe RC3 is fine but might need to go back to RC2.

I just loaded up RC2 and it doesn't seem much different except there's a couple Cybruisers unleashed earlier and the map ends immediately when the boss dies (instead of opening up exit teleporters).

[Dime]

ya the cybruisers and the boss has 2500 more health.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 28 -- A Lightbridge Too Far - 102% Kills / 100% Secrets - FDA, 1 death (dat cybruiser!)
Another campaign across the lunar surface, as Valiantguy battles from outpost to outpost, clearing each in turn before using it as his base of operations for tackling the next leg of the journey. For being a quite linear map, it has a whimsical open-air feeling to it, by virtue of linking a series of small 'sandboxes' together via a looping route that has more to it than initially meets the eye. Each base (or major outdoor battlefield) is essentially a stronghold or encampment protecting a switch which actuates one of the titular lightbridges, which act as a convenient, vaguely racetrack-esque (and very visually distinctive) way of shuttling the player to and fro about the lunar landscape, unfettered by the logistical strictures that the heavily height-varied environment would normally entail. Basically, you can think of them as being a more scenic alternative to teleporter pads, as they essentially serve a very similar function (e.g. linking together discrete areas which otherwise would not flow/segue into one another via conventional means).

I'm probably reading too much into things (again), but I felt that the map is quite aptly named, and not merely because it contains lightbridges! In keeping with the implied filmic/literary reference, the lion's share of the action involves advancing across varied terrain (often open) under heavy fire from distant and superior enemy positions, trying to quiet the most pressing threats to reach the next objective or small safe zone without being vaporized by one of the dozens of different projectiles flying at you at any given moment. In a spatial sense, this is one the most expansive maps in the set, such that projectiles fired at you from a distant position may often take several seconds to reach the target point, which can really screw with your dodge timing if you don't stay frosty. Given the expansive setting, the monstercount is predictably on the beefy side, although in actual fact you usually only find yourself directly engaging a small number of enemies at any given time, while distant groups of enemies constantly complicate matters by pissing support fire at you from well outside your immediate range (imps and arachnatrons especially, in this case). Depending on your personal style, there are a number of choices to be made in how to handle particular areas, most often boiling down to a choice between engaging enemies as you reach them (or they reach you), which allows you to adopt a more deliberate pace but also gives the snipers additional opportunities to attack you, or choosing to press ahead into enemy territory in order to quickly eliminate the snipers with the most powerful/obnoxious degree of overview, which of course carries more initial risks but likely exposes you to a lesser degree of incidental attrition in the long run.

I wasn't playing very well on whatever day it was when I recorded the FDA (whiffed rocket shots and platforming errors galore, and the final cyberdemon managed to stand his ground and soundly emasculate me), and apparently I realized it, since I got spooked by the arrival of Abaddon's 437th Armored Division, which shows up to protect the final lightbridge once it is activated. I apparently felt compelled to retreat to one of the earlier moonbases in order to collect a soulsphere and some other stuff I had previously left behind, and so ended up having to carefully fight my way back into the final area upon return, whereas I had approached most of the map up to that point in a more gung-ho way. This ended up working out pretty well, since most of the enemies in that area naturally dispersed into isolated pockets, courtesy of pathing AI and the irregular terrain (I'm amazed that spider didn't get itself killed in an infight, though), and of course the arachnorbs were able to follow me freely to the other side of the map, so there was no true lull in the action, which I suppose is as good a proof as any that the map caters well to a variety of markedly different approaches.

