The DWmegawad Club plays: Eternal Doom

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP31 Monster Mansion

So long I have been turned around in this particular map, it made me want to skip it, but I pressed on and eventually won it after literally an hour. That was my first time playing the map, but now, a lot of stuff has been memorized. Still takes me very long to beat this map, and the music track really starts to hurt my ears the more I play.

this is some sort of luxury place (I suck with words), with rooms, dining hall, kitchen, tennis court, swimming pool, lounge area, patio, garage, storage house, Jim Flynn sure as fuck mashes everything he could out of realism here. Even moreso, there's actually not too many monsters in here, only around 89 on ITYTD for a matter of fact. You'd think Monster Mansion would be crawling with guys. I don't even bother to enter the mansion until I've gotten rid of quite a few window snipers, which comprise more annoyances than anything, as usual. Entering the mansion gives us the rocket launcher, only to be surrounded by a few mad mid-tier monsters. I really wanted to reach the lounge area, mainly for getting the red key (oh my god this place has a bar). Of course, you wouldn't expect Flynn to hide it behind a non-conspicuous bookshelf. At the TV, I accidentally set it on fire, then open the panel to find a remote on the floor, which shows exactly what I must do. Very clever Flynn. But before I do that, I can actually use the TV as a teleporter and head to the west side of the mansion. Several mid-tier monsters populate this area, and you can hop the wall by the trees it seems. I clear out the garage, then make my way back and follow the TV's guidance. The red switch opens the nearby door, but there's two walls that can be opened. I can even head through the backside of the bedroom by one of these paths. and there's ANOTHER non-conspicuous hidden door leading to the leisure yards.

Flynn even manages to implement a security room, complete with a forcefield, monitors which give me soulspheres in certain places after switch presses, teleporters to said places, and even a secret switch. The yellow key is accessible after using one of these monitors, as well as shooting a switch through the glass. Not cool considering certain other types of glass breaks upon shooting. At least with this key I can finally mop up the final parts of the level. Also, higher difficulty levels have monsters teleporting in sporadically, which are obviously distracting. That stove is a bit hilarious since the lost souls get crushed by something invisible and leave corpses behind.

[gaspe]

MAP31 - Monster Mansion

And here we are to Jim Flynn's take of a house full of monster. The place always gave me the impression of being a residence or something where to spend the holidays. Also I wonder if the level is inspired by a place that actually exists. The realism is done pretty well and all the rooms and locations (bedrooms, baths, garage and so on) are plenty of some cool furniture. There are also many tricks used to various cool stuff (like the televisions). Gameplay takes place mostly in the inner areas of the house, with some big fights in the outdoor with the bridge. Flynn isn't afraid to put mainly mid-tier monsters in the map and he always mixes them.

MAP32 - Halls of Disarray

It's interesting Getsu Fune's remark of MAP14 ending area that is the starting room of MAP32. Anyway this is probably the worst map of the set, for sure my least favourite. Lots of hallways, it's a bit like MAP06 but without interesting areas of features in the middle. Also the architecture is quite uninspired. The first areas are empty but it doesn't build atmosphere.

[T-Rex]

Secret maps (sort of), here I come!

Map31: Monster Mansion (Jim Flynn)
104% kills, 100% items, 100% secrets
Time: 19:54

