The Ultimate Doom II : Doom II levels reimagined

[JohnnyTheWolf]

Out of curiosity, do you plan to remake The Ultimate Doom in a similar manner as well?

[Gardevoir]

I'm not saying that I will, but it's possible, definitely not all of it just on my own, people are already helping me with this project. First I'll need to deal with university and other stuff, and obviously, finish remaking Doom 2.

[LkMax]

Gardevoir said:

I couldn't come up with any better name in time, won't be changing it though. Still better than "doom2bestremakeevur.wad".

Doom 2: Doom Harder
;D
Also, if you remake Doom 1, what will you call it? Ultimate Ultimate Doom?

[JohnnyTheWolf]

How about Doom: Extended? :P

Anyway, I am currently stuck on Map 6, which seems considerably more difficult than its predecessors and that perfectly illustrates how the size of the new maps can be detrimental to pacing. Unlike in the original map, it is very easy to die - especially at the beginning with the four Masterminds. As a result, you cannot afford to be as aggressive as in the original map and you need to advance much slower and more carefully.

[LkMax]

JohnnyTheWolf said:

How about Doom: Extended? :P

Ding ding ding, we have a winner! I think "Doom 2: Extended" perfectly describes the mod, and bonus for being a simple title.

[StalkerZHS]

"Doom 2: Black Mesa Edition"

[Gardevoir]

Titles are made to drag attention. Whether this is misleading or not, it sure makes a lot of noise around it. I won't be changing the title of this mod just because you guys expect it to be something different, and besides, there was no such thing before (expect that one mappack that was just custom maps and had a similar name but w/e), so, this is my image of Doom 2.

Anyway, I am currently stuck on Map 6, which seems considerably more difficult than its predecessors and that perfectly illustrates how the size of the new maps can be detrimental to pacing. Unlike in the original map, it is very easy to die - especially at the beginning with the four Masterminds. As a result, you cannot afford to be as aggressive as in the original map and you need to advance much slower and more carefully.

While this mappack indeed is way harder than original Doom 2 and the maps are bigger, it is still a matter of learning the maps secrets and finding the correct and easiest path to your victory. Once you realise that there are hidden crusher switches that can easily deal with any of these Masterminds and that there is a Megasphere secret near the start (WHICH PEOPLE USUALLY IGNORE EVEN IN THE VANILLA), you can just run around the whole map trigger happy. Just like the original Doom, no, any mappack in existence, it is a matter of learning. If you do not like the complexity of the maps, that is fine! Many people don't and tell me some of these maps are way too hard compared to the original, and I even had complaints about the number of monsters on map01 and 02, yet still, those are large maps and most of the enemies you meet there are weak meatshield zombies or imps, and then when you find SSG, it is time where harder mobs start appearing. I am trying my best not to turn this mappack into a slaughterfest, as many testers on the zandronum online community tell me the mappack is too easy even with insane difficulty monster replacers. If you're having a hard time, try easier difficulty (that cuts approximately around 15-25% of monsters on each level) to learn the maps, then, turn on the higher difficulty and try your best again. If there are some parts that are just bullshit and unforgiving, (like for example the exit of Map08 which I hopefully made easier last version... I should update the download links), I will try to patch em up for everyone. Anyone is free to test the levels, but if you prefer, I suggest waiting for the final version of this mappack which I aim to release by the end of this year (HELP IS WELCOME UNIVERSITY IS KILLING ME).

And sorry if I have accidentally insulted anyone, having a bad week.

[LkMax]

Yeah I was almost sure this would be your reaction (unfortunately), and the mod is yours so you do whatever you want, but I'll never call it Ultimate Doom II because that's just wrong to me, the same way "Doom" is a game made in 1993 and I'll call "Doom 4" the one made in 2006. =P

[Gardevoir]

And for me the only real sequel to Doom2 is Doom64. Opinions \o/

[LkMax]

Gardevoir said:

And for me the only real sequel to Doom2 is Doom64. Opinions \o/

That I can get behind.

[JohnnyTheWolf]

Gardevoir said:

If you do not like the complexity of the maps, that is fine!

Oh, do not get me wrong: I enjoy this campaign! :)

As I said before, if I am to make *one* criticism, it is that it lacks the pace of the original.

LkMax said:

That I can get behind.

So do I: Doom 64 is a criminally overlooked entry in the franchise.

[JohnnyTheWolf]

Anyway, back to The Ultimate Doom 2.

So I am having problems with "Tricks and Traps":

1- Just where is the Blue key? And how do you access the middle teleporter in the room with the five of them?

2- The puzzle near the end strikes me as a little bit too unfair: its difficulty would be acceptable if it led to a secret instead of the level's exit. :S

[Gardevoir]

1) The Blue Key is hidden inside the 'Clockwise' random teleport room. It's fully optional, though.
2) I already made it hopefully slightly easier in the latest version. It was indeed a bit too much for most of the people.

[Gardevoir]

Spoiler

The Spooky Haunted Abandoned Mines by Guardsoul. Lookin' damn perfect!

