[UPDATED] The DOOM System Upgrade Thread

[rampancy]

Plasma Gun said:

With that in mind, here's what I would recommend...

knowledge bomb!

thanks so much for the info. this is just the kind of info i need to make some important decisions!

[Plasma Gun]

rampancy said:

knowledge bomb!

thanks so much for the info. this is just the kind of info i need to make some important decisions!

No prob, if you have any more questions feel free to ask. I'm happy to help and it's clear that there are a lot of really knowledgeable folks on these forums too who have come out to help in this thread as well. You're covered :-)

[PsychoGoatee]

Plasma Gun said:

Glad you're liking it! It's pretty nifty how a ~$319 upgrade can turn a PC from barely capable of playing games to something that's probably measurably superior to a game console.

The GTX 970 is a really good GPU at an awesome price.

For sure! Thanks again for convincing me to do it in that benchmark topic.

[Plasma Gun]

PsychoGoatee said:

For sure! Thanks again for convincing me to do it in that benchmark topic.

Happy to help! One thing that strikes me as amazing is just how well the 2500K (I think this is what you have) has held up. This is a chip that came out in early 2011 and it's still tearing through modern titles.

The one thing that's a little frustrating is that the system requirements printed on the box might have people thinking that their 2500K/2600K class chips are not good enough, but the truth of the matter is that paired with a good GPU these CPUs are more than adequate.

They are also legendary over-clockers, so in the scenario in which you do need more performance, you can probably crank up the clocks fairly easily on low-cost cooling and see a huge boost in performance.

[AirRaid]

Plasma Gun said:

Just go with the stock cooler. Beware that the stock cooler does NOT come with a "K" series part; you'll need the non-overclockable chips to get ahold of one of those.

Is this a new thing? My 2500K came with a cooler.

[Plasma Gun]

AirRaid said:

Is this a new thing? My 2500K came with a cooler.

Beginning with Skylake, Intel has stopped including the cooler. Makes sense as many buyers of these chips toss those coolers into the trash bin, but it's a bummer for those who actually used them. Non-K models still get the cooler, though.

[MiNaM]

Here is how Doom Alpha is running on an i7-2700k 3.5GHz vs 4.5GHz OC with HT on, and 1680*1050 vs 4K DSR (3360*2100) resolution..

AA on High/Max


as we can see, pushing the processor +1GHz OC has no framerate improvement at all, while surprisingly running the game on 4K will make a significant performance hit that even a GTX980 couldn't handle !

[AirRaid]

How is that surprising? At 1680x1050 the GPU is rendering 1764000 pixels per frame. With DSR at 3360x2100 It's rendering 4 times as many pixels per frame - 7056000, AND scaling it down, every frame.

Surprising it takes a huge performance hit? not really.

[ReFracture]

No improvement when you crank the resolution and the GPU becomes the bottleneck anyway. This is incomplete without a graph representing the overclock at 1680x1050, I'd be curious to see if that minimum framerate moves at all.

[pritch]

Plasma Gun said:

Any plans to upgrade the GPU at some point before Doom?

TBH I really didn't want to have to...

My plan was to get a newer card for this machine in a year or two. I already have a massive backlog of games I've bought in Steam sales to play through on this set up that will do just fine with that card.

I was thinking as a sort of mid-life upgrade, new card, hopefully much bigger 2nd SSD reasonably affordable by then, possibly a 4k monitor (current is 1920x1080).

It'll bum me a bit if I can't run Doom 4 but I'm not sure it's going to bum me enough to push me out of this cycle. Also I'm not sure what it says about PC gaming if a major new release won't run on hardware that's only 2-3 years old, but then I've seen before threats of "it won't run on that" and then in the final release that it will, albeit lower settings, perhaps when execs get terrified that release price sales will be low...

I also personally don't like anything that excludes a significant proportion of willing customers who can't afford to upgrade. I'm lucky that I can if I really want to, and I'm not advocating going too far back, but there has to be a balance struck IMO.

Plasma Gun said:

Beginning with Skylake, Intel has stopped including the cooler. Makes sense as many buyers of these chips toss those coolers into the trash bin, but it's a bummer for those who actually used them. Non-K models still get the cooler, though.