Ever since I played Eternal Doom, Jim Flynn has been one of my most favourite mappers, that I took a look at all his other Doom maps, and I must say, they're just as fun to play as his contributions to this megawad. Monster Mansion, the first of the mandatory secrets maps, is no exception. It's a house-type level as the name suggests, complete with garages, bedrooms, libraries, a bathroom, a storage room, a living room, a dining room, a kitchen, and a tennis court and swimming pool to boot. This is really a change from the medieval-themed castles we've been seeing throughout. First time mappers might find themselves wandering around trying to know where they're supposed to go, but once you get a grasp on the puzzles, they should present not much of a problem. There's some instances where you'll have to shoot switches to be able to go further (like with the switch guarded by a chaingunner near the entrance gate, and then a cleverly hidden switch to reach the yellow key). I really like how you must open the side of the living room television to start it up and then press it again to reveal a remote control on the floor, and then pressing on the remote will show a hint on how to open the red door. Unfortunately, you can't activate the remote by stepping on it (ala Quake), so you'll have to hump on it when you're close to it. I also find it neat how entering on the screens will teleport you at different locations (as in the case of the monitors in the basement where you'll be teleported to where the locations they display, though hitting the switches beforehand will grant you access to some goodies). There's plenty of hidden passages, so you'll be searching every nook and cranny finding the secrets and most importantly, progression. As you make progress, an assortment of monsters will repopulate at random locations, so stay on your toes, especially with the arch-viles. Some hilarious moments are present in the level, particularly the part where you cook some lost souls on the stove near the end. A really good Eternal Doom map, which would fit rather well on Duke Nukem 3D, being one of the most realistic maps in the set. Pretty complex and the puzzles may be obtuse, but damn is it a lot of fun, especially when you're already familiar with them. It's also nonlinear as well, so there's multiple ways to complete the map.

Map32: Halls of Disarray (Matt Bollier)
100% kills, 100% items, 100% secrets
Time: 09:04

This is probably the weakest map in Eternal Doom. It's a short and linear map, which isn't bad, but damn, the first part is rather dull because you're only just shooting or hitting switches and don't face any enemies until later on when you get to the part where you need to raise the walkway (don't forget to backtrack for the imp closets that open up by then for 100% kills!). It also feels rather drab as it's mostly boxy rooms connected by rectangular corridors. The action is not so great either, just a bunch of imps to plow through and some chaingunners as well, along with a few other baddies thrown in. I would recommend using the plasma gun when you're hitting the skull switches on the elevator, opening up the bars below and even cacodemon cubbies. One of the secrets, the caged soulsphere, can be tricky to find unless you know to hump the wall sandwiched between the metal sides in the walkway area. I wish I could get to say more about this map, but it's all just hitting switches, shooting enemies, then hitting more switches, and then a little more action, and well, that's all there really is to it. At least it's a breath of fresh air from all the intricate puzzles, especially from Map31, and we're back to the expected medieval theme, considering this was the original Map15 in the second release of Eternal Doom.

Soundblock said:

Oh Alex did bunches, including the opening map. I made Smelting Plant, Junkyard and Uranium Mines. I started Beaudry's Mansion, but Alex had to finish that one for me, since for a while I was stuck in Norway with VISA woes. The ones the two if us didn't make were done by Mal Blackwell, someone who was actually part of the early Eternal Doom team for a brief while (none of his excellent texture contributions stayed in though - he had a killer set of metals, rails & wires, mostly remixes of doom2.wad textures, but excellent ones - I've enquired him recently whether he still has those textures but he doesn't). Stupid me made a comment about how his textures were "just remixes" and he took his ball and left. :-(

Thanks for the info, Soundblock. Pretty interesting that Mal Blackwell was part of the early Eternal Doom team. I know he wasn't so prolific, having only made two Doom maps dating back on its early days.

So with that, the mandatory secret levels are done, and we're going to be seeing a few short maps before it's back to the mammoth-sized ones onwards. So, it's time for my weekend break before I resume the playthrough again. See you all next time and have fun.

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP32 Halls of Disarray

Not much to say here, it's brown, it's linear, the puzzles are pretty weak. If anything, it's a filler map, very easy, only notable points are the first imp ambush and the four-switch ordeal featuring cacos. Also, no enemies for like 1-2 minutes of playing. At least it's shorter than the previous two maps, and short in this case applies to three more maps later on.

[antares031]

MAP16 - Guardstation
ZDoom, UV - Pistol Start, KIS(%): 100/98/100

The difficulty of progression of this level is somewhere between MAP31 and MAP32. It's linear, but some elements are well hidden enough to piss you off. Seriously, how could I expect an essential switch inside of the pitch-black secret room? To make it even worse, it uses switch texture with dirt and a face of ghost, making it even harder to find because of the lack of brightness and the surrounding brown, foliaged brick texture. One more thing I need to complain is the teleporter for the blue skull key. This time, I was able to find it thanks to the automap. But without the automap, I hope you have eyes of an eagle to figure it out. Other than that, the visual of this map is pretty good. The author did a good job to express the concept of this level; A medieval guard station. And the difficulty of combat is not that hard, considering that I had no problem with defeating those monsters with normal shotgun, chaingun, and berserk pack only.