[bioshockfan90]

For sure, looking great. Better than most "doom 2 remade" projects, so I'll be keeping an eye on this one.

[Gardevoir]

WELCOME TO BRICKTROPOLIS

Features :
- Bricks
- More bricks
- Occasional rocks
- Guess what, bricks
- Water canals with brick borders
- Bricks is all you need
- Brick brick brickity brick
- Zombie neighbours

Spoiler

OH RIGHT, Guardsoul made a map too. Tenements or smth...

Spoiler

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[scifista42]

I don't think CEIL3_5 is fitting for the floor border in the last screenshot, it glaringly fails to tile any well.

[Keeper Raul]

Awesome mod! It's just what I wanted, make Doom 2 fresh and challenging again. But I have some problems/suggestions: Once upon a time John Romero said that the first thing you see in a level is very important, it helps build a good first impression, but I was kinda disappointed with this: http://imgur.com/a/TRhdP.
The new enemy seems to be glitchy when I use this gameplay mod: https://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/69451-smooth-doom/
Also, the monster in the bathroom at the beginning of "The Waste Tunnels" is too Duke Nukem for my taste, but maybe that's just me.
Anyway, I hope this helps, keep up the good work!

[Firedust]

The download link appears to be broken.

[rhinoduck]

Firedust said:

The download link appears to be broken.

Here's an alternative source: ultdoom2-dv2.5.zip

[Firedust]

rhinoduck said:

Here's an alternative source: ultdoom2-dv2.5.zip

Thanks a lot!

[Spectre01]

Just making sure, but this is still an ongoing project with the first 18 maps done as per the OP right?

[Firedust]

rileymartin said:

Just making sure, but this is still an ongoing project with the first 18 maps done as per the OP right?

Yeah, they update the thread on the zdoom forums more frequently than here. And it's not the first 18 maps. There are 18 maps but they are not in order, if that makes sense.

[Gardevoir]

I am making all the levels in order, but the guest mapper Guardsoul just picked the ones he preferred to make, so that's why some of them are not in order. Thanks for reminding me about the broken link, Best Ever died and I totally forgot to change it around everywhere, things should be fixed now.

As it is mentioned in the main post (or should be at least?) due to this mappack using dehacked patch that edits the SS Nazis (and not only), it is recommended that you load any gameplay mod after the mappack itself so it can properly replace any actors. If that doesn't help then you'll need to create an own patch wad that fixes the sprites of the SS in the mappack for your gameplay mod. Sadly I can't do anything about it.

As for the Map01 starting spot, it has two reasons to look like that :
1)As a kid when I was messing out with different map editors, I changed Map01's starting area to look similar to how it is on this map.
2)It kinda references how the starting area of Map01 was originally supposed to look like I guess?

I am well aware of "the first thing you see in a level is very important" quote and I try to stick to it with each map's starting zone. For you Map01's starting point may not look like it's anything interesting, but for me it's just a short path before you get your first encounter, which you might've not even noticed because you took the way to the balcony which people in the original Map01 often missed and started fighting with enemies over there instead.

[Firedust]

I actually like the way you've edited the starting areas for some of these, Gardevoir! Especially, the one for Waste Tunnels.

Also,please, do not decrease the number of enemies, I actually think this plays pretty damn well and I don't think it's as difficult as certain people make it to be (I've seen someone on zdoom forums saying it was too hard). HMP and ITYTD exist for a reason. I really like your idea of making the original levels biggers, most definitely correlates with what I felt like when playing this game when I was like 5. The levels are great, although I haven't played all of them.

Looking forward to the final release!

[General Rainbow Bacon]

Yeah, I agree. This looks really good. And from what I've played the gameplay is fine for a remake. I'd rather it be hard than another doom 2 at normal difficulty, that'd get boring.
Don't listen to difficulty complaints, it just reinforces the fact that some people are juvenile idiots who can't sleep at night if they aren't able to play maps on the hardest difficulty.

[Liberation]

This looks very interesting, will be having a go once I finished what I'm playing.

General Rainbow Bacon said:

Don't listen to difficulty complaints, it just reinforces the fact that some people are juvenile idiots who can't sleep at night if they aren't able to play maps on the hardest difficulty.

I play a lot of megawads etc on ITYTD and still die loads, no shame.

[PsychoGoatee]

Saying not to listen to other opinions (on say difficulty) but to listen to yours, that doesn't add up. Everybody's view is valid, we're all just people playing some video game levels.

If some find the difficulty an annoyance, that's a fact. I haven't played it (it's on my to-do list), I'm just saying all feedback is valid.

[General Rainbow Bacon]

I understand what you're saying, but I'm just saying it's his wad, he doesn't have to do what others tell him to do, even me.

[Gardevoir]

HI there, small update.
Few bugfixes, minor changes on some maps (mostly map04) and uh, that's it I guess.

[Oh look a Download button]

And few bonus screenshots of WIP Map15.

Spoiler