Mutiny [Community Project]

[40oz]

Not many people seem to like D_DEAD; I like it a lot! No biggie though. D_DOOM is very good too. I also realized I named your map Downtown, when it probably should have been named Slums. It's just so gritty and rife with crackhouses, public transportation and subsidized housing and just reeks of poverty (in a good way :D) It makes much more sense to call it Slums.

[40oz]

ALPHA 02 RELEASED
ALPHA 02a RELEASED

PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS THE CURRENT STATE OF THE PROJECT. SOME OF THESE MAPS ARE INCOMPLETE, WHICH CAN RESULT IN UNFAIR OR LEGITIMATELY BROKEN AND POTENTIALLY UNFINISHABLE MAPS. PLEASE REVIEW THESE MAPS ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY CAN BE, NOT FOR WHAT THEY CURRENTLY ARE.

Mappers and testers are on the same team so please be patient, and understanding. These mappers are depending on you (testers) to assist them in making their maps the best they can be. Please understand that these maps are designed to accomodate all skill levels and should be tested as such. When you test these maps please indicate the skill level, and source port used when reviewing and/or reporting errors. Demos, Screenshots, bulleted error reports/suggestions or lengthy reviews are much appreciated. Please be meticulous and specific, but fair and friendly. Please do not hesitate to use cheat codes, dehacked patches, gameplay mods, or to observe the map from a map editor. In fact, you are encouraged to do so, but please mention it in your review if it is not obvious.

During testing, please check that the maps have the following:

1. Player Starts 1-4
2. Deathmatch Starts
3. Doombuilder Visual Camera thing types removed
4. At least 1 secret area
5. At least 1 "item" (for 100% items)
6. Difficulty settings implemented
7. Some Multiplayer specific items/monsters
8. No HOM effects (if it is obviously not intended)
9. Possibility of completing the map in ~10 minutes or less with no monsters
10. Gameplay that you would consider to be fun

Mappers, should you continue to work on your map, please continue to work on your single map file and upload it alone in the MAP01 slot. DO NOT EDIT THE ALPHA AND UPLOAD IT PLEASE.

DOWNLOAD Alpha 2a

MAP01: Surface by Fonze, Jimmy, and 40oz
MAP02: Shipyard by Pinchy
MAP03: Triton by MrGlide
MAP04: Warzone by joe-ilya, AD_79, and 40oz
MAP05: Downtown by dt_
MAP06: Faceless Corporation by Angry Saint, Corsair, and dt_
MAP07: Bunker Base by 40oz
MAP08: Compactor by Pavera and jmickle66666666
MAP09: Construction Site by Impboy4, Doomkid, and dt_
MAP10: Generator by scifista42, NoneeLlama, and dt_
MAP11: The Furnaces by AD_79 and 40oz
MAP12: Wildcard by purist and traversd
MAP13: Laboratory by Egregor and 40oz
MAP14: The Firewall by AD_79 and Breezeep
MAP15: Breaching The Unknown by KevinHEZ and dt_
MAP31: The Brain AD_79 and an_mutt

Changelog:

MAP01: Optimized the map for multiplayer with deathmatch starts, weapons, transforming layout, and cooperative ammunition and monsters. Fixed a couple skill related errors Fonze located, changed the arrangement of crates and barrels in the center area, and tidied up some texture misalignments.

MAP02: Reverted the version back to Pinchy's latest original, previous alpha version used one I modified by mistake. Still very WIP

MAP03: Uses MrGlide's Triton map instead of my Gravity Well map. Still very WIP.

MAP04: Unchanged, still WIP

MAP05: Uses the most recent updated version by dt_

MAP06: Unchanged

MAP07: Added some extra ammunition per Fonze's request, changed Hell Barons in secret area to Revenants, optimized the layout for deathmatch and cooperative settings.