[Cacowad]

Map 15: This is interesting, the map was good to explore and fight trought, details were made minimum due to the vast rendering distance, i imagine, but it convey to me the feeling it is some sort of work in progress fundation for a even bigger structure, wich i find interesting. Notable traps are the chaingunners's arena and the arch-viles's one, both can be neutralized with some foresight. The last arena can be "cheesed" by grabbing a secret blur-sphere, and i really didn't bothered to deal with the two cyberdemons.

map 31: this cross the line between being extremely cool and frustrating, mostly due to the fact that i played it without sounds (yes, i play most of the time without sounds, i am a weirdo), wich didn't helped with the audio clue that i imagine where scattered all around the map (especially the blue key area). Secrets everywhere make for a fun (and slighly irritating) ride if you forget for a while the run 'n gun mentality. The red door puzzle was really cool and lead me to a couple of secret areas while trying to figure it out. I'm gonna copy that television stuff someday. The most irritating puzzle of the map go to: the switch that is hidden in plain sight right behind you when you teleport to the bridge section, i spent really more time that i should had running around searching that one switch. Obligatory mention of the cooking lost souls and the hidded cellars into the hidded security chamber, wich also contain the light switches for the entirety of the previously dark outside. One secret didn't worked for me, the soulsphere you can see in the sky pit at the beginning didn't raised for me after i pressed the button in the security office that should have raised it (since the picture on the camera show it raised).

map 32 and 16 coming tomorrow.

[Devalaous]

Well, got my computer back, so I might as well give Eternal another try after so many years. Surely im skilled enough to actually beat it this time :D (And have the attention span to get past the puzzles)

[TimeOfDeath]

Soundblock said:

I made Smelting Plant, Junkyard and Uranium Mines.

Holy fuck I didn't realize you mapped for Redneck Rampage. Makes sense though, Uranium Mines is super epic. There's a J. Cluck's remake for doom2 on the /idgames archive but I can't remember what wad its in. I've been meaning to remake Nut House in doom2 but haven't got around to it.

[punnyone]

Map 31 - Monster Mansion - 92% kills, 66% secrets.

Jim Flynn finally enters Eternal Doom with what is certainly one of the most atypical of the set's maps. Unlike many other mansion based doom levels, Monster Mansion aims for absolute realism. Every room you can imagine your dream mansion to have is present here, and then some. Some of my favorite areas include the pool/tennis court area, and the 3D bridge field to the left (dated looking now but jaw dropping then!). There are also some really cool novelty moments such as burning lost souls alive on the stove and the tv remote puzzle...

...oh that's right, this is a Jim Flynn map so puzzles are the name of the game! To this day, I occasionally miss one minor section. In this playthrough's case, I didn't explore the upper right crate room enough and missed kills and a secret apparently. My first few times playing through this always resulted in me cheating. But oh boy, it is very satisfying to solve some of those puzzles for the first time. The security camera puzzle I've always found the most impressively designed.

Combat ranges from tight corridor fights to blasting archvilles in the open field areas. Nothing too hectic, while still providing many challenges.

Overall - one of the most unique levels not only in the set, but for Doom in general. Another contender for favorite map of the set.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP14: Pistol Only
29:31 | 82% Kills | 95% Items | 66% Secrets

Uh...not sure what happened here? I guess according to the wiki it's buggy in ZDoom or something? Couldn't open that shoot-the-blue-hole door, and then somehow I skipped the entire red key section. Also got stuck in the arch-vile room: the outside switch is repeatable-open-close, but the inside switch is once-only-stay-open. I can blame the author for that one, even if I can't blame him for the ZDoomisms. Not a particularly fun map either way.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP31: Monster Mansion
87% kills, 1/3 secrets

