The DWmegawad Club plays: THT: Threnody & No Rest for the Living

[Demon of the Well]

Map 07 -- Fort Halderman - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
I didn't really care for this the first time I played it (when the project was in public beta stage), but wanted to give it the benefit of the doubt and have another whirl for this playthrough....sometimes one's mood is just 'off', you know? Something to consider for those reading (or writing) less than glowing reviews, methinks. Be that as it may, I replayed the map in full and still don't care for it, I'm afraid.

It feels empty, really empty, even. That's the big issue, I think. Not just 'empty' in terms of a fairly light smattering of (mostly small) monsters not really convincingly filling out the big airy spaces, but empty of vibrancy, even of ideas in places. The warehouse/shipping depot building where the red key eventually appears feels like the most worked piece of the map's considerable expanse, with its stepped 'lights up' sequence and its use of a conveyor belt to introduce the keycard and few hapless guardians into the play area, and the first few minutes offer a pleasant sense of expectancy as there appear to be quite a few different avenues for exploration off of the starting lobby (that the start area has the highest concentration of enemies, most of whom are zombiemen easily killed in droves, probably also helps in this regard). It doesn't take long for this early surge to start petering out, though, and generally speaking the longer it goes on the more it dwindles, the short flare of inspiration at the red key aside. The yellow key area? When that sort of thing starts showing up in your map, you've probably made it too long/large for its own good.

Other than the secret encounter tied to the blue armor vest which most players will probably never see, combat is simplistic throughout, having the feel of a corridor shooter even where the level branches into outdoor locations--you walk along, you see monsters, you shoot them. Fin. They are mostly smallfry, as aforementioned, so I wouldn't exactly call it a 'slog' per se, but the vast majority of the action comes off as filler, like it's there because it's expected to be and for no other reason. Shotgun, chaingun, and eventually SSG are the mainstays, with a prop chainsaw not likely expected to be taken seriously as a throw-in. Both rocket launcher and plasma gun eventually appear, but I reckon it's too little too late--the RL shows up too late to be used to multi-kill most of the groups of weaklings, and ammo for it is limited as well (esp. without the two cases of reloads found in what is probably the level's most obscure secret), meaning it basically gets used once for the RK fight as a suppression weapon. The plasma gun's cameo is even more limp, with 90% of its ammo found in the sealed 'garage' (or whatever it is) with the spider mastermind--you have to rush in there to collect it before the spider blocks the door, and even if you do that the weapon is not only thoroughly unsatisfying to use in that close environment (a mid-sized square with lots of pillars to hide behind to avoid the spider's minigun), but tactically inferior to the SSG to boot.

Aesthetics are acceptable and polished enough in terms of basic concourse, but also fail to satisfy. In addition to the mostly bright and shiny techbase environments, there is a lot of outdoor terrain as well, but it's conspicuously blocky and orthogonal in terms of geometry, and so looks artificial to the point of distraction. The overall style is very representational in thrust, which is definitely a TNT/Halderman trait, but I felt like it was unsuccessfully trying to imply narrative through its progression, with a few key progression points being simply game-y and unclear rather than suggestive of diegetic interaction--apart from the issue mentioned by others where the red key is really easy to miss entirely (especially for a player aggressive enough to make short work of the monsters which precede its appearance), the first step in the route to the blue (first) key is also abstract to the point of vagueness. In our age of ever-dwindling attention spans, this sort of '90s' progression is sometimes more interesting and engaging than it's given credit for, IMO, but for that to be the case the overall environment generally has to be intriguing enough to draw you into its enigma, never really the case here since everything is so stiff and reserved. The layout doesn't do much to win one over, either--I feel like there are a lot of redundant locked doors which do little more than act as red herrings to draw you along to a further dead end in another locked door, with the early impression of non-linearity/explorability being largely illusory. Should you happen to hit one of those dead ends, your punishment is an uneventful backtrack back to where you should be, and then a commensurate back-backtrack along a now-empty combat route later on. It feels lifeless, and the presence of one minor monster closet after returning to an earlier area from the YK 'maze' does more to underscore the issue through its singularity rather than to alleviate it.

Just doesn't work for me, I guess. Memfis' intimation that this is 'too modern' is also a bit of a headscratcher to me, I must confess--if anything, I'd say it's too affectedly old-fashioned for its own good, sounding the notes of that adventurish 'realistic' TNT style (as a lot of PWADs in the late 90s/early 00s were wont to do) while losing almost all of the music.

[Spectre01]

Map 08: Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong

Well... some of the visuals were neat I guess. Not a fan of this map as neither the gameplay nor the exploration element appealed to me. Visually, it was one big mess of ideas without any clear focus or theme. The progression is also very obscure, more so than AV Map20 or the like, and the damaging blue floor didn't make navigating that large room any more fun. Apparently I missed a small switch in one of the room which leads to the red key, that happens to be a secret, and spent quite a bit of time wandering through the level. I was really tempted to idclev to 9 and just write "No" in my post. The gameplay consists of small skirmishes against weak foes with equally weak weapons, the majority being Shotgun and Chaingun action. There are a bunch of Rocket Launchers throughout the map but the cramped nature and the lack of substantial foes leaves it underused. First map in the set I straight up didn't like. Oh, and that teleportation maze was ass.