It's also a way for Intel to drastically cut its shipping and manufacturing overheads, whilst still charging the same if not a little more for Skylake versus previous SKUs which if you are cynical...

There was nothing really too wrong with the stock coolers - I ran a Q6600 at 3.2Ghz no problem with mine, and it would've done 3.6 if I hadn't borked it slightly with those incredibly annoying pushpins...

Ok maybe the pushpins were really bad. But that's a universal truth.

[MiNaM]

AirRaid said:

How is that surprising? At 1680x1050 the GPU is rendering 1764000 pixels per frame. With DSR at 3360x2100 It's rendering 4 times as many pixels per frame - 7056000, AND scaling it down, every frame.

Surprising it takes a huge performance hit? not really.

I know that, but I thought that Doom wouldn't need a beefy GPU and a GTX980 is an overkill that could actually produce way more than 60fps @ 1050p, something like 70fps or higher but the engine is capped to 60..

I was actually expecting 50fps @4k, i was wrong..

It would be a disaster if idT6 won't support SLI, we'll never play Doom 60fps @ 4k with current hardware !

ReFracture said:

No improvement when you crank the resolution and the GPU becomes the bottleneck anyway. This is incomplete without a graph representing the overclock at 1680x1050, I'd be curious to see if that minimum framerate moves at all.

I'll try 4.5GHz OC on 1050p and see if that will improve min framerate, also a 2k bench, and check if it could run in Stereoscopic 3D

[Plasma Gun]

MiNaM said:

I know that, but I thought that Doom wouldn't need a beefy GPU and a GTX980 is an overkill that could actually produce way more than 60fps @ 1050p, something like 70fps or higher but the engine is capped to 60..

I was actually expecting 50fps @4k, i was wrong..

It would be a disaster if idT6 won't support SLI, we'll never play Doom 60fps @ 4k with current hardware !

I'll try 4.5GHz OC on 1050p and see if that will improve min framerate, also a 2k bench, and check if it could run in Stereoscopic 3D

I doubt that id Tech 6 will support SLI/Crossfire.

[AirRaid]

MiNaM said:

I know that, but I thought that Doom wouldn't need a beefy GPU and a GTX980 is an overkill that could actually produce way more than 60fps @ 1050p, something like 70fps or higher but the engine is capped to 60..

I was actually expecting 50fps @4k, i was wrong..

It would be a disaster if idT6 won't support SLI, we'll never play Doom 60fps @ 4k with current hardware !

No current hardware can handle new (like, current gen engine) games at 4K comfortably. You would probably be able to set up some crazy Triple Crossfire rig that could get close, but right now it's just too many pixels to push and maintain healthy framerates. The next gen of GPUs coming this year will be what you're looking for in that regard.

[HavoX]

Plasma Gun said:

I doubt that id Tech 6 will support SLI/Crossfire.

That was the case when Doom 3 came out, IIRC. Heck, Crossfire didn't even exist back then!

[DBThanatos]

Hello there.

How about this old rig:
OS: Windows 10 pro x64
Processor: Intel Core i5 650 (2 cores, 4 threads, @3.20 GHz)
Motherboard: Gigabyte H55M-S2V
Ram: 6GB DDR3 @1333MHz
Video Card: GeForce GTX 960 (4gb)

I will indeed get more RAM soon enough, I just have to find THE right RAM because I had got a nice 8gb stick, but I was fool enough to not make sure it was the right one. So I ended with a "powerful" ram that my MOBO couldnt feed.

Now, my major concern is the processor. I know it´s below the minimum requirements and when I was comparing performance benchmarks between the minimum recommended and mine, well, it doesnt look good.

Yet, I dont really have that much experience with benchmarks and what everything means. THIS is the spec sheet of my processor. What do you think? Will I be able to run the thing at all? I mean, Im not aiming for the best looks or anything. I dont mind playing in low settings and whatnot, but all that seems to be more related to the video card.