MAP08: Unchanged

MAP09: Unchanged Uses the most recent updated version by dt_

MAP10: Uses the most recent updated version by NonneLlama

MAP11: Uses the most recent updated version by AD_79

MAP12: Unchanged

MAP13: Some changes to gameplay, and new starting area, still very WIP

MAP14: Unchanged

MAP15: Unchanged

MAP31: Not Included Yet

[40oz]

Mutiny Roadmap

I intend to implement deathmatch and cooperative settings in all maps if the mappers don't do it themselves. The maps should be totally preserved in Single player. There will be some additional monster teleport ambushes and extra shellboxes in Cooperative, possibly an extra secret area for more ammo or to make some challenges more fair. In Deathmatch, players will most likely start in a dummy sector so the players can trip some lines that will change the layout a bit then teleport into the map.

I'm currently developing MAP13, then I will move on cleaning up MAP04 some more.

I would like the next release to be a beta. Hopefully I'll be able to talk TeamTNS to do a cooperative run in it to check for multiplayer related errors to get fixed up or anything else worth reporting. This means the currently unfinished maps will need to be in a functional and near-finished state by then.

I would like to see a new TITLEPIC, INTERPIC and possibly CREDITPIC come soon. I did speak to TraceOfSpades and MrGlide (Both very talented artists) to see if they will do a sketch or two for these, then I will use an image editing program to digitally color them in, such as like the background graphics in Doom 1.

Jimmy offered the usage of any of the tracks in his 30in30 projects for Mutiny. There are also some tracks he made specifically for this project. To be fair, I asked Alfonzo, a midi enthusiast, if he would volunteer himself as the official "musical score director" and handpick the tracks for each of the maps himself that don't yet have their own midis. He accepted, and by the time this mapset is in beta stages I will ask him to do it then, and Mutiny will eventually have its own full soundtrack. I think it will still need title music, intermission music, and text interlude music though. If not, the IWAD music I selected that is currently in the alpha will have to suffice.

There was some discussion about developing a new dehacked boss monster for the final map but I seriously doubt I'm going to get around to making new sprites for it. I thought a bit about making some kinda resized/recolored/frankensprited monster using stock Doom resources but even that seems like a lot of work for me. So the final map may just be an icon of sin battle, some kinda climactic slaughter, or whatever an_mutt and AD_79 decide to do for their map.

Eventually I'd like to have the maps tested for continuity to check that the maps seem like they realistically flow into one another for a consistent and thematic narrative story. Also to check that the player doesnt accumulate too many weapons or too much ammo through continuous play that will make the mapset too easy in the long run.

---EDIT---

I'd like to see a credits map developed for MAP33. Preferably a long linear snaking techbase map connected by small arenas with a few monsters, and some floating text somewhere in each room such as the ones from Eternal Doom III with a map title and all the mappers who contributed to the map. The map will be played and recorded as a demo by a volunteer who can quickly kill the monsters, then stop and wait a few seconds in front of the text so the viewer can read it. This demo will be used as the DEMO1 lump in the wad when its complete.

After release I will also release the texture pack independently for mappers to use in speedmapping sessions or their own personal projects or whatever. Hopefully it will generate some interest for a "Mutiny Mission Pack" which will be some extra maps including some of my own and probably some of the unused maps for this project that can be played with Mutiny if the player so chooses.

Help I could use

Could certainly use some more testers to offer varying viewpoints on the maps.

MAP02 definitely could use an additional mapper to do some work on it. There is very little thing placement. The map is otherwise a good size and length and is a functioning layout. I think I'd like to see those razor thin teleport lines replaced with tunnels or bridges, or at the very least, regular Doom teleport gates too.

MAP03 could use an additional mapper to help develop the map further.

If there are any maps of which have been reviewed and not yet updated, I'd like to hear from the mappers who worked on them. If you don't have time to work on them I'd greatly appreciate it if you would volunteer someone to help work on it for you so we can get this project moving along.

Thank you everyone for all your help so far!

