Snap(map)chat

[Koko Ricky]

I think in a way it wants to be a way to let both novice players and veterans get a piece of the action without worrying about the demanding skills needed for modding modern shooters.

[geo]

Clonehunter said:

I hope D4!ZONE becomes a thing

Me too.

[mikeo007]

chubz said:

I'm still waiting for a full-fledged 3D map editor that doesn't suck (aka is both very powerful and easy to use, like Doom Builder and the Build editor).

I've tried them all--from Radiant to UnrealEd to Hammer--and hated every last one with a passion. Those tools are just so goddamned complex and time-consuming to use, even for accomplishing basic tasks, that it completely sucks every ounce of fun out of the level design process.

Trenchbroom is the closest I've seen to fitting this bill. Unfortunately, brush based mapping for the most part is relegated to the older Quake games where you can get away with less detail.

[Koko Ricky]

So it went from brushes to what?

[mikeo007]

3D models in most modern games. Brush based detail is almost non-existant.

[wheresthebeef]

The Source engine is still brush based, you just have to add a lot more smaller details and keep within a certain scale to make sure everything fits perfectly, especially when you get to Left 4 Dead and you have to account for every different size of the zombies when making just a simple pathway.
It uses models as well, but not to the extent of Unreal, where pretty much everything you see is a prop. Although Source 2 looks to be going a completely different path altogether.

[DooM_RO]

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/interviews/a655477/doom-interview-its-bruce-lee-on-a-skateboard-with-a-shotgun.html#~phyN7Y5QdnJCIj

Snapmap looks like a great feature. Is there any other mod support?
"Absolutely. So with Snapmap, you can change a ton of stuff. You can literally use the logic editing to make a completely new game mode. We've had people internally create a tower defence-style game, we've had people create little piano keyboards in the world that you can play music on, and puzzles.

"I've been in the industry for 20 years, and I'm not a level designer by background, but using Snapmap is one of my favourite things. That's how easy it is. You don't have to have any experience with past tools, you can just jump in and snap together a map. You can add predefined gameplay where you can drop an object in the world and make, say, a boss battle, and then when the player enters that space it does a boss or a wave battle.

"Or you can then go into that one piece and say, 'OK, I want a wave battle here, but I want it just to be Mancubus and Imps', and then it'll just do that. Or you can go in and specifically place every single thing, you can connect elements so that this thing triggers this, but only under these conditions. You can use the system to change the way the HUD displays the score, change the way players move in the world, you can make them slower and faster. It's a very open system.

[Linguica]

"Snapmap looks like a great feature. Is there any other mod support?"

"Oh sure" *talks about Snapmap at length anyway*

[kelliegator]

My only concern about Snapmap so far is that it looks like it won't allow a lot of outdoor environments, I certainly haven't seen anything that looks like a custom-made hell level yet. But maybe they're still working on it.

I also hope that the graphics bar won't limit it too much. But otherwise it looks cool. I don't have the patience to make maps myself, but playing other people's creations and enjoying custom game modes might just be what it takes for me to get a PlayStation Plus Subscription... because my computer can't run the game. >w>

[Zemini]

kelliegator said:

My only concern about Snapmap so far is that it looks like it won't allow a lot of outdoor environments, I certainly haven't seen anything that looks like a custom-made hell level yet. But maybe they're still working on it.

I also hope that the graphics bar won't limit it too much. But otherwise it looks cool. I don't have the patience to make maps myself, but playing other people's creations and enjoying custom game modes might just be what it takes for me to get a PlayStation Plus Subscription... because my computer can't run the game. >w>

This is one of my biggest fears regarding snap map. I am sure someone will crack the graphics limit at some point in the future though. I hope they separate PC AND Console maps because some day our PC's will be able to handle massive maps with hundreds of enemies at once.

I would also love to see outdoor zones as well and a way to shap them the way we want.

[DooM_RO]

Zemini said:

This is one of my biggest fears regarding snap map. I am sure someone will crack the graphics limit at some point in the future though. I hope they separate PC AND Console maps because some day our PC's will be able to handle massive maps with hundreds of enemies at once.

I would also love to see outdoor zones as well and a way to shap them the way we want.

Skyrim mapping is a bit similar to snap map in that you can snap a few hallway prefabs and make a crypt or something. Making a cave is a lot more difficult.

[DF88]

They should take some notes from Far Cry 4s editor. A combination of premade and customizable layouts.

[Doomkid]

Nevander said:

An action that classic Doom desperately needed. I have to use tricks to accomplish the same thing in classic Doom (i.e. cross a linedef right in front of the item which then lowers/raises a floor/ceiling tied to the same sector which releases a monster into an area where it can cross a teleport linedef and end up where you want it to. Lotta work for a simple "teleport X thing at Y location when player does Z."

I'm glad this wasn't possible til the ZDoom era honestly. So many people have been forced to come up with creative and interesting ways to trigger traps since that wasn't built in to the engine :)

I'm glad ZDoom came along and allowed us to do all kinds of new stuff though!

Linguica said:

"Snapmap looks like a great feature. Is there any other mod support?"

"Oh sure" *talks about Snapmap at length anyway*

Fuck that made me laugh

Yeah like others, I really want to draw my own weird shapes in addition to having the prebuilt bits and pieces. The thought of not having massive outdoor DM maps is a sad one.

[qdash]

My second fear about new Doom after multiplayer is SnapMap limitations. It's doesn't matter how good it sounds from official PR before release.