The thing is that, for example, "Wolfensten the old blood" says that needed a "Core i5-2500 3.3GHz" for MINIMUM, and yet, I was able to play the game in my rig without any issue. Im wondering if the game is going to actually be that processor intensive to justify having to buy a whole new MOBO+PROCESSOR.

[Plasma Gun]

dbthanatos said:

Hello there.

How about this old rig:
OS: Windows 10 pro x64
Processor: Intel Core i5 650 (2 cores, 4 threads, @3.20 GHz)
Motherboard: Gigabyte H55M-S2V
Ram: 6GB DDR3 @1333MHz
Video Card: GeForce GTX 960 (4gb)

I will indeed get more RAM soon enough, I just have to find THE right RAM because I had got a nice 8gb stick, but I was fool enough to not make sure it was the right one. So I ended with a "powerful" ram that my MOBO couldnt feed.

Now, my major concern is the processor. I know it´s below the minimum requirements and when I was comparing performance benchmarks between the minimum recommended and mine, well, it doesnt look good.

Yet, I dont really have that much experience with benchmarks and what everything means. THIS is the spec sheet of my processor. What do you think? Will I be able to run the thing at all? I mean, Im not aiming for the best looks or anything. I dont mind playing in low settings and whatnot, but all that seems to be more related to the video card.

The thing is that, for example, "Wolfensten the old blood" says that needed a "Core i5-2500 3.3GHz" for MINIMUM, and yet, I was able to play the game in my rig without any issue. Im wondering if the game is going to actually be that processor intensive to justify having to buy a whole new MOBO+PROCESSOR.

It really depends on how CPU intensive & core intensive the game is. If the game really needs ~4 physical cores to run well, then you're probably not in a good place. However, if it is not a CPU intensive game and/or just hits 1-2 cores really hard then you should be fine.

On a per-core basis, your CPU utterly trashes the game consoles. But the game consoles have 8 weak little cores working together versus your two fairly strong ones.

Anyway, tell me how much you're willing to sink into upgrading and I will come up with the best path for you. Just need to know your budget.

[DBThanatos]

Thanks for the reply. It's though to say how much I have for a budget, since my budget is basically not even there. I recently spend a fair amount buying the video card so Im out of spare funds.

I thought of start selling stuff I no longer use in order to get some extra cash. Also currency exchanges make it hard to give an estimate given the crazy fluctuations. I'd say I have like 150 usd. :(

[Plasma Gun]

dbthanatos said:

Thanks for the reply. It's though to say how much I have for a budget, since my budget is basically not even there. I recently spend a fair amount buying the video card so Im out of spare funds.

I thought of start selling stuff I no longer use in order to get some extra cash. Also currency exchanges make it hard to give an estimate given the crazy fluctuations. I'd say I have like 150 usd. :(

$150 USD is a lot of cash, my friend. Here's how I'd put it to work if I were you.

- Buy a Core i7 860 to drop right into your board from eBay for around $65 shipped. I found this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-CORE-i7-860-PROCESSOR-8M-CACHE-2-80-GHZ-CPU-SLBJJ-/361517035275?hash=item542c182f0b:g:giYAAOSwHxVW8aGC

Keep the remaining $95 into your bank account, because I think in this case you would be good to go :-)

That said, min spec does want 8GB of RAM...so if you try the game w/ this new CPU and it still doesn't run well, buy the following:

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/ga-h55m-s2h/CT5290925

[Deatheye]

Plasma Gun said:

$150 USD is a lot of cash, my friend. Here's how I'd put it to work if I were you.

- Buy a Core i7 860 to drop right into your board from eBay for around $65 shipped. I found this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-CORE-i7-860-PROCESSOR-8M-CACHE-2-80-GHZ-CPU-SLBJJ-/361517035275?hash=item542c182f0b:g:giYAAOSwHxVW8aGC

Keep the remaining $95 into your bank account, because I think in this case you would be good to go :-)

why should he buy a 860 Oo?

[Plasma Gun]

Deatheye said:

why should he buy a 860 Oo?

Quad core with hyper-threading, cores individually much faster than what's in a game console. Easy, cheap drop-in upgrade.