[nxGangrel]

Sorry for being absent for so long. There's no way I was going to quit the project.
I played the Alpha 1 demo and the level design and architecture is fantastic! A lot of the levels are very hard too!
40oz, I wouldn't mind collaborating on a level or two of yours if you'd like. We could also revisit the original level of The Brain if you wanted to still work on it. By this point, I won't be working on the three levels I did with Fonze, Trace, and Scifista.

I'll also be able to help with anyone who needs are partner or needs some one to add small additions to a level.

Great work so far guys!

[40oz]

Thanks nxGangrel! Sorry I didn't get too far with our map, I think we could work on it again sometime for the Mutiny Mission Pack, which will likely find a home for a lot of the unused resources for this project. It was coming along pretty well but at this particular point in the project I'm not sure there's much space to fit it in the original 16 maps now.

Thanks for your help with the textures, too. People have liked the ones you made a lot :)

[Fonze]

Ooo an update; sounds sexy! I'll start using these with my playtests.

Also, I'll throw my hat into that ring for the credits demo. Granted, there are many, many better players than me and if pretty much anyone steps up theyd prolly make a better choice, but if nothing else I'll see what I can do when the time comes.

As for the map NxGangrel and I worked on; I'd be willing to revisit it at such a time when the mission pack is developed.

[traversd]

Whoops, missed A2.

I'll get changes made this week - was waiting for Fonze to finish their playthrough.

rdwpa - the RL change is on me sorry. A last minute swap with the SSG in the nukage cavern and think that a non-secret pickup of the RL is something to look at putting in - possibly in the RK zone somewhere.

40oz - I'll add coop+dm stuff you mention as well.

Thx
Travers

[purist]

rdwpa said:

Map12: FDA.

This map really needs another rocket launcher. Somewhere, anywhere. A huge chunk of my 50:52 playtime* is spent doing things like single-shotgunning the revenant clown party or waiting for arch-viles to blast damage themselves to death on monsters they are infighting -- scenarios where the RL could have been really useful. There are duplicates of other weapons laying around, just not that one for some reason.

And I really think "Play the fight straight up or cheese it and suffer through tedium" is bad, a la the YK encounter. Part of the fun of FDA-ing lengthy maps without saves is cheesing what you can to increase chances of survival. Being punished for that leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This seems to be one of those maps where the author(s) did their testing with saves before the more dangerous encounters -- it seems "out of touch" with how people might approach it without them.


*Unsuccessful 3:51 attempt, successful 47:01 attempt.

Finally got time to take a look at this, thanks for the demo rdwpa, I always enjoy watching 'em. The last version of the map I'd seen was 1.8. Some observations:

1. Traversd has done a fantastic tune up job on this map. Particularly on the rocks, which are immeasurably better. To be fair, anything that looks good in this map can be pretty much solely credited to Trav. I don't think it would be an exaggeration to say I left him to it once the bones of the layout and main fights were in.

2. It's disappointing that it wasn't apparent to close the door on the revs on either attempt in the demo. This fight or flight being balanced as both possible from the start but much more easier avoided until later was the hardest challenge for me gameplay-wise. Since 1.8 more revs have been added which may have been necessary to prevent the player from too easily killing them all and missing the rest of the level but as it is I think the only option is to run away either via the teleport of lift.

3. The RK fight was only a mini-battle but it seems to have been nerfed by allowing the player to too easily leave the area once the trap is triggered. Also, it seems that the monsters in the outside area are triggered differently now, which allowed rdwpa to rely on more safety sniping than intended - this may be a trick of my memory though.

4. I like the new double archvile setup before the YK. Quite cool.

5. It was painful watching rdwpa single shotgun the big herd of revs from the ledge. An RL might have helped cheese the fight, but it would still be too easily cheesed. As Trav says in 1.8 there was a freely available RL earlier in the map if the long route is taken and I agree it wouldn't hurt to put it back. That said, the invul was wasted in the demo and this was originally the opportunity the level gives you to "clean up" - not sure if the sheer number of revs there now make this no longer a viable option which would be a shame. I think the best solution here would be to add the RL but also trigger a lowering floor or something so that the player can't use the ledge as cover like rdwpa did.