Map 29 -- Red Shift - 100% Kills / 66% Secrets - FDA
I think Scifista's enthusiastic response captured the spirit of this map well. Another iteration of Skillsaw's beloved three-key setpiece buffet pattern, it's a loose and bloody romp in and around some towers and small stations in and around a bunch of lunar craters, and is very catch-as-catch can in terms of progression (it seemed fully non-linear, if I'm not mistaken), in contrast to the more checkpointed nature of the previous map. While it certainly acquits itself as the penultimate map credibly enough via its considerable monstercount, heavy combat, and suitably distinct aesthetic flair (amazing what a commitment to an assertive color can do against a broad backdrop of unending lunar grey), it's really not a particularly taxing endeavor in comparison to a number of the set's earlier maps, and I suspect was intended more to build adrenaline and euphoria heading into the battle with the final boss in map 30 than to be the culmination of the mapset's challenge and general style. Monsters may be plentiful and given to attacking en masse in a variety of battles both staged and incidental, but given the veritable wealth of healing items, powerups, and ammo (esp. bullets and rockets) that Skillsaw has provided, and a layout which facilitates player movement far more than it does monster-pathing, it is really they who are the unenviable underdogs in this scenario, in spite of their great numbers; nearly every advantage is yours in this case, and there are few excuses for losing if only you will seize the many opportunities for victory provided.

And, I reckon, this is just as it was intended to be. Something of a certainty in modern action games is their regular usage of what I believe is colloquially referred to as the "press X to awesome" trope, where the player character is cinematically depicted as performing (un)godly feats of strength, skill and prowess with a mere properly-timed buttonpress or two, or sometimes even in entirely non-interactive cutscenes. Don't get me wrong, I can certainly see the appeal (and logistical necessity) in this approach, but I mention it because it illustrates something that Skillsaw (amongst others) does so well in his mapping: Often in Valiant, as in 'Red Shift' here, situations are carefully balanced and arranged to appear (and indeed, sometimes genuinely feel) intimidating and overpowering, while actually favoring the player in an 'odds' sense in many ways. All you really need in Valiant, I think, is confidence, and maybe a bit of bravado--go on the offensive, don't try to micromanage every little development in the battle scenario, and don't be hesitant to make liberal use of the many resources that are usually provided to you, and more often than not you'll win, and often win with style. You can still die your share of nasty/quick deaths, of course (especially if you try to constantly advance at a really cautious/deliberate pace, allowing the mapset's many snipers and crossfires maximal opportunity to tear you down), but if you get in there and get your boots bloody you'll often find you're able to win the day, even if you make many mistakes and don't always have much of a concrete strategy in mind. And it's satisfying to win, and win decisively, against such seemingly stacked odds, isn't it?

Wholly apart from its various aesthetic and 'disciplinary' virtues, this is why I suspect Skillsaw's mapping is really so popular with so many different subsets of the community with such starkly varying tastes in gameplay: his stuff is tuned to capture that sense of over-the-top cutscene protagonist badassery, except it's Doom, where there are no cutscenes (beyond the most rudimentary level, anyway) and there are no QTEs, and so rather than simply watching said badassery unfold you actively participate in it, from the first frenzied fusillade to the final buckshot coup de grâce....that's Red Shift pretty much from start to finish, and it's a lot of Valiant. And that's cool.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 30 -- Electric Nightmare - 205% Kills / No secrets - FDA
By this late point in the playthrough I had fortunately corrected the issues eliding from my own improper understanding of certain -cl 11 behaviors (e.g. its dynamically deferring to user-made changes in the game's config, rather than being hardwired to handle certain issues in certain ways like some other complevels), and so there are no siamese-monsters or other vile-related shenanigans in this .lmp file, fortunately.

Valiantguy vs. Diabolist in a nasty arena that very much favors the latter, with all manner of satanic shitheads running interference throughout the course of the battle, and some incredibly disruptive (and decidedly deadly) streams of ionized plasma hosing down the battleground from on high, courtesy of the looming arc-towers, further complicating the scenario.