What a weird level. At first I thought it was just gonna be another bland myhouse.wad level. Then I had the feeling of "I have nowhere to go and I'll never figure it out." I found the red key pretty quickly (the teleporter placing me there at a specific angle clued me in) but I needed Getsu Fune's review comments to figure out the TV... mainly the "keep pressing everything" aspect since that's not usually how Doom works. I gotta admit the TV bit with the red key switch was pretty cool though. There's actually a lot of nifty design work here, especially considering my first thought was that it was just laughably oversized like most Doom furniture of the time. And it is, but aside from that it's pretty good and even quite clever in spots (such as the TV and opening fridge!)

While it's got that going for it, I can't say it was too much fun to actually play... there's a lot of Beef Barons for no real reason, the glass windows are completely arbitrary in how they work (sometimes they block everything, sometimes you can shoot to break them, sometimes they just let bullets/fireballs pass through...) and the last main area is a big clusterfuck of high-HP enemies on tiny-ass ledges.

If this were truly a secret level I'd cop out and excuse any misgivings with the "well it's secret" excuse. But it is required progression... still, though, while it definitely has some drawbacks the interesting bits help carry the day.

[Crusader No Regret]

My personal opinion is that if progression on map 11 is too obtuse, you're not going to enjoy 20 and 30.

Moving on...

Memories of map 12:
This is a brilliantly done map, just not inclined to take the time at the point to make my way through again. Some quick thoughts,

- Arg, that chaingunner in the tower at the start. No way to hit the south facing one until the bridge is raised.
- That rocket launcher secret is probably important when playing from scratch.
- First time I completed this map, I skipped the switch hunt. Attempted a keygrab on the yellow key, eventually succeeded, and left without max kills.
- Archviles concealed by fire I don't recall having issues with. It's consistent within the setting and their delayed attack gives a chance to escape without damage.

Map 13: By saving a megasphere from the last map, I can preserve enough health to survive the death exit with about 30-40% and keep my arsenal for the next map. take that game.

Map 14: Gave this a go from pistol start. Remembered to crush the archvile so no problem there. Messed up some other gimmicks so ended up punching a few extra cacodemons. Thanks in part to that, was at under 40% health for most of the map. Player skill being higher these days, quite a number won't need that first invulnerability to punch out a revenant and hellknight. I think if one rushes, they can reach the other revenant still invulnerable. The mass infight at the end is basic though still fun and it was hilarious when the spider mastermind won and went down in a single shotgun blast.

I'll stay off the bandwagon of disliking this map. Still, this does come off as gimmick reliant and something that wouldn't generate much attention had it been a standalone map outside a megawad.

[NuMetalManiak]

yeah I know this is Eternal Doom but you don't set a TV on fire by pressing use on it and then using it as a teleporter thereafter to the far left of that map. That was something I did by complete accident the first time and I'm sure everyone who beats the level had to do that. Plus necessary unmarked doors.

MAP16 Guardstation

this is an okay map. Again not much considering how short it is (by Eternal Doom standards), but it has some interesting tidbits like the warping chapel right at the start. I think one of the secrets is required, and a few switches don't have clues on what they do. The spiral staircase segment isn't well implemented, and neither is that really brown area (I'm not even sure what to call it). Forgettable. Love the music though.

[Veinen]

Map10: Crimson Tide

Ah yes, this one was another one of those standard Eternal Doom fortress maps. Feels a little less empty than the previous map although in reality there's not really that much more enemies here. They come in small mobs though so perhaps that is the difference which helps create a different feel. The opposition never really had a chance here though since SSG and a backpack are given right away. Shells ammo is abundant throughout the map but it seems to me that the authors gave some though to ration CG ammo. There's actually a lot of use for the CG in this maps since hitscanners are plenty and you're better of taking them out from the distance. Overall an average experience.

Map11: Dawn of The Dead

I really like this map. Very complex and non-linear and even though I've played this a number of times I have no clue what the "correct" route here should be so I just kind of wander around and somehow make progress. Never have I really got stuck for an extended amount of time so I guess my "strategy" works. There's a good amount action to complement the exploration although overall the map is not very difficult at all. Great map nonetheless, one my favorites in Eternal Doom.

