rehelekretep Posted December 3, 2016 rdwpa said:The interiors of Echeloncouple's house are cute, and the music is cool, very redolent of Ribbiks's style. At least rehelekretep has something a tiny bit more substantial to max now. psych! 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demtor Posted December 3, 2016 MAP05 - “They Rise” gzDoom - UV – Continuous A very moody start to this one. Loved the rapid beating drum line on this music as well. Don't forget to go through the flames behind you and grab the always useless computer. It seems when alien demons invade, computer technology will not help you as much as you think it will. To me, one important thing happens in this map that gets overshadowed by the large distracting pink metal subway car. There is a shotgun sargent who surprisingly pops up to greet you if you manage to survive the zombies and snake man in the halls. His death brings you a significant upgrade in firing power, the shotgun. MAP06 - “Home” gzDoom - UV – Continuous I'm curious to see how the ammo situation will play out in this wad. As it is here, I ran out of shells early, decided to save my rockets for now and pistol whipped a spider and a few more zombies before finding more buckshot around the corner. I know I have cells but without even a chaingun I feel like I'll have to wait quite a bit before those become useful. I am lost without a computer map! None to be found here. Where is my achievement for finding them all so far? Here I was hoping they'd be hidden through out each and every map. Guess not. It's been mentioned already but it really is too bad this is so small. I get that small maps and odd design choices are par for the course with Echelon but I felt like things could have really started to pick up here if a little more effort was put forth even if it was just a few copy pasted areas. Ah well, just enjoy the unique looking green buildings while you can because it will be over quickly. They contrast so well against the dark blue sky. The interior design of the home is the unsung highlight of the first combat heavy map I think. You can cook up a greasy meal and peruse some art pieces at your leisure. My favorite being in the bedroom with Marilyn Monroe and her blue armor. Seems no one is home but there is written note (in a language I don't quite understand) but the TV screen confirms there was an evacuation. Which also serves as the exit switch for this map, oddly enough. No red sprites to show this will end, just a quick flick of the channel and it's time to move on. Before we do however, let's over analyze some of the eclectic art on display inside shall we? Three sets of trees. One group huddled close together. For warmth perhaps, as the blue here gives a cold and uninviting feel. Another group lined together standing tall against the ominous red sky. In defiance maybe of what the outside forces will bring to their long standing community. The last trees are shown touching each other tree limb to tree limb while casting their individual shadows over the surroundings before them. Natural unity and independence on display all at once. Blue on blue, layered together. Repeating colors and patterns, pleasing to the eye however unchanging in form. Is it just the combined look of the design I find enjoyable our is it the deep rooted desire to see things make orderly sense when put together correctly? A touch of the ancient orient with a deity and rounded mountain ranges from that region of the world. Nature and religion on display in such simple forms but both with very complex creations. Similar in beauty and perhaps in lifespan. The dog looks familiar, hmmm. Are those yellow sticky notes? In the picture to the right, I see ancient ruins and a bridge before a vast mountain range during a sunset. I wonder who these strange people are. What was there life story? Did they struggle with alien invaders in times past as well. For all one knows that shotgun is an heirloom passed down through their family. We have another dog on canvas. Former pet or just a dog lover? He is noble in appearance and his vest suggests he is bound to a duty or cause. Is this Elivs? Or perhaps just a historic depiction of a living relic from a forgotten era? Are we also destined to leave behind seemingly unimportant displays of humanity and expression once we're gone as well? If so, what will our dance move be and what will it say to other generations? Here we have another dog, this one more serious in tone compared to the cuteness of the other before. He is looking at what could be the form of a medical pill for consumption. Something that can be both destructive but also helpful at once. This, next to what can maybe be seen as a tan clay abode of some sort in a desert underneath a hot sun. A resilient home of a past society before the use of electricity perhaps. A simple picture of a simpler time. The last piece on display is a weird black and white form of some sort with touches of brown. Is it a hurricane from satellite picture? Twisted bone skull or a natural sink hole? Is it real or fabricated? Are the colors taken from it intentionally or is it shown as it is. I suppose one will never know. Maybe it's the artist's way of expressing futility in questioning things that are not meant to be over analyzed... 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
40oz Posted December 3, 2016 I thought the UV-Maxes in less than 30 seconds posted here were fishy... I just played some of Echelon for the first time today, and I completed 10 maps in probably less than 10 minutes -- these maps are short! Theres a lot of cool inventiveness and the use of color is very impressive. I especially like the red fire in the beginning maps. The gameplay is kinda silly though and I often feel like the lead actor in a movie set that forgot his lines, and instead of cutting the take, the director is just kinda sitting back to see what happens. I think i'd like to see a video playthrough of Sverre playing through these maps more so than myself clumsily blasting my way to the exit without soaking up the atmosphere. There's a lot of story-line narrative here that demands my attention but I'm a "kill everything and go" kinda player. These art assets are amazing though. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Spectre01 Posted December 4, 2016 MAP05 - “They Rise” Just like in map04, there are more switches to crush monsters with. Not a big fan of the instant death ceiling crushers in those places though as they give zero time to reacts before you're caught in one. I guess you can crouch out of it since that's fine in this wad. Very fruity looking pink train at the end. Rather unusual texture choice there. MAP06 - “Home” It's night now and we're in a very unusual looking suburb where the doors and buildings look way too small. Got a few spiders to shotgun or dump your rockets on for continuous folks if they still got any. Also, what is that in the sky supposed to be? A giant space station or something? That's clearly no moon, it's too big! MAP07 - “Outpost of Hell” It looks like the walls of your house collapse and you find yourself in a red brick fortress instead of the green town. Those Vipers go down in two regular Shotgun blasts but I do like their projectile attack and explosion if you're too close when they die. Don't punch or chainsaw them. :P Got some Cacos to shoot but not much happening yet. MAP08 - “Starport Departures” Monster count is steadily going up and we're breaking the 100 mark in map09. Big fan of that ending sequence with the cool looking ship and the Pinky horde to punch out. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demon of the Well Posted December 4, 2016 Alright, time to revisit Echelon. Given the WAD's rather nonstandard format, I reckon I'll be adjusting/streamlining my usual posting format as well, and in contrast to my normal preferences I'm going to be using carryovers for this playthrough, which is what I would recommend most others do in this case as well--the game simply flows much more naturally this way, though from my past experience the pistol-start route is still quite viable for those with the inclination (as a general rule, the WAD is largely bereft of real challenge regardless of balance considerations). Map 01 -- Overslept - 100% Secrets A rather austere dorm compartment in a decidedly ascetic barracks somewhere, presumably not far from the main UAC quad. The plated metal walls and flooring aren't exactly homey (betcha the floor is unbelievably cold should one get up in the middle of the night to take a piss!), and the napkin-sized pillows almost seem more of an insult than an amenity, but hey, free internet! Echelonguy was apparently up too late the previous night, playing Cookie Crush or browsing cat-picture blogs or whatnot, and so finds himself alone and running late. The level, such as it is, ends when the blue floppy disk (?!) lying on the floor near the door is inserted into the terminal nearest Echelonguy's bed, a sequence presumably intended to inform players that they will occasionally need to try the 'use' key on computers and other points of interest in the environment in order to progress in the game. Despite being comprised of one tiny room and fielding next to no gameplay content in the traditional sense, this is still a very informative map in its way, coming out of the gate with a decidedly representationalist artistic slant and an offbeat, humor-inflected tone, as evidenced by the upbeat funky BGM and the fact that Echelonguy (who in this case is objectively NOT Doomguy, by the way, regardless of one's personal headcanon) is apparently something of a slacker. This tone carries through much of the game, even its darker segments. The conceit of a seconds-long maplet whose purpose is essentially purely narrative is also not a one-off, as many have already seen. The one bit of gameplay which does exist is the chance to find a computer area map concealed in a secret compartment; to my memory, nearly every map in the set (esp. the tiniest ones) has at least one secret like this, and indeed there are a number of them where looking for the secret can easily comprise 99% of the time you'll spend in them. This somehow puts me in mind of the batcave intermission maps from Batman Doom, though I'm sure there are probably better points of reference. Map 02 -- Richter Scale - 100% Secrets Hey, dead guys and explosions and shit that's on fire. Welp. Looks like UAC done gone and UAC'd. Again. This is functionally the same map as 'Overslept' before it, containing no combat and exitable in seconds via a quick dash through the burning hallway at the back. Again, the only proper gameplay that exists here is the chance to score an early rocket launcher in a concealed equipment bay via fiddling with a nearby computer terminal. Finding this weapon significantly impacts the flow of the next handful of maps (though again, the pistol is more than adequate protection should you pass up the RL), and I felt like there's an authorial assumption that most players will take the time to try to find it since the map is so small. That's perhaps overly optimistic of him, but certainly helps to set the mapset apart in its predilections. Aesthetically, here we see a little more of the picture that defines much of the WAD. Depicted is a rec room with a card table, table hockey set, and....missile bays in the walls?.....wrought as focused bits of sector-detailing situated in an otherwise very spartan room. The abstract yellow room between the rec area and the exit hallway is vague to the point of total anonymity. Much of Echelon is like this (or at least much of the earlier parts of the game, at any rate), fielding very basic or minimalist architecture and extremely simplistic layouts, relying on general tone, narrative and the novelty of the new/custom art assets to lend the game world flavor and vibrancy. It is in a sense very old-fashioned in that regard; sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't, IMO....those with a taste for what KMX calls "DoomCute" are sure to be boundlessly enthralled by much of what we're in for, suffice to say. For my part, I certainly respect that opening the set with two-plus microscopic narrative maps is a very bold move, but for the few moments this sequence of levels realistically takes to complete, I feel that the concept is already beginning to border on the edges of threadbare--cute is no substitute for content. To some extent, this is surely a matter of one's personal expectations, I suppose--I have to wonder if I'd feel different about it if a number of these early maps had simply been combined into one larger level rather than segmented into micro-maps. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Aquanet Posted December 4, 2016 MAP05: They Rise and MAP06: Home This wad really tests where you come down on the polish vs. amateur hour debate. Unlike a lot of unpolished stuff out there, if you get past the rough edges, there's a bucket of fun to splash around in. I'd be tempted to recommend new players start at MAP06. The house is great, the train is great, the textures are cool. I'm fine with this wad having very short levels and serving up a niblet of something interesting, followed by another in quick succession. The success comes in continuing to surprise the player. Hey, double Laika. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Havoc Crow Posted December 4, 2016 MAP06: Home That's a city? Looks almost like a train depot to me. There's one building with a neat if deadly security system... wonder what's that fish-shaped thing on the ground there though. The marine's own house is fun though. Teeheehee, I like the shotgun shell painting (though I have no idea what's that brown square thing next to it). That said, the abundance of abstract, or otherwise striking pictures in a rather gray, underfurnished house gives off a creepy atmosphere. Heck, even the picture of six trees, with their oddly twisted trunks and the empty surroundings, gives off almost a Silent Hill or Yume Nikki vibe. @Demtor: I'm fairly sure the note says "Gone to Mars <3" 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
rehelekretep Posted December 4, 2016 map07 -respawn in 0:45 map08 -fast in 1:47 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