6. Equally painful was watching the slow death of the YK viles. This one though I put down to player's choice. There was more than enough ammo to take the fight to the viles and not need to rely on infighting or splash damage. Of course it's a fair tactic for FDA demo recorders but most players will either play with saves or learn the map before attempting without them and whilst I don't mean this to suggest I think playing without saves is not a legitimate method to play, it's not something a mapper should be necessarily expected to legislate for. That said, if thinning out those revs is viable, this could help those willing to be more aggressive in that fight - less bodies for the viles to rez.

7. It seems the mini-fight at the exit has been removed. It's a little odd to have so little resistance there but it doesn't really bother me.

[40oz]

I wondered about that switch, myself. I thought if there might be someway to change the layout of the map in such a way that the player has the opportunity to learn that the switch shuts the door, then go somewhere and return to the area now with revenants attempting to breach the area, hopefully that would push the player to use the door than attempt to chip away at them with the shotgun.

[baja blast rd.]

"Thanks for the demo" -> proceeds to criticize every play choice. :D

Re #5, there's no way to use the invul to kill all the revs with the SSG at any point (and using too many cells isn't a good idea on principle when you don't know what's coming later). Lowering the floor would make the cleanup phase pretty trivial with the RL. With the ledge there's always the risk of splash damage, whereas the rev horde wouldn't pose any threat pouring through a 192-wide opening. That would be a lot more fun though.

[purist]

rdwpa said:

"Thanks for the demo" -> proceeds to criticize every play choice. :D

Re #5, there's no way to use the invul to kill all the revs with the SSG at any point (and using too many cells isn't a good idea on principle when you don't know what's coming later). Lowering the floor would make the cleanup phase pretty trivial with the RL. With the ledge there's always the risk of splash damage, whereas the rev horde wouldn't pose any threat pouring through a 192-wide opening. That would be a lot more fun though.

Haha, it was more a frustration in the sense that the level allowed or encouraged you to make those. At the same time I do appreciate that the object of an FDA demo is to survive at all costs.

There was certainly enough cells on the map, even without you being able to reach that floating cell pack. Funny how it is always the instinct of the player to distrust the mapper to evenly place cell ammo and use it only in emergencies lest you were expected to a stack for a big fight later on. Anyway, reintroducing the RL would solve both problems.

@40oz - I think that might have to been a good idea but it would take quite a bit of reworking to do that now. There would need to be a new area between the door and lift and an alternative reason to close the door, which I can't think of right now.

[dt_]

40oz- did you use the latest map09 posted on the last page? Has a few fixes and the fall damage is gone

[40oz]

No I must have missed that, sorry! I'll get a hotfix version up in a few hours when I get home.

[40oz]

Updated Alpha 2 to Alpha 2a, which now features the most recent version of MAP09: Construction Site. Thank you dt_

DOWNLOAD

[baja blast rd.]

I watched demos of map07, so I can't record a FDA. The level can break in two ways, however, both occurring during casual playthroughs of mine: http://www.mediafire.com/download/y2poz9jl8f2pr1p/mut07_breakages.lmp. The first one happened when I decided to try to board the lift without alerting the manc. The second when I decided to manually close the door because there was a monster outside that I decided to skip for the time being. I guess remote switches would make those impossible.

The last fight can also become quite ridiculous if ghost revenants are resurrected, LOL. That happened too. :D

This is the most fun way to start the level: http://www.mediafire.com/download/rdumbcw8oot7325/mut07_fun.lmp

It's not actually a pure cheese since of course camping everything is possible and much safer, but I like that it's possible. Because inasmuch as any aspect of the level is tedious, it was killing the barons without the RL, and then moving on to the imps (though I liked this more), and then clearing out the mancs, etc. Please don't turn that into a slow door. :D

[Fonze]

Here are my current collection of demos: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3k18zq6d029gir5/MutinyAlpha0xUV1-9Fonze.zip?dl=0

Ok well I didn't get the memo on version 2a, so I had used v2 in conjuction with dt_'s standalone updated version of the map to make this demo, so you will need both for playback (the main wad was used as a texture pack, the MAP# should be 01).