[gaspe]

MAP16 - Guardstation

This one looks pretty cool, and the music is great. It was really nice to put those pillars in the chapel, though the proportions are a bit weird. And for the rest there are some cool structures. The only weapons here are the SG and the CG, and thankfully there aren' many tough monsters to kill.

[dobu gabu maru]

Soundblock said:

From the original release, 99% of the original textures were done by me. You may have noticed that I didn't use a single Hexen texture in Map 12 (bar the aforementioned tree).

Oh wow you're right—neat!

MAP32: Not bad! It unfortunately uses a pretty dull texture choice throughout the map, but it’s not terrible to look at (WOOD and METAL go together like toast and jam)… if anything, I just wanted it to have a wider range of light values. This map compliments MAP31 nicely, being a completely linear affair with really straightforward puzzles (I liked the blue key one). Combat isn’t anything to write home about, but it wasn’t overly malicious nor did it starve you of the SSG, which means it wins points with me. This is the kind of “filler” level I enjoy playing.

MAP16: Not much to say about this one. Has a better sense of space than the last map, though it aimlessly meanders to and fro as well. That container room near the end with the sergeants and revenant is risky business, but I was glad to have my trusty SSG by my side. Gotta say too, I’m real happy when I can beat these maps without resorting to a walkthrough (though I liberally use IDDT—no shame in that).

[antares031]

MAP17 - The Crypt
ZDoom, UV - Pistol Start, KIS(%): 100/100/100

Despite the fact that we've hit the MAP17, this level is mild and compact one. There are less than a hundred monsters in this map on UV, and the overall progression is the compilation of small combats. This level doesn't have complex layout and cryptic puzzles, so you won't have much trouble to beat this one. The architectural detail is pretty good. It's not an eye-candy, but it's good enough to enjoy this medieval crypt. The final quest after the red key door is somewhat predictable, thanks to the boxes of rocket around the arena. But I must say that the partial invisibility is just there to troll you.

[Ribbiks]

I liked these ones apparently:

16: fda. pretty good. Some of the trap-oriented areas were nice. The progression was obscure-but-not-too-obscure so overall it felt rewarding. Texturing and detailing looks solid too.

17: fda. Heh, this music feels like it should be in the opening credits of a western, not a graveyard. I kinda liked this map, tight, good bit of high-tier enemies occasionally positioned to be threatening. Hurray climactic cyberdemon fights. God help the player who decides to pick up the blur sphere in that last area.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP32: Halls of Disarray
94% kills, 7/9 secrets

Pretty forgettable map, as it's very corridor-ific and slathered in the same bland all-wood scheme for 95% of the map (the other 5% being equally bland all-grey stone and a small outdoor area). It's not terrible, as at least each room has a little bit of interest going for it with height difference or what not, but that's about it. Even the progression peters out as the map just sorta ends without any climax or resolution or anything, just up another staircase and suddenly the NOW ENTERING text.

[gaspe]

MAP17 - The Crypt

Despite this is actually a good map visually and on the gameplay I never liked it so much. The music is totally unfitting in the setting. This time though the map left to me a better impression than the past ones.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 32 -- Halls of Disarray - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
While I don't think I'd go so far as to say that this is the worst map in the set (not when it's up against the likes of map 14, anyway), there's definitely something "off" about it, and the overall experience is not very inspiring. It's almost as if the level is not quite finished or is missing an annex that would make the whole make more sense; as is one gets the sense that some of the level's quirkier ideas are not as they are so much for the sake of quirk itself, but rather leftovers from what might've originally been intended as larger/more elaborate ideas before these were scrapped and the level released in its relatively simplistic state. Many have commented on the silent start to the level, for instance; in Doom, this rare design angle is usually used to set up a sense of suspense, which is an impression that doesn't really come off here. This failure may be partially due to pure aesthetic (the level's brightly lit and its tune is rather peppy, in a medieval march sort of way), and it seems like the appearance of the first imp is intended to be cheekily anticlimactic to prep you for a scare when his kin start teleporting all around you, but there are other gameplay relics suggesting this may not have originally been the intent, ala the nonsensical monster-closets that eventually open in the pre-ambush areas after you've already left, even though there is literally no reason whatsoever to ever return.