baja blast rd. Posted December 4, 2016 "Outpost of Hell" (7) I can't think of much to say about this one. It's what it says on the tin and not much more, a generic outpost of hell with, I guess, a peculiarly placed computer console. This map again would be stronger with an exterior vantage. I really like the music, cool bassline. "Starport Departures" (8) The ending area is great; the general shape of the composition feels like something Eternal (the mapper) might do, with the vast open space containing an object that though representational has an air of the abstract. The lack of the vista for once really suits the scene. The lead-up is mildly entertaining -- comical area map sectret, fodder mow-down -- but the ending makes the vignette. I like the music again. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demon of the Well Posted December 4, 2016 Map 03 -- Towering Inferno - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets Wherein Echelonguy descends to the burning admin building's ground floor, catching his first glimpse of the enemy force along the way. And it is little more than a glimpse, really, involving a whopping three creatures, all of whom could be easily ignored entirely if one for some reason took that notion. The first encounter as intended seems to be with a couple of lost souls, of all things, though if you happen to choose the long way down, hopping from floor to floor while crisscrossing the burning gap in the middle, they are quite likely to die from infinitely-tall barrel-splash before you ever meet them. The other path, riding the elevator down to the bottom, presents a more suitable introduction, with the souls drifting towards you from a distance as you contemplate the proverbial walk upon hot coals before you. The map also affords a meeting with the first of Echelon's new monsters, the pyroviper, a flamethrower-wielding serpent-demon most reminiscent of the ophidian guards from Heretic. His weapon fires an irregular (seemingly random?) spread of slow but damaging flamebursts with each discharge, seemingly casting his role as a short range light area-denial unit. He's hardy enough to absorb a few rounds and keep on ticking, but a clip's worth of bullets or so will usually do him in, as will a single well-placed rocket, though these are probably better saved for later. The tower descent proposed here involves a brief run through a more or less abstract obstacle course of sorts, more conceptual than the purely scene-setting framing of previous levels and a little more substantial by dint of offering two different routes, but it's still realistically over in a matter of seconds unless you decide to try to pick up all of the little trinkets dotted about. Visually it looks more or less like a competent but unremarkable piece out of the early ZDoom era, with a somewhat campy BGM track to boot, though more attention is paid to lighting here than may be readily apparent from the short run through the map, with blinking effects layered with thin shadowed sectors used to emulate the flickering of flames in alcoves and upper-level spaces. Lots of barrels for one reason or another, though outside of accidentally killing a soul or two they serve no practical function during conventional play. Lots of dead guys piled up around the exit latch, apparently the three weak enemies were too much for this squad of supposed hardasses to handle. Makes one wonder how many of these demon invasions could be stopped short if UAC would ever shell out for something better than D-list security. Map 04 -- Apparently the Apocalypse - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets Apparently the UAC parking lot is incredibly flammable. More souls and vipers here, with the latter being perched out of the field. It's immediately clear that the vipers make for somewhat poor snipers given the erratic functionality of their weapons; standard imps would arguably be more effective since they are at least guaranteed to fire shots on-target. Ironically, the most dangerous thing here is the pair of exploding barrel traps, which I read as being intended as simulating firebursts rather than actual traps per se, which can both very easily kill you if you happen to be milling around in the wrong place (am I the only one who doesn't immediately shoot at barrels with no obvious purpose?). Rather underwhelming from a play perspective, even for an early map; again, locating the secret is probably the biggest to-do. Demtor's post above shows the official way of doing it, but as Echelon is a WAD that fully condones both jumping and crouching, you can also reach everything in the map by riding the orange lift up to the ledge on the east side, then jumping into the first burning booth, and from there in turn into the second burning booth and onto the western ledge. Aesthetically, it's again clean, but minimalist and somewhat unremarkable other than the playful conceit of showing decidedly hellish imagery in an early/pre-Hell setting. The veneer is thinnest where you turn around after being blocked out of the fake exit teleporter at the north end; looking back at the building you ostensibly just came out of from the previous level (and now must re-enter), there's a rather obvious failure of 3D perspective. Nothing that will ruin the experience for anyone other than the most implacable aesthetes, I imagine, but it does shore up the persistent sense that Echelon was made from a perspective not fully in-step with modern community mores and perceived standards (which I also imagine probably only endears it further to a certain subset of the audience). Also, we are presumably now to assume that Echelonguy undertakes the next leg of the adventure with a live puppy cheerfully wriggling and fidgeting around in his fanny-pack. +50 bonus points. Map 05 -- They Rise - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets Always check behind you at mapstart etc. etc. etc. As the somewhat hammy feaux-Castlevania BGM track sort of implies, this burning and crumbling bit of one of the base's access corridors is the stage for the debut of the zombie enemies to Echelon, here cinematically framed as fresh corpses that suddenly rise to attack through the influence of unknown powers (read: arch-viles positioned just outside the play area who can reach the bodies, which are initially killed by barrels offscreen). In a ZDoom context, the classic Goldbergian mechanism used to create these scenes might be taken as somewhat quaint (IIRC ZDoom can script a corpse to animate and attack independent of all other actors), but nevertheless it's always nice to see something as humble as the former human enemies treated with a certain diegetic respect. In gameplay and layout terms, this is still very rudimentary stuff, literally nothing but a simple corridor where you pistol-pop zombies (or again, it's easy to ignore them entirely). There's room for a bit of flair with the viper who emerges from a burning room at the end of the main hall; with just a bit of coaxing you can use him as an ambulatory barrel to stylishly cluster-kill the second group of zombies when his body explodes upon his death. The shotgun also debuts here, pried from the hands of a zombie sergeant spun as doing a possum act (though again, in mechanical terms he actually pops up out of the floor), as does the basic imp, mincing around as a group of three atop the eye-gougingly colorful bullet-train near the exit. All told, the same verdict as every other map thus far applies: cute, but with very little real substance. Map 06 -- Home - 100% Kills / 100 % Secrets Ah, this is something a little more substantial, relatively speaking, anyway. Echelonguy emerges at a boarding platform somewhere further down the line and mows down a few of his neighbors (presumably