I would say that it is the hostile environment (thank badness there's no damage-floor!) and the extra interference which really makes this fight, since the boss itself is a powerful but relatively straightforward foe (which one could argue is the most authentically/classically Doom-y approach to such a fight, I suppose). Having encountered the Diabolist previously in a variety of (G)ZDoom PWADs, I initially anticipated a different style of attack from the boss (namely a chain of much faster but individually weaker line-of-sight AOE attacks, and perhaps some truly bothersome homing 'firesnakes'), but in Valiant he behaves more like a traditional arch-vile, albeit a supercharged one, with augmented HP and a significant footspeed boost. His only direct attack works (and seems to time out) just like the standard vile's line-of-sight spell, but actually comes out as a multi-hit combo, meaning that A) you can avoid the first hit by breaking line of sight but still be tagged by later hits if you jump the gun and re-enter LOS too early, and B) if an early hit catches you you will very likely end up absorbing at least some of the successive hits as well (because you'll be thrown into the air and effectively lose control momentarily), resulting in massive damage. He nearly steamrolled me on at least one occasion by successfully combo-ing me in that way (I can't tell if the first big mistake I make was him hitting me twice or him hitting me once and the pyroknight right in my face hitting me some more), and a couple of times later on he caught me with a later hit after I'd instinctively dodged the earlier hits, as well, managing that certainly took some adjustment to years of instinct (and some sheer idiot luck).

He has the standard vile's resurrection powers as well, so a lot of the other enemies that are gradually introduced into the arena over time inevitably end up being match-long factors (untrivial because the enemies themselves are untrivial, pretty much entirely mid/upper-tier dudes), although there did seem to come a 'breakpoint' of sorts where having enough (potential) corpses around meant the boss itself was much more likely to busy itself in resurrecting its flunkies rather than actually attacking, which is a good thing, since it was by far the most individually powerful combatant on the field, what with me not having a BFG and all.

All that being said, in true Valiant fashion, you're given plenty of ammo and powerups to work with, as well as a reasonably easy-to-navigate and cover-rich battlefield, and so as per usual you can make a fair few mistakes and still end up winning the day as long as you don't get flustered or give up. By way of criticism, it seemed to me that the single most dangerous element in the fight is actually the little guardwalls between the stretches of fencing around the arena--they are both chunky in aspect and obtusely-angled, and when I fought him again in Eternity after recording the above FDA (in order to see the game's ending text, which I assume doesn't display in PrBoom+, since the earlier episode-ending texts naturally don't either) I got firmly wedged in a nasty angle like a tortilla chip fragment between one's teeth while strafing around the periphery, and so suffered a horrible death.

While I'm an advocate of the Icon of Sin concept in principle, I certainly am not averse to a custom boss fight, and I felt this one worked pretty well and fit in suitably with the rest of the game (e.g. being more about loose high-speed scrapping than a great deal of exacting precision or heavy strategizing). Damn cool visuals, too. Interesting to hear that the boss used to have more flunkies and some higher HP, speaking for myself I found myself thinking that having a small number of regular viles introduced at some point would make the battle truly intense, but of course the non-DECORATE visual glitch (which sees the boss periodically flickering to the standard vile sprites rather than the Diabolist sprites, BTW) makes that a less viable proposition.

********

What's to say that hasn't already been said in this case? Valiant is a collection of eminently Skillsawsy Skillsaw maps, all fast and loose action in some generally eye-pleasing and very colorful (literally) locales, following the surprisingly rare Scythe II model in its episodic/thematic structure (a treat for me, I'm quite fond of that particular model). I am generally not a great proponent of balance changes to the base game (esp. not where monster speed and HP is concerned), but I must say I find very little to object to in Valiant's extensive DEH/DEC work, each change appears to have been carefully considered, and the altered enemies work well together and in the context of straightforward, traditionally Doom-y setpiece brawls--while certain adjustments in approach were of course necessary, in broad form I was able to play this very much like I play regular Doom and still succeed, and while that's a simple thing to say it is no small feat. Of the new monsters, I most liked the Valiant pyrodemon--cool-looking, HP that's low enough to use him in some way in most situations and versus most weapon loadouts, a raging powerhouse in infights (he knows E. Honda's hundred-hand slap!), credible threat over distances despite his linear attack, and FUCK is he scary when he manages to appear right next to you--but the arachnorbs are a close second, as they add a relatively basic low-tier enemy that works well in groups to Doom's normally limited roster of flying foes, and are vastly more satisfying to kill than lost souls, and indeed more than many other enemies. And then there's the minigun, I know I'm going to be giving the poor old 'nilla chaingun a bit of a cold shoulder for a while yet after this month is through. A specific minority of the maps get a little too abjectly video-gamey in aspect for my liking, and I suppose in an ideal world I probably would've enjoyed the mapset even more if it had more often taken me out of my comfort zone as regards combat difficulty, which would be pretty hard to do with this style of item placement, but both of these things are inherent aspects of Skillsaw's style, and I am happy to overlook them in favor of tearing ass around through his colorful, projectile-saturated, player-empowering rambo-world for a while.

