How long will doom 3 be?

[Little Faith]

Let the fans do the add-ons. It's cheaper and, frankly, more reliable.

[dsm]

bigbadgangsta said:
Episodes - if they do episodes, they should at least have 5 with 20 levels apiece. To be realistic, I would say 10 levels apiece.

You're not being very realistic here: 5 episodes with 10-20 level each???
Have you already forgotten what some of us have said about the time it takes to do a single level in the new engine? Besides, it's already official that the game will have 30 levels or even a few more!

Hubs - I think it would be cool to see levels have multiple areas, kinda like Map 01, then you gotta go into like a computer complex area, so it is Map 01 - Area 2, and so on, and then after you finish all of Map 01, you go onto Map 02 and take on its areas.

As long as the hubs aren't too confusing (I liked the way they did it in Quake 2), I'd like it.

Multiplayer levels - I think they should have at least 30 or 40 deathmatch levels, 25 capture the flag levels, 15 team deathmatch levels and levels for other game modes.

Once again, just HOW quickly do you think id are doing the maps? 1 map per week? We're talking highly advanced technology here - doing a single wall takes forever in the new engine afaik - don't expect there to be all that many DM maps...if there are any at all.

Secret levels - I dunno about including secret levels...maybe remakes of E1M1 and Map 01?

Secret levels would ROCK! But again, I'm not sure there'll be any at all, since it takes so long to make the maps.[/quote]

Add-on level packs by ID - they should avoid this. If they do do an add-on pack, they should make it free to download and it would be multiplayer maps.

Boy are you naive. To think that id would go through countless hours of work doing highly complicated maps and give them away for free???
Keep dreaming sonny! I for one wouldn't mind shelling out money for a mission pack/expansion pack, as long as it's good (most official mission packs done for previous id games were kickass - TA was an exception, maybe because it was just another multiplayer only game).

Let the fans do the add-ons. It's cheaper and, frankly, more reliable.

Pfft, if the fans did add-ons, we would likely not be seeing new enemies/weapons in the mission packs - and a mission pack without new weapons or enemies is kinda displeasing imo. No way, let professional people do some add-ons for us - the community would have to spend years before they could learn to model well enough for that.

[RRROOOAAARRR]

One thing that would piss me off is if the ending's crap - I mean look at Medal of Honour, great game, shitty ending...it would suck if it was, like, "well done you killed the big nasty thing goodbye" which is kind of how MOH felt...:D

[Zaldron]

RRROOOAAARRR said:

One thing that would piss me off is if the ending's crap - I mean look at Medal of Honour, great game, shitty ending...it would suck if it was, like, "well done you killed the big nasty thing goodbye" which is kind of how MOH felt...:D

I rarely play a game to see the ending but I feel your pain. That was supremely lame. Then again what kind of ending for a game like MoH you can do without coming up too cheesy?

id's retelling the invasion. It makes you wonder if the servants of Hell actually invade Earth this time or not.

[dsm]

RRROOOAAARRR said:

One thing that would piss me off is if the ending's crap - I mean look at Medal of Honour, great game, shitty ending...it would suck if it was, like, "well done you killed the big nasty thing goodbye" which is kind of how MOH felt...:D

Hm, I don't think that id would make an ending THAT bad - they've always done a fairly half-decent ending imo (though never a great ending).
I think RtCW's ending was one of the better endings in an id game - I think it was cool to see BJ from the "outside", blasting away at some nazis (although that sequence seemed a li'l bit cheesy).

[Zaldron]

Oh please, RtCW's ending sucked more than Quake's. But everything id has done for Doom III surprised me so far, so I guess they'll make a good ending too.

[dsm]

Zaldron said:

Oh please, RtCW's ending sucked more than Quake's. But everything id has done for Doom III surprised me so far, so I guess they'll make a good ending too.

Why did it suck?
And I happen to think that Quake1's ending is the suckiest endings in any id game.

[Shaviro]

dsm said:

Why did it suck?

The enemy was way too easy to kill.

[dsm]

Shaviro said:

The enemy was way too easy to kill.