after checking to see that they've become undead) before stepping through the door of his own home sweet home, to find that his wife has wisely fled the city for her mother's place, in what are hopefully safer climes. Again tiny in scale and depicting a realistic environment (if also slightly whimsical--beware the Jesusfish, just as you would IRL!), the action here is very straightforward Doom fare, less expressly cinematic/narrative in framing than in the previous maps. Far from groundbreaking, generally mindless shotgun fare with nary a hint of real pressure, but the contrast is notable--we even see the first full-fledged closet 'trap' here. I felt that it reads better overall than what was in the preceding maps, particularly as concerns the fact that the interior of Echelonguy's house is still a part of THIS map--at previous pace I wouldn't have been at all surprised to find it given its own mapslot. Some more new assets debut here, with the residential block and much of the boarding platform wrought in a deep, ruddy glass-bottle green mesh of masonry and metal plating, which stands out nicely against the stock grey concrete and cloudy midnight-blue sky, which itself holds a number of mysterious sights. It's very colorful, but in a way very distinct from the variously neon-shot or powder-dusted presentations of other notable modern WADs--in combination with the saucy BGM track, the impression is of a diegetically gritty world that has been rendered in a vibrant way, like an old SNES or Genesis game depicting a futuristic setting from a late 80's/early 90's cultural perspective. Whether intentional or not, in PWAD terms it more closely captures the visual flavor of older sets like STRAIN or Dystopia than anything else I've seen recently (and thus makes it an interesting pairing with Mutiny, to whit), though my overall impression of the total package is that it's like nothing so much as a map from the venerable Demonfear, which incidentally should readily appeal to newer players who greatly enjoyed Echelon, provided they don't mind stock assets/monsters. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demon of the Well Posted December 5, 2016 Map 07 -- Outpost of Hell - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets I'm not sure it fully registered with me when I played Echelon before, but the intermission text which precedes this level is actually the stock "You have entered deeply....." scrawl from Doom II. Strange and/or clever, I guess? Just what has happened here, narratively speaking, is not really clear; at mapstart Echelonguy is standing by his couch and TV just as he was at the close of map 06, but this little bit of domestic tableau has apparently been spontaneously swallowed and surrounded by the grounds a Hellish red barbican most readily (and presumably intentionally) reminiscent of "Hell Keep" in what would seem to be an eyeblink. The sky above is still notably that of Earth, however, and the intermission text following this level describes the outpost as 'advancing', perhaps implying it moves over or under the surface of the planet somehow. Weird. Other than the sudden shift in scenery, there is very little of note here. Gameplay consists of a frontal assault on the barbican, its battlements lightly staffed with weak defenders who will fight among themselves with very little coaxing on the player's part. Cacodemons debut in the inner hall, as does a conspicuously free soulsphere which should feel like being totally spoiled rotten to any remotely competent player. To me it reads like a filler map, and while there are many positive things to say about Echelon, something as concise as it is has very little business or excuse for fielding any degree of filler. Maps are flying by at a breakneck pace, and the play is escalating worryingly slowly in keeping pace. This is at the heart of my major criticism of the set, though I suppose we'll get into that later. Map 08 -- Starport Departures - 68% Kills / 100% Secrets Yeah, cool music here. Breaking free from the Outpost grounds, here Echelonguy immediately does an about-face to claim a keycard before going Dirty Harry on the unsavory crowd loitering in the departures lobby before making a run for the last shuttle left on the tarmac, as a herd of carnivorous monsters rapidly closes in (I didn't kill this last group of pinkies, didn't seem right somehow). The return to cinematic framing makes the map feel more like a relevant part of the game than map 07 prior, though again if we're talking in terms of nuts and bolts the action that's on offer here is simplistic at best, essentially a couple of rote 30-second doorway fights with a bit of miscellany as a preamble. Other than the cinematic exit sequence, notable features include a rare properly-used specter and a weird little fast-hatch door near the red key which sometimes seems to open on impact (i.e. when you shoot at the sergeant up there) to release the killer tomato behind it, while at other times remains mum and sets you up to meet him at point-blank range a few moments later. In contrast to some of the earlier maps, there are two secrets here instead of one, but both are very easily found by all but the most oblivious of players. As a visual presentation, the run to the stylish and sleek-looking shuttlecraft is obviously the main highlight. The rest of the level is in line with the subtly anachronistic look of the previous maps, fielding simple boxy architecture and a light smattering of new texture assets, primarily as visual trim in the lobby. I didn't feel that these assets blended nearly as smoothly with the stock stuff as the green city textures in map 06 did, and the overall look of the lobby is somewhat slapdash as a result, with the inset sector-detailing on the side walls looking particularly "that'll do." Again, not very impressive as a single piece, though of course it must be said that Echelon is in no way, shape, or form meant to be digested as a series of single maps. Nevertheless, I'm still wondering if the whole would read better if some of these maplets had been combined into larger maps (with the same core concepts and settings, of course) rather than being segmented into crumbs and nibbles as they are, and as I replay this early part of the set I find myself becoming more firm in my opinion that the conceptual vestiges of the "PAR" project seen at work in Echelon are doing the whole little but a disservice. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demtor Posted December 5, 2016 MAP07 - “Outpost of Hell” gzDoom - UV – Continuous lol, wut? Where did...? That just happened? I think the drugs kicked in again because somehow this hell keep just appear out of nowhere? Maybe this is some sort of a visual directional choice. Like a sort of "smash cut" in a Doom map instead of a movie. Anyways, time to rage and get back to killing shit. Fun quick bit of shotgun work above and below. Few cacos before the exit. Nothing special, just really easy stuff with almost a guaranteed ending with %200 health. MAP08 - “Starport Departures” gzDoom - UV – Continuous Zombie guards standing and looking the wrong way will always be funny to me. Stole the red key by jumping... huh. I know it's allowed in this wad but that didn't seem well thought out here for obvious reasons. The interior design is neat looking. The race to the ship was a fun touch. Dirty pinkies, keep your jacked up arms off of me! 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