My top 5 maps, in no particular order, were:
Map 06 -- Engineering Disaster
Map 10 -- Candlecove
Map 18 -- Crush Depth
Map 24 -- None More Merciless
Map 29 -- Red Shift

[scifista42]

Dime said:

You should play the older boss version too scifista just as a fun way to see how it played out before. I believe RC3 is fine but might need to go back to RC2.

I had already checked it out back in the day, but didn't bother trying to win legitly, so I decided to quit until I do proper playthrough (which happened now).

[mouldy]

Time to catch up with the final episode:

Map25 - “The Eagle Has Landed”

Love the light and shadow on these moon maps. Gameplay starts a little stingy on ammo, I guess I should have used the chainsaw more. Still, lots of barrels around. The most memorable moment for me in this map was the point blank suicide bomber trap, very dirty trick. Fun map, left without finding any secrets though.

Map26 - “Blast Wave”

Quite a hectic start, and lots of surprise bombers to watch out for. Going for the rocket launcher straight away became my undoing, on the second attempt I took some time to nose around and clear out some of the snipers. Its fairly plain sailing after that, although I had a hairy moment when a suicide bomber blew me off the platform in the red key fight. It turned out to be quite lucky as it allowed me to kill everything from safety down below. By that point I had enough tools to make short work of most of the traps. Still left without any secrets, don't think I'm going to have much luck with those in this episode.

Map27 - “Rocket Zone II”

More of a laid back start to this one, but the difficulty steadily climbs as the adventure unfolds. Highlights were archvile trio and the teleport ambush in the valley of death. The 2 storey arachnotron snipe-fest was maybe a bit over the top, but on the whole this was a very enjoyable map and an interesting journey it leads you on. Still not a single secret found, either I'm just being slack with my wall-humping or these lunar secrets are a bit on the devious side.

Map28 - “A Lightbridge Too Far”

Not shy with the rockets this one. I was pretty much using rocket launcher instead of SSG the whole map, and still ended with 50. I count that as a good thing by the way. And hooray I finally found all the secrets. The first time I played this map, my tactic for the final part was to hit the switch and run the gauntlet to the finish line with my fingers crossed, but the secret invul made things a bit more of a battle this time. I didn't even remember the imp horde on the bridge.

Missed 20 enemies somewhere.

Map29 - “Red Shift”

Total warzone, excellent stuff. Its a complete sandbox so I imagine some choices might make life more difficult than others, I did a lot better this time around anyway. The only part that seemed uncharacteristically harsh was the flame baron ambush at the yellow key. Its easy to escape once you know whats coming, but its still death in microseconds if you make a mistake. I think I would save the free invul for that fight next time. Very entertaining map. The one secret I found gave me a megasphere, not that I needed it with all the health strewn around.

Map30 - “Electric Nightmare”

This is a really cool set-up for a boss battle, though I found it a bit frustrating. What with trying to hit the boss while avoiding its flame and killing/avoiding any stuff it resurrects while dodging sniper fire its just too much for my brain to think about. You have to be constantly on the move while trying to focus on killing the archvile, and in the end when all the other monsters were unleashed I found myself just circle strafing while they all congregated in the centre, so I'm wondering if that is the best tactic: don't even bother killing anything and just run rings around the centre until everything gathers there. Then you can lob rockets into the scrum while the archvile is tied up resurrecting them all, and as long as you keep circling the snipers don't even shoot at you. I made it in the end, and saved the moon or whatever the story might be, I confess I haven't been reading any of the text. Nice to hear the thunderforce music, this wad reminds me a lot of those old shooters.