For the "Fail" demo, the first 2:45 are b/s of me getting to the area on the ground after the SM from the beginning and for the main demo the last 2:45 were b/s of me trying to find the secret and the last bad guy, though apparently the music track for this level has revenant sounds in it so that really threw me off for a bit (funny, though). Ironically, though I reached the exit switch, I did not finish this level, effectively making both of these "fails," heh, because I got myself stuck looking for the final crap. Apparently when the entrance to the SM area closes, if the player goes back through the yellow door and down the lift they are f*cked. Kinda funny, but should prolly be fixed.

Anyway, for the list:

MAP09: Construction Site
by Impboy4, Doomkid, and dt_

- All player starts
- DM starts present
X Visual mode camera present
- 1 secret area
- 12 items
- Difficulty settings implemented
X No multiplayer anything
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- The gameplay was fun, but totally did not fit in with the map's placement. This was one of the easiest maps from this set that I've played thus far. I will totally echo rdwpa's statement that I loved the use of the SM here. It's funny to me that I didn't notice the switch last night for the megasphere, but with that blue armor from before and the SS it could have been something else. Still, I think more-so the other things (the blue armor and the SS) could have been something else instead. The megasphere was nice for the fight just for that feeling of instant 200's, but if you wanted to sort of artificially up the difficulty of the map to better match its neighboring maps, an SS wouldn't be such a bad idea instead of the megasphere. I didn't mind the instapop HK's at all, in fact I found them to be a bit of a let-down; like that's it? Both for the SSG and the ending, after the previous maps those two encounters felt so out of place I didn't know what to expect. The manc from behind was good for the end, but I think one or two PE's behind him would be a great addition to that encounter, as I ran behind him and then dealt with the three of 'em. The rev upstairs as you approach the blue key is pointless, except to punish a player's mistakes that engages in an act that can only be described as hubris. I really liked the two revs in the beginning as well, that was a fun fight with the cover and ammo situations. Those fucking spectres in the vent right before the SM killed me more than everything else in this map collectively. I don't know what that means but it's prolly not good for me so we'll just leave it at that >.< The only other thing I can say is overall this map could have used a bit more in the difficulty department, at least in the form of pressure applied during some encounters. The one right after the red door, for example, could have used a second PE to the left side of that room; I just plugged away and, well, plugged away and he died quick. The caco(s) (I forget if there were 1 or 2 now) just shot him in the back and he was about useless except as a feel-good device, and yes, I feel good now cause I handled him-- wait, that came out wrong. Couple other encounters that could have used that one extra guy (inside yellow door, inside the switch-activated door, the SSG encounter), but inside the blue door could have really used something other than the two weakest enemies in the game. I suppose also this map was balanced for fall damage, but now that it's gone some of those encounters blah blah I'm repeating myself; apologies.


That all said, I still really enjoyed this map; it looked great, played great (just a little easy in comparison with other maps), and I had fun doing it.




One last thing, don't forget to take a look at MAP08: Compactor's HoM at some point before the release; sooner would be better than later because I'll prolly forget to remind you later.

[baja blast rd.]

Map 15: Cool map. Here's an FDA. :D Nothing bad I can think of. AV sprites poke through their boxes at the end, but maybe that was intentional. Mutiny seems to have an unconventional difficulty curve. I think map05-07 have (or had, if map05 has been nerfed) probably the most lethal fights of the maps I've played, plus map05-06 are LONG. Many of the fights in map15 seem a bit easier than intended, so as a closer it would be anti-climactic. (If this isn't the final map, never mind then.)

(Unless I specify otherwise, all demos will work with the latest alpha at the time of my post.)

[PsychoGoatee]

This looks cool! I look forward to checking it out.

[40oz]

Since I'm waiting I decided to touch up and/or make new versions of some of the graphics so they look a little neater.