[cannonball]

MAP07 - “Fort Halderman” by Gothic
Well I died here once, but due to my computer wanting to alert me to some other thing which killed my activity in pr-boom, so ate a ton of plasma, thanks :P
This was a really easy and to be honest a rather boring map with some questionable monster placement at times. The archvile is one example where I had to backtrack a long way just to get some cover. Not good.
The Mastermind wasn't a good edition either, I just hugged a pillar in the same room and took her out with the SSG. The other spiders in the corridors is a big no-no as well.
So here we are the first dud in this mapset in my opinion. Sorry Gothic.
Edit - I will say that the conveyor trap was pretty neat so it wasn't all bad.

[The_SloVinator]

I apologize for my yesterday antics. Lessen learned. If I have a shit day, I should not play games.

Anyways...

Map 8: Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong

My point still stands. Too many details to the point where it screws up with player.
I love detailed levels but this is a bit too much for my taste.

I like the music & it wasn't that challenging monsters-wise.

[cannonball]

MAP08 - “Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong” by dobu gabu maru
This is one crazy looking map, very cramped in places too, I died a few times at the start but otherwise I did okay. The progression is a little confusing at times but I didn't mind the more relaxed gameplay here. You do get the feeling that this is one of those "What would a TNT styled mapper do a map in this day of age?" kind of vibe. I didn't get the teleport maze at all and it felt very trial and error in execution to reach the final goal which is the yellow key, that said given other works by Dobu there is probably a clue somewhere in the base that I missed :P
Joe Ilya raised a good question in regards to weird texture and architectural usage as of course Joe gets panned often in this regard whilst maps like this I personally find okay. In the end the map still works and looks fine as there is some kind of rationale behind the design so whilst the texturing looks strange it still seems cohesive as opposed to some of Joe's maps which look very 1994 in nature though saying that his mapping has improved a lot over the past couple of years.
Overall an interesting map which doesn't quite work at times, still it is an interesting insert into this map set and the wad certainly gets a positive boost from its inclusion.

[Pirx]

well, as for bailing on AV, i had little time for gaming with only the last 4 maps to go, and then everyone had left the thread, so no interest to blather about so little.


now threnody is inspired by Ty's work, with homages here and there, overall reminiscent in style and gameplay of tnt and eternal doom.


MAP01 - “Eirene” by Chris Hansen

simple starter map, base style, with imps and zombies. there's a chaingun behind a secret wall so you can shoot them from there. a bit of sniping imps through windows, a mix of high-ish tech (concrete and steel) and low tech (mossy stone)


MAP02 - “Rockage” by joe-ilya, Chris Hansen

tribute to "quarry" from icarus, with the imp "stables" and the outdoor area with 1-2 chaingunners, just a bit more detailed than the original. moody music and cloudy sky, with the same mix of tech elements and rocky cave. 2 knights to keep one moving a bit and zombies that would have been fun to blow sky high. yeah, i'm not a fan of fake walls, at least so early in an episode when you don't seem to be in hell yet and physics that warped...


MAP03 - “Chemical Facility” by Paul Corfiatis

a techbase consisting of a series of interconnected rooms leading from one key (and the due fight) to another, in a clever way. mostly light opposition, with the mid-tiers coming about at the half of the map, where the ssg is also presented, as well as secret rocket and plasma with a modest supply of ammo so the balance doesn't get screwed up. i still worked it with ssg and chaingun mostly, the only ugly surpise being an 80 hp hit on the back of my head by a revenant i didn't see, on stairs behind a door. being a pcorf map, it also has its fair share of pinkies. and i'm even more amazed by the wad's music.


MAP04 - “Manly Hatred” by Chris Hansen

cool map. a water processing plant with cisterns outdoor and boom features like moving and deep water (well, knee-deep, but it pushes you and flows between grates). lots of ssg action against well placed revenants and chaingunners which spice up things with their ambushes, and the part with rocketing the pain elementals was surprisingly evil, considering the difficulty so far. the archvile near the exit caught me by surprise, but i managed to shoot the 3 barrels placed in a row right in his face, wonder if this setup was intentional. the tnt music remix was interesting, although i would have preferred something darker, more ambient.



cisterns!




burns in water


MAP05 - “Nukevil” by Doomkid

i thought doomkid makes deathmatch maps, and i really enjoyed this one. visually it's a plain techbase with crates, storage, some nukage, not much detail, but it keeps one plowing through the opposition, mostly mid-tiers, but there's enough rocket and plasma ammo to make the weaklings explode hilariously. i read there's a bfg also, not really needed (i expected a cyb), but the more the merrier. the final room went down in a hail of plasma. looking forward to doomkid's next map.




a manc and a knight - managed to kill each other

[rehelekretep]

map08 - fda here

ooooh boy where do i start? first off, this is a pretty cool map, and i can appreciate the work thats gone into it BUT 1) i cant concentrate on multiple things at once, and 2) i am terrible at finding my way, so this map challenged me a lot in both these ways :X

it actually made me think of a JPCP map, especially the slightly unconventional texturing

the blue room with the barons, pillars & SteveD trademark 'troll-RL' was the highlight

i was dumb enough to run along the radiation floor and die a few times :(

+100 points for the pun-tastic name, and +100 also for the SS stuff everywhere especially the Hitler-portrait office :p

[Suitepee]

rehelekretep said:

it actually made me think of a JPCP map, especially the slightly unconventional texturing

I do consider tooooooasty from the JPCP crew to be the Japanese dobu gabu maru......they have a similar penchant for ridiculous map detailing!