baja blast rd. Posted December 5, 2016 "Lunar Arrivals" (9) This is more like it, the first true map that isn't bitesized, occupying the upper region of small or the lower of medium-sized, depending on your definitions. The spaceship is behind us -- a vista! -- and the opening scenario is mildly entertaining, single-shotgun combat against imps, which is far more satisfying than in classic ports, for my tastes, because the blockmap fix buffs the shotgun's damage just enough that a single blast will nearly always take out an imp. Then there is a close-range trap involving vipers that poses a credible threat if react too slowly, but if you escape, you can amuse yourself as two shotgun blasts is enough to take them all out in a small domino sequence of explosive death. The small arena fight in the next room is comprised of various low-tier originals complemented by a viper, and I've noticed that the inclusion of even or two of these monsters gives a new flavor to what would otherwise be incredibly rote encounters; it's fun to time shots at the viper so that its death blows away a few low-tiers. I've noticed that the viper's attack doesn't trigger infighting (or perhaps I've missed it), which is a conventional behavior modification to custom DECORATE monsters that have spread attacks -- you wouldn't want your fun new monster to be completely incompatible with group-based encounter design. This is all capped off by a bit of typical computer humping and a group of monsters designed as fodder for that fancy secret rocket stash you found earlier. All in all, a decent map, the sort I wish Echelon had more of up until now and has a lot more of later. "Exodus" (10) Yes, and I also have a rocket launcher. A blue armor repository (no excuse not finding it, really) with a very softballed timed crusher "puzzle." Would perhaps be more interesting if it were mandatory to sync the crusher cycles, or at least the cycles for two crushers at a time. Coming off the previous map I didn't really mind this, but I suppose it's unfair to earlier maps that I'm playing these in groups of only two for the club. I think I'm going to be playing these maps in larger batches from now on, saving the writeups in a word processor until the appropriate day. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Lingyan203 Posted December 5, 2016 https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLgS1ZoidySwOp5OM-0nsti6aWah-EeMqV Echelon playthrough! 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Aquanet Posted December 5, 2016 MAP07: Outpost of Hell and MAP08: Starport Departures This wad isn't a keen one for hell maps, and the first is no exception. Also it's easy to run past the cacos in what would otherwise be the climactic fight. There's no cool factor in 07, well, unless you count the circuitous way you progress over the outside structure. 08 has a cool looking spaceship and a nice enough tech interior. Overall, the first episode is pretty flimsy. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Spectre01 Posted December 5, 2016 MAP09 - “Lunar Arrivals” Nice starting view.Somewhat medium-sized map with a "sizeable" monster count for this wad so far. Gameplay revolves around fighting "hordes" of Imps and Demons with the occasional hitscanners and Vipers. That crusher before the secret cell pack is annoying as shit. Had to crouch out of it. Not a fan of this wad's use of them at all so far. Good news is we finally get a Chaingun! MAP10 - “Exodus” A "boss map", reminding me a lot of Scythe's map10, which has you fighting 5 Nobles in a very cramped room. I nearly died after almost getting walled in due to campy play. I also got stuck by jumping out of the window in the exit hallway with the crushers as there seemed to be no way up from the little outdoor area below. The exit switch looks quite nice, with another pointless map. Midi's good though. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demtor Posted December 5, 2016 MAP09 - “Lunar Arrivals” gzDoom - UV – Continuous Don't stand and stare too long, there is a lost soul who wants to say hi. Too bad this music track wasn't swapped with Map 1's. In any case, this was my favorite so far but that's not saying too much at this point as it's the only map with a high monster count and encounters with large numbers at once. Making this one feel more like what a Doom map should be. Right at the start, there are a large amount of imps with more teleporting in behind you. If you mess around too much you'll piss off deaf snakemen around the other corner and have a real fight on your hands. Good stuff. The attempt to cage me in with 3 snakemen failed completely, hah. Nice try. The wall drop at the end with like 30 imps and a couple of HK's was fun. The blue and dark shadowed area worked together to make things hard to see but nothing too crazy. Just cool looking mostly. MAP10 - “Exodus” gzDoom - UV – Continuous Pretty simple stuff here. The fight itself was pretty easy if you remembered the middle has a passable step as well. So each section has 3 exits to keep from getting cornered. Not sure why we have to deal with more crushers after you opened the door but I guess it does add a bit of panic if your trying to just run past all of the nobles. I liked the evil looking switch to the device that was causing the evacuation stall. Had a System Shock vibe to it almost. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Memfis Posted December 5, 2016 rdwpa said:I think I'm going to be playing these maps in larger batches from now on Yeah, it seems almost incorrect to play this wad the megawad club way. It's like watching 5 minutes of a movie per day or something. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
TheOrganGrinder Posted December 5, 2016 MAP07: Outpost of Hell It's not a Dead Simple remake, and I like the fact that we've gone from representational (if stylised and downright strange) maps based on starport architecture so a shamelessly infernal fortress here, a castle of searing red stone whose battlements teem with lesser demons and whose inner keep is lair to an almost-camouflaged clutch of cacodemons. The transformation of the house at the beginning is one of the map's more surreal moments, giving a sense that in the blink of an eye it's transformed into the crumbled shell that's your first view of the level. MAP08: Starport Departures Cool spaceship, and in the intermission text following this map we get an explanation of what the various objects seen in the sky texture are intended to be - though for the ship struggling through a portal to be visible from earth, it's just to be truly titanic in scale. Some fun but optional demon-punching to be had here. MAP09: Lunar Arrivals Probably the most substantial map so far, and the closest to traditional Doom in its assemblage of rooms, corridors, and switches, all decked out in the classic STAR* textures. The focus here is on mass combat, with zombies, imps, and demons swarming by the gleeful dozen to obstruct the player's progress. MAP10: Exodus So the traditional End-of-Act-1.5 "controlling switch" makes its appearance a level early, at the end of a relatively low-key boss arena/shotgun brawl. After MAP09's gestures in the direction of traditional Doom progression and gameplay we're back to the short and sweet here, all the better to appreciate the extra layers the author's weaving into the narrative between every level. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demtor Posted December 5, 2016 rdwpa said:...saving the writeups in a word processor until the appropriate day. Ya, that's a really good idea. Think I might have to do the same. Being that my favorite maps are some of Mekadon's massive works of genius, it's really hard for me to enjoy something like this just two at a time. I've been replaying the maps 6-10 over and over with a mix of mods like beautiful doom and brutal doom. Trying to decide which to use for a fresh start. While I enjoy the smaller scale battles a lot better with Brutal D, I always have the same problem with it. Which is the drastic weapon and enemy changes that up the difficulty considerably also end up altering the gameplay. So much so that a map maker really needs to have it in mind when creating his WAD otherwise... shit gets dicey. Not in a fun way either. However, I do love some of these screenshots I've collected with it, muwahahaha! 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Pirx Posted December 6, 2016 ok i didn't realize that tiny maps does mean tiny, so the first 2 serve only story-telling purpose, and to let one grab some stuff, as it's evident by the bits of ammo found over the first maps that echelon should be played in continuous mode. MAP01 - “Overslept” nothing but a room with some beds and a keycard ;) MAP02 - “Richter Scale” found the staff quarters ruined, an abandoned cards game, a burned table, some nice detail here, as small as this is, oh, and a rocket launcher MAP03 - “The Towering Inferno” ran through a building in flames, shot one custom enemy, some fire-throwing lizard. shot it without paying much attention. its fireballs are slow, but if several of them are shooting, this might end like with a blur sphere and mancubi. the elevator has a niche where you can pick up some plasma cells. MAP04 - “Apparently the Apocalypse” got outdoors, saw the building ablaze, didn't shoot the lizards as i thought i'd better keep my few rockets. MAP05 - “They Rise” yeah, too bad that pre-placed corpses are an old trick, but it works neatly. punched whatever zombies there were, and the one fire lizard. that one exploded in my face, so much for not paying attention. actually you can punch them away and have them explode, just like barrels. MAP06 - “Home” the pink train takes you to your house, which is nicely decorated, thanks demtor for all the details. a bit excessive security, yes, or what's with the grates on the left, looks like prison cells? turned around at the entrance and saw some strange lights in the sky... MAP07 - “Outpost of Hell” gzdoom displayed the intermission text from doom2 here. sudden change, a map made of red brick and lava, which doesn't hurt though, some rabble up a castle wall, and here we go and shoot our first cacos. MAP08 - “Starport Departures” back from hell to the starport, solve a simple puzzle to get the red key, then i could witness the lizard's firepower - not bad, they killed pinkies in 2-3 salvos. cartoony, but nicely detailed creatures. i left the pinky herd on its plains, and i didn't have berserk for them, and boarded the shuttle. MAP09 - “Lunar Arrivals” some imps teleport here in your back, while a larger imp mob and some lizards attack from farther away. the lizards proved successful in killing the pinkie herd for me. the exit room with several imps in the dark reminded me of one of the first maps of sunlust, i think m03, where some enemies were similarly invisible against a dark background and could be killed by infighting. MAP10 - “Exodus” you clean the ship of some nobles, iirc 4 knights and 1 baron, and that's literally all. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Spectre01 Posted December 6, 2016 MAP11 - “Lunar Escape” Didn't manage to find the one secret here, even with IDDT. Dark blue map where you walk around and mow down bunches of weak enemies. A new Cacodemon variety makes an appearance here, which drops 5 HP bonuses upon death and fires a bouncing projectile. Seems to hurt if you get hit by the initial one. MAP12 - “Crash Landing” The best part was grabbing the secret Plasma Rifle, as I had 200+ cells stocked already. Some tech corridor shooting here, with the Fatso and Revenants making their debut. I did like the red area with the flames and a Revenant on his throne. Nothing particularly special and the wad remains "ok". Looks like we are heading into some urban maps, and while I don't expect Hellbound cityscapes we'll hopefully get something more interesting. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
baja blast rd. Posted December 6, 2016 Demtor said:Ya, that's a really good idea. Think I might have to do the same. Being that my favorite maps are some of Mekadon's massive works of genius, it's really hard for me to enjoy something like this just two at a time. I've been replaying the maps 6-10 over and over with a mix of mods like beautiful doom and brutal doom. Trying to decide which to use for a fresh start. While I enjoy the smaller scale battles a lot better with Brutal D, I always have the same problem with it. Which is the drastic weapon and enemy changes that up the difficulty considerably also end up altering the gameplay. So much so that a map maker really needs to have it in mind when creating his WAD otherwise... shit gets dicey. Not in a fun way either. However, I do love some of these screenshots I've collected with it, muwahahaha! The custom enemies are quite cool. Not sure if Brutal Doom gets rid of those, but if so that doesn't seem like such a good idea. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
baja blast rd. Posted December 6, 2016 "Lunar Escape" (11) Again, this is more like it. Set in a moody blue lit lunar base, it's probably the mapset's first truly attractive location. Action is simple but satisfying, coming mostly from droves of low-tier monsters well suited to the player's current armory. Much of the healing in the map comes in the form of bonuses, which I liked since I entered the map with well over 100 HP. The new enemy, the clusterfiend, is a dopey-looking monster resembling a deep sea fish that drops a cluster of health bonuses upon death, which is super awesome. As far as stats go, it has 225 HP and fires a bouncing?! projectile that does a bit more damaging than the noble fireball. I hope to fight more of these soon. (I personally prefer the name dopeyfish to clusterfiend, which seems too serious for how silly it looks. :D) "Crash Landing" (12) The predominant design element is the modern one of hoisting objectives very nearby just out of reach, and having the player navigate a circuitous loop to reach them. This stood out to me because progression up until now has been mostly of the straight line variety, usually with a dash of interacting with objects in the environment. "Crash Landing" also marks the debut of the revenant. I love revenants, but I haven't really missed them so much; the new upper low-tiers have filled the role of stronger mook among weaklings just fine. The clueless mancubus waddling around behind the broken door in the start room was pretty funny, especially since it would have been much too fat to pass even if the door were operational. Armor bonuses were in abundance in the numerous side rooms, allowing me to keep my blue armor going strong. Visuals are markedly spartan, but I did enjoy the view out into the wrecked world, one of those diorama vistas I've been a broken record about this month. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demon of the Well Posted December 6, 2016 Echelon is indeed not a WAD that fits particularly well with the standard DWMC format, and so I've already been playing the maps in larger chunks of 6-7 or so and making basic writeups ahead of time for them. Map 09 -- Lunar Arrivals - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets Nine maps in, here we see the mapset's first piece of credible action, and it's not just a one-off in the level--the first large fight with enemies (potentially) teleporting in from various angles is followed by a claustrophobic lock-in trap, which is in turn followed by a simple open arena fight, and then concludes with another large-ish monster reveal at the exit. Some of the set's recalcitrant OG Doom-style shotgun slowballing recedes here, with the chaingun making its first appearance (I actually picked it up off a dead commando this time, but there's one placed in the map as well) and the last couple of fights invite you to finally cut loose and sling some rockets around, just for the fun of it. Bloodshed at last, how I've missed you. Also of note here is the first secret, a simple pushwall concealing a teleporter which leads to an isolated little puzzle-box, with the prize being a bulk cell pack. There is something quite charming about seeing a full, elaborate presentation made of the acquisition of a relatively minor item like this, sits well with the greater mapset's not entirely deadpan serious tone. The change in pace here is certainly welcome, but it's difficult to ignore that, in terms of execution, most of the above is more than a little rough around the edges. The first fight, for instance, seems designed with the intention of creating a modern multi-front fight to encourage aggressive play (as opposed to just camping out in the opening corridor and potentially being overwhelmed), but if one adopts the sort of Rambo playstyle that has become a point of no small amount of demagoguery for a subset of the community, the mechanisms driving the fight will likely fail--the different groups of teleporting monsters are apparently keyed to different sound zones, with a bodged-together system of one-way sight tunnels as insurance, but if you don't fire a shot until you're in the thick of the monsters farther into the base and don't walk down the intended corridor, one or both of the groups tied to the two pads nearer the start point will never wake up and join the fray (and similarly, if you do try to camp out by the entrance, the same problem arises with the group farther in not appearing). The lost soul drifting over from out by the shuttle seems intended to bait you into firing at it in order to preclude this, but it's a very sloppy and very unreliable solution. Similarly, the aforementioned secret playing out as intended sort of relies on the 'honor system', in that the little test involved in reaching the item only makes sense if you play it with classic/default constraints. Jumping--which, to reiterate, is fully condoned and supposedly accounted for in this mapset!--allows one to cheat it quickly and easily. Other instances of 'loose' mechanics may or may not be intentional; the viper lock-in can be defused by running straight through the room from door to door, which will see you slip free before the bars descend, trapping only the vipers. Since the trap is somewhat visually telegraphed by mismatched bits of texture along the room's walls, this is perhaps the intended/anticipated play, but given some of the earlier malfunctions it's difficult to know for sure. Visually this is still looking rather antique, almost histrionically so in places, with the north-reaching annex and nearby construction looking like something straight out of the more lo-fi maps of Icarus or something of that vintage. Bits of ceiling-bound macrotectural detail belie the WAD's modern vintage and the author's considerable experience, but the overall impression is very speedmappy, not in an entirely fetching way considering that the set's unique (if simple) aesthetic/narrative flavor has largely been what has carried it up to this point. Map 10 -- Exodus - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets A bossmap of sorts, featuring a handful of Hell nobles inhabiting an enclosed command tower or something of that nature, including the set's first Baron, which I would say are used effectively if this were 1994 and I had yet to fully grasp the concepts of running and sidestepping, or something. The layout is framed in such a way that the intended scenario seems to be the player getting chased and cornered and unable to punch through the nobles' HP in time to escape, which is quite sensible on paper, but more than a little softballed in execution, coming off as more quaint than anything. The perils of aiming for a level of play that is 'accessible to everyone', perhaps? As it stands the most amusing thing in the level is again the secret, here playfully lampshaded by the running gag of the computer area map. Also somewhat unusual here is the map's position in the pistol-start/continuous balance dichotomy. Whereas the great majority of Echelon makes more conceptual sense if played continuously, the particular concept of this map really only holds water if approached from pistol-start, which will require the player to move through the layout in order to collect ammo and weapons to steadily wear down the group of nobles as they pursue him/her. Using carryovers, the setup is categorically ineffective, with the poor hapless infernal bluebloods (er, greenbloods?) being promptly splattered all over the walls by the remainder of the rocket surplus from the previous map. It could perhaps be argued that Echelon might've benefited from the addition of death-exits here and there, but of course this would've presented something of a narrative disconnect as the mode of storytelling here stands, and so in that sense little designed engagements like this one have unfortunately been sort of 'written into a corner', so to speak. Again, visuals are the map's best asset, the battle space nicely silhouetted against the broad windows with a view of another nifty new sky texture. The more compact scale seen here sits more naturally with the simpler architecture, and blinking/glowing light effects, largely absent from the previous map, here return in force. Most of the visual flair, though, elides from the new textures, which are very simple in design but very striking in color, particularly the deep, dark cobalt-blue paneling comprising most of the interior structure. Note also the unfortunate marine who has been literally stomped into the floor. Maybe he didn't know how to strafe, either? 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
