The DWmegawad Club plays: NOVA II

[cannonball]

MAP06 - "Water Maim" by AD_79
A solid map this one, very much in the theme of Essel's McGee map in Episode 1. No complaints to be found. Good job overall, despite the author's now dislike of this map :)

Map07 - Dry Well by Joe Ilya
Some of the additions to this map seems unnecessary, the floating decorations seem a little over the top in my opinion. The map otherwise is serviceable enough, though a little more ammo would be nice (just a couple of shells and clips will do).

[dobu gabu maru]

Since we're moving on to Jaxxoon's map for the Wednesday people, I need to bring to your attention that he's made quite a few changes to it that you can download here. It hasn't been included in the main wad since I personally have some mixed feelings about it, but for those with ample time on their hands it'd mean a lot if you gave both versions a shot so we could decide which to keep.

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MAP07: Ah, joe-ilya—veritably the Lil B of our forums. He has clearly grown since his early submissions for the first NOVA, but this map undoubtedly retains some of his fabled quirkiness. Thankfully I’d say there’s more good than bad here, and since it’s a short map his style doesn’t overstay it’s welcome (unlike the dreaded MAP15 “Quake” submission he summoned from the depths of hell [which was axed]). Nice interconnectivity, a cool door-wall reveal and a decent amount of ammo balance—definitely the best we could ask for from joe.

[gaspe]

MAP08 - Demon Trench

Kills; 100% | Items: 91% | Secrets: 75%, 100% in the second version

A surreal map that starts in a house like building, than you proceed through some caves to get in a base. There's a nice suspense feel helped with the music. I really liked the secret where you get behind those imps so you can neutralize them in safety.
I played both version and personally I like more the first one (that one in the Nova II wad). They are both fine, but in the first version the atmosphere is more enhanced; and the balance of ammo and the size of the places give you some more tension while playing the map. It has more character than the second version. the tuned up fights work, but overall I think everything is staged better in the first version.

[Jaxxoon R]

Blessed be the stragglers, for they will be the last to fall into the trapdoor.

I'm not exactly the best at well-thought-out and comprehensive writing, so I figured I'd just do what Jaws did and post a series of videos. I'm a bit more talkative than him though, for better or for worse. Also, anyone else notice just how ugly Youtube makes Doom look in the video titlecards?

I'm using GZDoom w/o mouselook + software lighting mode + strict Boom compatibility, since PRBoom+ is very washed-out and has audio stuttering on my system and GLBoom is simply very ugly. If anyone has any tips on how to fix my problems with PRBoom+ please do tell and I'll switch to it instead if desired.

Edit: Oh no, gaspe cheated-- you're only able to play up to the day of the month in terms of map numbers. We need an established timezone lordzone so people can't win by time travelling to the future.

[Pinchy]

I've made some updates to MAP02 but will wait a little longer before posting a new version.

I imagine my later stuff is going to fall apart much worse and become more of a burden than it's worth.

[dobu gabu maru]

Jaxxoon R said:

We need an established timezone lordzone so people can't win by time travelling to the future.

Whichever time zone gets to "tomorrow" first gets to post about it (Pacific islands) because trying to set it to an established UTC/GMT can be more confusing than it's worth. Plus we're pretty lax as is, so as long as people aren't 2 days ahead of the rest we should be fine.

[Jaws In Space]

This map by Jaxxoon R is split up into 3 different themes. You start off in a house area, then move through a canyon/cave system, & end up in a tech base area which was my favorite section of the map theme wise. I see that Jaxxoon made a update that expanded the playing space & think that this was a good idea, I found the house section in particular to be quite cramped to fight in. Monster placement on the whole was pretty easy, I wasn't challenged too much at any point.

As for the update I approve of most of the changes, such as making the first 2 sections of the map larger, but I feel that the tech section suffered from being enlarged. Monster fights were a bit harder this time around, not sure if that was because I pistol started or not. I did think that there were a few too many demons in the house section for sure though.