[Zemini]

It would be nice if someone could get a pic of all the pieces so we can start making our own snap maps on graph paper.

I know a lot of you are thinking the same thing.

[wheresthebeef]

I hope a virus type mode is possible to create, because I put in that mode and the mapmaker many MANY countless multiplayer hours in Timesplitters 2.
Tight corridor mazes or giant huge wide open hangars with teleporters everywhere with a bunch of flaming bots running at you.

[wheresthebeef]

In the live panel at Quakecon, it was announced that Snapmap is the basic tool for everyone to use, however they still want to allow their full tools (on PC) to be used by the public

[DooM_RO]

wheresthebeef said:

In the live panel at Quakecon, it was announced that Snapmap is the basic tool for everyone to use, however they still want to allow their full tools (on PC) to be used by the public

Probably the best piece of info out of this panel...which is depressing.

[Shaviro]

Yeah, that was extremely uneventful.

[wheresthebeef]

When that guy asked the question about the 2-weapon limit and loadouts and if there would be modes without it and the crowd cheered, Marty definitely struggled to not confirm anything.
This whole thing was meh, the same footage of E3 was used, the main host's mic was way too low, and I didn't feel I learned anything new.
I wish we'd get a video of a multiplayer match; boggles my mind why there hasn't been footage shown yet.

[id.dav]

wheresthebeef said:

In the live panel at Quakecon, it was announced that Snapmap is the basic tool for everyone to use, however they still want to allow their full tools (on PC) to be used by the public

That's true! Marty said that snapmap doesn't replace their desire to provide their tech and tools for real modders.

SnapMap is actually a data with instruction file wich client uses to instantly transfere map data through all user machines without actuall downloading the map. I can understand now why it could be very popular among casual community.

[Tritnew]

To be fair, this Mapping System could work for Doomers that are new to Mapping I supoose, they can make a good and nice Map and show It off to the community, I'm sort of planning to take that route once DOOM Is In stores, so It'll be a good start for Me.

[Reisal]

geo said:

They should make a random map generator since it has prefabs.

That would be Ajapted's job if he's interested in it in the future :P

[andrewj]

From what I've heard so far, SnapMap will be a great platform for random generation.

But I gotta finish my other one first :)

[vengencebot]

With this, I hope to see a standalone MP version 'Doom 4 SnapMap Edition' about a year after initial release to increase future playability.. I'm on X1 so its still a fairly new system giving 2+ years ahead. Also with new additions to use for creating Mods/Maps. With the new addons as a DLC for Doom 4 owners.
Now with that said, this is cool. I will destroy all.

[zinkai]

My only concern with snap map is the limited tiles to use and themes.

Are we gonna be stuck with one theme and other themes gonna be paid dlc? Ie hell theme or biohazard etc etc

As for tiles I am really eager to see how many we get. Are we gonna get big areas to plant with multi entrances to attach other tiles to? Do we have say a blank sqares have multiple pathways? Are we gonna get multi floored rooms? Can we make like pits for the player to drop down? Can rooms have monster closets? Can u add a monster closet to say a corridor?

Argh I just want it now.

[Megamur]

I'm pretty excited for SnapMap. Keeping it simple and limited just means more people will be able to use it, as opposed to just tech geeks. Just compare classic Doom's modding community to Doom 3's: you literally have classic Doom speedmapping competitions, whereas Doom 3 map projects take forever (if they're completed at all).

Besides, look at all the cool stuff people managed to make for vanilla Doom despite its many shortcomings. I'm sure some enterprising designers can do the same with SnapMap.

[andrewj]

I keep thinking that *if* all you can do architecture-wise is to connect fully enclosed rooms and hallways to each other, then that is a major major limitation and nothing in the maps people create will have anything very interesting or creative (again, architecture-wise). Though the ability for people to create "more of the same" is still nice and better than nothing.

My *guess* answers to zinkai's questions:

Q/ Are we gonna get big areas to plant with multi entrances to attach other tiles to?
A/ Certainly

Q/ Do we have say a blank sqares have multiple pathways?
A/ Tiles would be fully enclosed (walls on all sides, except places where can attach other tiles). No reason there won't be a smallish tile where all four directions are doorways.

Q/ Are we gonna get multi floored rooms?
A/ Certainly

Q/ Can we make like pits for the player to drop down?
A/ No, have to choose a room tile which already contains a pit

Q/ Can rooms have monster closets?
A/ No, the monster closets will be part of certain room tiles, so you have to use those room tiles to get a monster closet. What you almost certainly can do is have monsters teleport in when you grab an item (etc).

Q/ Can u add a monster closet to say a corridor?
A/ No, but there will be corridor tiles which have monster closets as a part of them.

[id.dav]

So much lie! Duffy says about huge modding community yet he ignores the fact that this community is PC only and uses proper tools wich do not restrict your creativity.

[id.dav]

Megamur said:

I'm pretty excited for SnapMap. Keeping it simple and limited just means more people will be able to use it, as opposed to just tech geeks. Just compare classic Doom's modding community to Doom 3's: you literally have classic Doom speedmapping competitions, whereas Doom 3 map projects take forever (if they're completed at all).

Besides, look at all the cool stuff people managed to make for vanilla Doom despite its many shortcomings. I'm sure some enterprising designers can do the same with SnapMap.

Yet easy to use should not mean you have to be limited! It doesn't reqiure a tech geek to build a map....you just need imagination and creative thinking.