At the moment I am waiting on:

MAP02: Needs an additional mapper to do thing placement and gameplay choreographing.
MAp03: currently going through some updates, (MrGlide is on that now)
MAP04: going through some big changes (joe-ilya is on that right now)
MAP10: currently going through some updates (last I heard, dt_ is on that)
MAp31: I haven't seen any version of this yet, so I hope something is going on behind the scenes.

Many maps also need multiplayer settings implemented in them, I'll have to go through the maps and find out which ones they are, and also confirm whether all of them are final versions before moving on.

Anyway, I redid the M_DOOM graphics. Much cleaner now!



And here's a new INTERPIC I did. Thank you Breezeep and AD_79 for the map this screenshot is based off of, and rdwpa for the FDA that this action shot was lifted from



MUTINY COULD USE A NEW TITLEPIC

I would like an artist to sketch something for the TITLEPIC background for Mutiny. I can digitize the drawing and color it in with photo editing software, myself (here's an example.) What I'm looking for is an artists' sketch to use as a base. Pencil or graphite drawings preferably. Snap a photo of the drawing and send it to me.

Now I'm a bit undecided on what I would like to have shown as a TITLEPIC graphic. Perhaps any other of the Mutiny Teammembers could help me with that? What would like to see? Doom guy fighting monsters? burning cities? The more detailed your description, the better!

[baja blast rd.]

I like the scheme of the old M_DOOM. Seems like the best of both worlds would be to use #1's font/border but with #2's brightness.

[40oz]

The old one was a poorly resized version of the one on the OP. What do you like about it? I think I could do some of the lighting bolts or something behind it. Would that work?

[Magnusblitz]

I like the new M_DOOM better all-around, except for now having the II from Doom II in it. Just seems weird to have it in and still covered up (even if it is obviously a Doom II WAD not an Ultimate Doom one).

[baja blast rd.]

40oz said:

The old one was a poorly resized version of the one on the OP. What do you like about it? I think I could do some of the lighting bolts or something behind it. Would that work?

The font, the black border around the font, and the plasma pattern on the letters.

[kuchitsu]

I've always thought that interpics\titlepics\etc made from screenshots are kinda lazy and usually not that impressive. Almost anything drawn will have more character, and photos are better than screenshots too I think. In my mind such pictures should be closer to, like, game cover art.

[baja blast rd.]

http://www.mediafire.com/download/tbozoodt1bdcsiw/mut03unf_rdwpa_fda.lmp

Pointless FDA for the new map03. Recognized the new name on the maplist but didn't read further.

[SFoZ911]

I like the older INTERPIC, it looks better and I like the color scheme. I agree that the new M_DOOM looks overall better than the older one.

[MrGlide]

I want to do a cyborg revinent gripping the mutany text., what do you think?

[40oz]

kuchitsu said:

I've always thought that interpics\titlepics\etc made from screenshots are kinda lazy and usually not that impressive. Almost anything drawn will have more character, and photos are better than screenshots too I think. In my mind such pictures should be closer to, like, game cover art.

What's lazier, begging for people to do it for me or doing it myself? Sorry I don't make decent art or take photos; bit this is within my realm of expertise. If you're an artist or photographer, be my guest.

MrGlide said:

I want to do a cyborg revinent gripping the mutany text., what do you think?

That sounds pretty cool :)

[Angry Saint]

I have to say I prefer the old M_DOOM. It really gives a feel of dirt, old, cyberpunk.

The new one is so... post-cyberpunk, too clean.

I would say the same for the INTERPIC.

[joe-ilya]

I like the new M_DOOM more because it's easier to read, it just needs the II numbers removed because it would seem bootleg-y if so.
The new INTERPIC fits the theme more than the old one, because the old one seems out of place with it being a ghetto or a shelter.
It would be cool to have a heighty burning city view with all sorts of corpses laying around as a TITLEPIC, doesn't need a title on itself since M_DOOM is here anyways.

I'm almost done with my map, some final touches and I'm done, I've also replaced a MIDI with something from requiem.