[Dave The Daring]

Urthar said:

I suspect if Jaxxoon was paired with a good artist, they might produce some excellent work.

How about Jaxxoon Pollock?

[ArmouredBlood]

Going to to stream this in a minute at http://www.twitch.tv/armouredblood

E: Highlight here. I got kinda annoyed at joe in chat on map6 so played kinda bad. http://www.twitch.tv/armouredblood/v/7064365

[TheOrganGrinder]

MAP08: Demon Trench

A very atmospheric map, with a creeping sense of wrongess to it, from the house that's all odd levels and weird connections from one area to the next like some kind of Winchester Mystery House, to the base at the end where metal and technology twist and bend in disturbingly organic ways. House > outdoors > base isn't an unheard-of theme and progression for a Doom map, but this particular level renders it in a style that's more like a surreal nightmare than a concrete reality.

Difficulty and encounters were, I felt, unremarkable for the most part. Interesting use of the red key in that it seems only to let the player access a secret and otherwise sealed cache of ammo at the end of the map - definitely a consideration for continuous players, and also a nice little reward for thorough exploration of the far end of the map.

[scifista42]

MAP08 - "Demon Trench" by Jaxxoon R

I've played both the version in "nova2_D3.wad" and the updated version. I liked both, can't decide which was better. As usual, the one I've played first (=the original version from "nova2_D3.wad") gave me a certain (good!) impression, and the latter one then seemed odd in comparison, because that's how my mind works. In other words, I slightly prefer the original version. The updated version appeared to be more spacious, but actually unnecessarily oversized in many places that were OK before, which is not a real problem, though. Combat was good in both, although in the updated version, I've been noticing more frequently that enemies were placed in groups, cluttering next to certain walls, easy to outrun or neutralize by causing infighting. The updated version also had worse starting view than the original version, I would prefer if it got changed, if only the starting position moved (maybe here: http://i.imgur.com/JtfQa2T.png). Also, 2 crates in the start area had misaligned textures: http://i.imgur.com/7djwWLU.png

I've enjoyed the map for its exploratory feel, it's one of the types of gameplay besides action/challenge-oriented that I tend to enjoy if it's done properly, and this one was. The environment looked nice, was elaborate and varied enough, including a lot of fancy non-orthogonal architectural shapes, even inside buildings. Gameplay kept me entertained more than well enough. I've appreciated an attempt at non-linearity, but I wished the red key and final area could be connected by an additional path for the sake of bigger non-linearity. Anyway, good map, whichever version you choose for the final release. I've hinted my personal preference above.

[cannonball]

MAP08 - "Demon Trench" by Jaxxoon R
I like the dark feel expressed in this map, and to be honest the cramped nature doesn't hurt the map in ways where it might in other maps. This feels like a map which should be played slowly with lots of little ambushes to keep you on your toes.
Overall this one is rather easy, I would like to think that other monsters could be utilised in certain areas as opposed to hell knights, also I like the red key secret idea, but the red key door needs to be earlier in the map as it really doesn't help the player for the map in question.

[gaspe]

Jaxxoon R said:

Oh no, gaspe cheated-- you're only able to play up to the day of the month in terms of map numbers.

It was already the 8th in my timezone when I posted.

[Jaxxoon R]

dobu gabu maru said:

Whichever time zone gets to "tomorrow" first gets to post about it (Pacific islands) because trying to set it to an established UTC/GMT can be more confusing than it's worth.

gaspe said:

It was already the 8th in my timezone when I posted.

I should know better than to try my attempt at subtle, silly humor on the internet. Maybe that's why so many people are into memes, it's obvious someone's trying to be funny.

Ohwelleitherway 'is pretty much don't matter much really. I don't know how to end this post.

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP08 Demon Trench 5/5

a really weird moment happened at the northern end of the map where an imp somehow sank into the ground (not far from the switch that had multicolored torches around it.) otherwise, very spooky map with a claustrophic feel. although I didn't like it at first, it grew on me the second time. loved blowing up the imps with barrels.