So that is the end of valiant. Its quite a masterpiece of design and gameplay, a little frustrating here and there but its impossible not to like it with the effort and craft that has gone into its creation. And a one man megawad as well, crazy amount of work. Its particlarly inspiring to see custom monsters utilised so well. Still that flame baron could use some nerfing...

[Surreily]

Episode 5
The final episode surprised me with its drastically different theme - some kind of moon base. The first map, "The Eagle Has Landed", introduces the new theme without providing a huge challenge. There are one or two encounters that can be considered nasty, but for the most part, I had no trouble.

Next up is "Blast Wave", which ramps up the difficulty a lot. Suddenly, we're dealing with rocket barons, super mancubi, and all sorts of other nasties. Of all the maps in this episode (besides the final one), this is where I had the most trouble. The use of shadows is very noticeable here - another fine map.

In "Rocket Zone II", there are several rockets, making the title very appropriate. What stood out to me in this map were the nasty traps. I had some major trouble with the one where the wall rises behind and monsters teleport in from both sides. There was also that arch-vile pit and the part near the end with loads of rocket barons and fire barons. The secret area was awesome too, and I somehow managed to do it on my first attempt (probably due to the author putting way too many megaspheres in there, thanks!).

The next map, "A Lightbridge Too Far", features an interesting gimmick: by flipping switches, fancy lightbridges pop up for a few seconds before dropping back down into the floor (except for a few cases where they permanently rise). These bridges are beautiful, and they animate in such a way to make them look like they are pulsing with orange and blue light. I did love most of the map, but the area near the exit I found to be rather dull (teleporting monsters). Also, nice try hiding that shootable switch, but I just knew you'd put one in a place like that somewhere in this WAD :P

The final real map, "Red Shift", is a nice big sandbox map. Much like "Rocket Zone II", there are some nasty traps dotted around, but these were a little easier to handle. I can't think of much to say about this one - it continues the theme of the previous four maps well (but with a more red theme) and it plays well too.

I don't want to spoil the final boss for those who might just be reading this, but I am sick of Icon of Sin bosses, so this one was a nice break from the usual.

Conclusion
Valiant is a collection of 32 maps, consistent in quality. According to the dedicated Valiant thread, the author's goal was to provide a variety of maps, and I believe this was achieved. If there's one criticism I have with this project, it is that some of the maps have very similar aesthetics (especially in episode 2 and 5) and could have been a little more unique. Overall, I am very happy with the way this project turned out. Rating: five invisible arch-viles out of five.

[Gez]

mouldy said:

Map27 - “Rocket Zone II”

Still not a single secret found, either I'm just being slack with my wall-humping or these lunar secrets are a bit on the devious side.

Too bad, that's a map where the secrets really deserve to be found!

[mouldy]

Gez said:

Too bad, that's a map where the secrets really deserve to be found!

Haha holy shit! On your recommendation i went back and found the mother of all secrets. I'd give that a standing ovation if i didn't have a computer on my lap.

[Suitepee]

http://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/c/6771884 = part 3 of my playthrough, covering maps 16-24. (UV, continuous)

Episode 3 was great, the best in Valiant so far. Episode 4 was tough, annoying and made me curse Skillsaw's name for a brief time. Although map 24 was a good way to close the episode.

Still not a big fan of all the (Imp) snipers, despite multiple people trying to persuade me otherwise. But for the most part Valiant remains fun and creative, and the level of visual detail is crazy good at times.

Episode 5 is set on the Moon, which hopefully means a fun conclusion to things! (I've also been told of a good easter egg on map 27 that I cannot miss)

[Pirx]

Gez said:

Too bad, that's a map where the secrets really deserve to be found!