[dobu gabu maru]

MAP08: Judging from the title of the map it should probably be clear that I’m not being entirely serious with my effort here (well, assuming you know my oeuvre). Usually I like crafting maps with a certain mood, atmosphere, and storyline to accompany them, but this was meant to be more of an offbeat, freeform experiment. Since I don’t really care for the TNT iwad I felt I was better off honoring Ty by imagining how I would make an E1 map in the 90s, with the added stipulation of using handful of Boom features I hadn’t used before (like the faster scrolling). And by “imagining how I would make a map in the 90s”, I more or less meant “purposefully do stuff that’s regarded as pretty dumb”. For instance:

• Teleporter maze? Check.
  
• Inescapable pit? Check.
  
• Damaging floor that’s not nukage? Check.
  
• Doom furniture and vehicles? Checkity check.
  
• General recklessness in regards to texture choice, like doors used as decoration? You betcha!

In addition to this, I added some personal constraints in order to get myself out of my comfort zone, like rarely adding high tier monsters, mapping rooms at unconventional angles, and depriving the player of the SSG. My core philosophy while creating the entire level was basically “if you think of it, do it.” That’s why there’s strange stuff like that lower pegged door wall, superfast scrolling lights, lift that goes up to the ceiling, two teleporters right beside each other, the big moving floor orgy, etc.—essentially any time an idea popped into my head, I made sure to implement it rather than discard/scrutinize it. I feel this outlook helped to add some inoffensive eccentricity to the level that I personally find endearing, though obviously some feel the map is too chaotic/disorganized due to it.

In similar fashion, since oldschool maps weren’t shy about ripping oldschool midis or being blunt with their references (E4M1's NIN anyone?), I decided to “dedicate” the map to one of the greatest corporate evils of the late 90s—Enron. Of course it's all mostly tongue in cheek stuff, like the OOPS logo, gleefully decorating Jeffrey Skilling’s office with nazi memorabilia, and having their gold assets guarded by the mouth of Satan himself. I think inserting Lay and Skilling as SS soldiers would be a good idea (thanks rdwpa!), though if I was going to change anything about the map, it'd probably be to add something behind the elevator doors in the car garage. I thought about putting a TNT truck back there but as time went on I more or less wanted to be finished with the map as soon as possible (which is why I outsourced the vehicle development to NinjaLiquidator).

The reception has been kinda interesting, since people find the map to be plenty intriguing or downright awful, depending on whether they can stomach the visuals and cramped gameplay. While I can't defend the lack of space (which is going to be a recurring point of contention in all my work, sorry), I'll at least say the visuals weren't picked at random; I don't think there's many cases of clashing colors or inconsistent theming... the map is primarily green and brown with black in the dark areas and white in the light, various reds or blues used as highlights. Plus there's still plenty of instances where I adhere to symmetry or manually adjust textures so they tile cleanly. I even make sure certain trimming (like this) stays both varied yet pleasing to look at, which I admit can be pretty dumb to do in a map as frantic as this. It's not "cohesive" as a holistic experience, but I think each individual area strives to remain internally consistent... to a degree (the opening is perhaps the most mishmash).

As it stands, I'm pretty happy with how it turned out... perhaps the biggest failing in my eyes is that the switch in the TNT section above the teleporter maze doesn't properly convey that it raises the floors in the maze, but other than that I implemented every dumb 90s thing I wanted to. Sorry not sorry that switch 2 is so hard to find... I wanted players to use their map!

[Demtor]

MAP07 - “Fort Halderman” by Gothic
UV - gzDoom - Pistol Start

Neat map, bit of a convoluted layout though. Had me running around quite a bit before I finally got a whiff of some direction. I haven't experienced anything like the RK conveyor belt bit before. That, was pretty damn cool. I enjoyed the mining sections. Felt like a cross between your average tech-base map and an adventure map.

MAP08 - “Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong” by dobu gabu maru
UV - gzDoom - Pistol Start

Whoa. Okay, I am very new to this. Alien Vendetta last month was my first jump into Doom Wads and this is my first Dobu Gabu Maru map and it was quite strange at first.

I read a few passing comments from a few of you so I knew I was in for something different but I didn't think of how much it would effect my play style. Visually, it was such a busy feast for the eyes that I had to play at a slower speed because everywhere I looked there was so much detail and oddball things. Like moving ceiling fixtures. A hundred rising and falling floor squares. Moving background and wall textures. That's just to name a few. There were countless arrangements of various oddities that my eyes just wouldn't settle quite like a normal Doom map would let me.

So, once I got used to being lost and a taking more of a plodding/poking pace I was able to make some decent progress. Right away I keep going in what felt like the wrong way and became overwhelmed. There are a lot of different paths you could take right from the start and I liked that even if things got a little rough because of it. Having options makes exploring more rewarding when you make it work in the end.