Outside of the pair of imp ambushes that bookend the meat and potatoes of the level, there's very little of note in the combat, almost always simplistic blasting of a trickle of monsters positioned ahead of you in the series of corridors comprising the playspace; this is another level where it's distractingly obvious that you are on little more than a one-way funhouse walk. Concourse is generally quite clean, and the level's not without a certain vague sense of place owing to its very consistent/coherent texture scheme and persistent theme of walkways and passages over sludge and other liquids--some sort of bass-ackwards dark ages cedar sewer system, maybe--but there's so little of substance going on in terms of action, exploration, vista, and the like that these humble niceties can't really carry the presentation. A shame, too, as there are clearly definite ideas at play in a few places, ala the sort of "Mathias Worch lite" flavor of the blue skull's room, but in execution these bits are too little, too late. While some will surely disagree, to my taste this sort of stuff generally comes off as feeling more dull than the much larger/longer/more obtuse levels, so I'm glad it's somewhat of a singular outing in the context of the larger set (and also the only entry by this particular author, incidentally).

Map 16 -- Guardstation - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
Was somewhat surprised to read that this is in fact another Landefeld level, as other than the big pavilion to the southeast it's much more compact and modestly scaled (esp. vertically) than what he usually makes. The titular Guardstation appears to be an improvised checkpoint of sorts, consisting of some makeshift barracks and a small jail set up inside of a run-down old monastery, with a mausoleum and an unusual irrigation apparatus nearby. As with map 07 (another monastery, interestingly enough) earlier on, it seems to be implied that the UAC has established some sort of presence here, with some military storage crates and other artifacts of modernity appearing later in the level. A short-range warpgate bars further passage into the cemetery grounds and the rest of the realm beyond, perhaps a failed bulwark against infernal insurgents in the area; deactivating this eventually proves to be the overall goal of the level.

The analysis I find myself wanting to make here is that this is essentially a more palatable version of exactly the same sort of thing we just saw in map 32; again, it's a very linear/simple path marked primarily by simple incidental combat with an ambush or two at a couple of key chokepoints (and here too, the first/earliest of these is probably the most potentially damaging). Where it gets the leg-up on the previous map is simply that the combat, while simple, is generally a fair bit bloodier, and the environment itself is consistently more visually interesting, both in terms of detail and theme. The chapel building is arrayed with pillars, braces, hangings and other structural detail that nicely assuages its squat, boxy nature, and a wide range of texture assets is used (including a few from the modern/future set, as aforementioned) without seeming too clashy. Lighting seems a mite underdone in some areas, and other instances of visual roughness occasionally present themselves (obvious texture misalignments, the failure of perspective concerning skybox/buildings at the east end of the first yard, etc.), but on the whole there's a lot more to look at here than in map 32 prior.

Level progression is fairly straightforward by the set's general standards, with only one minor 'secret' definitely involved in normal progression, that being the hidden teleporter near the outdoor pews (I was unsure if the switch hidden behind a crumbling wall in one of the jail cells was mandatory for progression, or merely involved in opening the way for the optional detour down into the trench surrounding the big pavilion, E1M2 style). There's a touch of inelegant backtracking involved in a few places given the switch-heavy progression, with little done to disguise the fact, but we'll give Landefeld a nod for going out of his way to stage a cacodemon telefrag at one point. As aforesaid, combat is mostly simple gunfights versus what lies ahead of you as you move through the Guardstation, with little to trip you up other than a couple of 'surround him' ambushes. This go-round I saw some uncommonly kind RNG vs. hitscanners, and so ended up walking around for much of the runtime at like 120% health courtesy of the surfeit of blue potions scattered around. Also had more good luck in that an enemy commando obligingly opened the secret door into the soulsphere channel for me, which I do believe is a secret I've never found before now. Thanks, baldy! For his trouble he received an energetic high-five as thanks, except we both sort of whiffed and I ended up accidentally hitting him in the face with my knuckleduster-laden mitt. Oh, well, it's the thought that counts.