I have not played the updated version of this map and I don't intend too since it removed the nice claustrophic feel this one had.

[obake]

Map08 : Demon Trench by Jaxxoon R
Played on HNTR, HMP, and UV, 100% kills and secrets on each. Average time: 20 minutes. Deaths: 6

This is quite an intriguing map, full of atmosphere, chaos, and contention. The beginning has a lot of Revenants among other monsters. As the map progresses, Hellknights and Barons become more of an obstacle. The ending area has mainly hitscanners.

As said before, I love the atmosphere of this map. The Doom 64 track is only part; the map has a lot of eerie lighting among its dimly lit rooms, yet there are enough light areas to not feel monotonous. This mainly applies to the outside canyons, which even though are obviously set in day, shade everything below.

The map is not as hard as I remember it being, but perhaps that is because once I discovered the backpack secret on easy, I was able to obtain it early on when I played through medium and hard mode.

The action is fairly straight forward, though there are a few small surprises to catch players off guard. My favorite is the battle in the lower cave room, where a pesky Baron teleports at the top of the stairs out to block in the player. Even this battle is not all that tough, but it still takes a lot of moving around, and you especially have to watch out for the three sergeants on the side ledge.

There are a few bugs I found. Linedef 2315 is missing a lower texture for when sector 4 next to it lowers all the way down.

Thing 203 (Lost Soul) is tagged deaf, causing me to have to backtrack all the way to the beginning to find the closet it was hiding in. It should either be removed or not have the "deaf" flag.

Overall, this is a wonderful little map. I still have as yet to play the recent update. I will give my thoughts on it after I play it.

Edit: I forgot to mention that both the starting area where there is the barrel you can shoot from the window and the secret where you shoot the barrels from behind are fantastic!

[Urthar]

Had a quick run through the updated version of MAP08.

I don't think it works nearly as well as the first version, and felt like a more conventional DOOM map. The original's narrower spaces didn't feel particularly cramped or awkward, and it's smaller chorgraphed ambushes and slower pace enchanced the suspense.

Of course a second play through will never capture the same suspense, so it's hard to judge, but I think the original was the better version.

[dobu gabu maru]

Jaxxoon R said:

I should know better than to try my attempt at subtle, silly humor on the internet.

Humor always falls a bit flat with text. Speaking of humor, I liked your video—your chatter was casual and amiable.

MAP08: My favorite E1 map. It’s dark, claustrophobic, crude, and oppressive, limiting the player’s ammo to the point of constriction. The rooms are arranged in a strange and asymmetrical way, making the easier monsters in Doom’s repertoire (imp, HK) more dangerous due to the lack of space provided. I really like the way the map snakes around, and other than the blue key door not being properly marked and the SR exit, I think the map plays perfectly. The red door is a bit useless, but the fact that it's there is nice.

Granted, the new version is good too, but swaps out the cramped spaces for pinkies, which doesn’t exactly have the same effect. I think the cave and house section play fine (though the house doesn't look nearly as interesting being so wide), and I've already stated some problems with the gameplay for the tech section in the main NOVA thread. I don't think it's a major step down, but seeing as this is one of NOVA II's two clausterphobic maps, it would be a shame to see it changed. I'm also a stickler for change in general (damn you cannonball for removing the Doom furniture in MAP01!)

[Magnusblitz]

MAP08: Demon Trench
100% kills, 2/4 secrets

Another decent map, this one provides a fairly linear assault through a dim, foreboding house/cavern/base affair. There's nothing really tricky here, though a lazy player could get vaped by a few spots like the hell noble pincer trap, or being uncareful with the cramped surroundings when fighting a revenant, etc.