27 - rocket zone II

adding to my previous post on this map: i played it again, as i liked it and insisted on finding the secret area. well, the entrance is hidden pretty obviously in a place where the player doesn't normally go... and there was said music change! (in gzdoom). oh yeah. very entertaining slaughter part, pretty much the same circular arena as map31. once the walls open, it's a matter of running circles, firing the bfg until everything is dead. a group of cybruisers were the last ones standing. all for getting a backpack ;)



28 - a lightbridge too far

i didn't find the opening great: i had only a shotgun, and those lightbridges kept raising a cybruiser right in my face. meh, should have looked better, there's a chaingun too.

however, as soon as i reached the lunar surface, it's one of the visually most memorable maps of this megawad, together with candlecove and genocide motor. nice rainbow effect connecting the lunar surface and the craters serving as arenas. rockets are provided so generously that i could smack imps with them for good measure, almost doing away with the shotgun.

the last, large crater has a horde of enemies teleporting in, but thankfully i was not trapped, as there's a way out, which is the better solution with all that fire flying around, from super mancs and spiders especially. there's also an invulnerability, which ends the affair quickly, but as i didn't know the map already i discovered it when everything was dead. i didn't see the mouselook trick with the cyberdemon, but i just parked my ass on the inactive lightbridge in front of him and riddled him with bullets. overall a colorful, entertaining map.



29 - red shift

a large demonic city made completely out of concrete and red metallic stripes, under a giant looming red planet, wherever that is. large scale action with lots of enemies and powerups. i

managed to get out of all traps pretty easily, only the one where several pyros emerge from metallic doors almost got me. overall it promotes an aggressive approach, because trying to camp

gets you sniped from all directions, in most cases.



30 - electric nightmare

i'm not a big fan of icon maps (purists will scoff at that, but autoaiming feels weird to me after many years of mouselooking), so this final map having a good boos fight was certainly refreshing. circling around tends to herd the enemies in the central area, so it's mostly a matter of firing at this mob, hoping to hit that super-vile. the plasma balls coming from the electric arcs complicate the task. you have to keep moving all the time and possibly run into his line of sight.



to wrap it up, valiant is a professional quality megawad that doesn't sacrifice gameplay for looks. enemies like pyros and orbs feel like they belonged to the original game. the new enemies are challenging but not overpowered. to counter them, there's the more powerful chaingun, and even the pistol becomes usable. each episode is consistent within its theme, with good variety so you barely notice it's made by just one mapper. skillsaw also avoids falling into some tropes, like the map07 manc/arachnotron theme, final mapset in hell (he even creates an own hell theme, the skintech & glowmetal one), and a real bossfight.

so finding weak points is merely nitpicking. pretty much the only thing that annoyed me was the constant sniping. there could be less of this. other than that, it's excellent. thanks, skillsaw.

[Magnusblitz]

Overall Thoughts

Before anything else, I should note, at little surprise, that this is an extremely polished and well-designed megawad with very high "production" values. There's not a stinker map in the set, the themes and textures all look great, the new monsters (and weapons) work pretty well, and it's got a lot of nice little extra touches like the episode breaks/menu and such. People can expect a lot of out megawads in this day and age, and it's because of wads like Valiant those expectations exist.

Being a one-man megawad, it should come as no surprise that the maps tend to hit heavily on the author's style. And Skillsaw definitely does have a noticeable style - if I had to sum it up (from my limited experience with it) I'd say: lots of 'open' layouts (very little corridor-gunning), gameplay usually centered on the player's mobility being able to move around a large area, needing to explore to find weapons (often waking up the map's denizens while doing so), teleport ambushes/setpieces, and lots of snipers to keep the player moving. Some players grouse about this, as I suppose they prefer more "old-school" Doom layouts (lots of closed corridors, coming across enemies as they proceed, etc) but it's hard to deny that having the gameplay so based off movement certainly helps lend some dynamism to the maps here.