Overall I really enjoyed roaming around a weird twisted Enwrong nightmare of geometric horrors. I wouldn't want a whole wad of levels like this but I'm okay with an oddball here and there to mix it up.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP07: Fort Halderman
37:35 | 94% Kills | 97% Items | 50% Secrets

This one is pretty cool. It really does look and feel almost like TNT and Icarus had a kid together, and for that reason alone I really liked it. It played fast and fun, to the point where I was just zipping along and got sideswiped and killed and had "Oh crap the last time I saved was..." moment. (Wasn't terribly funny at the time, but I can laugh now.) The highlight was, of course, the red key conveyor belt battle, which was very cool, but I really liked that one lift that was lowering an endless supply of crates; that was really neat to watch.


MAP08: Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong
51:02 | 98% Kills | 96% Items | 83% Secrets

Holy cannoli, this was delightfully random. Reminded me a lot of that "Wishy Wackadoodle" map from a year or two back. For the first like 10 minutes straight, I was just running forward shooting and picking a direction to head, just getting gloriously lost. The big main area with the blue damaging floor was pretty obnoxious, honestly, and so was the teleporter maze—but the rest was pure gold. I nabbed a number of secrets late, but the level was so sprawling and convoluted, I couldn't bear to go hunting for the few I missed. Fantastic level.

[Capellan]

Shotgun Symphony behind me, I can start Threnody. Usual settings of PrBoom+ 2.5.1.4; no music, HMP continuous, frequent saves, and finishing the level is my only objective.

Map01
Solid if not terribly memorable opener. The combination of rock, wood and tech in the same base definitely puts me in mind of what little of Ty's work I have actually seen, which is Icarus, basically. The chance to traverse a room at two different heights also puts me in mind of some levels from that pack.

Gameplay is simple enough. Mostly shotgun work, though the chaingun is in an early secret that practically has neon lights around it, it's so heavily signposted. (you can tell the secrets are easy to find when I get 100%)

I did like the nukage falls area, with the way the textures had been mixed and the new tree sprites included.

[Demtor]

dobu gabu maru said:

...tons of explanation and insight...

Very cool! Thanks for giving us a glimpse of your thoughts and ideas during your creative process. Didn't realize you posted until after I just laid out my thoughts on your map! Hah, fun stuff.

[cannonball]

MAP09 - “Forgotten Reaches” by Doomkid
The final and by far the weakest map by Doomkid, the texture usage is far too variable here and in a medieval and hellish setting it stands out a lot more here and crosses the line from quirky to ugly I am afraid. The gameplay is rather slow and sloggy here as well which does not help, the secrets seem a little shoehorned in as well.
Overall I didn't enjoy this one that much.

[The_SloVinator]

I decided to continue.

Map 09 - Forgotten Reaches

Ok level design. The usage of textures is meh.

Metroid music in a DooM game is always a welcome thing in my opinion.

Gameplay was decent with few traps that got me.

[Tristan]

MAP09: Forgotten Reaches - Doomkid
Time: 19:15 (01:51:31) | Deaths: 1 (1)

Certainly an improvement on the last time I played it, none of the flat-out bullshit that even HNTR (iirc) had back in beta. Atmospherically and visually it's Doomkid's strongest offering in the project, but gameplay isn't quite up to par with his previous two maps in the set. Dobu himself said MAP08 featured cramped gameplay, and I guess thinking back on it that's kind of true, but I wouldn't have said so myself because I never had an actual problem in that map with lack of space to fight things. Not quite the same here, for example, why am I backed up against a wall in a narrow elevator trying to dodge mancubi fireballs? I've comes across many worse offenders in this regard, but it did make for some annoying moments.

The first two cyberdemons of the set show up here, both of which you fight in the red key room, though only one of them is there to begin with. Funny thing is, I sort of forgot about the one that was initially placed there, and hoooo boy that gave me a good scare, haha. Got away from it unscathed, fortunately, and playing continuously I was able to just blast it away with the BFG when I was actually ready to get rid of it. My first death of the WAD came just afterwards, from the small cluster of monsters by the red key when you take it. It's not actually a difficult fight, but when I realised rockets weren't the best choice here, I tried switching to the BFG to sort it out quickly.
Yeah, well, that was anything but quick. Naturally if you're firing a weapon already and you press 7, you end up having to wait about six months until the BFG ball actually leaves the gun, during which time a revenant suddenly appeared immediately to my right. Punch punch. In fact, the map on the whole isn't so difficult now, not really any higher in difficulty than say MAP06 or 08, so that makes the death here a bit more unfortunate.

The most annoying thing about this map though made itself apparent in the closing stages. I love dark themes and atmospheres, but holy shit, I thought I had to go and find a red door to go and get the yellow key which you ultimately need to beat the map. Nope, I don't even recall seeing a red door in this map at all, so I wandered around the map like twice looking for it, and what did I eventually find out? The yellow key is actually in some side chamber in the room that initially contains the second cyberdemon and the BFG, but good luck actually seeing that entrance because it's dark as fuck in here and the only lit sectors in that side-chamber are very much out of sight.