Ah but that was the boss - I'm talking about the ending CUTSCENE.

[Lord FlatHead]

Zaldron said:

id's retelling the invasion. It makes you wonder if the servants of Hell actually invade Earth this time or not.

If I remember correctly, that Russian feature on Doom III mentioned that "the entire game is set on Mars". Although that's not definetive information by any means - Dima's proved to us all just how unreliable Russian 'gaming journalism' can be.

[dsm]

Lord FlatHead said:

If I remember correctly, that Russian feature on Doom III mentioned that "the entire game is set on Mars". Although that's not definetive information by any means - Dima's proved to us all just how unreliable Russian 'gaming journalism' can be.

Indeed, it's already been officially stated by id employees that Doom 3 will feature a side trip to Hell.

[Manik999]

id hasn't given us a good ending since UDoom, in my opinion.

But anyways, there's two ways they could go with this:

1. They could make a mini-level transition(like Half-Life) where small bits of levels are loaded at a time to cut down on waits.

2. They could construct hubs(like Hexen & Q2) where you need to go through one place and come back before you can go somewhere else. Similarly, They could create multiple pathways in a single level to save space. For example: you need to get a vehicle through a main gate(which is locked down). Find a separate entrance, turn off security systems in the building, go out the front door to let the vehicle in.

Now, depending on the complexity of D3's levels, the first option would probably not serve its purpose well(unless they can cut down on the info required to "describe" a level). Of course, the more stuff that each level has in common, the less stuff has to be swapped in and out of memory.

But I think the second option makes more sense, since it takes away from the linearity of the game. It'd be interesting to see if id's mappers could create multiple ways to finish an objective which affects factors in later stages of the game.

[RRROOOAAARRR]

dsm said:

Ah but that was the boss - I'm talking about the ending CUTSCENE.

Point...Heinrich was pussification incarnate, but watching Himmler's face as he gets wiped is priceless...

[Dark-tenshi]

Manik999 said:

2. They could construct hubs(like Hexen & Q2) where you need to go through one place and come back before you can go somewhere else.

I like this idea,but don`t implement it too much.Sometimes i feel a bit frustated because of this..

It'd be interesting to see if id's mappers could create multiple ways to finish an objective which affects factors in later stages of the game.

Well,I really doubt that id will do it.

[Lord FlatHead]

RRROOOAAARRR said:

Point...Heinrich was pussification incarnate, but watching Himmler's face as he gets wiped is priceless...

What's even cooler is when you noclip trough the walls, put a dynamite charge on Himmler's car, then quickly kill Heinrich I and watch the cutscene. "Ze American has ruined everything... " BOOOM !

Heinrich Himmler is the creepiest guy who ever lived, no exceptions.

[Mogul]

I never was very much into the hub idea. I felt cool after I'd unlocked a new area but, as lame and unrealistic as it may be, I'm a find the key and flip the exit switch kind of guy. Puzzales are OK, though, and objectives can be pretty cool, provided you don't turn Doom into Rainbow Six. Not that R6 is a bad game, but you know... Doom is not R6. Ha.

[RRROOOAAARRR]

Lord FlatHead said:

What's even cooler is when you noclip trough the walls, put a dynamite charge on Himmler's car, then quickly kill Heinrich I and watch the cutscene. "Ze American has ruined everything... " BOOOM !

Heinrich Himmler is the creepiest guy who ever lived, no exceptions.

I just keep wanting to noclip through and kill that smug twat Deathshead when you're killing the finished ubersoldat...

[dsm]

RRROOOAAARRR said:

I just keep wanting to noclip through and kill that smug twat Deathshead when you're killing the finished ubersoldat...

Patience, my friend. It has been officially stated that there'll be a mission/expansion pack for RtCW - chances are that we'll get to kill that "twat" in that one (after all, you got to kill Dr. Schabbs in Wolf3d, right?).

[RRROOOAAARRR]

dsm said:

Patience, my friend. It has been officially stated that there'll be a mission/expansion pack for RtCW - chances are that we'll get to kill that "twat" in that one (after all, you got to kill Dr. Schabbs in Wolf3d, right?).