Something that did surprise me a bit is that I felt the mapset, on the whole, was actually kinda... easy. The levels (with a few exceptions) tend to be loaded to the gills with health and ammo, while the amount of snipers and damaging floors often means the player will need to take some damage to get weapons or other powerups, there's almost always health to heal back up or more ammo to keep blasting away with. Demon likened it to a 'rambo' style and I think that fits - the player is pushed to keep moving and keep shooting, but if you actually think about it, these maps aren't really all that hard. If I died, it was usually because I was doing something stupid (often involving rocket launchers and close range), there's plenty of cover in these maps and very few situations where I couldn't beat a setup after one or two tries (with the notable exception of the final level, which, like when I tried to kill the titular boss in Diablo II for the first time, took about 30 deaths).

I also tend to shy away from gameplay mods and stick with the tried-and-true Doom bestiary, but I think the extra monsters and weapon tweaks here fit well. For the new monsters, the Pyroknight, Aracnorb and explodeyman trooper are great additions - the Pyroknight has a highly dangerous attack but relatively low HP, making it great for "oh shit" moments without making it a slog to kill; similarly, the aracnorb is well-balanced from the HP/damage perspective (one reason I really dislike Cacodemons is that their HP is just too much for their use/damage threat). The suicide trooper is just plain fun. I'm a bit cooler on the cybruisers and super mancubus, neither one really seemed to fill a need, but they're not bad, either. The modifications to the imp and demon make sense, as well. The pistol is pretty forgettable but the minigun makes up for it - like others, I will miss it when we move on to other wads.

Given it's nature as a modern-day, one-man megawad with attempts at providing "large amounts of variety", I don't think it's out of line to compare it to another release along those lines, Going Down. I'd say I like Going Down just a smidge more, mainly due to more variety in theme, tighter concept (and also just generally hitting my sweet spot in terms of length/secret-hiding) but Valiant is pretty damn close. If this is Skillsaw's last megawad, he can certainly be proud of it.

Favorite Maps:
MAP06: Engineering Disaster
MAP09: 14 Angrier Archviles
MAP13: The Netweaver
MAP27: Rocket Zone II
MAP28: A Lightbridge Too Far

Least Favorite Maps:
MAP03: Tiers of Pain (felt like a filler/speedmap)
MAP08: Bushwhacked (too much gymnastics, bugged exit)
MAP21: Skindustrial Zone (just nothing notable)
MAP26: Blast Zone (too much sniper fighting)

[NuMetalManiak]

welp, I failed to contribute even after directly saying I will.

I did play it all though, and I feel that I should confess: Valiant is in fact, good. but for me it's just too good. what exactly do I mean by this? well, first of all, there's a lot of gameplay changes in the monsters and weapons, that to me, make mainstaying means of killing monsters a lot less useful. both the berserk fist and the super shotgun don't get a lot of use unfortunately, but at least the chaingun kicks ass. many of the custom monsters are make or break for me. the cybruisers and arachnorbs were pretty fun to fight, while the pyro demons and imps were among the worst of the even badder lot.

if fast-paced gameplay is gonna be how Doom WADs are gonna be from now on, then my faith in the community is gonna be lost very quickly. Almost all of Valiant's levels exemplify this. a lot of the maps also have barrels everywhere, making me wonder if skillsaw is the Micheal Bay of Doom WADs (please do not take offense). now, skillsaw's mapping design is damn good. I know that from experiencing his BTSX maps. but there's times where the fast-paced gameplay just makes me so uncomfortable, like I cannot finish this one map without staying at low health all the time or retrying it multiple times with save/load abuse and nearly breaking keyboards. I really don't see how anybody can consider this mapset easy, because even on ITYTD, plenty of the levels did it for me in a bad way.

if I were to summarize each map, I'll say that the 1st, 3rd, and 5th episodes were great. 1st was alright at most, 3rd was pretty beastly, 5th was a throwback to Lunatic (with another throwback right in one of the maps), but had a really annoying boss fight. 2nd and 4th episodes pissed me off. A lot of my time spent was running from shit and I'd rather kill first instead. right off the get go of both episodes I'm already doing that. I really hate how the introduction level of the pyro-demon is already spent on having to run from archies. from what I've played, Episode 1 was great, the first three levels of Episode 2 were annoying. The last three maps of Episode 2 were great though, thankfully. Episode 3 was pretty good overall, with MAP17 being my personal favorite map in all of Valiant. I hated the slaughterfest secret level though. Episode 4 already has annoying infight map at 19 and another grueling lava map in 20. Later maps thankfully were better. But I did enjoy practically all of Episode 5, until the boss and those plasma turrets.

maybe all this of what I think of Valiant stems from how much hype this has gotten since its release. I mean, Valiant came straight out of nowhere, surprising us all and making us want to play because skillsaw is such a cool guy or something. but the attention that this mapset gets is really just starting to become sickening.