baja blast rd. Posted December 6, 2016 Demon of the Well said:the sort of Rambo playstyle that has become a point of no small amount of demagoguery for a subset of the community ^._.^ Demon of the Well said:It could perhaps be argued that Echelon might've benefited from the addition of death-exits here and there, but of course this would've presented something of a narrative disconnect as the mode of storytelling here stands, and so in that sense little designed engagements like this one have unfortunately been sort of 'written into a corner', so to speak. I think in ZDoom it's possible to use scripts to strip players of certain items of their inventory at level start, such as the rocket launcher, or revert them to pistol start or some buffed version thereof. That allows continuous balance to be enforced without death exits, and can even be written into the narrative (Echelonguy's stash was robbed by some lost souls as he slept!). But at least we get to keep our stuff this way. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Aquanet Posted December 6, 2016 MAP09: Lunar Arrivals and MAP10: Exodus I like the laptops in 09 and the slightly Icarus stylings. These packs of demons are catching me by surprise and almost causing me problems. 10 I have to agree plays muuuch more interesting as a pistol start. Beyond that, it would have been additionally more interesting if it was a timed exit and not just a matter of finding the switch. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demon of the Well Posted December 6, 2016 Map 11 -- Lunar Escape - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets The secret here's a cheeky one. I didn't get it on my first playthrough, and spent a while chasing red herrings before finding it on this go round. The prize is the juiciest so far, though, worth the effort. A larger map by Echelon's standards, "Lunar Escape" sees Echelonguy battling through a different part of the lunar base, still couched in intoxicating deep blue tones, to reach another shuttlecraft, much like the one that brought him here. The latch out onto the landing field requires security clearance, however, and so most of the actual action here is framed as a fight towards the heavily defended (again, by Echelon's standards) security command center, where the blue disk with the clearance codes rests. In gameplay terms, this amounts to a light and very linear spree through packed groups of enemies along a few broad halls and landings, the most memorable scene being a brief jaunt along the skydomed deck past a number of strange little terminals that somehow remind of petroleum pumps, of all things. Imps constitute something like 80% of the enemy composition, with the occasional commando placed to needle you from afar if you start getting too complacent. Ammo as a generality is plentiful, and rockets continue to be steadily trickled out, allowing for an ongoing montage of satisfying cluster-kills that somewhat compensates for the otherwise PG-rated action. As others have said, a new enemy known as the 'clusterfiend' also debuts here, and rather casually at that--the first one I fought through a window (of the sort with classic DoomCute shoot-through-yet-unbreakable glass) after he had the gall to hock a loogey at my flanks from afar. A member of the gasbag genus, the clusterfiend is slow-moving and fairly fragile, but the plasma bursts it belches pack a punch and sometimes require more than one dodge as they will ricochet off of the first solid surface they hit, though given the spacious surroundings here this is hardly a factor in this case. Apparently its internal fluids are quite potable (I like to imagine they taste like a spiked blueberry smoothie), as Echelonguy can derive nourishment from them. Visually, the soothing cobalt hues of the previous map continue to resoundingly dominate here, and the level affords quite a few looks at that really cool lunar skybox, which hints at places we never actually visit (at least not in this story). Architecturally and stylistically it remains very simplistic, however, and again some rough edges are apparent, ala the paper-thin wall/failure of perspective along the southwest wall of the landing field. The music seems rather ill-fitting in this case, a sort of pensive interlude-type track in what is a very player-empowering victory-lap of a level. Map 12 -- Crash Landing - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets Apparently the shuttle crashed, and Echelonguy, in another somewhat surreal turn of events reminiscent of the drastic thematic shift of map 07 earlier, awakens to find himself in a dusty corner in a ruined starport on Earth. The story text following this level says that it's unclear how much time has passed since the conclusion of the mission to secure the ark-ship's escape flight on the lunar base, but suffice to say things have not been going well down here. The most striking thing about this level is that it's vastly more grim in tone than the 11 levels which precede it, trading the saturate blues and greens of places past for a grimy dark metal base where many of the systems are nonfunctional. The main command center, looking out on what was once presumably a landing strip teeming with shuttlecraft (now totally empty, understandably) but now shows only decay and some rather unwholesome-looking tenements in the distance, is a blazing inferno thanks to the efforts of a pair of increasingly familiar firebugs. The base's chief officer evidently chose to 'go down with the ship', so to speak, and his charred carcass springs to necromantical life to attack you as you pass by his flaming command chair. Through this all, there's a jarring, unwelcoming piano-jangle flopping around in the background, more unnerving than it has any right to be. Action here again involves a short linear jaunt through the devastated facility, battling a variety of foes in straightforward face-offs along the way, including the set's first mancubus and its first revenants, which some players may find themselves compelled to treat with just a little more respect than usual by dint of lacking the SSG (though the dubiously 'secret' plasma rifle available here provides a reliable panic button should all else fail, provided at least you've been gradually amassing ammo for it during previous levels). Again, far from revolutionary or particularly remarkable stuff, though in line with the level's more menacing aesthetic there's a subtle sense of general placement being just a bit more spiteful here, with zombies often perched at high, sharp angles to unload on you with impunity if you don't stay frosty. The lost souls congregating amidst the conflagration in the command center are also deceptively tricky, emerging from odd angles and through sheets of lurid crimson flame to bite at you while otherwise occupied. The sense of personality here finally goes beyond the tiny-map gimmick and the presence of new texture assets, I think--definitely an uptic for the set. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
rehelekretep Posted December 6, 2016 if anyone is finding the mapset not very challenging then i would highly recommend playing on -fast Sverre's liberal use of imps, demons and hitscanners makes combat a lot more exciting 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
Demtor Posted December 6, 2016 rdwpa said:The custom enemies are quite cool. Not sure if Brutal Doom gets rid of those, but if so that doesn't seem like such a good idea. I thought that would be a problem too at first but so far the new enemies are fully intact and unchanged as far as I can tell. 0 Quote Share this post Link to post
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