whats up with the demon legs?

[raymoohawk]

what do yall think abotu the legs of the demon and garon of hell in teh original doom? many illustrators draw them as digitigrade for the demon and ungulate fro the baron of hellknight, but looking at the sprites it looks like that is not the case. at first i thoght the femur was just short like in birds, but it looks more like their legs lack a knee, or have the knees on back wards. do you think this was a deliberate choice or lack of familiarity with anatomy on behalf of the id team?

post your thoughts on demon legs or any ohter quirky anatomy details you like about doom :)

[RestlessRodent]

Demons and aliens might not follow life as we know it.

[Avoozl]

Demons don't exist they were a human idea and had defined designs, aliens on the other hand do exist but we will never know for a very long time what they would look like.

[raymoohawk]

lol i know demons arent real XD

i just wanted to know what people think about their leg design, for some reason id sodtware dropped this kind of leg after quake 2 (wich had mechanical version), even tho it made the demons look more unique

[Linguica]

[raymoohawk]

would yall have liked it if doom 3 and 4 had kept the doom style legs?

[Lila Feuer]

The garon of hell.

[Maes]

That's nothing. Wait until you see the backside of cacodemons and pain elementals.

Avoozl said:

Demons don't exist they were a human idea and had defined designs, aliens on the other hand do exist but we will never know for a very long time what they would look like.

Just like demons, according to Clarke.

[Godling]

Maes said:

Just like demons, according to Clarke.

/off_topic
You do know that this a mini-series coming Dec.14th? I loved this book and hope the series stays faithful. Can't wait. /squee

[VGamingJunkie]

Not trying to start anything but it's really funny how you insist demons can't possibly exist while opening yourself up to the possibility of aliens, the designs of whom were just as made up by humans. Seems like a bit of a personal bias if you ask me.

[Avoozl]

Earth can't be the only planet filled with life in the entire universe and I said we don't know what aliens would look like, I never said they would look like our ideas of them. My general idea of aliens is simply life on other worlds.

[Maes]

No, Avoozl. The aliens are the demonic hellish mutant extraterrestrial monster devils OF DOOM. FROM SPACE.

[VGamingJunkie]

So then why do you insist demons can't possibly exist?

[ASD]

They're digitigrade.

[Jaxxoon R]

Because demons are an enemy found in id Software's hit Doom series.

[scifista42]

Because the idea of possible existence of demons comes from mythology/fantasy, while the idea of existence of aliens (read: extraterrestrial life in any form) is a scientific concept.

[VGamingJunkie]

What makes you so sure? Last I checked, the depiction of aliens is also a work of mythology and fantasy. Unless you want to show me some little grey people with solid black eyes, you can't claim one is more valid than the other. Sure, aliens may possibly exist but you can say the same for demons. Just because there are mythological depictions of them, that doesn't mean they can't possibly be real. They just probably won't look like how they appear on paintings, much like how any aliens out there probably won't look like little grey men.

[Lila Feuer]

To me they're extraterrestrials (anything outside of Earth is automatically so) that took on the form of human fears of hell and damnation and demonic imagery and used it to their advantage.

And then they just ended up digging the aesthetic so they kept it or something.

Explain the Spider Mastermind and Arachnotron, those things don't look like demons. And the Arch-Vile is also strange looking, like some kind of Martian.

[scifista42]

Life is an existing phenomenon. We know that it exists on Earth. Scientists agree that it is not unreasonable to assume that it might exist elsewhere in the universe where suitable conditions would allow it. On the other hand, demons have never been scientifically confirmed. That's why it's pure fantasy to speculate about their existence.

[Gez]

raymoohawk said:

it looks more like their legs lack a knee, or have the knees on back wards. do you think this was a deliberate choice or lack of familiarity with anatomy on behalf of the id team?

Deliberate choice, demons having backward knees is a folklore thing.

[VGamingJunkie]

Aliens haven't been scientifically confirmed, either, you just admitted it was an assumption.

[Da Werecat]

And demons aren't even a scientific assumption, they're just fairy tales.

[RaphaelMode]

They're "made up" because their leader telepathetically contacted people at Id (among others) from Kepler 621e through a fold in 4th dimension. So that there will be no mis understanding and to prevent Doom plot from happening, basically. I'm tired of this discussion in every [insert legitimate lore question here] thread.

This reminds me of the time someone asked "how would chairs look if our legs bent the other way?". Everyone but one person became furious and kinda disgusted by the asker. Like some egregore just thrown a killswitch in their brains to not answer the question. Status quo is god.

[VGamingJunkie]

Da Werecat said:

And demons aren't even a scientific assumption, they're just fairy tales.

Speaking of assumptions.

[Antroid]

Unless you completely abandon the original meaning of "demon", demons are a concept based on things that are made up and the likes of which have been repeatedly deemed ridiculous as people stopped believing in them (like basically every single mythological creature from the older mythologies).

Aliens are a concept based on a precedent that Earth's very existense sets and on simple logic that even a child should be able to grasp.

How is it so diffcult? Are you perhaps trolling? I refuse to accept that someone can't see the difference between the idea that somewhere in the entire universe another planet might have conditions suitable for life (in fact, it seems way less plausible to believe that Earth is unique in the entire universe) and the idea that supernatural forces (that have never been demonstrated in any adequate capacity) exist. These two things are fundamentally different.

Please note, when we say aliens, we don't mean greys in flying saucers that have been abducting cows and probing people's asses.

[Maes]

Speaking of imaginary creatures' legs, I always found the dragons in Golden Axe to have long, sexy legs.

[NickDaring]

I think it's an artifact of using wooden artists model as the basis of the original sculptures. From looking at the photos of the sculpts, I'd guess that they simply twisted the waste of the wooden model around so the knees pointed backwards and sculpted over that as a skeleton.

[raymoohawk]

@gez

i wasn't familiar with that folklore, where i'm from the folklore says that demons have a rooster leg and a goat leg

@nickdaring

that seems like the most likely explanation :) i suppose thats also the reason why the monsters are so muscular, they needed to hide the maniquin parts

that said id software kept the same leg type for the fiend in quake

@people derailing

i wasnt implying that demons are real, i just wanted to talk about id soft designs

[Godling]

/2_cents

Debating aliens vs demons is silly as shit.

Aliens are the suggestion of life elsewhere in the universe. That's it... very simple. Just scientists and the like suggesting there is the reasonable possibility of life... somewhere... over there (waves arms wildly in all directions)... maybe?

Demons on the other hand have a thematic and culturally driven history and are really meant to serve as conduits for exploring the human condition. Their actions and behaviors are superimpositions of our own... as opposed to shear speculation on the nature of alien life. Demons represent US (read: humanity). Demons represent our failings and foibles. Demons represent humanity gone very wrong... versus an alien that really only represents the unknown and the scientific possibility of more life in the cosmos.

[raymoohawk]

:( the point was to talk about the design desicions of the id team, i dont believe in demons, and am not claiming that the id creatures should follow what we see in earths animals, i just thought it would be interesting to discuse their hypothethycal biology like some kaiju fans do