Overall, other than a couple of annoyances here and there, one of which is admittedly pretty major for me, the map is pretty standard, I wouldn't say any of the rest of the gameplay really shines, but it works well enough as a "normal map bridge," - for lack of a better description - between the wackiness of MAP08 and...well, I won't say anything about MAP10 for now :)
It still has a pretty oldschool style to the texturing, but it felt maybe a bit more cohesive here, but that might be just my preference for the darker style, which this captured pretty well. Very good choice of music too.

7/10

[rehelekretep]

dobu gabu maru said:

MAP08:

• Teleporter maze? Check.
  

it was definitely an interesting map - although i had forgotten about that maze - bad dobu gabu maru! >:|

[Spectre01]

Map 09: Forgotten Reaches

Good timing to switch themes before the nukage techbase overstays its welcome. This was a nice hell map with more of what I enjoy: having good weapons with a bunch of ammo and killing lots of big foes. The Cyberdemons were a nice surprise, especially when I first walked into the library with just the SSG and decided to try another path after seeing one hiding behind some bookshelves. :P I also liked the high monster density and limited movement space that forced you to slug it out in close quarters. Made some good use of the Berserk and Chainsaw too. Hell, I used every weapons on this map which is always a good sign. I will say that the 2nd Cyber was mostly trivial as you can use the stairs to BFG him with impunity, despite taking some minor splash damage. Good liberal use of Archviles as well. I've enjoyed all 3 maps by Doomkid the most so far. Loading up the next one though, the almost-1k monster count and huge automap makes me think I'm in for a 1 hour+ map.

[baja blast rd.]

Map 09: Forgotten Reaches

I liked maps 5 and 6! Having the most fun was conditional on finding secrets, but they were fun. Here, eh, not so much, really. Combat here is mostly of the grindy frontal non-threatening sort, and probably nowhere else in the mapset so far is Memfis's comment about monsters existing solely to slow down progress more apt. I really don't understand why two-thirds of these monsters exist. I think the changes from the original version probably ended up being somewhat disastrous for this map. I'd probably enjoy this map a lot more if there was either a lot less health and ammo -- meaning infighting and evasion was obligatory, and the monsters felt more like actual threats instead of roadblocks to inevitable victory -- or there were a lot fewer monsters, which would increase the pace quite a bit.

Best part is the cyberdemon sneakily hanging out behind the bookshelves. LOL.

Video whenever I feel like replaying the map. Have been working on map 10's route.

[Suitepee]

https://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/v/93983396 = final part of my playthrough, covering maps 18-20. (UV, pistol starts)

Fuck map 19 and it's annoyingly slow, irritatingly placed enemy slogfest! Nice detailing let down by cumbersome gameplay, which only really lets up at the end of the level....just.

Map 18 was alright.
Map 20 was a decent final map, with a claustrophobically tricky final wait for a "sky pillar" lift to descend. Apparently the plasma gun is the way to win this fight, and you'll need to win it off one megasphere of health replenishment too! It almost felt like a Ribbiks encounter..... and no Icon of Sin to close out THT! Good!

Overall I found THT to be a mostly enjoyable experience, save for maps 12 and 19 due to being slogfests. (visually interesting mind) I found dobu's map 08 to be the best of the mapset. Ty would have been proud!

I would like to have seen Prestidigation (by Ty) be given a tribute map in this collection though, but perhaps one for the future.

I look forward to No Rest For the Living!

[Demon of the Well]

Map 08 -- Fightnancial Crisis at Enwrong - 100% Kills / 91% Secrets
This is perhaps the strangest map by Dobu that I've seen to date, even moreso than that oddly lavish Joe-ilya remake from a while back. Blame the 90s, eh? Visually and structurally, this is for the most part well in line with what I expect (and admire) from this author, cavernous centerpiece chambers juxtaposed with sprawling webs of claustrophobic tunnels and burrows, all lovingly endowed with layers upon layers of painstaking sector detailing and many evocative diegetic vignettes. The overall mood and presentation of the place differs markedly from Dobu's usually starkly languid fare, however, the major departures being that the texture scheme is somewhat busier than normal (somewhat reminding of something by Mouldy, indeed, or perhaps early Tourniquet), and more fundamentally, that the whole thing's clearly not meant to be taken entirely seriously, as its rather silly name implies.

For the most part, I felt that the map was quite aesthetically attractive, combining a dizzying array of shapes and scales carefully interlaced and overlaid with one another in an initially confusing knot of geometry that begins to seem strangely logical the more you fiddle around with it, not unlike one of those tangled metal brainteaser puzzles one might find on a corporate exec's desk. While the texture scheme is indeed elaborate, I didn't find it to be visually noisy to the point of distraction; most selections seem to be made from a more or less realistic 'materials' standpoint (i.e. stucco, wood and other 'domestic' materials in the lobbies and offices; metal plating, chrome, and cement in the more industrial regions, etc.) and there's a mostly consistent grey-black-blue color scheme at work to keep some of the zanier choices anchored. Where things do look a bit more visually frenetic, this usually comes off as deliberate wink-wink nudge-nudge sort of stuff. A few instances play as purely abstract 90s-isms, ala the mysteriously scrolling blueberry Wolfenbrick visible through cracks looking into out of bounds areas, but most play off as wacky in-world details, ala the Nazi imagery in and around the head offices and garage or the maw of Hell acting as gatekeeper to the company's coffers. Only the small garage and its absurd sector-cars is something I'd call genuinely ugly (knowingly silly or not), with the rest of the level marked by engaging sights great and small, including some traditional DGM standbys via the highrise cityscape diorama near the garage and the shadowy metal-plated artificial 'geode' look of the 1-2-3 chamber.