[Deatheye]

Plasma Gun said:

Quad core with hyper-threading, cores individually much faster than what's in a game console. Easy, cheap drop-in upgrade.

upgrade to what?

[Plasma Gun]

Deatheye said:

upgrade to what?

From a Core i5-650 -> Core i7 860.

[Deatheye]

Plasma Gun said:

From a Core i5-650 -> Core i7 860.

yes but what's the point of that

[pritch]

Deatheye said:

yes but what's the point of that

If you're really on a budget and you don't want to start changing the board it's a decent enough drop-in-and-go. Sell the i5 and you're not going to be in more than about 30-40 bucks. You won't get a better likely real world performance increase for that money any other way. A quad core i7 of that vintage should properly outperform the dual core i5.

The only issue I can see is power consumption and heat - i7 of that era was still 45nm I think? And they were thirsty buggers. If you wind up having to buy a new cooler for it too, might not be quite such a great choice.

[Moon Marin]

I really think you guys should hold off on upgrading until after the beta next week. If you're in the beta you can play the game and see how it runs and decide if you really need an upgrade. If you aren't in the beta - someone else is going to benchmark the beta so dont worry, hang out and see if you need an upgrade after someone bench's the game on the newer build.

[june gloom]

Moon Marin said:

I really think you guys should hold off on upgrading until after the beta next week. If you're in the beta you can play the game and see how it runs and decide if you really need an upgrade. If you aren't in the beta - someone else is going to benchmark the beta so dont worry, hang out and see if you need an upgrade after someone bench's the game on the newer build.

I'm overdue for a GPU upgrade anyway. That being said, I'm probably going to end up buying a new PC in the next couple years largely because I've never replaced a CPU and the thought of it terrifies me.

[DBThanatos]

Plasma Gun said:

$150 USD is a lot of cash, my friend. Here's how I'd put it to work if I were you.

- Buy a Core i7 860 to drop right into your board from eBay for around $65 shipped. I found this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTEL-CORE-i7-860-PROCESSOR-8M-CACHE-2-80-GHZ-CPU-SLBJJ-/361517035275?hash=item542c182f0b:g:giYAAOSwHxVW8aGC

Keep the remaining $95 into your bank account, because I think in this case you would be good to go :-)

That said, min spec does want 8GB of RAM...so if you try the game w/ this new CPU and it still doesn't run well, buy the following:

http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/ga-h55m-s2h/CT5290925

Oh wow. That's wonderful. But sadly enough, it doesnt ship to my country. But now I have a good idea of what to look for. I didnt know used CPUs could go that low.

Thank you very much for this information. It gives me a bit of hope. Now I just have to find one CPU that does ship here.

[Plasma Gun]

dbthanatos said:

Oh wow. That's wonderful. But sadly enough, it doesnt ship to my country. But now I have a good idea of what to look for. I didnt know used CPUs could go that low.

Thank you very much for this information. It gives me a bit of hope. Now I just have to find one CPU that does ship here.

What country do you live in?

[rampancy]

dethtoll said:

I'm overdue for a GPU upgrade anyway. That being said, I'm probably going to end up buying a new PC in the next couple years largely because I've never replaced a CPU and the thought of it terrifies me.

swapping the cpu is easy thing to do. you verify that the cpu is oriented in the socket properly and put the little throw lever back in place.

mounting the heatsink is pretty simple too, there are tons of vids on youtube.

as long as you check your mobo for compatibility beforehand you should be good to go.

[MiNaM]

MiNaM said:

ReFracture said:

No improvement when you crank the resolution and the GPU becomes the bottleneck anyway. This is incomplete without a graph representing the overclock at 1680x1050, I'd be curious to see if that minimum framerate moves at all.

I'll try 4.5GHz OC on 1050p and see if that will improve min framerate, also a 2k bench, and check if it could run in Stereoscopic 3D

Here's my update,

1- @1050p & 4.5GHzOC i got +2fps only on the min framerate, no big deal..

2- The game was very playable @2K resolution with the CPU @ stock 3.5GHz clock, 49.3fps avg & 42fps minimum..

3- I couldn't enable Stereo3D on DOOM, the game refuses to go in 120fps mode..