[SoundofDoomDoors]

I wonder if I'll finish the WAD. Interesting reading here that the secret levels are mandatory. I know Plutonia makes you play 32 if you get the secret route to 31, but I don't think I've played a wad until now that makes you play both.
---
MAP12: Hey I recognize this layout! Epic 2 map 28 was inspired by this level! Fortunately, this one's a lot easier and took me a half hour less to finish. Cyberdemons to the back are not cool. Neither is killing the player in inescapable lava. That happened when I straferan to the yellow key before pressing the switches. I think you need the red key in Epic 2 28 before you can do the switch hunt there. On this map, it's the other way around, so I died from a bad assumption.

I still like the map overall in spite of the ocassional cheapshots, mainly because seeing the resemblance in the layout to a map I've played before made it easier to navigate It did take me a while before I figured out the trick with the lift to get the blue key. That's crafty. Judging from demos on youtube, SR50ing across is also possible. SR40 didn't work when I tried it, but that happens. What are my turn keys again? I have no idea. I remembered the archviles in the flames from Epic 2 MAP28. Fire a few rockets into each one and forget.

95% Kills
100% Secrets
2 Deaths
49:25 Clear Time
---
MAP13: Cool concept. Multiple ways to a death exit. I like it. No more maps this quick, I expect. The floating text isn't visible from behind.

0% Kills
100% Secrets
Death exit!
0:33 Clear Time
---
MAP14: Fun tyson map, but pretty boxy. The main area made me cringe. There isn't much to look at here, but I was so busy gibbing things I didn't care. I missed the chance to crush the AV, so I punched him instead. The invisible walls at the end were interesting, especially since there's a method to the madness with the props indicating the corners of the wall. I left the bosses at the end after I got the key and figured out the puzzle.

95% Kills
66% Secrets
0 Deaths
18:24 Clear Time
---
MAP15: Mixed feelings. I like the multi-layered main area. I don't like the only armor being in a secret and general lack of health. I got pitted against six or seven chaingunners with 60 health and no way to progress but iddqd at one point. Taking advantage of the weapon switch delay is clever. Unavoidable death for players low on health is awful.

I found the secret level first. I have no idea where the proper exit is if there's one at all. I got ammo for one cyberdemon, but had to fight two. I just left after I released the second one.

P.S The above was written before I caught up in the thread. I know the secret levels are mandatory. I'm scared to death of Jim Flynn because I've played parts of Bob Evans' Odessa series before online. They're an experience, to put it lightly.

??? Kills
??? Secrets
Too many deaths to chaingunners
??? Clear Time. 30 minutes? It wasn't too long. 12 took more time.

[Devalaous]

SoundofDoomDoors said:

I wonder if I'll finish the WAD. Interesting reading here that the secret levels are mandatory. I know Plutonia makes you play 32 if you get the secret route to 31, but I don't think I've played a wad until now that makes you play both.

Hell to Pay treats the secret levels as mandatory levels.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP16: Guardstation
100% kills, 1/2 secrets

Oddball little map here, almost feels like a few different maps drawn together. Parts of it are a quite solidly-designed and nicely detailed chapel, but other parts are less-detailed... and there's also the weird second half which is decidedly abstract (aside from the little UAC interlude). One mandatory secret here, but the automap helps... also got a little lost when I hadn't realized I picked up the blue skullkey somewhere. Lots of random switch hitting too, but the map is thankfully pretty small. Shares the same problem as MAP31 in that the glass (well, bars in this case) aren't consistent throughout the level... some block, some don't, and some turn out to be doors. I think the map would've been better with the second section cut out, personally.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP15: Celebration of Evil
38:22 | 97% Kills | 87% Items | 66% Secrets

Oh, hey, this level! So, yeah, this one's pretty cool. Probably the biggest disappointment is that super-cool giant cathedral that's basically completely empty. Kinda feels like a bit of a waste. That final cyber fight, I nabbed the invul, then fell off the platform and got stuck between the platform and the surrounding enclosure. Hrm. Also, in GZDoom at least, there were HOMs on the bridge steps of the northern area with the four pools. But lots of good stuff here; some memorable setpieces. I did end up not bothering with the final cybers, as the exit was right there; might as well save my rockets.