On the gameplay side, this is definitely one of the more relaxed Dobumaps I've seen, and also probably the most genuinely non-linear/explorable, a pair of attributes it seemed fairly intuitive to see together in this particular author's hands. I've certainly seen Dobu do exploration framed in highly interconnected structures before, but never on anything like this kind of map-wide scale. Usually his exploration segments have tended to be really chilled out on the action front, occasionally to the point of near silence (and in one memorable occasion, containing literally no combat at all). The more atmospheric feel this type of setup naturally lends itself to has served him well in the past, but I also have to suspect that he's usually handled these segments in this way simply because his preference for ruthless, high-stress, point-blank designed encounters (usually with ammo/health controlled very strictly) would severely limit general playability in this kind of setup at best, and possibly fail to function at all at worst. Thus, previous Dobu maps generally have the nightmarish melees and the pensive searchings largely or even entirely segregated from one another. What's different in "Enwrong", then, is that it has no real nightmare fuel as such, using mostly incidental placement of mostly basic monsters throughout. Perhaps this is a design choice adopted in respect to the level's loosely 90s philosophy; whatever the case, it certainly lends itself more readily to a map like this one, where the core of the play experience is in being able to freely go in so many different directions at so many different points in overall progression. Modest designed encounters have still been fit in here and there--the scuffle against the nest of imps on very limited footing over the radioactive floor deep inside the geode machinery comes to mind--but the focus here is clearly on the non-linear and elaborate layout, rather than on fight choreography.

And this map's absolutely a tour de force of non-linearity, to whit. This was another level I had played earlier, when Threnody was in beta; in that first playthrough, I quickly found myself in the blue 1-2-3 chamber, and gradually climbed from the lower level of the 'geode' machinery to the top, activating the numbered switches along the way and surmounting the last little deadfall snare on the collapsing stairway to claim the yellow access card. The playthrough ended not long after when I got stuck in an unintended inescapable pit just beyond the yellow door directly behind the player start point (an issue which is now fixed, for the record), and so there was still a great deal for me to see this go-round. This time, in the name of fun I resolved to take a different route than the one I had previously, and so ended up fording a sewage trench, storming the garage, uncovering a secret key(!), and eventually unraveling the warp-maze in the heart of R&D only to find myself approaching the yellow card from the other side, meaning that the entire 1-2-3 chamber is essentially optional (and likewise, that all the stuff I went through this time is equally optional). My weapon loadout differed markedly this play, as well, with a heavy slant towards shotgun, pistol(!!) and chainsaw(!!!) until I eventually pried a chaingun out of a slain commando's filthy fists just as I was running out of shells. Taking a different route, the shell/bullet economy can play out quite differently (esp. if you don't find one of the secret berserk packs and so have no real melee option), and it's possible to get a rocket launcher much sooner than I did in either playthrough. I don't object to the effective absence of an SSG, incidentally (though apparently there is one somewhere in there in some kind of crazy super-secret), though I'm not sure that gating both RLs behind secrets most likely to be uncovered after clearing the areas they're in was quite the way to go, since the physical characteristics of most of the map only allow the weapon to be useful in very specific times/places. This is arguably a 'cost of doing business' thing for a layout with such complexity and with so much optional content, though, and I'll be sure to make better use of one of them next time.

Really cool map, seems to openly invite replays.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP09: Forgotten Reaches
38:42 | 99% Kills | 93% Items | 71% Secrets

This one was pretty fun, too. Loved the use of the Eternal Doom textures. A few panic-inducing moments, but nothing that couldn't be handled by BFG or (thankfully) just running away. The cybers weren't bad; the first I was able to use the secret invul on (after quickly taking out the vile and his horde.) Indeed, what hurt me most here was my inability to switch weapons properly (playing by keyboard in the dark); that got me in trouble on more than a couple occasions. What I assume was that double-secret blursphere/soulsphere eluded me; I wandered back and forth so much looking for a way in, but got nothing. Cool map.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 09 -- Forgotten Reaches - 107% Kills / 71% Secrets
So apparently this one used to be significantly different in earlier versions, but I think in the beta/RC version I played right before Threnody came out it was more or less as it is now. Doomkid, fellow DWMCers, what's markedly different between what we see here and the map's earlier incarnations?