[Tarnsman]

Getsu Fune said:

Valiant is in fact, good. but for me it's just too good.

I am so sick and tired of this asinine mentality. No, it's not "too good" you just didn't like it. This constant "OH GOD WHY DOES THE COMMUNITY HAVE TO HYPE UP SO MANY THINGS WHY CAN'T THEY FORM THEIR OWN OPINION ON ANYTHING... What? What did I think of it? Oh well... um... it was good but like I didn't like it... but no it's still good I'm not insulting you it really was good... TOO GOOD in fact" crap needs to stop. Stop lamenting the popular opinion and then dancing around it. Stop pussy-footing around and feeling the need to conform to the rest of the community's opinions on something, call it bad, you didn't like it. That makes it bad. Not good. Not some new apex of greatness that is too good to be enjoyed by us mere mortals who should be playing flawed Doom mapsets and not the artisan-crafted works of God. BAD. Then if you want call the author a terrible person, tell them they ruined Doom forever, remind them they suck, possibly throw in a request for them to end their own life, go hog wild.

[NuMetalManiak]

sheesh, am I not allowed to voice a MODERATE opinion anymore without being blasphemed by thine periphery?

I like it but I don't outright love to play it. that's all I'm trying to say, really.

[Magnusblitz]

You're obviously allowed to voice your opinion (that's the point of these threads, natch) but I think Tarnsman is just pointing out that saying something is "too good" (as a complaint) makes no sense, especially when it's coupled with complaining about the hype.

[Jaws In Space]

Tarnsman said:

I am so sick and tired of this asinine mentality. No, it's not "too good" you just didn't like it. This constant "OH GOD WHY DOES THE COMMUNITY HAVE TO HYPE UP SO MANY THINGS WHY CAN'T THEY FORM THEIR OWN OPINION ON ANYTHING... What? What did I think of it? Oh well... um... it was good but like I didn't like it... but no it's still good I'm not insulting you it really was good... TOO GOOD in fact" crap needs to stop. Stop lamenting the popular opinion and then dancing around it. Stop pussy-footing around and feeling the need to conform to the rest of the community's opinions on something, call it bad, you didn't like it. That makes it bad. Not good. Not some new apex of greatness that is too good to be enjoyed by us mere mortals who should be playing flawed Doom mapsets and not the artisan-crafted works of God. BAD. Then if you want call the author a terrible person, tell them they ruined Doom forever, remind them they suck, possibly throw in a request for them to end their own life, go hog wild.

I disagree with Tarnsman, I don't really like Valiant, but I also think that it is a good map set. The problem I have with wads like Valiant & others is that they play it extremely safe & stick to a "Good map" formula. I feel like the authors of these maps go trough a checklist on each map to make sure that they made none of the bad map mistakes. Do I have an open layout with many directions to go, check, do I have monsters attacking from multiple directions putting pressure on the player, check, does my map have simple clean design yet a good amount of detailing, check, did I make any 64 wide corridors, no, and so on and so forth. It's a formula designed to ensure good maps, but the problem is that the maps start to feel samey & repetitive, does that make it bad? Not really, as a whole Megawad perhaps, but I couldn't say any of the individual levels are bad. This formula for good maps can work when used in small amounts such as with small maps or by just doing an episode, but when you keep doing it over & over again for 32 level it simply just starts to become quite dull. I think that it's perfectly reasonable to say that that I don't like Valiant, but would I say it's a bad wad? Absolutely not.