MAP31: Monster Mansion
41:45 | 94% Kills | 90% Items | 66% Secrets

So I'm on the record about loathing Jim Flynn maps*, but I figured this maybe one wasn't too bad, so I'd give it another go. (Though I will almost certainly be skipping maps 25-26.) And yeah, it wasn't too bad. It actually had some of the most exciting combat yet in the WAD. It's also one of the only maps where I've actually remembered where stuff is. However, as before, I got stuck outside (in the pool/tennis courts area) and couldn't find my way back in. I had to pull up DoomBuilder to figure it out. Turns out you have to jump off the very end of the diving board to lower the blue key! Y'know, so you're not looking across the room to see the lift lower (I couldn't even hear it from that distance.) Blech. Other than that, lots of unmarked doors that were either just guesses or things I remembered from my first play. (I found the computer map, which I'm pretty sure I didn't last time.) I would have gone back for some blue armor and the night goggles, but when I got to the exit I saw an archie running around outside resurrecting things, and figured it wasn't worth it.

*On the subject of why I dislike Flynn's maps so much: Obviously, there's the maddeningly-obscure progression. Which isn't necessarily a big problem; I liked his Master Levels well enough, tricky as they were. I think part of why I detest the Eternal maps so much, though, is they just don't fit the rest of the WAD, aesthetically. I mean, you've got castles and Hexen-textured in-the-past stuff, or time-portal techbases, and then Flynn pops in with a "my house" level (toilets, toilets and TVs everywhere!) or a demonic bank branch, of all things, or all the weird gimmicky crap from MAP26. It's like everyone in the project was working with one theme, and then Jim Flynn is just doing his own thing that doesn't fit at all.

[Magnusblitz]

MAP17: The Crypt
100% kills, 2/2 secrets

Another little chapel (with graveyard) level, and a tiny one too with a sub-100 monster count on UV, mainly due to avoiding the small fry and using mostly mid-tier monsters. Nothing puzzling about this one, just a pretty straightforward romp. Looks nice though. Definitely shows its age though, by thinking that the invisibility spheres are a help rather than hindrance for the two fights they show up in. There's also a Zone 300-style Meat Corridor at the end. Music makes me think I should be in medieval Japan instead of Europe.

[T-Rex]

Magnusblitz said:

Music makes me think I should be in medieval Japan instead of Europe.

The irony about that is that the title is called "InDIAn Song." Then again, Epic 2 uses the same track in one of the Egyptian-themed maps, Map08, IIRC.

[NaZa]

I was NOT active, so forgive me.

MAP04: Nucleus by Sverre "Soundblock" Kvernmo

| Kills: 100% | Items: 90% | Secrets: 75% | Time: 43:19 | UV | Blind | Pistol Start |

Well, this was a shocker! A gargantuan map filled to the bone with various monsters! I took advantage of flipping the blue switch before that timed door closed completely in the blue key trap. It took me some time to figure out what to do to get the yellow key. A nice ending as well, with a great Spiderdemon fight. The warehouse area was a little bit awkward to navigate, but I liked it!

[NuMetalManiak]

MAP17 The Crypt

Hey this map's even shorter. the graveyard shift isn't too noteworthy though, other than a chaingunner trap at some point. I don't think the sliding door was meant to have a mancubus like right in my face upon opening it. The invulnerabilities around the cyber and baron segments at the end make this effortless. This is probably the shortest of the short trifecta.

[NaZa]

MAP05: Time Gate by Sverre Kvernmo

| Kills: 100% | Items: 90% | Secrets: 100% | Time: 24:48 | UV | Blind | Pistol Start |

I liked this level. It felt like a breather compared to the previous, but it was still fun. That "reactor" or something can give you epilepsy due to how intense it flashes. Also that Imp trap when you thought you were done was great. Overall, nice map.