As to what I thought of it, I would tend to agree with what seems to be the common assessment that it's weaker than Doomkid's previous maps, though I didn't find it to be actively aggravating or the like. More obviously linear than the last several maps (including Doomkid's own), this is something like a funhouse of simple tricks set in a rather vaguely textured ruinous sort of place, something like the rotting husk of an underground station claimed and turned into a nesting ground by hellspawn. It begins saucily enough--the first thing you have to do is pistol-whip a former human commando within spitting distance, and then frantically grab his weapon and turn it on advancing creatures before you're overrun--sending you down a winding, ivy-ridden access well before seemingly opening up a bit with a number of latches off of an underground bunker. All but the right choice quickly dead-end, though as in the author's previous maps the intended flow in terms of item/weapon acquisition seems to assume that you try the rooms in the 'wrong' order, getting a crucial RL from the desecrated library (with stealthy cyberdemonic bookworm lurking in the stacks) and the SSG and likely a berserk pack from the cistern room before clearing out the beasts rattling around in the cage-nest room with the BK. Try and do things out of order by going to the right room first (that is, the room with the key in this case), and you simply hit what is effectively a progression wall in that your armaments won't be sufficient to manage what's in the room. There was a similar issue in the author's previous maps, as aforesaid, but it's more pronounced here....I could see one making the argument that the matter being one of actual progress rather than simply of convenience/quality of life plays up the (presumably intentional) dungeon-crawling feel to the proceedings, though I reckon the whole picture would benefit if the limited non-linear aspect were more genuine. Imagine a scenario where you don't go into the library until you're able to pass through it, get chased out by the Cybrarian, and then end up having to contend with two of them in that space later as a result!

After the BK milestone, things mellow out considerably, which is less a function of encounter design (almost entirely frontal after this point, save the little exit trap) as of the simple fact that you start getting spoiled for supplies, with plenty of ammo (after the early paucity of shells and rockets), a free BFG, several totally free soulspheres, and a number of overpowered secrets. Monster composition never backs down--there are arch-viles used in ambush, lots of mid-tiers in congested spaces, even a second cyberdemon as aforementioned--but it's nothing to sweat about given the simplicity of encounters alongside the dramatic uptick in player momentum. These later stages of the map are probably not aided by two cosmetically different but functionally very similar areas appearing in close proximity in the progression (those being the upstairs redrock mini-maze and the ashen bloodfall canyon), though in fairness no one idea/area drags things out long enough for the proceedings to begin seeming truly laborious. Things conclude with a backtrack to the start point; new monsters have been revealed to make this more eventful, but since they are mostly both deaf and easy to spot before they spot you, their impact is limited. A pre-activated crowd gradually rumbling out of the start room down the ivy-grown stairwell probably would have worked better.

Not terrible by any means, but does seem somewhat stilted.

Edit: Yeah, I couldn't figure out the blursphere/soulsphere secret either. Some kind of remote timed tripline, maybe, I'm usually pretty bad about catching those.

[Tristan]

I looked back and it turns out my complaint about MAP09 came on the day of the idgames release, and it was on HNTR and now I'm thoroughly confused, as none of those rooms (which included the blue key room) gave me much trouble this time. Visually I don't remember it being any different, though probably because it's just turned out it's the same bloody version of the map, haha.

[Spectre01]

Map 10: Formalhaut

My prediction yesterday was indeed spot-on as this bic boi took a good 1 hour and 13 minutes to clear. Not unusual for a Mechadon map though as I learned from BTSX E2's map25 opus. There are roughly 1k enemies and a bunch of the encounters fall into the "slaughter" category as you fight through hordes of hundreds of enemies, the favourite combination here being Revenants + Cacos. There's a secret BFG that can be grabbed early on through a somewhat elaborate shootable switch puzzle. Feels like a mandatory weapon to have a good time on this map though, as the fights in the 2nd half would progress significantly slower without one. What's interesting is the large amount of rockets in the map compared to shells and the fact that the RL is grabbed earlier than the SSG. At one point I had maxed out all my ammo reserves and ended up spamming rockets at everything which was quite fun.

None of the combat is overly harsh as the large-scale fights happen naturally and without lock-ins to restrict your movement. An interesting departure from the setpiece-heavy design that's all the rage. I imagine a few of the fights can be tricky without the BFG due to the large number of Demons restricting rocket use. The map mostly alternates between a large techbase and sprawling "whiterock" caverns. Despite the large size, progression is mostly linear and at no point did I feel lost or confused as to where I should be heading to. Combat is also well-paced and the sufficient ammo keeps it from falling into the "slog" category. This is a well-done, large-scale adventure-slaughter hybrid map.

[Capellan]

Map02
I see that many others have noted the references to Icarus map03 that can be found herein. I actually like this map considerably better than the original, to be honest, as the action feels considerably more organic (albeit low key).

I agree with Demon that some barrels near the zombieman cluster would have made for a more amusing gameplay moment, as shotgunning them down as a trifle drab.

[Fonze]

Suitepee said:

https://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/v/93983396 = final part of my playthrough, covering maps 18-20. (UV, pistol starts)

Fuck map 19 and it's annoyingly slow, irritatingly placed enemy slogfest! Nice detailing let down by cumbersome gameplay, which only really lets up at the end of the level....just.

Map 18 was alright.
Map 20 was a decent final map, with a claustrophobically tricky final wait for a "sky pillar" lift to descend. Apparently the plasma gun is the way to win this fight, and you'll need to win it off one megasphere of health replenishment too! It almost felt like a Ribbiks encounter..... and no Icon of Sin to close out THT! Good!

Overall I found THT to be a mostly enjoyable experience, save for maps 12 and 19 due to being slogfests. (visually interesting mind) I found dobu's map 08 to be the best of the mapset. Ty would have been proud!

I would like to have seen Prestidigation (by Ty) be given a tribute map in this collection though, but perhaps one for the future.

I look forward to No Rest For the Living!