Really..? Damn, I must have missed that - thanks dude, you've just made my day, I loved RTCW and have wanted more for a while.

I never played the original Wolf though ( or DOOM for that matter...PC noob here :-) )

[dsm]

Well, in the original Wolf3d it was definitely easier to kill the soldiers (if you shot them, they would JERK IN PAIN, not like in RtCW where most of the enemies are "Terminators" that don't react to getting shot), but there wasn't all these shiny weapons (only RtCW weapons that were in the old Wolf3d: knife, pistol (Lüger), smg (MP40), and a chaingun (Venom gun).

It's good to see that at least the weakest enemies in Doom 3 appear to react to getting shot - thank God, I was getting really tired of all these enemies that appeared to be made out of rock, where they should have seemed more vulnurable.

[RRROOOAAARRR]

Actually the Lopers react quite nicely I thought, with a grunt of pain each time they're hit. It's a good way to judge if you're getting them or not if you're shooting them from an odd angle - I tend to snipe my way through, so that helps.

And the ubersoldaten jerk in pain and bits fly off them, also they slow down gradually as the damage accumulates. Which is nice :-).

[dsm]

RRROOOAAARRR said:

Actually the Lopers react quite nicely I thought, with a grunt of pain each time they're hit. It's a good way to judge if you're getting them or not if you're shooting them from an odd angle - I tend to snipe my way through, so that helps.

And the ubersoldaten jerk in pain and bits fly off them, also they slow down gradually as the damage accumulates. Which is nice :-).

Yeah, but compare the regular soldiers to those in MoH:AA - that's one of the few things I like about MoH: the enemies actually seem badly hurt when you shoot them.

Btw, the lopers are really a nuisance - I wouldn't mind them if it wasn't because of that invisible electrical damage field they generate in their immediate area when they leap.

Only safe way to dispose of Lopers: Make sure you can run behind cover and keep a looong distance to the bastards, and make sure you're armed with heavy weapons - flamethrower is by far the most effective.

I sure hope that Doom 3 wont have such an annoying critter.

[LorD BaZTArD]

I don't know about that dsm, id seem to love the concept of the jumping creature, for example, the fiend in Quake 1, the mutant in Quake 2 and the Loper in RTCW, also judging by the doom3 footage, the imp and pinky are fond of jumping as well. So jumping creatures IMO are going to be there anyway. (are already there actually)

Personally, I liked the loper, ripping the bastard up with the venom gun was always satisfying. I'm still not sure about the monsters in pain concept though, It really depends on the game I guess. But overall, I'm not too concerned about it. If it's in, cool, if it's out, cool. either way.

[dsm]

LorD BaZTArD said:

I don't know about that dsm, id seem to love the concept of the jumping creature, for example, the fiend in Quake 1, the mutant in Quake 2 and the Loper in RTCW, also judging by the doom3 footage, the imp and pinky are fond of jumping as well. So jumping creatures IMO are going to be there anyway. (are already there actually)

Personally, I liked the loper, ripping the bastard up with the venom gun was always satisfying. I'm still not sure about the monsters in pain concept though, It really depends on the game I guess. But overall, I'm not too concerned about it. If it's in, cool, if it's out, cool. either way.

It's not the jumping that I mind (heck, that's what makes the Lopers cool), what I mind is this: A loper leaps straight at me, I quickly sidestep and the loper flies right past me, I yell "HAH! Missed me freak!", then I notice that I just lost like 40% health, grrr.

[RRROOOAAARRR]

The way those bastards jump really freaked me out at first, IMO it's pretty cool...and the field effect doesn't really bother me, they would do that in RL after all. I hang back and snipe 'em to bits, 5 rounds from the Mauser drops 'em almost every time.

You're right about the MOH:AA death animations, they are excellent, I love te way the Nazi scum writhe in pain, gives me a warm glow ( cont. in the 'future serial killer dept.' )...and adds enormously to feel and immersion of the game. MOH:AA is the first thing I'll be installing on my new upgraded PC.