Jaxxoon definitely has a penchant for what I deem "polygony" shapes, lots of weird angles and nibbly bits, much different from the usual squares or nice rounded curves in most modern maps. In the "man-made" areas it makes things feel even more foreboding since we're so used to the nice right angles or curves that it feels "off" somehow. There are a few spots where it just feels like a bit too much "detail" though, making gameplay a bit constrained (such as the weird barrier in the middle of the staircase in the base area).

Some other weird little notes... I too had the problem with the deaf lost soul that obake noted. Having the monster teleport line by the blue key switch is strange, it just led to all the monsters teleporting away - make it a one-time thing, so one monster flanks and the other remains. There's an imp stuck in an invisible pit, and some of the cacodemons had trouble moving out of their little cubbyholes. The stacked shotgun/bullet/medkit in front of the "cross" looks amateurish. I don't like the use of the pipes as a lift texture since it's not obviously a lift, but that's a minor complaint. Also, the red key secret is useless to pistol starters.

Overall, it's alright; the best things going for it are the sense of atmosphere and foreboding wrongness created by the weird angular design and music. Gameplay's pretty ho-hum.

---

Playing the updated version, I like the original better... making the areas wider and adding more monsters just makes the combat more of a chore, there's nothing that makes it more interesting. I think the cavern area is perhaps improved the best by the changes, actually, since the new design looks more natural; but the house and base areas are definitely hurt.

[Jaws In Space]

dobu gabu maru said:

(damn you cannonball for removing the Doom furniture in MAP01!)

Cannonball, stop being a horrible person & put the Doom furniture back!

[mouldy]

MAP08 - "Demon Trench" by Jaxxoon R

I played the updated version, I'm not sure what the differences are. I don't remember the old one having any problems, but I enjoyed the new one all the same. It has an atmosphere of brooding menace which works really well, although the gameplay itself I found pretty easy for the most part. I really like the visuals, they are disjointed without looking messy. The room next to the exit with all the goodies seems pretty redundant where it is, unless giving the player a blur-sphere after all the monsters are dead is a little jest. I don't really have a preference for which version is better.

[gaspe]

Jaxxoon R said:

I should know better than to try my attempt at subtle, silly humor on the internet. Maybe that's why so many people are into memes, it's obvious someone's trying to be funny.

Ohwelleitherway 'is pretty much don't matter much really. I don't know how to end this post.

Don't worry I was still kinda sleepy when I posted so I didn't get it exactly.
Btw I'm doing this again :^)

MAP09 - Husk of What Once Was

Kills: 100% | Items: 93% | Secrets: 100%

After Demons Trench we got another surreal map. The first part is a rocky outdoor, there's a very big area where most of the action takes place. Ammo is extremely low that we have to rely on infighting or simply run the first time we encounter the monster. A teleport takes us to a base with a realistic feel.
The explaration of the base is very good, here we have access to more weapons and ammo. The grey texturing is a nice continuation with the white rocks of the first part, and the fast animated comp textures are a nice touch to the atmosphere.
I found the plasma gun in the big outdoor area after I visited the base, and I found the bfg after I killed the Cyberdemon. It looks like there are more ways you can do this map. I never took a teleport in the base before I reached the exit and than I came back to kill the remaining guys.
The lightning is very uniform but it doesn't feel like more contrasts are needed. The music it's very good.
My favourite map so far in the set.

[an_mutt]

Howdy folks, I streamed a little more of NOVA II tonight, making may way through maps 13 to 17. I also played the secret maps, but gave up at the end of 32 at the mutual agreement of myself and the chat. There's a super duper treat at the end of the stream!! Please watch it, or don't even!! I wouldn't.

[tourniquet]

gaspe said:

and the fast animated comp textures are a nice touch to the atmosphere

Really? This is actually a ZDoom exclusive bug that i still need to unriddle.

[gaspe]

tourniquet said:

Really? This is actually a ZDoom exclusive bug that i still need to unriddle.

LOL. Well, in the mood of the map I thought it was something intentional.

[dobu gabu maru]

tourniquet said:

Really? This is actually a ZDoom exclusive bug that i still need to unriddle.