Hey Suite; got the chance to watch your stream. Bit off-topic so spoilered.

Spoiler

I appreciate your compliments on my enemy design; I do scatter enemies and pressure the player from multiple angles. It's not for maximum dick-ish-ness; it's for maximum effectiveness. UV is as much as the map has to offer in terms of difficulty so it's meant to apply fairly constant pressure from many angles, anything else would be easily pacifisted; one of my goals when mapping is to prevent triggers from breaking and encounters from being skipped. Every set piece encounter is meant to be fought quickly and aggressively where it takes place, not in the room before; that's not fun and it's why you didn't have fun. I also sometimes punish players for retreating to cheese certain fights because if you're to the point of cheesing, you should be playing on a lower difficulty. As a quick example (of the retreating part, not the difficulty part): your run of 19 was minorly plagued at the end by 2-3 AV's you didn't have to fight there and then, though in all fairness it did make the cyber fight much easier. Unfortunately you made the map more difficult and less fun for yourself by playing slowly, but we often find what we are looking for in life and when you go in with an expectation sometimes you create your own Hell :) If the difficulty level is too hard; turn it down and have fun :) Extra smiley faces to help convey I'm not trying to be a dick by saying this; just being real. I'd rather see you have fun than curse my name.

Speaking of, you can curse my name any time you want; you're not going to offend me, hehe. But just to be sure you direct that hate towards the correct outlet: don't direct any hate towards didy for the gameplay of UV here; that was me and I stand by the encounters as they are.

Sorry you didn't enjoy the map(s). Good luck on NRftL; give 'em Hell!

[Capellan]

Map03
Decent techbase level, though I felt the "flick a switch and now monsters teleport in / emerge from closets" thing got a little overplayed by the end. Flicking switches in general was a thing here in fact, which I guess is at least somewhat in keeping with some of the projects Ty worked on. The silver hall also reminded me of Icarus.

I've never been a fan of the "key borders on switches signifying that they give you access to that key, rather than that they need that key" motif. Apparently this is a frequent pcorf habit. Well now I have my eye on you, Corfiatis! At least in this map the switches all work the same way, and the doors are then directly opened: I've seen other maps where switches were used both to mean "access the key with this switch" and "this switch needs a key", which makes me want to burn the level author with my mind powers.

Was a tad disappointed that I couldn't jump out of any of the windows. There were numerous times it seemed it should have been possible.


Map04
I'm not generally much of a fan of the Boom trickery with currents and deep water here, but I guess they are pretty appropriate to include in this map set.

Pretty decent looking map here with some good gameplay. I found the secret route first up and went that way, quickly stumbling into the wider map. There was a definite sense here of a gradual shift of initiative here, with the monsters having the stronger tactical position in the early going and then the player getting into a more and more dominant position.

I was a bit surprised to suddenly pop up in the exit room, and actually made a point to backtrack and explore the map a bit more thoroughly, picking up 3 extra secrets in the process. I don't often bother to do this, so I guess I must have been enjoying the level!

[baja blast rd.]

Map 10: Formalhaut

Mechadon is an unfathomably skilled mapper. With everyone else, I can analyze their maps and understand how they built them, what sort of process they could have used, conceivably, but I have zero clue at all how one creates these Mechadon buildings! The architecture is pretty amazing, and it's not just the shapes, which aren't too hard to grasp, it's the way textures interlace so well and create this awesome structure of awesomeness. It's baffling, I tell you. I have no idea how many hours these maps take, but I hope for my sanity that it's upwards of 100.

On the gameplay front, Mechadon is less about creating unique encounters and more about crafting a sense of progression within a level, as Alfonzo said in a stream some days ago (and I already knew but I'll just give him credit since he reminded me to mention it in my write-up :D). We start out with the single shotgun in an open outdoor environment against lots of low-tiers in purely incidental combat, the chainsaw present for a bit of spice. Soon after that we pick up the chaingun indoors and combat starts to take a more trappy and claustrophobic leaning, culminating in the first big encounter at the blue key. After that, the rocket launcher makes its appearance, and the playspaces get bigger, and combat is distinctly about carving out space with the rocket launcher in set pieces. The SSG shows up too. Then cell ammo appears as combat returns to the open outdoors, only with the scale (and monster count) beefed up a dozen fold. Contrast! The BFG secret can be found really early, but Mechadon has restricted cell ammo to a shot or two per big encounter on average. Although I really think the BFG should be freely available somewhere in the final area, because the action is bound to drag otherwise, since the waves are so similar. From the roster, there is a conspicuous absence of cyberdemons and archviles, which is refreshing, because big epic adventures all seem to culminate in a climactic cyberdemon fight of some sort, which gets old.

Here's my video. sub-25 shouldn't be so hard if I work out an actual plan for the last area, beyond just setting everything loose, and if monsters don't go missing (I used IDDT at the end). I don't think I'll try this month again, though. Hope you enjoy.

[The_SloVinator]

Map 10 - Formalhaut

I dislike slaughterfest maps but this one sticks out. It was actually fun.
Probably because it doesn't squish you in one area with thousands of revenants & other demons, wishing you luck to survive.
Instead, you have room to flee & make strategies.

Great architecture too. One of the best maps so far.