I actually really like it and hope it stays in the final version—it's pretty surreal to watch.

[Urthar]

ZDOOM - HMP - Pistol Start

MAP09 - Husk of What Once Was

The darkly ambient music seemed to be at odds with the contents of this map, which had some fairly frenetic gameplay outdoors followed by a series of relatively dense ambushes in a Tom Hall like tech base. It's certainly not a slaughter map, but the music really suggested that this should have been more exploratory and emptier than it turned out to be.

The map itself was pretty well crafted, progression and landmarks worked fine, though a map of this length might need some armour and health - perhaps a cache in the techbase section. In the end the map didn't really grab me, but perhaps it works better in UV.

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP09 Husk of What Once Was 2/5

fucking hell a large MTJ map. the chaingun gameplay at the beginning seemed fine until the hellknights and mancusnipers. it all empties out in a very large open area with a ton of ground to cover and more snipers. there's a nifty plasma gun in the middle that triggers a cyberdemon ambush, which was something I accidentally skipped on my first playthrough of the map. the rocket launcher in one of the corners helped quite a lot with the snipers, which were a big concern for my playthrough here. then I got the plasmagun to trigger the ambush (made sure not to forget it this time!). An okay ambush, but there being shotgun guys kinda kills the vibe a bit. Overall, wasn't really too much a fan of it, in a similar vein to my own MAP04 even.

the second half of the map is pretty textbook techbase with lotsa hitscanners. the second rocket launcher I found (with blood around it) had a very weird animated texture that I'm not sure if it fit the room. there were a few other ones in other rooms as well. okay areas with some nonlinearity. interesting BFG secret, and thankfully a way back to the large canyon in case I missed something! there's another one in the end area behind the archvile, but the doortraks are unpegged.

[Jaws In Space]

I enjoyed this map from mrthejoshmon, the map is split into 2 different halves. The first half is an outdoor area where most of the action takes place, this is a side of mrthejoshmon that I haven't seen before & I liked it quite a bit. The second half of the map is his typical style tech base that would fit right into something like Icarus, though I did seem that Hell Knights weren't as common here as in his Nova 1 maps which was nice.

I noticed a bug with some the textures in this map, I'm playing these wads with GZDoom if that makes a difference.

[TheOrganGrinder]

MAP09: Husk of What Once Was

Cool title, spooky Hexen-esque music. And with a monster count of 333, probably the most heavily populated map so far.

The map is pretty cleanly divided into an initial outdoor/caverns area dominated by a vast, flooded, rock-walled arena, and a later techbase area that overlooks that arena through a couple of tiny windows before burrowing into the rock face. The arena fight is memorable, with heavy hitters firing from elevated vantage points around its walls while imps and cacodemons throw their bodies into the general atmosphere of mayhem, but I felt most of the actual challenge of the map lurked into the closer quarters of the base area. And I felt that I should have liked this more than I ended up doing; more varied and recongisable interiors within the base might have helped, and there was also something weird going on with a flickering wall texture in there.

You can't immediately get back to the ourdoors area once you head into the techbase, but a couple of routes back open up at different points - one right at the end, once you've reached the exit, but a secret exit lets you double back earlier, if you stumbled into the techbase by accident, or were forced to leave monsters behind, or simply want to double-check for secrets, hidden monsters, or supplies.

I'd have suggested putting the exit linedef a little further down the tunnel as it's probably quite easy to stumble over it while dancing around the two arch-viles in that final little yard.

I did like the moment, as you're making your way out through the air vents towards the level's climax, when you can look down into a deserted office with a hanging body over a pool of blood. Who was this guy? It's a cozy little place he's got for himself, maybe he's the site director or head of research, someone responsible (or who feels responsible) for the hellspawn that have invaded the base and slaughtered everyone else? While the hanging body is a default graphic asset and thus heavily mutilated, the scene has kind of a whiff of a suicide about it. An eerie little tableau indeed.